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LPG The hows whys ins and outs of LPG for your Land Rover

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  #21 (permalink)  
Old 25th May 2011, 07:44 AM
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Should only need to remove the tank if it is in an awkward spot shouldn't you? A tank in the back of a ute etc should be accessible as most work would be around the box on top. But assuming it has to be emptied of gas before testing if valves have to be replaced, do you lose what gas is in it, and how does this work with lpg only vehicles? Drop the tanks at home, put them back in and you'd need a tow to the servo.

I'm guessing you need to have them removed and refitted by a gas installer though, not just pull them out in the backyard?
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  #22 (permalink)  
Old 25th May 2011, 08:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pfillery View Post
Should only need to remove the tank if it is in an awkward spot shouldn't you? A tank in the back of a ute etc should be accessible as most work would be around the box on top. But assuming it has to be emptied of gas before testing if valves have to be replaced, do you lose what gas is in it, and how does this work with lpg only vehicles? Drop the tanks at home, put them back in and you'd need a tow to the servo.

I'm guessing you need to have them removed and refitted by a gas installer though, not just pull them out in the backyard?
Nope. The gas tank must be completely removed and inspected for rust and damage over its entire surface. Utes are really bad for collecting rubbish and leaves around the gas tank causing rust. Even sedans can have damage from poorly mounted tanks rubbing on metal parts for 10 years.

There are procedures for emptying a tank detailed in Australian standards. Where a tank has substantial amounts of gas it should be decanted into another cylinder. I have two forklift bottles around the workshop for this job. Enough of this gas can be refilled into the tank after testing to drive the vehicle to a servo.

All work on a LPG vehicle on any liquid carrying component is legally required to be done by a licensed gas fitter. Many people do this kind of work themselves and don't get caught but don't fool yourself, it's illegal just the same.
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Old 26th May 2011, 07:01 AM
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Originally Posted by bee utey View Post
No, not true. Specifically the relief valve and the rubber seals between the valves and the tank must be replaced. On a multi valve the relief valve is part of the valve block and often not available as a spare part, hence a whole new valve. APA tanks cost me $100 to test, some testers charge more, some less, some valves fail the test and add cost but not often.
So Bee utey, I've been told as far as tanks go that either APA or Manchester are the pick of the bunch. Is one better than the other? I've been looking for a tank for my Series 3 and have been offered an apa and a manchester secondhand, both only 3 or 4 years old and in test, but the apa was out of a sedan and has 45 degree angled mountings where it fitted into the boot (down into the spare tyre well no doubt). Is it legal/safe/advisable to make up brackets to mount this to a flat surface or am I better going for a flat mount tank? I'm guessing theres no safe way to cut off brackets so as to leave the tank cylindrical and then use universal brackets?

What's your advice?
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Old 26th May 2011, 08:51 AM
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What's your advice?
At the end of the day the only way you qualify for a LPG rebate is to have it done by a licensed fitter. Take both tanks to your local fitter and have him advise. Yes you can cut brackets off a gas tanks but no heat damage is allowed to the tank itself, ie paint bubbling etc. Manchester and APA are roughly equivalent, the tank to choose is the best fitting one.
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Old 26th May 2011, 09:20 AM
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Tank testing........
I had a VT commodore pull up out side my place on the week end.Boot opens and i see a fitted gas tank behind the rear seat BUT behind that is another tank which looked something like one you would see on a 2T forklift, this was held in place with rope.
Some time later i hear hissing and smell gas, this guy is refilling 9kg gas bottles from his boot (for his mates)3 of them.
I didnt see any LPG stickers on the number plates.
Obviously some people are fitting their own gas setups
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Old 26th May 2011, 12:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bee utey View Post
At the end of the day the only way you qualify for a LPG rebate is to have it done by a licensed fitter. Take both tanks to your local fitter and have him advise. Yes you can cut brackets off a gas tanks but no heat damage is allowed to the tank itself, ie paint bubbling etc. Manchester and APA are roughly equivalent, the tank to choose is the best fitting one.
That was the idea, to get as much as I can secondhand and then have a fitter do the bulk of the work, certify it and install everything new that is needed like service lines and filters, converter etc. Then should still qualify for the rebate but reduce costs significantly especially if i mount the tank where I want it, cut any holes where needed so they don't put things where I don't want them, and fit the filler point (into an original landy fuel filler on the passenger side so it looks standard). I'm hoping he will let me sort out some of the wiring at least, so everything on the car currently still works, because I don't think he's fitted one to a series landy before. Might have to give them a copy of the wiring diagram.
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Old 26th May 2011, 12:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pfillery View Post
That was the idea, to get as much as I can secondhand and then have a fitter do the bulk of the work, certify it and install everything new that is needed like service lines and filters, converter etc. Then should still qualify for the rebate but reduce costs significantly especially if i mount the tank where I want it, cut any holes where needed so they don't put things where I don't want them, and fit the filler point (into an original landy fuel filler on the passenger side so it looks standard). I'm hoping he will let me sort out some of the wiring at least, so everything on the car currently still works, because I don't think he's fitted one to a series landy before. Might have to give them a copy of the wiring diagram.
Actually mounting the gas tank is as highy regulated as the plumbing side of things. Please liase with your gas fitter before you attempt any component mounting yourself. Ask to read his copy of AS1425 to familiarise yourself with the regulations first. I have seen too many dangerous installs to imagine "common sense" can produce a safe conversion.
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  #28 (permalink)  
Old 26th May 2011, 12:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bee utey View Post
Actually mounting the gas tank is as highy regulated as the plumbing side of things. Please liase with your gas fitter before you attempt any component mounting yourself. Ask to read his copy of AS1425 to familiarise yourself with the regulations first. I have seen too many dangerous installs to imagine "common sense" can produce a safe conversion.
When I discussed the install with them, they told me that they will advise where the tank can go and we will mark the holes where I want them, I'll drill, cut etc and then take the whole lot to them for the bolt up, that way at least I know it is correct.

The tank I'm looking at will go across the width of the car at the front of the cargo area behind the front seats. Don't really want it going lengthwise if I can help it. That way I can still fit some seats in the back unless there are any rules to preclude this (however I've seen falcons etc with third row seats right above the gas tank)

If I supply the tank alone they have told me it will be about $800 cheaper, even more if I supply a whole kit. But it is probably better to start with a new converter and all the other under bonnet parts and just use a secondhand tank. At least it gives me a good baseline to start from.
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  #29 (permalink)  
Old 26th May 2011, 06:09 PM
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We picked our 101 FC today with a certificate, total cost was $1302.40.

We found out they, we have 2 tanks, are APA tanks with a total capacity of 183litres so we thought not a bad price, (they haven't been tested for 11 years) which includes the certificate for registeration

that's the next step

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  #30 (permalink)  
Old 27th May 2011, 06:32 AM
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I just bought the tank for the install on my series 3. Cost $60 for a Manchester tank only 3 years old so no test needed for a few years and it is still 3/4 full of gas. Most quotes I've had for retesting are between $99 and $200 but I guess that is with the tank removed already. Must be a one way valve on the filler inlet because there is no tap on there and the gas stays put.

Next step decide where the tank is going and work on the hardware to mount it in. Then look forward to finding another way to get to work for the day while it is in the workshop.
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