D2 help,camping holiday very soon

[eileen]

Hi can anyone offer some advice our D2 TD5 is playing up sudden loss of power and gets hot, the temp indicator does not go in the red but close enough. After five or ten minutes on the side of the road off we go again. The first time this hapened we got it towed to a LR specialist, he changed the thermo and a return hose but could not find anything else wrong with it. After this however the fan always comes even when starting from cold.I took it back to said LR specialist and again said he could not find anything wrong with it.

Several thousand K's later and its happened again. This time we were in the middle of nowhere and after letting it cool drove on, an hour later it happened again, today we drove for 3 hours with no probs.

Next week we are due to go camping in NW WA but am now concerned we may get stuck with kids,gear etc.

I do not mind if we have to get the head gasket done but the mech said it did not need to be, and his advice can be expensive. It does not lose coolant neither is there any black smoke and RAC man tested the coolant with his chemical tester for combustion gases and all ok

what are possible causes of this ? can anyone suggest something, any advice would be most welcome

[stig0000]

Hi can anyone offer some advice our D2 TD5 is playing up sudden loss of power and gets hot, the temp indicator does not go in the red but close enough. After five or ten minutes on the side of the road off we go again. The first time this hapened we got it towed to a LR specialist, he changed the thermo and a return hose but could not find anything else wrong with it. After this however the fan always comes even when starting from cold.I took it back to said LR specialist and again said he could not find anything wrong with it.

Several thousand K's later and its happened again. This time we were in the middle of nowhere and after letting it cool drove on, an hour later it happened again, today we drove for 3 hours with no probs.

Next week we are due to go camping in NW WA but am now concerned we may get stuck with kids,gear etc.

I do not mind if we have to get the head gasket done but the mech said it did not need to be, and his advice can be expensive. It does not lose coolant neither is there any black smoke and RAC man tested the coolant with his chemical tester for combustion gases and all ok

what are possible causes of this ? can anyone suggest something, any advice would be most welcome


cheak the easy stuff first,, oil in the harniss can wip up all sorta werd fualts,, id be cheaking both ends first,

search oil in harniss td5

[wardy1]

yep x2

[LandyAndy]

Hi Eileen.
It certainly needs looking into before heading north.
The fan running constantly definately means it been hot,the ECU is trying to protect the motor by running it and limiting the engine output.It will continue to run till the fault is cleared in the ECU.
The "sniffer test" used by the RAC man isnt reliable on a diesel,diesels especially modern ones dont produce much carbon monoxide wich the test is looking for.
There are a couple of other ways of testing for a leaky head gasket,which I suspect is your problem.
*Suspend a 500ml coke bottle to collect ANY coolant spat out from the overflow pipe,monitor its collection.
*Run the heater on full heat,does it work???? Have you now lost a heap of coolant???? Often if combustion gasses are leaking into the cooling system they displace coolant by forcing it out of the overflow,but the heater core now contains gasses instead of coolant.Running the heater will move the gasses around the system if they are trapped in there.The oveflow bottle remains full leading one to think no coolant is being lost.
*Get the engine up to full operating temp,preferably including a good workout up a long hill.Pull over and carefully squeeze the top radiator hose.It should have some pressure but if its extemely hard its a sure sign of compustion gasses in there pressurizing the cooling system.
*DOUBLE CHECK that the thermostat is correctly installed!!!!!,It can be fitted incorrectly,there was a post the other week with the incorrect/correct fitting.
Where in Perth are you,somebody with TD5 experience may be able to have a look at it for you to check the above.
GOODLUCK.
Dont take it on holidays as is,I would be very concerned that it will let you down.
Andrew

[eileen]

thanks Andy, I checked the ECU and the red plug was swimming in oil, so changed the injector loom and spent hrs cleaning the main loom. However as you point out the fan still runs constantly I am going to do your tests today as I too have suspicions about the head gasket, thanks to stig for getting back to me so soon, a day later and I would not have been able to get the loom until tuesday

[LandyAndy]

Here is the map of people with Nanocoms willing to help other members.
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/electronic-diagnostics/101644-members-diagnostic-equipment-map.html
Get somebody to see what faults are stored,it will also stop that fan running all the time.
I have a Nanocom and willing to plug it in for you,but Im 160ks from Perth(Williams).
Goodluck
Andrew

[eileen]

Andy, been out for a spin and did the heater test, interestingly it lost more coolant driving it hard for twenty minutes with AC on coolest setting than with heater on full. The heater worked well straight away, the top hose was pretty hard but the expansion bottle seemed to have lees pressure in it, was this because of running the heater ? How do I get in touch with 5teve in Kinross ?

[LandyAndy]

Best way is via PM (private message)
Click on Private Messages under where it says Welcome and your username,top rh side of screen.If you cant work it out I can send you his ph number via PM.
Andrew

[LandyAndy]

Keep your fingers crossed that the oil is upsetting the apple cart.Heater/hose test sounds promising.
Take the ECU out again and remove the sealing grommet on the orange ECU plug.Leave it out for now,keep it in a safe place and replace before doing any wet off-roading.Once the oil is gone put it back.
Leaving it out helps the oil drain easier,it will take some time.
Expect a long list of faults to show,the oil changes values the ECU reads and sends it into confusion.I will add a post here from last week that I believe is oil in the harness generated faults.I had the same issue a few years back,I got the headgasket and oil in the harness at the same time!!!!
Andrew

[LandyAndy]

Here is a list from another post(Catch 22,D2a faults I cant clear),I had much the same(give or take a few) when I had oil in the harness.
Despite replacing the culprit(injector harness) they will take some time to go away.
Well worth flushing the main loom with metho spirits a few times then hot water to speed up the process.



FAULT 08-01 air conditioning fan drive over temperature (CURRENT)
FAULT 08-02 fuel pump drive over temperature (CURRENT)
FAULT 08-03 tacho drive over temperature (CURRENT)
FAULT 08-04 gearbox/abs drive overtemperature (CURRENT)
FAULT 08-05 air conditioning clutch over temperature (CURRENT)
FAULT 08-06 mil lamp drive over temperature (CURRENT)
FAULT 08-07 glowplug relay drive overtemperature (CURRENT)
FAULT 10-01 air conditioning fan drive open load (CURRENT)
FAULT 10-02 fuel pump drive open load (CURRENT)
FAULT 10-03 tachometer open load (CURRENT)
FAULT 10-04 gearbox/abs drive open load (CURRENT)
FAULT 10-05 air conditioning clutch open load (CURRENT)
FAULT 10-06 mil lamp drive open load (CURRENT)
FAULT 10-07 glowplug lamp drive open load (CURRENT)
FAULT 10-08 glowplug relay drive open load (CURRENT)
FAULT 12-01 air conditioning fan drive open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 12-02 fuel pump drive open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 12-03 tachometer open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 12-04 gearbox/abs drive open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 12-05 air conditioning clutch open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 12-06 mil lamp drive open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 12-07 glowplug lamp drive open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 14-01 air conditioning fan drive open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 14-02 fuel pump drive open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 14-03 tachometer open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 14-04 gearbox/abs drive open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 14-05 air conditioning clutch open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 14-06 mil lamp drive open load (INTERMIT.)
FAULT 14-07 glowplug lamp drive open load (INTERMIT.)

GOODLUCK
Andrew

[Graeme]

Turning the heater on does nothing for the flow as the coolant flows through the heater all the time. There is no coolant tap/valve in the heater circuit.

[Graeme]

Not much of a LR specialist if they didn't check for oil in the injector harness and couldn't work out why the engine is overheating. I wouldn't trust any work they did!

[eileen]

yes I agree, I am most likely going to take of things myself from now on, especially as the information available on AULRO seems far superior and readily available. I used to play a lot with cars/engines when I was younger and have had to do an engine transplant in a fiesta, and a clutch in a Honda civic so I'll have to get the tools out again for the head on the disco

[justinc]

Hi Eileen,
Sorry to say I think yes it is a head gsaket leak if it looses any coolant AT ALL when under load, and the hoses are quite hard, then that is a pretty fair indicator. If your vehicle is manufactured prior to 2001 then it is a good bet that the dowels have failed at some point and the head shifted, causing the gasket to loose its 'seal'.

I also agree that since some other issues weren't picked up, then you should start doing this work yourself,(Although I have seen plenty of these with oily looms that run just fine:confused:) as at least you know it is done right. Of course all of us here are only too happy to help if you get stuck/ have questions. Take a look at Psimpson7's tutorial about Td5 head removal/ refitting. It is a great referrence.
:)

JC

[2 rocks]

Hi Eileen,
Sorry to say I think yes it is a head gsaket leak if it looses any coolant AT ALL when under load, and the hoses are quite hard, then that is a pretty fair indicator. If your vehicle is manufactured prior to 2001 then it is a good bet that the dowels have failed at some point and the head shifted, causing the gasket to loose its 'seal'.
JC

Eileen
As an adjunct to what Justin's described, I had this happen shortly after buying my car and feared the worst - however a good 'bleed' of the cooling system via the screw in the top hose resolved this and I've had no problem like this since.
Fingers crossed for you!
Cheers
Mike

[5teve]

Well...

I had a look at it when nick bought it round last night and we are still pretty confused!

Oil in the harness probably wasnt helping but there really was only 2 errors logged... cleared them and they have gone.

Nick says that it hasnt 'overheated' since last week. Had a good look around and it looks like the tensioner is screwed... it bounces around all over the place and sounds like its clattering against something when the a/c is on. The electric fan is on with the a/c and goes off when the a/c is off. dont know if it runs continuously with the a/c tho.

The water level was low but not very low... and as nick has changed pipes etc etc recently i'd say that its very likely there is a shed load of air in the pipes which is taking time to come out. It also had the dreaded green coolant in so Nick will change that out for decent red stuff.

There is evidence of leaks all over from the pipes that he has replaced but there looks like a leak from the back of the water pump too. I seem to recall there being issues with water pumps?

As the issue is intemittent do you think a water pump issue could cause it? maybe the pump cavitating? just thinking out loud!

Nick also went for a drive with the nancom logging... max water temp was 93 but stayed fairly consistently at around 90, interestingly the EGR modulator never activated that i could see... everything else seemed fairly good.

The Rad cap too i wasnt sure of as the overflow (when the cap blows) running down the side of the expansion tank seemed to be weeping.. so was wondering if the cap was screwed too...

Bit of a mystery really.... maybe as Mike suggested its just air... and one of those things....

I'd be surprised if the head was the issue... any more suggestions?

Thanks

Steve

[Tombie]

I'd suggest getting a new radiator for 1, then flush and re-bleed...

But sooner, rather than later, its going to need a head gasket.

Intermittent suggests under load its unable to shed its heat loading.

Find a big hill, go for a decent hard run up it...

Any coolant loss = head coming off motor time...

[5teve]

Thanks Mike

He did give it a bit of left foot (4000+rpm) up a reasonable hill (not too many close to me) probably about a minute climb... which is when the temp picked to 93... then dropped once he hit the top...

Nick has had the Rad flushed but i'm not sure how effective it is...

Coolant loss i'm still not convinced about... until its flushed refilled and refilled several times more as the air bleeds out i dont think anyone can make a call on it losing anything.. i know it took about 5 top ups and about 3 or 4 days for the defender to settle... and i spend ages when filling it trying to bleed everything out...

He also mentioned that he gave it a pasting in the dunes at the weekend after doing the harness and it didnt play up... i would of thought that sand would of loaded it up quite well?

I hope for Nicks sake it isnt the head... but.. as he said... he's willing to do it and doesnt mind as he plans on keeping it.

Thanks

Steve