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View Full Version : Mercedes G-Wagon LAPV 6.X concept



Ranga
21st June 2010, 09:41 AM
Mercedes G-Wagon LAPV 6.X concept | Review | carsguide.com.au (http://www.carsguide.com.au/site/news-and-reviews/car-news/mercedes_g-wagon_lapv_6x_concept?utm_source=ndmhouse&utm_medium=cpc&utm_content=newsfooter)

Michael2
21st June 2010, 02:40 PM
http://carsguide.com.au/images/uploads/merc-g-wagon-concept-w.jpg

it looks like it's got portal axles

weeds
21st June 2010, 02:50 PM
http://carsguide.com.au/images/uploads/merc-g-wagon-concept-w.jpg

how good does that look

Chucaro
21st June 2010, 07:13 PM
As soon as they are in the Trading Post for $ 3000 I will get one :)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/596.jpg

medic455
23rd June 2010, 10:49 AM
As soon as they are in the Trading Post for $ 3000 I will get one :)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/596.jpg



Hmmmmmmmmm....nope
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2010/06/325.jpg
Now we are talking

[biggrin][biggrin][biggrin][biggrin][biggrin]

Ranga
23rd June 2010, 11:51 AM
WTF is that?!

Camo
23rd June 2010, 12:08 PM
Looks like a new look Hummer

looks pretty cool though

Lotz-A-Landies
23rd June 2010, 12:48 PM
<snip>https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/596.jpgHow quickly they forget!

In WWII, troops in armoured vehicles were being injured and killed inside non-welded armoured vehicles. Not by the ordinance directed at them but by the rivet and bolt heads becoming projectiles inside the vehicle when the fastener failed.

"The more things change, the more they stay the same"

VladTepes
23rd June 2010, 02:22 PM
If a bomb big enough to make the fasteners fails, goes off next to you and you are driving that - you have bigger problems than bolt heads.

THE BOOGER
23rd June 2010, 03:05 PM
WTF is that?!

Thales Australia concept "Hawkei" being trailed for light armour relacment of the 110 here:D

Lotz-A-Landies
23rd June 2010, 03:40 PM
If a bomb big enough to make the fasteners fails, goes off next to you and you are driving that - you have bigger problems than bolt heads.It takes a lot less effort to make a fastener fail than it takes a welded seam to fail. Then when a welded seam fails the plates open up, they don't become high velocity projectiles rattling around inside the crew compartment.

While the concussion injuries may be significant, a projectile through a vital organ is potentially far more serious or more likely fatal.

uninformed
23rd June 2010, 04:20 PM
How quickly they forget!

In WWII, troops in armoured vehicles were being injured and killed inside non-welded armoured vehicles. Not by the ordinance directed at them but by the rivet and bolt heads becoming projectiles inside the vehicle when the fastener failed.

"The more things change, the more they stay the same"

yeah Im sure they are building these with the same materials, specs and construction type as those WWII vehicles.....:rolleyes:

Lotz-A-Landies
23rd June 2010, 05:00 PM
yeah Im sure they are building these with the same materials, specs and construction type as those WWII vehicles.....:rolleyes:I don't care what space aged materials they are using to armour the vehicle. Ballistics remain the same. I don't care that the WWII tank was riveted with cast iron rivets and grade 8 bolts and the Mercedes is assembeld with carbon ceramics and kevlar.

If the grade 8 bolts, or titanium bolts or whatever bolts or rivets they are held together with, fail, they will fail producing a projectile travelling at high velocity.

So be it a kevlar, carbon ceramic, or titanium projectile it will kill the same as if it were a cast iron rivet head.

BTW: why do you think the Perenties in Afghanistan have rag tyres (cross ply) instead of steel belted tyres? Answer because the kevlar or steel belts become projectiles instead of disintegrating when hit by IED

geckos
23rd June 2010, 05:10 PM
Windscreens on the bushmasters are bolted on, boxes on the side, remote weapons station on the top, windows on the side. not one soldier has been killed while inside them. injuries are mainly from concussion. most vehicles are fitted with spall lining inside, over there. The humvees have some boilt on armour, i cant coment on that....

geck

Lotz-A-Landies
23rd June 2010, 05:38 PM
Windscreens on the bushmasters are bolted on, boxes on the side, <snip>
Bolting may be O.K. depending on what is at the other side of the bolt. If it's a nut on the inside then that has a potential to become a projectile. However if the bolt is threaded into a structural part of the body then the only potential projectile is on the outside.

The toolboxes and fuel tanks on the outside are sacrificial, the bolts etc are unlikely to penetrate inside.

On the G-Wagen LAPV-7.X the body behind the armour (particularly the doors) does not look anything other than the standard frames. Once again if the external bolts have nuts etc on the inside they may be a risk.

I guess what I'm saying is that if you want light (or heavy) armour protection of a troop carrier, then the vehicle should be built like that from scratch, not just some add on stuff to a regular unarmoured vehicle, particularly if the armour is bolt on bits.

Fail

http://www.wwiivehicles.com/unitedkingdom/foreign/m3-medium/grant_02.jpg

Pass
http://www.wwiivehicles.com/unitedkingdom/foreign/m4-medium/sherman-mk-iii-01.png

Pass
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2010/06/325.jpg

Fail
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/596.jpg

slug_burner
23rd June 2010, 06:01 PM
Thales Australia concept "Hawlei" being trailed for light armour relacment of the 110 here:D

I think that is Hawkei (http://www.thalesgroup.com/Pages/PressRelease.aspx?id=10324)

isuzubob
23rd June 2010, 07:18 PM
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/596.jpg

This concept features Mog chassis & diffs underneath G engines & bodywork.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/ (http://img820.imageshack.us/i/gwagen7x01.jpg/)



Mercedes-Benz Daimler at Eurosatory 2010 Actros 4151 AK 8x8 recovery truck FGA 14.5 chassis LAPV 6.X*-*Army Recognition (http://www.armyrecognition.com/eurosatory_2010_defense_exhibition_news_pictures/mercedes-benz_daimler_at_euroastory_2010_actros_4151_ak_8x8 _recovery_truck_fga_14.5_chassis_lapv_6.x.html)

uninformed
25th June 2010, 09:18 AM
I don't care what space aged materials they are using to armour the vehicle. Ballistics remain the same. I don't care that the WWII tank was riveted with cast iron rivets and grade 8 bolts and the Mercedes is assembeld with carbon ceramics and kevlar.

If the grade 8 bolts, or titanium bolts or whatever bolts or rivets they are held together with, fail, they will fail producing a projectile travelling at high velocity.

So be it a kevlar, carbon ceramic, or titanium projectile it will kill the same as if it were a cast iron rivet head.

BTW: why do you think the Perenties in Afghanistan have rag tyres (cross ply) instead of steel belted tyres? Answer because the kevlar or steel belts become projectiles instead of disintegrating when hit by IED

think about this: steel winch cable when under tension will store that energy and if the cable fails it releases that energy rather quickly.......why does not plasma winch rope do this???? its doing the same thing.....????

Yes it does matter what material they use and the specifics of every little design detail...so comparing something from 65 years ago while worth the mention may not prove scientfic

spudboy
25th June 2010, 09:48 AM
As soon as they are in the Trading Post for $ 3000 I will get one :)




I'm thinkng 2050, give or take a few years....

disco2hse
25th June 2010, 10:21 AM
This concept features Mog chassis & diffs underneath G engines & bodywork.

http://img820.imageshack.us/img820/2112/gwagen7x01.jpg (http://img820.imageshack.us/i/gwagen7x01.jpg/)



Mercedes-Benz Daimler at Eurosatory 2010 Actros 4151 AK 8x8 recovery truck FGA 14.5 chassis LAPV 6.X*-*Army Recognition (http://www.armyrecognition.com/eurosatory_2010_defense_exhibition_news_pictures/mercedes-benz_daimler_at_euroastory_2010_actros_4151_ak_8x8 _recovery_truck_fga_14.5_chassis_lapv_6.x.html)

Damn, they could throw one in my direction! [thumbsupbig]

Lotz-A-Landies
25th June 2010, 11:05 AM
Damn, they could throw one in my direction! [thumbsupbig]Yup - I wouldn't throw it back either!

Although you'd always be looking out for an Arnold Swarzenneggererarrraer :D

uninformed
25th June 2010, 05:37 PM
what are the cross plys in RAGS made from?

im guess its just as much to do with staking/puncture resistance and better offroad performace.....go out west and see what all roo shooters run on their trucks and for this reason

i just dont think you can run down the engineers that have designed this vehicle...ESPECIALLY from a photo!!!

lardy
25th June 2010, 11:18 PM
how much for the merc ...wonder how much a service would be:o

spudboy
26th June 2010, 07:35 AM
how much for the merc ...wonder how much a service would be:o

If you have to ask, you probably can't afford it!

Lotz-A-Landies
26th June 2010, 08:00 AM
what are the cross plys in RAGS made from?

<snip>you're not serious are you?

"Rag tyres" is the common name for bias-ply tyres also termed "cross-ply" tyres. They are made from rubber or synthetic rubber impregnated canvas like material with the strips of material running from one side of the rim to the other then moulded with additional rubber on the tread.

Radial (ply) tyres have the material running the entire circumference of the tyre which makes them less rigid in the side walls and less resistant to penetration, as a consequence they usually need a belt of either steel mesh or kevlar mesh running around the circumference above the ply and under the tread.

In Afghanistan the Perenties are wearing Goodyear Custom Hi Miler Xtra Grip (cross-plys) in Australia they wear Olympic Steel Trek (steel belted radials).

Roo shooters etc in the outback are most unlikely to have the stake they run over explode. Steel mesh in the radial tyre becomes shrapnel where most of the cross-ply tyre burns up in the explosion.

uninformed
26th June 2010, 11:06 AM
you're not serious are you?

"Rag tyres" is the common name for bias-ply tyres also termed "cross-ply" tyres. They are made from rubber or synthetic rubber impregnated canvas like material with the strips of material running from one side of the rim to the other then moulded with additional rubber on the tread.

Radial (ply) tyres have the material running the entire circumference of the tyre which makes them less rigid in the side walls and less resistant to penetration, as a consequence they usually need a belt of either steel mesh or kevlar mesh running around the circumference above the ply and under the tread.

In Afghanistan the Perenties are wearing Goodyear Custom Hi Miler Xtra Grip (cross-plys) in Australia they wear Olympic Steel Trek (steel belted radials).

Roo shooters etc in the outback are most unlikely to have the stake they run over explode. Steel mesh in the radial tyre becomes shrapnel where most of the cross-ply tyre burns up in the explosion.

what are the strips of material made from? RAG's were before my time mate....

and one could ask are you serious in running down the engineers that designed these trucks, from a photo, by comparing them with something built 60+ years ago.......

disco2hse
26th June 2010, 12:10 PM
what are the strips of material made from? RAG's were before my time mate....

You need to show Diana some respect.

You can buy them new, that's why your ADF is using them, like you know, now.

KarlB
26th June 2010, 01:25 PM
This tyre business all seems to be getting a bit silly. The term RAG tyre really should only be applied to tyres reinforced with cotton canvas. These days most bias ply tyres (often called cross ply) are reinforced with various 'plastic' polymers such as nylon and Aramid (which is what is used in bullet proof vests and the like). Radial ply tyres can be, and are, made without steel though that is not the common practice today. The ADF may be using Goodyear Custom Hi Miler Xtra Grip because the tyre "burns up in an explosion" and doesn't produce shrapnel but I would need to be directed to some evidence from the ADF to be convinced of this. I would have thought it most unlikely that an improvised explosive device such as the roadside bombs commonly employed in Afghanistan would actually have the power (ie heat) to actually vaporise the tyres (ie "burn in the explosion").

uninformed
26th June 2010, 04:58 PM
You need to show Diana some respect.

You can buy them new, that's why your ADF is using them, like you know, now.

Respect is a 2 way street! show some and get some....

Diana's point while appropriate in referrence to the WWII vehicles was disrespectful to the engineers and manufactures of the vehicle being discussed....and from what, A PHOTO....with no tech specs

nore did she note my example of how different materials doing the same job have a different result, which she was arguing against....

I dont doubt she has excellent LR knowledge and has been a valuble member here....but bashing another vehicle like that smacks of Toyota syndrome....but then again the only difference between US and them is the shape of our badge.....

Serg