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Thread: how td5 Injection actually works

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    how td5 Injection actually works

    Is there any interest in me running down how the injection setup works in the Td5 (and similar engines)

    If theres interest I'll edit this post

    And so here comes the first edit.

    So youve got an engine and yovue been filling it with diesel and when you goto check the plugs you see these monsterously huge metal thingys with pipes on em where the spark plugs ought to be and theres these little pen like things with a wire on em near those. The pipes run back to a large metal body attached to the engine and back to the fuel tank as well. Congratulations youve just found your injectors, glow plugs and injector pump as well as the injector lines and the return lines.

    So whats it all about... simple really the injectors preform the same function as the spark plug in an petrol engine they make the bang happen that pushes the piston down and the downwards motion of the piston with the help of lots of other metal bits makes the round rubber bits go round and that makes the vehicle move. No really thats what they do they dont do all that by themselves just like the spark plugs dont make the spark themselves the injectors are just one part of a seriosly well thought out bunch of wierdly shaped bits of metal, rubber glass and in some cases plastic bits that make up "The Diesel Fuel System"

    ok so the key thing that seperates a Diesel engine from a petrol engine is that a diesel engine inhales clean fresh air then squeezes it lots till it gets really really hot and then adds the fuel where a petrol engine inhales a mix of air and atomised fuel and then puts a bit of a squeeze on it then lights it up with a spark. (and yes you technological historian anoraks I know that there are still some diesel engines in existance that use a vaporisor and squeezes the whole fuel air mix till it goes bang but I havent ever seen one in a comercially available car so they dont count here hmmmkay)

    So in keeping with older school engines for a while (carbied petrols and Cav/VE/inline diesels) we know that the carby in a petrol engine meters the fuel into the engine to get the required power and the points tell the coil when to spark and the distributor points the spark to the right pot and if we get it all right then we get nice smooth power from the engine. For your basic diesle engine if you think of the fuel injection pump being a combination of all the previous components your not far from the right track. To make it easy lets take to our hypothetical 4 pot engines with our magical angle grinders and turn them into single cylinder engines. now that weve done that lets forget about the petrol engine and lets focus on the diesel as other than the vague similarity of function they dont have too much more in common when it comes to the fuel system.

    so you know where this is all heading lets start with an outline of the whole system. Whats in it and whats it do for a diesel engine. Theres 7 primary components to most early diesel fuel systems although the layout will vary from one car to another.
    1. The fuel tank(s) -they hold the fuel and connect to
    2. Fuel lines and valves- these get the fuel from the various components to other componants and if you have more than one tank pick which tank your going to eventually empty
    3. sedimentors, seperators and filters - these make sure the fuel is clean and not contaminated with water, grit, dirt, small children and hoefully keep diesel snot out of the rest of the system by cloging up and starving the engine of fuel.
    4. the lift pump or priming pump - this gets the fuel flowing around the system its a relativly low pressure high volume pump
    5. the injection pump - this is the bit that does the bulk of the work nutting out how much fuel to squirt in and when to squirt it in
    6. high pressure lines - these get the fuel from the injection pump to the injectors
    7. injectors - these squirt the fuel into the combustion chamber to make the engine run


    now Im not going to go into things like tanks filters and lift pumps here those things are all common to carbied petrol engines.

    the concept of how diesel injection works is no more complicated than your average cheapy Kmart water pistol your finger represents the effort of the engine on the pump the triggery bit represents the fuel injection pump the small hose from the triggery bit is a high ressure injector line and the nozzle is your injector. Yes Im being serious. When you strip off all the govenor bits max fuel setting bits idle adjust bits and all the other trickery bits of the injector pump that control how much fuel its going to squirt your left with a plunger in a barrel that works on exactly the same principal as your average run of the mill water pistol.

    Ok so we chuck in some controls that measure the fuel and at this point all we need to worry about is that they are mechanical in nature and work by allowing a small opening in the plunger to dump the fuel out of the collar back into the injector pump then on its merry way back to the tank via the return lines. so now we have some fuel at very high pressure (8000psi +) that gets directed via some valving to a high pressure injector line to wind up at the fuel injector.

    The fuel injector is pretty much a glorified checkvalve and spray nozzle and providing that the injectors in good nick when the high pressure fuel turns up at one end of it then all the bits inside do their thing and open up the galleries to the nozzle that then takes the high pressure fuel and turns it into a mist that then pretty much spontaneously combusts in the heat of the combustion chamber. a simple equivilent is putting your thumb over the end of your garden hose turn it on just a little bit and as the pressure builds up little streams will start to spray out from between your thumb and the hose and then when the pressure drops off it stops and your thumb stops any air from getting back into the hose. swap out fuel for water a set of pin***** holes for the gap between your thumb and the hose and combustion gasses for air and thats what an injector does.


    now unlike a carbied engine a diesel engine uses the fuel to do 2 very important things 1. it keeps the injectors cool and 2 it keeps them lubricated at the pressures and temperatures your injectors are working at they wouldnt last long without some kind of cooling system and lubrication. The diesel also lubricates the injection pump. and with all the fancy wierd shaped bits in the diesel fuel injection system there are tolerances that are sometimes meausred in the hundredths of mm. Easy to see why diesel engine have much better filtration systems than carbied petrol engines.

    now that thats out there digest it for a bit while I get ready to type up the way the td5 does business.
    Last edited by Blknight.aus; 8th February 2008 at 10:14 PM.
    Dave

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    I'm interested, perhaps a comparison to the old mechanical type as well.

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    You could make it easy for yourself.Cut and paste from RAVE.
    Im guessing it would be of great benefit for anybody who hasnt read RAVE or got a copy.
    Andrew
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    Dave

    I know it would definitely be beneficial , specially for someone like myself who has no idea how the TD5 works , I googled it and got the answer. I have RAVE , may be I should start reading it ?
    Last edited by Disco_owner; 8th February 2008 at 09:03 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dobbo View Post
    I'm interested, perhaps a comparison to the old mechanical type as well.
    as it shares a lot of basic principles with an inline injection system you need to understand before trying to wrap your head around unit injection Ive really no choice but to do it this way...

    Itd be like trying to get a russian to speak english by describing it to him in german.
    Dave

    "In a Landrover the other vehicle is your crumple zone."

    For spelling call Rogets, for mechanicing call me.

    Fozzy, 2.25D SIII Ex DCA Ute
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    Archaeoptersix 1990 6x6 dual cab(This things staying)


    If you've benefited from one or more of my posts please remember, your taxes paid for my skill sets, I'm just trying to make sure you get your monies worth.
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    how td5 Injection actually works

    Is this before or after there's oil in the injection loom and plugs?
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    td5 installement

    I just looked at the clock... tomorrowday.
    Dave

    "In a Landrover the other vehicle is your crumple zone."

    For spelling call Rogets, for mechanicing call me.

    Fozzy, 2.25D SIII Ex DCA Ute
    Tdi autoManual d1 (gave it to the Mupion)
    Archaeoptersix 1990 6x6 dual cab(This things staying)


    If you've benefited from one or more of my posts please remember, your taxes paid for my skill sets, I'm just trying to make sure you get your monies worth.
    If you think you're in front on the deal, pay it forwards.

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    Injection evolution, The Unit injector.

    ok so its a bit later than tomorrow day.....

    have we all got our heads vaguely wrapped around the basic principals of diesel injection? yes, cool, big thumbs up.

    Lets revise what we need to make diesel injection work.

    apart from the blindingly obvious tank, fuel, lines, pumps and filters we need

    1. a method of raising the pressure of the fuel to the point that it will over come the pressure in the combustion chamber and with enough pressure differential that it will spray into the chamber.

    2. a method of timing the delivery of the fuel so that the high pressure fuel turns up at the right time

    and finally

    3. a method of controling the amount of fuel that gets delivered.


    now traditionally all this was done away from the actual bit that delivered the fuel in a fuel injection pump of one description or another.

    early on in the piece someone came up with a cool way of getting rid of the injector pump and replacing it with a unit injector which is essentially an injector pump sitting upside down on top of the injector and instead of being driven off of an independant drive from the camshaft or the crankshaft via other gearing has a lobe on the cam to drive it and its usually between the inlet and exhaust valve lobes and its got a hell of a lump on it.

    so now via the fact that we have the pump sitting right on top of the injector and we have it timed directly via the camshaft we have the benifit of less moving parts and less connections that are under pressure. all that means less to go wrong and thats a good thing.

    to control it in the old school mechanical unit injector you have a mechanically controlled spill sleeve which works in essentially exactly the same way as the spill sleeve worked in your old style pump, depending on how much fuel you need injected the port moves around lines up with the gallery in the pump and dumps the fuel pressure out to the return lines.


    And thats the basic premise behind the unit injector.

    as the engine cranks a lobe on the cam turns and pushes down on the plunger of the unit injector which then raises the pressure of the fuel in the chamber below and once a certain pressure is reached the injector nozzle opens and fuel sprays into the engine at up to 3 times the normal injection pressure of a traditional engine with a fuel pump, timing it is taken care of by the cam so once youve got your cam set correctly thats one major adjustment you dont need to worry about so much but each individual injector can still be fine tuned as needed to suit your engine. As the plunger moves down under the influence of the camshaft fuel continues to be injected Once the required amount of fuel is injected the spill port lines up and then the pressure falls the injector nozzle snaps shut and the piston under the influence of the fuel burning happily away in the top of the combustion chamber proceed merrily on its way to the bottom of the cylinder thus driving the engine around for another turn.

    since we no longer have a huge housing to keep fuel in and ensure that all the plungers get clean airless fuel the fuel is delivered from the tank to the unit injectors at a faster rate and at higher pressures (65psi-ish for the TD5)
    Last edited by Blknight.aus; 15th February 2008 at 09:42 PM.
    Dave

    "In a Landrover the other vehicle is your crumple zone."

    For spelling call Rogets, for mechanicing call me.

    Fozzy, 2.25D SIII Ex DCA Ute
    Tdi autoManual d1 (gave it to the Mupion)
    Archaeoptersix 1990 6x6 dual cab(This things staying)


    If you've benefited from one or more of my posts please remember, your taxes paid for my skill sets, I'm just trying to make sure you get your monies worth.
    If you think you're in front on the deal, pay it forwards.

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    Injection process evolution PRIME.

    ok so weve got it all happening fuels getting in and its doing its bang part of the otto cycle and some mumpty reckons hes made an observation thats just going to shatter the world in terms of effecient fuel injection..

    "If we increase the rate at which the fuel burns in the early part of injection we can more effectively utilise the engergy released."


    oh great, how the hell do you do that in something thats already burning at a squillion miles an hour.

    Easy, dont inject it into a hot chamber inject it into a fire. lost you? thought so. lets make an anology, A very slow anology.

    IF you want to make a fire out of wood you dont just grab a huge log and put a match to it. It might work if your lucky but it will be slow to start and by the time it takes hold enough to be effective you'll have burnt half the log. This is rougly anologous of using a carburettor.

    so lets spilt the log up a bit and make some kindling If we put a match to that then it will light up a lot faster and burn a lot hotter. This is like your normal injection cycle be it from a unit injector or a standard pump and injector setup. The nozzle of the injector serves as your axe splitting the log before you burn it.

    but lets get tricky here, what happens if you dump that kindling onto an already hot bed of coals instead of trying to light it with a match? near on instant combustion right.....

    so Why cant we do that with out injectors? Well we can and its called PRe-Injection MEtering or PRIME.

    remember that spill port in your injection pump or the plunger part of your unit injector well it turns out with some clever design work what you can do is have the one pump stroke deliver 2 shots of fuel. Instead of having 1 place for the port to line up with the gallery in the plunger theres now 2 when the first spot lines up the pressure drops allowing the injector to snap closed and then as that spot passes the port the pressure builds again opens the injector and the main injection begins.

    now the TDI does it slightly differntly using a double stage needle in the main injector body, the effect is the same but the pressure spiking on everything but the injector is a lot lower.

    The PRIME part of the injection turns a hot chamber into a super heated chamber with a fire already in it so when the rest of the fuel turns up.... well I'll just leave that to your imagination.
    Dave

    "In a Landrover the other vehicle is your crumple zone."

    For spelling call Rogets, for mechanicing call me.

    Fozzy, 2.25D SIII Ex DCA Ute
    Tdi autoManual d1 (gave it to the Mupion)
    Archaeoptersix 1990 6x6 dual cab(This things staying)


    If you've benefited from one or more of my posts please remember, your taxes paid for my skill sets, I'm just trying to make sure you get your monies worth.
    If you think you're in front on the deal, pay it forwards.

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    At last the TD5 injector

    So now that we have all the elements of a TD5 injector developed lets add some lectronicory to it and make it out of some exotically hard metals with super fine tolerances...

    as you might have guessed from the lead up the TD5 injector is A unit type injector being the injector pump and the injector all rolled into one and driven by the camshaft. Where it differs is in the fact that its electronically controled.

    In place of a mechanical spill port a spill valve is controled by pilot pressure which is controled by the electrical solenoid that sits on top of the injector (its the bits with the numbers on it that you can see when the rocker cover is off)

    and thats essentialy the heart of it all, all the electronical geewhizadry exist for one reason to turn on and off at the right time one of the 5 solenoids that control the amount of fuel that goes into each cylinder.

    how it decides all of that in the scope of this post is best left to 2 words...

    "whiteman Magic"

    but now hopefully you should have a basic idea of whats going on where.
    Last edited by Blknight.aus; 15th February 2008 at 09:45 PM.
    Dave

    "In a Landrover the other vehicle is your crumple zone."

    For spelling call Rogets, for mechanicing call me.

    Fozzy, 2.25D SIII Ex DCA Ute
    Tdi autoManual d1 (gave it to the Mupion)
    Archaeoptersix 1990 6x6 dual cab(This things staying)


    If you've benefited from one or more of my posts please remember, your taxes paid for my skill sets, I'm just trying to make sure you get your monies worth.
    If you think you're in front on the deal, pay it forwards.

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