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Thread: 300 tdi Defender overheating ?

  1. #21
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    779
    Quote Originally Posted by edddo View Post
    Gday Aurthur
    Ok that makes some sense then.
    I would just about gaurantee that low range hilly 4wding on a hot day would highlight why the shroud is a good thing.
    But i wouldnt mind being proven wrong.
    ....
    Last weekend ended up at Murray Sunset NP.
    The bulk of the trip in and around the park was easy gravel tracks(ie. non 4WD) but there was also some deep sandy tracks to play in.
    The 30-ish k drive up to Mopoke Hut didn't cause any heat build up, and the sand dunes were what I would describe medium. ie. not too hard but definitely 4WD and I set to low range too. Brother drove most of the tracks so couldn't really tell how hard(or actually soft and boggy) they were.
    Was too lazy to lower tyre pressures too(have compressor, but I only a portable Chinese cheapie which takes forever to do it's thing). So poor little D1 struggled more than it should have in the sand.
    On the way back tho, I drove out and we took an even harder track .. sand dunes were much harder, low ratio again. Hit one (the last one) dune at about 40k/h(remembering that tyre pressures were still highway level, and she got bogged.
    Struggled to reverse back too(steering more than bogging) to line it up again and choose a different line. Had to hit 60k/h at the base of this dune, feathering and pushing throttle to get over. Made it at a very slow walking pace by the top of the ridge and had it been a couple more meters higher would have got bogged again.
    Of course lower tyre pressures would have allowed fuss free movement, but were were only 30km from the end of the park where the smooth gravel started again.

    Most of my efforts were focused more on the coolant and oil temps, rather than the track and getting over the dunes in one go(should have let brother drive ).
    Coolant temp never budged from it's 83, oil temp did creep up from a normal 60-ish to about 70-75. By the time we hit Ouyen 50k later I noticed oil temp back down to 65(coolant still at 83)
    My guess is that engine struggled a bit more than I thought it was(I feel less feedback from an auto than a manual in these conditions).
    My sand driving style is more 'feather and push' as needed rather than the typical push hard, hard charging style I've seen from many others.

    At the risk of taking the thread off topic, what happened next was that at some point between mopoke/Ouyen and home, stupid harmonic balancer started coming loose again(2nd time). Don't remember hearing it at Ouyen, and not once on the drive home.
    Loose balancer then took out the alternator pulley(completely loose) and must have stressed the water pump shaft as it was leaking out of the weep hole.
    So at some point, the poor 300 Tdi also had to deal with this issue as well .. just don't know at exactly which point it started(ie. in the N.P, at Ouyen, or on the easy 5 hr drive home from up there).

    Stupid me tho .. these dunes would have been an ideal test to see if the coolant still heats up as it used too with the A/C on.

    The replacement waterpump I was advised by the parts chap was a ProFlow branded one. My only request was that it not be a cheapie .. just a very good one. That's what he sold me.
    Since the new pump change, I now notice that (with all the other changes/mods) the coolant now seems to be happier at about 80 or so .. dropping to 79 too in traffic(and as a test without fan).
    It peaked at 83 briefly(a few seconds) but then dropped again on this test run.
    Old pump seems to have the exact same impeller blades as the new ProFlow type, and other than the small drip from the weep hole it was otherwise in good nik and clean

    But, yeah .. have it in the back of my mind to keep an eye on it if we hit any harder tracks or steepish hill climbs.
    Had plans to do a short drive into some hilly country today, but another curve ball was thrown my way .. dad's Exploder did a clutch so had to orgainse some transport for him while we work out what to do with that now.
    Cheers,
    Arthur.

    '99 D1 300 Tdi Auto

  2. #22
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Melrose SA
    Posts
    2,462

    Final Conclusion

    For the benefit of those in the future

    We installed a Dayco Thermostat DT50A 82 degrees C
    The tropical modification for the radiator (partially blocking off the half inch bypass hole in the radiator) for reference as a proof of concept we used a tubeless valve stem that had been shortened and the valve removed pushed on a piece of rod into the hole.
    This will be soldered up in the future apart from a 2mm hole

    The end result is its much better probably 5 degrees cooler on average

    Ongoing testing will be done next week when the vehicle is used out bush.

  3. #23
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    Melbourne
    Posts
    779
    Good to hear.

    On my drive yesterday I think I've had a bit of success with my hotter running 300 TDi with A/C on too.
    First true test with A/C on and >30C day.

    Before I did anything to my 300 Tdi(other than a service) with A/C I'd get low to mid 90's with A/C on on a freeway run, and in slower moving traffic high 80's to very low 90's.
    ie. as engine load and speed dropped, so did operating temps with A/C on. Without A/C .. coolant temps barely moved from 83C

    Yesterday my run had a very slight incline at 80k/h. Tdi struggles up this incline in top locked TC. It maintains 80k/h but can't accelerate unless I slow a little to allow TC to unlock or drop to 3rd.
    I wanted the loaded engine condition.
    coolant temp peaked at 90 dropped back down tho to about 87 before I hat the high point. A good sign.
    I'm thinking that the freer flowing tridon(88) is definitely helping.
    In the 80k/h zone on the freeway it sat between 86-91 or so .. also a better result from the previous steady 90-94 or so it used to hold.
    in the 100k/h zone of the run and a few hard acceleration moments I tested .. max temp was a brief 94, but always dropped back down to about 87(sometimes 86).
    It seemed to hold 88-90C for a short while, and always dropping back to 86-88C
    So I'm thinking that the freer flowing thermostat is definitely helping coolant flow between engine and rad .. for sure.
    Previously it'd hold the low to mid 90's and only drop after a slowdown/ease off period.
    Now it's appearing to react quicker to how (I think) the thermostat is operating.

    No idea if the lack of a fan shroud is making any difference .. but it certainly isn't hurting.

    I'm going to try to check if this bypass hole in the rad is still there in mine too.
    Is it easy to see from the fill plug?
    Cheers,
    Arthur.

    '99 D1 300 Tdi Auto

  4. #24
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sawyers Valley
    Posts
    31
    Interesting read considering my 95 TDi Defender 130 is still getting warm on Greenmount, Perth every arvo and with summer looming again, I would like to investigate further. With a new Tridon TS, new pump, rad, hoses, viscous and electric condensor fan getting me though last summer, Im guessing this air flow idea has merit though Im not that keen on chopping the guards up just yet. If I have a head wind, its notably a harder climb but a cooler temp although warmer than usual. Tailwind up the hill results the highest temps guessing due to less air flow. There's no doubt that the hill is a dam good test of the little 4cyclinder, and it has done it without a hitch every arvo, for over 6years.

    However, I'm still not convinced that landrover had the right idea of taking water from the head for the heater but then dumping it in with the cooled water ex radiator/pre water pump. For this reason, I regulate an increasing engine temp with heater, last course of action Im afraid, plus AC fan with no compressor so as to activate condensor fan.

    So far the engine temps have never reached the red, only 3/4s of the black. Interesting thing is that using a IR temp gauge, when the dash gauge is showing 3/4s, the temp on the thermostat housing shows 88deg howvever, the temp of the bottom hose going in to the pump shows 94deg?? Im guessing this shows actually how much the ex heater/head coolant rises the already cooled water from the radiator too before re-entering the motor. Im thinking of blocking it off but someone on here said dont last year so stuffed if I know. Maybe this is Landrover's smart way of cooling a hot part of the head, although they could've dumped it into the top hose which Im thinking of doing.

    Im thinking first job is to get coolant tested for exhaust gasses, if none then will add additional temp gauges, then progress with the chopping of side panels though I might remove spotlights first. Any ideas.

  5. #25
    Join Date
    Mar 2007
    Location
    Canada
    Posts
    274
    Your description is a viscous unit not locking up.

  6. #26
    Join Date
    Oct 2011
    Location
    Sawyers Valley
    Posts
    31
    Thanks for the input but I thought the same so I bought a third vc fan but no difference. I can hear it drawing when warm but I will try the paint brush test as Im not keen on fingering it. Just to be sure, I will take the spare and see if I can lock it up manually then fit it to see if any difference, wouldn't hurt.

  7. #27
    Join Date
    Oct 2017
    Location
    Exmouth Western Australia
    Posts
    2

    Is it using water?

    If it is not using water then I would be looking at thermostats as suggested.
    I had a interesting experience with a 300TDI head replacement a couple of years ago. I fitted the new head as per manual but found it used water and overheated almost straight away. What I found was when doing the first head bolt tension(40nm) I think. The first round all bolts came up to the 40nm but then I rechecked by going over head bolt sequence again and found the middle bolts went up more. I did the tension sequence another 4 times before all head bolts came up to the 40nm. No more using water after finishing tightening down head completely. I think that may be a reason for head gaskets failing between no2 and no3 cylinders.

  8. #28
    Join Date
    Dec 2009
    Location
    gove
    Posts
    24

    hot

    I would never let a diesel run to 110 - nothing safe about that. One bizarre problem i had with an overheating engine once was simply the water pump blades had corroded away so although everything looked fine, new radiator n hoses etc etc etc - it was an internal problem. Nothing to do with airflow :-/

  9. #29
    Join Date
    Jan 1970
    Location
    Melrose SA
    Posts
    2,462
    Quote Originally Posted by grounded View Post
    I would never let a diesel run to 110 - nothing safe about that. One bizarre problem i had with an overheating engine once was simply the water pump blades had corroded away so although everything looked fine, new radiator n hoses etc etc etc - it was an internal problem. Nothing to do with airflow :-/
    I agree and am equally as wary interestingly the TD5 ECU when the coolant temperature is at 110 Degrees C there is no De-tuning not until 115 -120 Degrees C

  10. #30
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Safety Bay
    Posts
    8,295
    Quote Originally Posted by swivelrat View Post
    Thanks for the input but I thought the same so I bought a third vc fan but no difference. I can hear it drawing when warm but I will try the paint brush test as Im not keen on fingering it. Just to be sure, I will take the spare and see if I can lock it up manually then fit it to see if any difference, wouldn't hurt.
    Mine's driven up green mount many times without the temp spike your describing,in two weeks actually as I'm working in Laverton Hospital for a month. I'd be removing anything that blocks airflow from the front of your vehicle and try again.Are you going up in fourth or fifth?.

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