Weight and driving in sand on 18 inch tyres...

[Nomad9]

Hi Forumites,
Took a trip up to Denham over the Easter break, towed the TVan for a bit of relaxing R&R looking at Dolphins and stuff like that.
On the way up to Denham we stopped for the occasional break and as you do you check things, make sure everything is right. Well, at the first stop which was Gingers cafe for a spot of meat free breakfast as I exitied the trusty steed I could smell warmish rubber, checked the tyre temps and the rear ones were considerably warmer than the front tyres and also the camper trailer tyres (as you would expect), checked tyre pressures around the 40 psi mark, I've got Cooper HT plus 255 60 18's on.
I've now also got, a dual wheel carrier both wheels fitted, 18's, I have a long range tank 104 litres I also have a 40 litre Engle, which as you would expect was full at the time. I have a home made shelf on which I mount the Engle and fridge slide, I have a high lift jack mounted on the dual wheel carrier, (looks good but I could well take this off I don't know I can justify carrying this around with me all the time I've only ever used this twice in about ten years, if I do take it off that'll be the time I need it). I have two plastic drawers under the shelf, one has a multitude of parts and tools in it should something unfortunate happen, I have an air compressor also a snatch strap, shackles and first aid kit plus a small amount of snack type food in the second drawer.
At the second stop, Geraldton I think, I checked the max tyre pressure for the tyre on the side wall, noted it was 50 psi so I bumped the pressure up to around 46 psi, the tyre temp dropped considerably, still warmer than the front tyres so I left the pressure there.
Next issue, during my time around the Denham area I did some beach driving, my favorite topic..... Going along fine came acoss some soft stuff, straight down, well more or less. So I dropped the rear tyre pressures to around 11 psi, low I know but I was on my own and I wanted to make sure I got out OK. Didn't drop the front tyres at all, drove out no problem at all, did what I had to do and drove out onto the road again, apart from being stopped by one helpful gent who wanted to tell me my rear tyres appeared to be flat, he wasn't far wrong, but they were still at 12 psi. After I had finished I pumped my tyres back up to around 40 psi I proceeded back to the camp site all good.
No I don't think I'm that bad a driver, I've never had issues like this before when driving either my old GU Patrol 265 profile tyres or my classic Rangie which had 245 profile tyres on it, the Patrol had similar equipment installed, the Rangie had very little but had a cable accelerator and three and a half litres of pure grunt!!!!
When my D3 went down in the soft stuff, I couldn't get the auto to get that shock reverse bump you need every now and again to make a move, the engine and gearbox went into a stall where the engine revs would go to a certain place and the vehicle wouldn't move, no wheel spin either, put the vehicle into forward and off we went in a "puff of smoke". This is the second time this stall "thing" has happened is this normal?
The vehicle is faultless, no alarms, no messages nothing and runs like a dream. At the moment I'm just putting this down to weight, I can't find anything else, the tyres are a 255 profile, sure they're not BFG's but the performance shouldn't be that bad should it? I understand momentum theory, no problem there, but driving around on a beach with kids on it and other holiday makers acting like a right "pot herb" using the "I have to have momentum" excuse doesn't really cut it.
By the way, the way I wired my electronic brake controller where I wired the controller directly into the multi pin socket behind the left hand rear bumper worked a treat, even when the auto lights cut in nothing unexpected happened which I'm thankful about, I didn't do any bridging wires around the fues holders in the LH rear inside panel, just info for others.
Sorry the thread is so long I just wanted to get all the info in the thread so people can make informed constructive comments. :confused:

[discojools]

Nomad9,
You must turn DSC off for sandwork. Remember that if you select another program or turn the car off you will have to reselect DSC "off" again as the off setting is cancelled. Also I would have let your front tyres down too as every bit of grip is needed when your are fully loaded. When I crossed the Simpson I found it best to use "Command Shift" in manual mode as it stops the transmission from changing up a gear when you lift off the throttle.

[Dingmark Jim]

A lot of us have had to learn about disconnecting the DSC the hard way. It's pretty disconcerting to have the D3/4 "stall" at the worst possible time on sand. Now that you'll remember to disconnect th DSC you'll find that at 11psi you'll be laughing. I found with my old V8 D3 (with 18" HT+ Coopers) was fabulous on sand with the DSC off - especially given the weight.

[AnD3rew]

I now have the whole family trained, whenever we get back in the car on the sand the whole family chimes up "DSC off Dad" before we take off.

[trobbo]

Is dsc off specific to just sand driving or should it be turned off for all offroad work?

[gghaggis]

It's best to have it off in sand, and a muddy, slippery incline would be another candidate for disabling the DSC - basically any terrain where you might need a bit of power and you're likely to be sliding a little (or a lot!)

Cheers,

Gordon

[Dorko]

Excuse the question but; I have read this some many times on the FL2 and this sites forums about driving in sand and turning off the DSC. I too learnt the hard way many of times because i have a short memory and forget it turns back on after start up.

Anyway, why dont LR disable this when it goes to sand mode? I dont no anyone that actually drives with this on? (Knowingly)

And if you do drive with it on in sand, what are the benefits, because i jsut always lose power...

Dorko

[WhiteD3]

Been caught by the DSC button a couple of times trying to climb slippery slopes.

Re the issue of weight. There's no denying the D3/D4 is a heavy vehicle but all modern 4WD's are. D4 2.7 TDV6 base kerb weight is 2486kg. An LC200 GXL TD weighs 2720kg kerb weight.

Weights are from the brochures.

[Nomad9]

Hi White D3,
Yeap I realise the weight thing, my Patrol fully laden was 2980 klios I think or somewhere close and that was without a full fuel load, water and a full fridge. My Patrol was on 16 inch rims, is the Landcruiser on 18 inch rims? It's just that my D3 seems very heavy in the bot bot if you know what I mean, additionally I can't get the BFG's I had on my Patrol with the extra ply in the side wall all things that contribute to the place I'm in, in my patrol I only had to let my tyres down to 15 psi and I could basically go anywhere.
This DSC thing has caught me before and no doubt will catch me again, I remember now I didn't reset the DSC when I changed the program to try something else, this could well have something to do with what happened.
Thanks for the input.

[gps-au]

All this talk/writing about weights.....

This morning, I had to do some back street running in the eastern suburbs of Sydney.... along the way I ignored 4 street signs.....

They all were the same (4 different streets)... think about this for a mo...

A RED circle with a diagonal line thru it and BLACK lettering inside the circle... only 2 letters "3T"

I am still wondering what the signs were trying to say. :angel:

[rmp]

Sand mode in LRs desensitizes the DSC but does not switch it right off. And even when it's off it's still a little bit active but you need to be very enthusiastic to wake it from its slumber.

I have no idea why DSC isn't totally off in Sand mode by default.

Nobody can explain Land Rover design decisions any more they can explain the inner workings of the female mind.

Nomad9 why on earth did you air the rears to 11psi and leave the fronts as they were? I would suggest 25psi all round would have been more effective?

[Nomad9]

rmp,
"Why on earth", I'm having a little chuckle right now, good question......... At the time, it was hot, I was in a one lane part of the beach with no way around for other vehicles, I had one off to the right in front and one behind, when I got out I could see the fronts where up out of the sand and the rears where down to the wheel nuts, so the quickest way I could see out of my predicament was to wave at the two people in front and behind and do something quick to get myself out of the hole I was in.
Hindsight is a wonderful thing, in hindsight I would have been better lowering the pressures all round before I got to the soft bit. When I sent off I was passing parked two wheel drive cars and wagons on the beach I didn't expect the beach to go as soft as it did as quick as it did. You live an learn.
Fair comment, under normal circumstances I would have lowered all the tyres to the same pressure and maybe nearer 25, as the adage goes "time - place - circumstance"........ Still chuckling.............

[rmp]

Thanks Nomad. I thought perhaps there was some new sand driving technique I wasn't aware of. Whenever I see someone doing something I wouldn't I always want to know why in case they have discovered a better way.

You are hardly the first and won't be the last to have trouble in sand. It humbles people very quickly.