All discussions relating to the Defenders end of production

Except they didn't go Common Rail post 300Tdi...

I would hardly call the P38 diff inferior.. What it lacks in outright strength it makes up for in clearance.

Many people have not had an issue with the P38 diffs..

TDCi certainly changed engine complexity and added a few more points of failure but overall these things are pretty solid...

Once upon a time there was nothing simpler or more robust than the old ice box. The ice man would bring the ice. Put it in the box. Cold beer. Butter doesn't melt.

Now we have these new fangled electric refrigerators. There is just so much that can go wrong. Compressors, gas leaks, evaporators...Not to mention utter dependence on continuous electricity supply.

You really cannot trust all this technology. How hard does it need to be? A block of ice. Do we really need "frost free" and multi zone cooling, vege crispers and chillers.

Don't get me started on fridges with chilled water or ice dispensers as accessories! If you just have an icebox - you got ice and chilled water without the electricity or butter conditioners.

Living in the past. Why do we have credit cards, we could all be bouncing around cashing cheques?
Get with the program, Land Rover is certainly attempting too, finally, with the Defender.

Plenty of hypocrites here. If one was really against technology you would not even be on here, not even a "ye olde worlde" IBM 8086 or amstrad computer would give you access to AULRO . and with an aucoustic couple modem :Rolling:

ICE BLOCKS ?? your in the dark ages, have you never heard of a Kero Fridge !!

computer controlled engines are Vastly more efficient and reliable than fully mechanical. You people that are dead set against CRD what type of 2wd car do you drive , if its after 1980 I bet its got a computer in it, and unless its a VB Commodore i bet its computer has never failed.

Just to be clear - my comments were meant to be funny. I drive a Puma. Love the electrickery. It turns 2yo in a a few days.

I find the mechanical vs electrical debate rather amusing. As you can see I have a 300Tdi. Sure it's basic but if something like the injector pump or similar plays up in the bush I, and I suspect many others, would probably have buckley's chance of fixing it - similar to diagnosing an electronic fault unless I was trained in using one of those diagnostic gadgets. Electronics are the way of the future both in reliability, efficiency, power and effectiveness - no one in the design industry is pushing the envelope of mechanical design ahead of electronics. Just like you'll never see computers using valves and transistors again, its highly likely we'll be driving electric Defenders before we see power supply going back to full mechanicals; besides, if it's reliable who cares how it works?

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Originally Posted by goingbush

Plenty of hypocrites here. If one was really against technology you would not even be on here, not even a "ye olde worlde" IBM 8086 or amstrad computer would give you access to AULRO . and with an aucoustic couple modem :Rolling:

ICE BLOCKS ?? your in the dark ages, have you never heard of a Kero Fridge !!

computer controlled engines are Vastly more efficient and reliable than fully mechanical. You people that are dead set against CRD what type of 2wd car do you drive , if its after 1980 I bet its got a computer in it, and unless its a VB Commodore i bet its computer has never failed.

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My Puma is less fuel efficient than my 300tdi Defender, this is a big surprise. It's reliability, electrical or otherwise, remains to be seen. It's definitely quieter and a bit more refined, except when the mid gear change revs stay up too long, or it automatically accelerates!! in first low reverse!! ...I love my Puma, but I'm not convinced that more computer intervention is a good thing. I certainly wouldn't want any new Defender to have dial-up off road driving programs. Simplicity is at the heart of all design perfection. There is no reason why this principle cannot be applied to vehicle computer management.

I'd be interested to hear, how reliable are Discovery 4's and Range Rovers when they are used constantly for hard work in tough environments a long way from service centres?

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Originally Posted by Didge

I find the mechanical vs electrical debate rather amusing. As you can see I have a 300Tdi. Sure it's basic but if something like the injector pump or similar plays up in the bush I, and I suspect many others, would probably have buckley's chance of fixing it - similar to diagnosing an electronic fault unless I was trained in using one of those diagnostic gadgets. Electronics are the way of the future both in reliability, efficiency, power and effectiveness - no one in the design industry is pushing the envelope of mechanical design ahead of electronics. Just like you'll never see computers using valves and transistors again, its highly likely we'll be driving electric Defenders before we see power supply going back to full mechanicals; besides, if it's reliable who cares how it works?

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Except in a post apocalyptic world, or in the case of a Corona Mass Ejection / Carrington Event , which may render all computer stuff useless, its only Valves and Mechanicals that are going to be left working :) The Amish can't wait to say , "I told you so"

Like this????
[ame]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lpK5XRBmT-k[/ame]

:D

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Originally Posted by MrLandy

My Puma [...] It's definitely quieter and a bit more refined, except when [...] it automatically accelerates!! in first low reverse!

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Ahhhh my introduction to the "idle jack" feature was bit of a fright too! Was trying to creep forward very minutely in low first... when the clutch pedal position was high enough, the computer jacked up engine idle speed a few hundred rpm....scared me!

Now i understand the feature and logic...like it