Grrrr!!!!! Tyre "service" providers

[JDNSW]

While in Yass, I developed a slow leak in one of my rear tyres, and got it fixed at the Yass branch of a well known tyre service franchise. When I checked tyres as I was leaving, I found it still (or possibly again) had a slow leak, and got them to pump it up, and told them about it. By last night, it was almost flat, so this morning I decided to take it off and take it to the local CRT to get fixed properly. It took me two hours to get the wheel nuts off, and I twisted off a 1/2" extension bar trying. Eventually got the worst one off using a hammer type impact wrench - the others came off with me jumping on an 18" breaker bar.

There is no excuse for this sort of thing - heaven help me if I had needed to change it on a lonely streetch of road without phone coverage! This is not the first time I have had this problem, although it is the first with that outfit. I wonder how many others are unknowingly driving round with immovably fixed wheels?

John

[VladTepes]

I feel your pain JD - rattle guns are evil.


I find the smaller indepedents are often a lot better service wise and helpful wise and quality wise than the big players.

[Landy Smurf]

that sucks and we have had that problem on our car.i dont like using power/air tools that much im old school

[Pedro_The_Swift]

you are right John,,

but they'd rather do it that way than have your wheel fall off. Which is their worst case scenario.

They dont really care about you trying to undo the nuts.

[It'sNotWorthComplaining!]

But "It's not worth Complaining!":D
NO BODY LISTENS ANY WAY:p

[Landy Smurf]

trust you to say that

[Shonky]

But "It's not worth Complaining!":D
NO BODY LISTENS ANY WAY:p

It is a bit "Shonky" though...

:wasntme:

[Tank]

John, one of those 12V Impact rattle guns will get just about any nut off, best $80 to $90 you'll ever spend, Regards Frank.

[Landy Smurf]

It is a bit "Shonky" though...

:wasntme:
:TakeABow:

[JDNSW]

John, one of those 12V Impact rattle guns will get just about any nut off, best $80 to $90 you'll ever spend, Regards Frank.

It would probably be worth having - but I certainly should never have to use one on a wheel nut. Thanks for telling me they work - I have wondered.

[Xtreme]

you are right John,,


but they'd rather do it that way than have your wheel fall off. Which is their worst case scenario.

They dont really care about you trying to undo the nuts.

That doesn't always follow.
I know of one case of overtightened wheel nuts on a Disco which resulted in three studs on the same wheel breaking in a remote part of the NT. It was a slow trip into Darwin hoping that the remaining two nuts would hold.

[Grumbles]

A subject I have often thought about. Perhaps it might be an idea to learn the nut torque setting suggested by Landrover and tell the tyre shop to torque to that setting by hand while you watch. Seems I've got some research to do it unless some one has a quick link to settings????

[JDNSW]

Further to this subject. Earlier today I phoned the company's national customer service manager and left a message on his phone. He called me back a short while ago, and agreed that I had reason to complain.

The end result is they are refunding the cost of the repair, sending a $50 gift voucher and requiring the Yass people to attend training on tightening wheel nuts.

My owner's manual does not give a torque figure for the 110, although I remember one tyre place saying that their book of torque figures give it as 85ft lbs. This sounds a bit high to me - the factory wheel brace for the 110 only provides a lever length for tightening of about six inches, doubled for undoing by a folding extension.

John

[Landy Smurf]

good work.keep them honest

[groucho]

I am pretty sure that all tyre places must use a tension wrench for checking
wheel nuts. As workplace regulations specify that now. Last month when i had the disco"s tyres replaced they used a special tension wrench and i asked why. They said they must do it by law now. They have been doing the ones on the trucks with a big one for years...........

[Landy Smurf]

where i was working they did not use one but they were just a general mechanic place but still were taking and doing up wheel nuts all the time

[Xtreme]

....................
My owner's manual does not give a torque figure for the 110, although I remember one tyre place saying that their book of torque figures give it as 85ft lbs. This sounds a bit high to me - the factory wheel brace for the 110 only provides a lever length for tightening of about six inches, doubled for undoing by a folding extension.

John

The Rave Manual for the D2 gives wheel nut torque of 140Nm (103ft lbs) - this would be for the alloy wheel nuts.
I have read somewhere, but can't find it ATM, that the specified torque for the steel wheel nuts was 80 or 90ft lbs.

[I Love My Landy!]

John, one of those 12V Impact rattle guns will get just about any nut off, best $80 to $90 you'll ever spend, Regards Frank.

Sometimes not even a medium duty rattle gun will work. The last tyre shop i went to tightened some of my wheel nuts so tight that not even my air powered rattle gun could get them off! My rattle gun is rated to 240lb-ft (325nm)! :o Some wheel nuts came off really easily, but the others just wouldn't budge.

Edward

[Graeme]

Earlier today I phoned the company's national customer service manager and left a message on his phone. He called me back a short while ago, and agreed that I had reason to complain.

The end result is they are refunding the cost of the repair, sending a $50 gift voucher and requiring the Yass people to attend training on tightening wheel nuts.
I like this approach as there is a real chance that some good will come of the complaint. A much better result than just abusing someone.

[Bigbjorn]

Shortly after the local B** J*** shop did a wheel alignment and tyre rotation on my County, I had it up on the hoist to check wheel bearings before a trip. A 1/2" drive air impact wrench would not move most of the nuts. Had to go and borrow a 3/4" drive which struggled with some. Would have been just bloody great to get a flat down the Diamantina.

Not a sign of anti-seize being used either.

I went back and made my thoughts known to the manager. I suggested that IF they got any more business from me then I would expect to see the fitter loosen the nuts with the on-board lug nut wrench and then re-tighten them using a torque wrench.

[JDNSW]

Shortly after the local B** J*** shop did a wheel alignment and tyre rotation on my County, I had it up on the hoist to check wheel bearings before a trip. A 1/2" drive air impact wrench would not move most of the nuts. Had to go and borrow a 3/4" drive which struggled with some. Would have been just bloody great to get a flat down the Diamantina.

Not a sign of anti-seize being used either.

I went back and made my thoughts known to the manager. I suggested that IF they got any more business from me then I would expect to see the fitter loosen the nuts with the on-board lug nut wrench and then re-tighten them using a torque wrench.

I have in the past had to borrow a 3/4 drive set and use ten feet of pipe on the breaker bar to loosen a wheel nut. That was the same outfit that some years earlier managed to remove a lot of paint off the County wheels, and when queried, admitted they used a shifter on the wheel nuts "because it is such an unusual size". Unfortunately they are the largest tyre place in Dubbo! Hard not to do business with.

John

[rick130]

John, I can't recall the standard Dunlop wheel nut tension, but the HD 130 rims call for 120-130lb/ft, 163-177Nm.

Just found it in the manual ('94-'98 MY) and the standard rims call for 80lb/ft, alloys 96lb/ft.

[drifter]

My stepson 'works' in that industry so I sat him down last night and read most of this thread to him (I couldn't leave him to read it himself - attention span of a gnat)...

Basically, he said that they all have a set of torque wrenches that are specific for each range of car tyre size - but limited to 3 sets covering the whole range.

Most of the guys, however, get lazy and just fire the things on. He is actually more aware of th problem, though, after he rattle-gunned a set of wheels on my vehicle for me and, when he got home, I made him try to take them off using the standard brace that comes with the vehicle. He is young and strong - and couldn't shift them - so I gave him a lecture about old farts like me stuck on the side of the road without a hope in hell of getting a flat off...

My other comparison for him was 'what if it was your mother stuck on the side of the road...'

He gets it (that convo was about a year ago) but admits there are many who don't


and he knows those guys at the Yass store - and my family have spent time at a BBQ with the Regional Manager from that outfit - while what he said and offered are designed to take the sting off your experience, I really doubt there will be any retraining - just a point made at a weekly meeting about the complaint.

And anyone offering me a free voucher to go back and taste a second experience of their less than satisfactory service would just be laughed at...



just my 2 cents...

[ramblingboy42]

I have recently purchased a set of 5 Khumo Kl71's from tyrepower in labrador, gold coast queensland. their service was excellent, they did the nuts up properly to tourque setttings and offered to change over for free from lh to rh rotation if I damaged a tyre that required directional change. their price was also right! I recommend this service to anyone in SE Qld.

[Tank]

It would probably be worth having - but I certainly should never have to use one on a wheel nut. Thanks for telling me they work - I have wondered.
John, they work all right, I also use whenever my air powered rattle gun fails to undo a nut/bolt, like bolt in crank snout of 300TDi and 2.25 diesel, I agree you should never have to use one on a wheel nut, Regards Frank.

[waynep]

When we were in Alice last year we needed a couple of slow leaks fixed. This was a major tyre outfit and they used a torque wrench, no rattle guns. First time I'd seen that. Mind may have been only coz I was standing there.

Any work I get done at a tyre place, where I'm not watching, I re-tension the wheel nuts myself as soon as I can. ( as well as being too tight some have been loose ).

[Landy Smurf]

i think i will do that in the future

[BMKal]

I use a small tyre place in Boulder for both mine and the wife's vehicles. Usually I stay there while he is doing the job, and more often than not help him out (there's usually only the one bloke working there).

I have noticed that, while he uses air powered rattle gun to remove wheels, he always uses a torque wrench when fitting, whether on my vehicles or on others that I have seen him working on.

One of the advantages of using a small "owner operated" business.

[bee utey]

Years ago a mate ran a small McLeod's tyre shop in Lobethal SA. Their rattle gun was specially modified so it could not do more than spin on the nuts hand tight. (although off was full power). Then he applied the torque wrench. That was company policy.
I believe you can get torque limiting sockets to go with rattle guns but I haven't used one.

[bobslandies]

you are right John,,

but they'd rather do it that way than have your wheel fall off. Which is their worst case scenario.

They dont really care about you trying to undo the nuts.

The real worst case scenario is that the m*r*ns (read "professionals") stretch your studs and they then break! Only for the fact that Land Rover studs are bigger than most at 9/16"BSF or alternatively 16mm that it doesn't happen that often with our vehicles. Today I removed a broken 9/16"UNF stud from a hub and I will bet it had been tightened with a rattle gun. Try breaking a 9/16" quality bolt!
It regularly happens with smaller studs that are overtightened.
Torqued up properly to specifications they will not come undone - and that can even be done with an airtool.

Bob