Cable driven wipers

[COFFEY76]

Hi,

is it possible to speed up my cable wipers?

Im getting my 69 109" registered and require the motor to be engineered (therefore the whole car) and i have to have 2 speed wipers with a maximum speed of at least 45 cycles per minute.

ive tested it without the motor running and not a constant stream of water and got pretty close with 37 odd cycles. and ive sorted out a resistor to slow it down and create another speed....

I dont want to have to pull out the wipers and replace them with another cable or even electric cos ive heard electric wipers require the firewall to be cut Therefore more engineering inspections and costs.

damn engineers

[p38arover]

Why would original equipment need to be engineered? Does he know what he's talking about?

The easiest option might be to replace the motor with a 2-speed motor from another car.

[COFFEY76]

i agree with what ur saying but yeah unfortunately its stated clearly in the regulations in vic roads that needs to be 2 speed 45 cycles per minute.

im not against changing the wiper over but what other motor would be compatable?

[akelly]

Mate that sounds bizzare! If the car had one speed wipers when built and you haven't made any change to the wipers there is no reason why you should have to change them. The engineer should be certifying that the engine mods are safe and meet the appropriate standards, the rest of the car is just a normal "roadworthy" check.

Even in NSW an engineer just checks the modification you have made. It's not like you have built a car from scratch, or a kit - in those cases you do need engineer certifcates for the entire vehicle. I've have engineering done on 2 cars and never had them check anything other than the mod I was getting approval for.

I'd double check that before I went to the trouble of mucking around with the wipers. Unless of course you want to chuck a 2 speed motor in, but thats about $100.

Cheers,

Adam

[BigJon]

It may say it in Vicroads regulations, but if the vehicle complies with the buidl date ADRs then it should suffice. Any regulatory changes should not be retrospective.

[COFFEY76]

ok what everyone is saying makes perfect sense to me.

but seeing as of the three engineers within 50km's of where i live referred me to this guy. and there are a list of engineers that vic roads will take notice of im kinda stuck with him.

if anyone could help me get onto a document which outlines what can stay original or not, that would be great.

He said right from the start that he would have to look at the whole car, but as soon as i say anything i get the 'u need to show me in an official document'

needless to say im not happy

[akelly]

What he may be getting at is that you need to show him what the original specs of the car were. When I got my holden conversion engineered in NSW the dude looked up things like the type of brakes fitted originally - this was to confirm that the boosted brakes (mine is a very late IIA) were original equipment and did not need engineering approval. He also did a "brake test" to confirm that the brakes met the specs for that size engine. Definitely didn't check the wipers though!

Your man may not have access to the original specs - if you have a workshop manual for your car (correct year and model) you should be able to use that to show him that single speed wipers are original fitment.

If he is suggesting your landy has to comply with ADR16, which refers to wiper speeds, he is a goose. ADR16 is only applicable to vehicles manufactured after 1/73.

Perhaps it would be worth posting in the "General Chat" section to find someone in Vic that has had the same conversion engineered recently (there's bound to be someone) and they can steer you to someone better?

Good luck!

Adam

[p38arover]

I hope he never has to "engineer" a 1903 vehicle or similar which had no wipers!

Which reminds me of a friend's FIL - he tried to register his 1903 Cadillac and was refused by the NSW RTA because "Cadillac never made cars back then"! GAAAHHH!!

[Mick_Marsh]

Interesting debate.
I am currently investigating a similar problem.
Seat Belts.
My Mercedes was produced when it was not compulsory to wear seat belts or have them fitted. It does, however, have aftermarket seat belts in the front but none in the rear. During the registration process, it got through the roadworthy and Vicroads inspection. I think the reasoning is because it was produced without seat belts, having them in the front is a plus.
Being a motoring enthusiast, I tend to peer into other peoples prides and joys. Whilst on one of my visits to the Chocolate Mill, I peered into someone's 1920's Buick. It had no seat belts at all and was registered (full registration, not classic/historic).
My point is, in my experience, if it came with a single speed wiper motor it should be registered with a single speed wiper motor.
If you wanted to register a HQ Holden, they shouldn't be requesting you to fit air bags to the current manufacturing standards (although, with a HQ, it would be a good idea).

P.S. I am currently investigating if you don't have rear seat belts fitted, can you legally have passengers in the rear seats. My actions will be to fit a set.

[akelly]

Mick, my understanding is (at least for QLD and NSW) that seatbelts are only required if the vehicle was fitted with, or for, seatbelts. So if your merc has mountings for seatbelts in the rear you must fit them - if not, then no need. Of course, thats only really for show cars and museum items - if you have people in the car then it makes good sense to fit belts.

Cheers,

Adam

[Mick_Marsh]

Mick, my understanding is (at least for QLD and NSW) that seatbelts are only required if the vehicle was fitted with, or for, seatbelts. So if your merc has mountings for seatbelts in the rear you must fit them - if not, then no need. Of course, thats only really for show cars and museum items - if you have people in the car then it makes good sense to fit belts.

Cheers,

Adam
Yes Adam, my old Mercedes will be getting rear seat belts. I don't want my rear seat passengers slapping me on the back of the head as they pass by on their journey out through the windscreen. I'm investigating for interests sake. Many other old Mercedes owners do not have seat belts in the rear as the rear seat is never used (having sat in the rear of these coupes, I can understand why they're not used. They seem to be designed for people without legs.)
The various departments of transport in each state have different rules regarding roadworthy's and design rules.
My understanding is if you modify a vehicle from manufacturers specs, you need an engineers report. (I'm speaking from experience here as one of my Landrovers is so modified that it required an engineers report.) Further to this, my understanding is (being pedantic here), if COFFEY76 modifies his wiper motor to a two speed setup, he will require a costly engineers report for the wiper motor. In Coffey76's case, as he is already getting an engineers report done for the vehicle motor, I would advise him to get it done rather than argue.

Does anyone know how to speed up the wipers on a '69 109"? I assume they're vacuum operated and oiling the wiper blades is not an option.

[UncleHo]

G'day COFFEY76 :)

The Series 2a's fitted with cable operated wipers(chassis suffix "D"onwards Neg earth) only had single speed units fitted (Lucas type LU-DR-3A,Rover part No R551226)and it was not self parking, and most 2a's were built before the Australian Design regulation came into force,1971,and only about 1973 was the requirement for 2 speed wipers and twin external rearveiw mirrors included,so if your vehicle in say 1969 then it predates the ADR's by a couple of years and those rules do not affect your vehicle, as the ADR's are NOT retrospective.


Hope that is of some help :)

cheers

[COFFEY76]

Cheers everyone.

ive found a document from a government infastructure website. the document is the 1984 edition of the ADR's which state that ADR 16 windscreen wipers must have 2 speeds and 45 cycles per minute for all vehicles manufactured on or after 1/1/73. with this information i will talk to the engineer. in theory if i have the paperwork then he will hear me out. but seeing as he is the one that has to sign the papers ill have to do what he wants.


NOW all i need to do is make sure i can past the brake test...

[UncleHo]

G'day COFFEY76 :)


You do NOT have to do what he wants he, has to do what the ADR's require, and ADR 16 only comes into affect on vehicles built after1/1/1973 and make that quite clear or that you will call the registry and report him, for not complying with the ARD rules as set out by Vic roads:)



cheers

[akelly]

Hey Mick - your point about the 2 speed wipers requiring engineering is interesting. I've been looking for a S3 motor for mine so I can have 2 speed. I have no intention of getting an engineers certificate(!) - my interpretation is that it would be the same as putting H3 headlights into a car that had sealed beam units from the factory, no engineering required as they meet the current requirements for headlights.

I could be wrong but geez, you'd be stiff to get pulled up for having 2 speed wipers in your SIIA landy!:)

cheers,

Adam

[groucho]

G'day COFFEY76 :)


You do NOT have to do what he wants he, has to do what the ADR's require, and ADR 16 only comes into affect on vehicles built after1/1/1973 and make that quite clear or that you will call the registry and report him, for not complying with the ARD rules as set out by Vic roads:)



cheers

I have had a few run in's with RTA inspectors and such over the years
and i often had to tell them you FOLLOW the the ADR laws you don't MAKE them. If you have to go further up the chain, fine.........

[Mick_Marsh]

Hey Mick - your point about the 2 speed wipers requiring engineering is interesting. I've been looking for a S3 motor for mine so I can have 2 speed. I have no intention of getting an engineers certificate(!) - my interpretation is that it would be the same as putting H3 headlights into a car that had sealed beam units from the factory, no engineering required as they meet the current requirements for headlights.

I could be wrong but geez, you'd be stiff to get pulled up for having 2 speed wipers in your SIIA landy!:)

cheers,

Adam
Adam,
I was being pedantic and taking the letter of the law to the nth degree so to speak.
Its the sort of thing an officious bureaucrat would do if they took a dislike to you. This happened to the guy next to me trying to register a Torana whilst I had a ridiculously easy time with a roadworthy as dogey as. (Don't get me wrong. The Mercedes is being brought up to scratch.)
I also have a Moke with a Gemini wiper motor. Who would notice? You're right about the headlights if you take the letter of the law to the nth degree but who is going to get an engineers report for that. They'll probably want the wiring loom to be increased in current carrying capacity and fused anyway (a good idea to do).
The question is "Where is the line drawn and who draws it?" (I have found being polite and saying yes a lot helps although puting it into practice is hard.)
Adam, I'd change the wiper motor and not worry about it.

Adam,
Your point about bringing an old car up to current ADR's, If you brought a '69 Falcon up to the spec's of a current Falcon, you would definitely need an engineers report. (I've seen that done)

[COFFEY76]

Cheers UncleHO,
its always encouraging to get some firm advice.
Being new to engineers its hard to know whats legit and whats not.

[p38arover]

I assume they're vacuum operated and oiling the wiper blades is not an option.

They are electric. Very few Brit vehicles had vacuum wipers. I can only recall some old Fords, e.g., Anglias and Prefects having vacuum wipers. Even my old '38 Vauxhall had electric wipers.

[JDNSW]

They are electric. Very few Brit vehicles had vacuum wipers. I can only recall some old Fords, e.g., Anglias and Prefects having vacuum wipers. Even my old '38 Vauxhall had electric wipers.

The only English car I have struck with vacuum wipers was the 1931 Swift I learned to drive on (among others), I was astounded to learn that Holdens were still using them at that time!

John

[p38arover]

I remember a mate's mid-Fifties 100E Prefect had them. Awful things (the wipers) - the car was a bit better.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

G'day COFFEY76 :)

The Series 2a's fitted with cable operated wipers(chassis suffix "D"onwards Neg earth) only had single speed units fitted (Lucas type LU-DR-3A,Rover part No R551226)and it was not self parking, and most 2a's were built before the Australian Design regulation came into force,1971,and only about 1973 was the requirement for 2 speed wipers and twin external rearveiw mirrors included,so if your vehicle in say 1969 then it predates the ADR's by a couple of years and those rules do not affect your vehicle, as the ADR's are NOT retrospective.Que?

I had a number SIIa, none were subject to or affixed with compliance plates and the cable operated wipers were all self parking.

The SIII still had single speed wipers up until the late 1970's even though the brochures suggested that they had two speed. The ones in the vehicles weren't.

If you need 2 speed wipers, get the motor, switch and wiring harness from a SIII Stage 1 and fit that. They are direct swap and you don't have a problem with the angle of the sweep. (And they self park.)

[JDNSW]

As stated, ADRs are not (in general*) retrospective, and all 2as predate ADRs. And I agree with Diana, no 2as had two speed wipers, and all cable operated wipers are (supposed to be) self parking.

One point worth noting though is that ADRs applicable to cars and commercial vehicles (including all Series + 90/110 + Defender) are different. A good example of this is currently the lack of child restraint anchorages and airbags in Defenders. This is probably why despite two speed wipers being a requirement in 1973, they did not appear in Series 3 until later.

* Particularly before the supposedly national ADRs, there were a few retrospective changes made to equipment requirements. A couple of them that I have encountered myself were the retrofitting of reflectors to all vehicles in about 1957 in NSW, and in 1967 I was required to fit a second wiper to a 1961 2a, also in NSW.

John

[gromit]

Coffey76, I'm not sure what motor you have fitted but is the engineer taking the approach that the car may go faster than original and therefore it needs 2 speed wipers ?
A friend fitted a big Ford motor in an old Land Rover many years ago and one of the things he had to do at the time was fit 2 speed wipers along with servo assisted brakes....

If the car is left standard you wouldn't have to change so I guess the only question is whether the motor you are fitting potentially increases the speed/performance over original, or is it just an opportunity for the engineer to get the car to meet more modern ADR's.

Mick, regarding seatbelts. Vicroads list the start date for compulsory seatbelts in a passenger car as 1/1/1969. Details are on 'Vehicle Standards Information 26' I have a .pdf of this but cannot find it on the VicRoads website.
If you fit seatbelts to a car that has never had them fitted originally I guess you would need an engineers report.


Regards,

Colin

[Scouse]

require the motor to be engineered (therefore the whole car) I've had a browse through this thread & couldn't see what you engine is fitted to your Landy.

When fitting a bigger motor in Morries, I need to fit 2 speed wipers, bigger brakes, seat belts, demister......

I can only assume that you have fitted a bigger motor than standard so 2 speed wipers seems like it might be a requirement in your state.

2 speed motors are fairly easy to fit but you need to match the sweep angle. This can be done by searching for the right motor, adapting yours to take the 2 speed motor or by fitting the cable drive pin in a different spot.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

As stated, ADRs are not (in general*) retrospective, and all 2as predate ADRs. And I agree with Diana, no 2as had two speed wipers, and all cable operated wipers are (supposed to be) self parking.

<snip>In general you're correct, however during my V8 SIIa conversion I too was required to fit 2 speed wipers, heater demister with two speeds, washer bottle and they required me to remove the inwards facing seats in the rear of the station wagon.

So at least my SIIa had two speed wipers. Eventually. :D

As Scouse says the problem I had was the sweep angle. Getting 2 speeds was easy as a lot of contemporary cars had Lucas 2 speed cable wipers.
What I did for mine was to acquire a motor from a Morris Marina, after unsuccessfully trying to get a drive with the correct sweep angle I reverted to Scouse's suggestion of moving the drive pin in the drive wheel inside the motor housing.

To get a switch that matched the look of the SIIa Suffix G & H* instrument panels I modified a headlamp switch so that it would supply power to the park circuit with the switch in the Off position.


* The instrument panel changed with the suffix D - but my vehicles fitted with the 2 speed wipers were Suff G and Suff H.

[UncleHo]

G'day Folks :)

My 1968 Series 11a (military spec) suffix"D" still has it's original rectangular wiper motor,and it is single speed non self parking,(suffix D &E inclusive) the later round wiper motors were (LU75664,Rover 606013*)were used from suffix "F"onwards.

*indicates new part not used on any previous Rover model

And as JDNSW stated that the ADR's for cars differed slightly to those required for commercial chassied vehicles which Landrover were classed as.

In Qld seatbelts were not required to be fitted until 1/1/1972 in commercial vehicles.E.I a December registered 1971 Falcon ute did not require belts BUT a 1/1/1972 Falcon ute did, it caused a lot of problems at the time and a lot of new owners had them retro fitted during the warranty period, as they were fined heavily when travelling interstate.

cheers

[Lotz-A-Landies]

G'day Folks :)

My 1968 Series 11a (military spec) suffix"D" still has it's original rectangular wiper motor,and it is single speed non self parking,(suffix D &E inclusive) the later round wiper motors were (LU75664,Rover 606013*)were used from suffix "F"onwards. <snip>This is interesting, as our 1950's Rover 90 had the square motor Lucas cable wipers and was self parking.

I also fitted a cable wiper motor system from a 1950's Morris Minor to my 1950 80" and that system was also self parking.

I wonder why Rover Co. would fit non self parking cable wipers to the suffix D Land Rover in 1967? Confuses the hell out of me! :confused: :confused: :confused:

[JDNSW]

This is interesting, as our 1950's Rover 90 had the square motor Lucas cable wipers and was self parking.

I also fitted a cable wiper motor system from a 1950's Morris Minor to my 1950 80" and that system was also self parking.

I wonder why Rover Co. would fit non self parking cable wipers to the suffix D Land Rover in 1967? Confuses the hell out of me! :confused: :confused: :confused:

I refer to my original comment that they were supposed to be self parking. Interestingly, looking at the wiring diagrams, a significant change to the wiring when the wiper motor changed was that the earlier one had the switch in the earth circuit, the later one in the live circuit. This means only the self parking on the earlier one depends on the earthing of the motor - in the later circuit, a faulty earth means the wipers don't work. Maybe this explains the perception that some were not self parking?

John

[p38arover]

So when I re-register the IIA with Holden 202 which it has had in previous registrations, will I need an engineer's certificate and 2-speed wipers?

[Mick_Marsh]

So when I re-register the IIA with Holden 202 which it has had in previous registrations, will I need an engineer's certificate and 2-speed wipers?
You shouldn't need to. If it's the same motor that it was previously registered with and the Department of Transport has on record, they wouldn't need to. It must have peen done before.

[Scouse]

I would say so.

Don't be surprised if they ask for more mods too but that depends on how the Land Rover brakes/spec compares to the Holden.

[Scouse]

You shouldn't need to. If it's the same motor that it was previously registered with and the Department of Transport has on record, they wouldn't need to. It must have peen done before.I believe that once the registration has lapsed, the game starts again.
Of course, if an engineers report exists for the original registration, then this can be used again if the same regs apply.

[JDNSW]

I suspect most Holden conversions were done before anybody thought of engineering approval! Which probably means that if the registration has lapsed, yes, it will require approval.

John

[COFFEY76]

Hi all,

Just to recap why i need to play with wipers.

Dads old land rover 2A has been fitted with a holden 202 motor (hi comp - causes even more problems for engineering)

It had been purchased 30 years ago with registration.

It remained registered until 2008 (unlucky i know)

on trying to re-register my mechanic informed me that the engine number on the car didnt match up to the number on the long standing registration.

talked to vic roads and they had no record or citation on their records of the engine conversion, therefore i need an engineers report.

The engineer inspected it and i needed to get new tires, new exhaust, remount seat belts and reinforce them, and 2 speed wipers.

Just rang him today armed with my ADR16 document telling him that because the car is older than the 1973 rule shouldn't i therefore be exempt. He was quick to tell me that because i am engineering an upgraded engine i will require 2 speed wipers cos of ruling blah blah blah.

SOO now im looking around for some way to get 2 speed. Hopefully they will run fast enough for me to only need to put a resitor in the circuit (i havent had a chance to check cos the car is at the mechanics getting new wheel cylinder and brakes pressure bled)

but failing that, is there another motor that i can just bolt on that will fit the existing cable that will run at 2 speeds?

[JDNSW]

.......
but failing that, is there another motor that i can just bolt on that will fit the existing cable that will run at 2 speeds?

Late Series 3 are two speed motors and will drop in, although the switch and wiring will need updating as well. I suspect, but am not sure that 110 and early Defender also will.

John

[COFFEY76]

Cheers.

so all i would need to do would be get a new late S3 motor and connect it up? dont need to change the cable itself? just re-wire a new motor in...sounds TOOO easy!

[UncleHo]

G'day COFFEY76 :)

Why don't you just pull the Holden and fit the original 2.25 4cylinder back to it,save on engineering, rego,and it is then original, so no need for 2 speed wipers,(or the engineer) and it will go just as quick, as the final drive ratio governs the lot, and it will only require a transport dept sighting to confirm the changed engine No. :) and rego will be cheaper I think, and if Vic Roads haven't got the engine change noted that means it is still known to them by it's original engine, so it then is only a number change.



cheers

[COFFEY76]

well it is a possibility, but ill have to hunt down a petrol engine and then have to make up new engine mounts (as the ones for the 202, which are not original, are welded back to the chassis) I would then assume i would have to work out the whole generator altenator re wiring?

apart from all the **** farting around i have to do for this engineering cert.

what is so bad about a holden motor? apart from wearing down driveline faster (so ive heard)

[akelly]

I know this doesn't help you, but your engineer is a ******

[COFFEY76]

haha nah mate i agree with you.

but all hope is not lost! this car is painfully close to being done. ive spent alot of time and money to get where i am. so fiddling around is not worrying me its just frustrating because i want to get it on the ROAD!! or rather off road.

[akelly]

Cool :cool:

I've been chasing a 2 speed motor for mine, just because it would be nice to have... they seem to run to about $100 on fleabay, thats for a new one.

Cheers,

Adam

[JDNSW]

................
what is so bad about a holden motor? apart from wearing down driveline faster (so ive heard)

Problems with Holden motor.

1. Gearing does not suit most Holden engines. Really need either overdrive or high ratio transfer case if used on the road at all.

2. Carburetter does not like steep slopes - major problem for offroad operation.

3. Engine lubrication does not like steep slopes. Loss of oil pressure and consequent engine damage is likely on steep slopes, particularly if engine oil is low.

Apart from this the major concerns are how well the conversion was done. There have been reports that some gearbox adapters were not all that accurately made, and have led to gearbox and clutch problems. The standard Holden aircleaner is a bit inadequate for dusty conditions, and on the earlier engines so is the crankcase breather system.

John

[Mick_Marsh]

You might try wiper motors from other english marques such as Morris 1100's, 1500's, etc. They look similar and might fit. I used to have heaps but I think I've tossed them all out now.

[Bunjeel]

Agree re the below, but on the positive side:
1. They're very reliable, economical and don't leak oil.
2. Easy to work on and parts available anywhere.
2. Carburettor can be modified to cope with steeps.
3. Steeps no problem with the crankcase oil at full + ,
4. Very strong performance on low-range.

I might be biased 'cos my Shorty has a 186S in it. I reckon it all comes down to how well the conversion was done. It shouldn't shorten driveline lifespan as there's not a huge amount of torque increase over the original motor. Overdrive sure helps on the highway though.

cheers,

John



Problems with Holden motor.

1. Gearing does not suit most Holden engines. Really need either overdrive or high ratio transfer case if used on the road at all.

2. Carburetter does not like steep slopes - major problem for offroad operation.

3. Engine lubrication does not like steep slopes. Loss of oil pressure and consequent engine damage is likely on steep slopes, particularly if engine oil is low.

Apart from this the major concerns are how well the conversion was done. There have been reports that some gearbox adapters were not all that accurately made, and have led to gearbox and clutch problems. The standard Holden aircleaner is a bit inadequate for dusty conditions, and on the earlier engines so is the crankcase breather system.

John

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Summary of Holden engines.

There are truths in both of the above opinions.

A lot of problems that people experience/d with Holden engines is because of poor maintenance or because they fitted a Holden engine that was worn out BEFORE being put into a Land Rover. The camshafts on Holden engines frequently were ground to mate with an automatic transmission and were not suited to Land Rovers.

Holden engines have relatively small oil volumes, this can lead to oil starvation on either steep inclines (front bulge sump) or steep decents (rear bulge sump) and it mostly depends upon which model sump is fitted to the engine. The best model sump was that fitted to the HT Holden as the bulge is in the centre.

The Holden (Stromberg) carby needs to have its float level lowered to prevent flooding on steep inclines. An adjustable main jet is an advantage.

Some adapter kits, particularly Dello, had significant alignment problems (3 planes), causing wear on primary pinion constant gears.

The clutch arrangement was a problem with some adapters. For the pre-diaphragm pressure plates, the best conversion was to use Vauxhaul Velox/Ferguson TE20 B&B clutch housing with LR springs/internals on the Holden flywheel. Some conversions used a specially machined heavy flywheel which gave better low-down low torque than the standard flywheel.

Overheating was sometimes a problem. This was often caused by lack of air flow through the radiator, the low eficiency of the Holden fan, the removal of the radiator fan cowl in some conversions and compounded by the low oil volume. Adding an efficient fan, correct fitting radiator cowling, addition of an electric thermatic fan and the addition of an external oil cooler usually solved the cooling problems.

I have a SIII 109/Holden 202 with standard gearing and it is reliable, have not had it overheat, it will tavel all day st 90KPH uphill and down dale but can travel at 110KPH if I choose to and it outperforms the original Rover 6 in every area except for low speed touque, although the additional 700cc capacity of the Holden mostly compensates the low speed torque.

[COFFEY76]

So with adjusted carby and full oil there isnt really an issue with off road driving?

[isuzurover]

Cheers.

so all i would need to do would be get a new late S3 motor and connect it up? dont need to change the cable itself? just re-wire a new motor in...sounds TOOO easy!

I fitted a 2-speed wiper motor to my IIA, just because I had one. The cable is attached to the motor, so you usually change the cable with the motor (or I did anyway).

The wiper drive spindles/gears and their housings need to be changed as well, as the 2-speed motor has a different stroke. If you use the single speed gears the wipers will wipe right off the edge of the screen.

So you will need:
(1) Motor
(2) Spindles and housing
(3) switch
(4) Wiring (I recall it is just 1 or two extra wires to run)

[Lotz-A-Landies]

So with adjusted carby and full oil there isnt really an issue with off road driving?Holden powered Land Rovers have driven all over Australia for decades.

As with any engine conversion, it has to be done in a professional manner, correctly modifying/tuning all of the aspects of the conversion. If it's not done and maintained in a professional manner it will probably give trouble and be unreliable as will any vehicle modified or not.

Diana

[COFFEY76]

I fitted a 2-speed wiper motor to my IIA, just because I had one. The cable is attached to the motor, so you usually change the cable with the motor (or I did anyway).

The wiper drive spindles/gears and their housings need to be changed as well, as the 2-speed motor has a different stroke. If you use the single speed gears the wipers will wipe right off the edge of the screen.

So you will need:
(1) Motor
(2) Spindles and housing
(3) switch
(4) Wiring (I recall it is just 1 or two extra wires to run)

So i would be able to buy all that in a kit? or pull it out of a series 3?

[COFFEY76]

Holden powered Land Rovers have driven all over Australia for decades.

Well the one im working on has had the holden engine in it for about 30 years and its still got a sticker from the alice springs department of transport conference 1984. so its proven to be reliable.

[hawequas]

hi chasps

i have a 53 80" with a holden grey 138 on very poor welding it does start but i have not driven it, as i am about to do a total rebuild with new wiring, paint job etc should i replace the engine before i get to carried away with the rest of the job

ta garth

[isuzurover]

So i would be able to buy all that in a kit? or pull it out of a series 3?

Kit? NFI, but yes, you could pull it from a LATE MODEL SIII

[JDNSW]

hi chasps

i have a 53 80" with a holden grey 138 on very poor welding it does start but i have not driven it, as i am about to do a total rebuild with new wiring, paint job etc should i replace the engine before i get to carried away with the rest of the job

ta garth

Depends on what you intend with the rebuild. It has obviously had that engine for a long time, but your comments about the welding suggest that it may not be the best of conversions. A further problem may be that assuming it is not registered, you will need to get engineering approval for the conversion, and this may well require it to be done properly, for example the welding!

On the other hand, sourcing a replacement engine similar to the original is likely to be difficult and expensive.

It might be worth noting that the principal reason for replacing a Rover engine in the past was usually because the cost of the conversion was far cheaper than overhauling the worn Rover engine. In the case of Series 1 Landrovers, there was also a useful increase in power that outweighed the disadvantages, although the change from a worn out engine to a relatively unworn one was the major improvement.

John

[COFFEY76]

I purchased a new 2 speed windscreen wiper motor from a mini and moke parts dealer in heidelberg today. brand new from england, and its exactly the same design, everything fits perfectly, and should meet the required speed. only need to wire it up and boom boom.

[geodon]

I have read this thread with some alarm as I have a Holden powered Ser2A I want to re-register. Eventually.
I rang VicRoads & was told that as it was registered previously with the same engine no. then approval is assumed to have been already obtained so all I need is a RWC to re-register it.

Which is fair enough, I reckon!

Retrospectivity sucks!

[Lotz-A-Landies]

I purchased a new 2 speed windscreen wiper motor from a mini and moke parts dealer in heidelberg today. brand new from england, and its exactly the same design, everything fits perfectly, and should meet the required speed. only need to wire it up and boom boom.Great

You may have to play around a little with making up the switch, or try the mini place for a caoorec toggle switch.

Just one important point to check is that it has a satisfactory sweep angle, you can do this by fitting it up and seeing what happens. If it sweeps past both side of the windscreen frame you'll need to modify it.

You may be able to transplant the one from the original LR one.

[p38arover]

I have read this thread with some alarm as I have a Holden powered Ser2A I want to re-register. Eventually.
I rang VicRoads & was told that as it was registered previously with the same engine no. then approval is assumed to have been already obtained so all I need is a RWC to re-register it.

Which is fair enough, I reckon!

Retrospectivity sucks!

I'm worried, too. I don't have any past rego papers. I do have the plates which are still on the car.

I doubt the NSW RTA still has any record of it. I wish I knew someone in the RTA to get them to check the records.

I wonder if I just go to the RTA if they will check for me?

[Mick_Marsh]

Ron,
They should be able to do a search on the NSW rego plates

Vehicle history check (http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/myrta/vehiclehistory.html) for NSW

[Lotz-A-Landies]

I'm worried, too. I don't have any past rego papers. I do have the plates which are still on the car.

I doubt the NSW RTA still has any record of it. I wish I knew someone in the RTA to get them to check the records.

I wonder if I just go to the RTA if they will check for me?Ron

It all depends upon the station that issues the blue slip. There are some modifications which don't require engineers certification, one of those is an increase in engine capacity of less than 15%. A Holden 173 or 179 fits well within the 15% and add to that the SIII Stage 1 had both a 3.5 litre V8 and a 3.9 litre diesel on the same suspension and brakes. Similarly the fact that the Land Rover has a chassis means that the rules are different to other cars.

So it comes down to what the inspector will accept and what he wont.

[geodon]

I don't have papers but I have a rego sticker on the windscreen with the rego number, an engine number ( still the same engine) and an old format archived VIN number which they were able to trace.

[COFFEY76]

If it has been previously registered with the engine that is in it then more than likely it was done properly. RTA or vic roads should have records on the previous rego. If the engine number (from LR to holden number) had been changed over or even mentioned or cited in the past history you wont need engineering to get it registered.

Trust me, I know, Im getting screwed by engineering myself and have tried all avenues.

[Mick_Marsh]

If it has been previously registered with the engine that is in it then more than likely it was done properly. RTA or vic roads should have records on the previous rego. If the engine number (from LR to holden number) had been changed over or even mentioned or cited in the past history you wont need engineering to get it registered.

Trust me, I know, Im getting screwed by engineering myself and have tried all avenues.
Been there. Done that. The pain is momentary. I wish you well.

[COFFEY76]

Thanks mate!

Just new exhaust and tires and i can stick it to the MAN!!

[COFFEY76]

So Tuesday next week is the big day!

Finally im ready to go for engineering...

New tyres (mining issue)

New exhaust, Finally sounds less like a cannon, more like an old HQ.

Keeping it regularly driven around the back streets in order to keep everything ticking over!

Brakes are easily stopping the old girl VERY well! Have to push it to cause a lock up (good on ya tyres!)

New seats are all plated up
New seat belts reinforced

Cable wipers run fast enough and at 2 speeds (if you look closely between the 2 speeds)


Can only hope that it all goes well!

[ezyrama]

Best of luck, I just hope I dont have the same headaches when I register Ralph the 11a with the nissan diesel in it. It was converted in NSW, used on a farm and never registered, but then again up here in QLD behind the bananna curtain we are about 10yrs and 3 mths behind the rest of the country.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

<snip>, but then again up here in QLD behind the bananna curtain we are about 10yrs and 3 mths behind the rest of the country.I thought it was 10 years, 3 months and 1 hour behind the rest of the country! :o

Or is that only in summer? :D

Diana :wasntme:

[ezyrama]

10 yrs 3 months and 2 hours actually, as it takes the sun a bit longer to come up in QLD as it's higher up the country.;)

[Lotz-A-Landies]

10 yrs 3 months and 2 hours actually, as it takes the sun a bit longer to come up in QLD as it's higher up the country.;)I'm still trying to work out which side of the Universe is up!

And I need to know that before I can agree with you if God's country is higher or not.

[COFFEY76]

The ONLY reason i have to jump through hoops is because the engine has a greater Horse power rating than the original land rover 6 cylinder engine.

MY engine feels like it has NO torque!

[ezyrama]

I'm still trying to work out which side of the Universe is up!

And I need to know that before I can agree with you if God's country is higher or not.

It's gotta be higher,every time I drive to Sydney for the kids to see the grandparents, I always use more diesel coming back(uphill), and no I don't drive faster to get out of Sydney!:angel:

[Lotz-A-Landies]

The ONLY reason i have to jump through hoops is because the engine has a greater Horse power rating than the original land rover 6 cylinder engine.

MY engine feels like it has NO torque!That's weird. In NSW it's the capacity of the engine, irrespective of the fuel. So if the 1992 RRc had a 3.9 Rover V8 I can fit a 3.9 Isuzu 4BD1 without question, similarly because the Stage 1 had a 3.9 4BD1 I can fit any naturally aspirated V8 up to 4.4litres and still comply with the less than 15% increase in capacity.

Go figure?

[COFFEY76]

Yeah the 202 is just over that 15% increase of power compared to the old engine.

I would rather have the original engine, but got all the goodies to fix the problems 202's have with fuel and oil supply on steep angles. 186 sump with centre bulge and tuned the carbie ready to hit the slopes!


Oh well no matter...
Pretty confident that the 6cylinder brakes will past the commercial vehicle brake test....