D3 Snow Performance & 19" MTR's

[chuck]

Just got back from Mt Skene where I was somewhat disappointed with D3 performance in snow.
Got stuck twice where others notably same spec TD5 D2 (my son) as my old D2 got thru and snatched me out.
DSC was off, low range engaged, snow terrain response selected.
I have rear diff lock fitted.
First time stuck at 26lb in MTR's.
second time at 20lb in MTR's.
Apart from driver error (This was my fourth trip to Mt Skene where previously the only time I got stuck was snatching some one out) what did I do wrong.
I am now seriously considering bigger tyres!!!
In addition even though the chassis was rubbing on the snow I was not able to get grounding height selection.

Have to admit though the drive there was good.

Any Thoughts???????

Regards

Chuck

[stig0000]

wat was the reason for getting stuck,, was its just plane run out of clearance?? i cant say iv never driven in snow, but it is sorta the same as sand, just keep going? and with the rear locker,;) find it werd for a d3 to get stuck were a stock d2 made it easy

[chuck]

The D2 is modified notably 265 x 75 x 16 MTR's & 50 mm lift.

Tried to attach 3 photos.

Regards

Chuck

27637

27638

27639

[rmp]

First photo shows your D3 half a car width off line. Keeping on line is v important in snow.

Your setup and technique sounds fine except that selecting snow mode is not the best for deep snow. In that mode the car is set for slippery surfaces, and deep snow requires more power, certainly uphill and even to the depth you had it to as seen in the shots. Normal mode is what I would use (and in fact did that same weekend in snow elsewhere), or maybe mud/ruts. I think that would be the difference. The tyres and diameter would have been fine as were the pressures.

Snow mode is fine for a thin, loose, slippery covering. Not what you were wading through.

To answer another poster; sand and snow driving are more different than alike.

[Tote]

A mate that runs MTRs on his cruiser has changed back to AT or road tyres after he found he was sliding off the road while stationary on snow. His theory is the lack of sipes on the mud terrain tyres prevent them gripping in icy surfaces.
May not be the vehicle at fault, maybe the tyres.

Regards,
Tote

[Piddler]

A mate that runs MTRs on his cruiser has changed back to AT or road tyres after he found he was sliding off the road while stationary on snow. His theory is the lack of sipes on the mud terrain tyres prevent them gripping in icy surfaces.
May not be the vehicle at fault, maybe the tyres.

Regards,
Tote

Hi,
I lived at Guthega past Perisher for 4 years and disagree totally, I drove through a lot of very deep snow most days in the winter on BFG Mud Terrains. It will amaze you where they will go. Its like sand; momentum but not too much!!!!!!! (have even had them up the ski slopes).

MT/R only way to go. Sounds like your technique was wrong.

[rmp]

Second that. Mud terrains will work really well in the sort of snow you were in. Snow of that nature isn't quite like sand, with snow you're compressing it more whereas with sand it's more about pure flotation. Try shovelling sand vs snow and you can see the difference in texture.

The LC100 experience was probably more to do with maybe the compound than the tread pattern.

[sniegy]

Have to admit though the drive there was good.

Any Thoughts???????

Regards

Chuck

Loose nut behind the wheel.??:BigThumb::whistling:

I'm off to Lake Mountain tomorrow with the kids, will be a bit of fun.

Take care Chuck.

[Dirty3]

Just got back from Mt Skene where I was somewhat disappointed with D3 performance in snow.
Got stuck twice where others notably same spec TD5 D2 (my son) as my old D2 got thru and snatched me out.
DSC was off, low range engaged, snow terrain response selected.
I have rear diff lock fitted.
First time stuck at 26lb in MTR's.
second time at 20lb in MTR's.
Apart from driver error (This was my fourth trip to Mt Skene where previously the only time I got stuck was snatching some one out) what did I do wrong.
I am now seriously considering bigger tyres!!!
In addition even though the chassis was rubbing on the snow I was not able to get grounding height selection.

Have to admit though the drive there was good.

Any Thoughts???????

Regards

Chuck

Hey Chuck,

I was first time in snow 2 weekends ago in my D3. I didn't like the snow selection with the terrain response, didn't feel like I had control, so reverted back to Mud/Ruts and found it much better.

Looks like Mt Skene had plenty of snow. Did you have to get a permit to drove there as I heard it's closed at Wren's Flat turnoff?
Land

Cheers Neil.

[chuck]

Neil,
Yes we did get a permit thru LROCV.
There was plenty of snow & there should be more this week.

No one ended up checking permit however on the way thru Mansfield there was a blitz with breathaliser, rego checks, warrant checks, outstanding fines checks & the DSE were there as well.

In some respects the D3 is harder to drive off road than my old D2.
I noticed far more sliding down the cambar of the road.
I have been up there three times in the D2 with much more snow, each time I did not get stuck however that was with 265 x 75 x 16 Mickey Thompson MTZ's aired down to 16lb & a 50 mm lift.

Perhaps I am not as "brave" with the D3.

Tyres do make a huge difference if you are doing to try the harder stuff.
The MTZ's never broke the seal on the rim even when down as low as 12lb.
On the 19's I have been down to 20lb twice & both times developed an air leak after breaking the bead seal. So naturally now I am averse to going down lower than 20lb.

One comforting thought though - an RRS with standard tyres was having a much harder time than I did.

I think I might go to bigger tyres in LT construction that I know I can air down with confidence.

Does anyone know if 265 x 70 x 17 Goodyear Wrangler MTR's fit in the spare wheel well.

Regards

Chuck

[gghaggis]

Neil,

Does anyone know if 265 x 70 x 17 Goodyear Wrangler MTR's fit in the spare wheel well.

Regards

Chuck

Yes, but they'll need to be aired down to around 15psi.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Forest]

So, what tyre pressure should one use in snow?? Sand kind of pressure?? or higher??

I have an AT if that makes any difference.

[rmp]

For deep snow like in the pics, low pressure. Flotation and reduction in rolling resistance, just like mud and sand. Go super-low and you can float on top in some circumstances and vehicles.

[trobbo]

Your setup and technique sounds fine except that selecting snow mode is not the best for deep snow. In that mode the car is set for slippery surfaces, and deep snow requires more power, certainly uphill and even to the depth you had it to as seen in the shots. Normal mode is what I would use (and in fact did that same weekend in snow elsewhere), or maybe mud/ruts.

Snow mode is fine for a thin, loose, slippery covering. Not what you were wading through.



Does the centre diff still lock up in normal mode?

[rmp]

Does the centre diff still lock up in normal mode?

Yes. The D3's centre "diff" is not like a purely mechancial unit on older models that is entirely locked or unlocked. It is a computer-controlled torque splitter -- which means it varies torque front/rear and degree of lock. This operation is constant and permanent. Different TR modes bias the lock (and other factors) one or or the other. TR is always active even when it is notionally disengaged with "Normal" selected, not the same as off.

Grass/Gravel/Snow considerably reduces the sensivity of the throttle so you can't acclerate as quickly and get the power down; which is why I don't use it in deeper snow. This design is good, but it also really annoys me on dirt roads -- takes forever to gather speed -- so I never use the mode and opt for Normal or Mud/Ruts instead. If the car slips a bit I can handle that using standard slippery-surface driving techniques. I would use GGS when it was very, very slippery, eg icy, but not on a dirt road when slip is controllable by the driver. But that's personal preference, and I wouldn't want to suggest what I do is the best way for everyone. Less confident drivers would be better off with GGS on dirt for example.

In general, it is better to err on the side of using Normal than select a wrong mode, and the modes are also there not just for the named terrains but also for the type of terrain and personal preference.

Usually when a D3 can't make it somewhere it's the driver at fault. The advanced electronics can't yet compensate for the helmsman.