Newcomer with LT85 question

[Svengali0]

Hi Everyone.

I'm new here but have been reading the various posts for a while. Great to see this is a good community to share and find advice:).

I am however not new to L/R and my current car, an '85 County LT85 standard 4BD1 is the 4th Isuzu powered L/R. Previous cars include civilian 6x6 4BD1T, a stage 111 ute 4BD1 (sans baffle kit on the engine and it was a 'chirpy' little thing too...) and a conversion 4BA1 into a Ser111 ute over 15 years ago (that was fun- the conversion plate was a 'Zenith' engineering kit (Milton, Brisbane) that left a bit to be desired).

I won't mention how many Ser 1, 11, 11a and 111's I have had. I couldn't help myself for a few years there and I just bought 'em no matter where they were- mostly diesels too. But my days of putting up with the old Rover diesel have long passed....


Anyway, the '85 County is getting just on 800km to it's 75 litre non standard tank (255/85/16 BFG muddies) so mileage is good.

This car has been all over Australia (previous owner used to take photos in the outback, and he sent through pics of the vehicle being featured in an Indian Cigarette commercial at one point about 12 or so years ago). I can dig up these pics and post if any one is interested...

Turns out that while the blessed 4BD1 has had nill work performed to it outside regular oil and filter changes, and pump/injector overhaul at about 365k's (now 540k's and still won't use oil or get hot)- the LT85 has been rebuilt about three times- and the last rebuild (unsure when, possibly early 400k) included modifying the bearings to take larger, beefier items more suited to load requirements.

This was apparently done in far North QLD.


I've been reading the threads regarding experiences with the LT85 and this has proved very useful.

Through this, I have taken note of opinions that the gearbox primary input shaft bearings appear to get stressed out especially through sustained running in fifth gear (I do a few long trips every now and then- mostly in fifth as you do...).

I have a symptom that is some cause for concern.

I can't tell if the throwout bearing/clutch release bearing is noisy of if the primary input shaft bearing is about to die. There is a noticeable metallic clicking at idle that disappears when I depress the clutch. Fairly recent onset (within the last 3k). The clutch itself is about at the point of it's half life by appearances.

Does anyone have advice about diagnosis? If one or more of the bearings inside the box is about to go then it would be sensible to pull the thing down and have it addressed- but there are significant costs in this even if I do it myself....
What to do...

Oh, gearbox oil recently replaced with 75/85 grade castrol mineral oil improved gear shifts significantly. There is almost no noise coming from the drive train apart from a distant muted whine (it is land rover after all).

The gearbox oil was fairly dark, appeared to be correct grade oil- and there was noticeable brassy elements in the bottom of my collection pan when the drained out oil sat over night.


Opinions???:):question:

[Nero]

No real input on the gearbox other than I had a falcon with a input bearing on the way, it rumbled rather than clicked when the clutch was out in neutral. It ran for many kms like that until I sold it.

What I'd really like to see is some of the professional pictures! :D

[isuzurover]

Which oil are you using??? VMX 75-85??? (VMX-M?)

It may just be a noisy throwout. Might be worth getting under the (secured) vehicle at idle with the old stethoscope (screwdriver etc.) and see if the noise is coming from the bellhousing or the box. Also remove the bellhousing drain and see if the noise gets louder,

I run Syntrans in mine, which I have found superior to VMX80 or similar oils.

If the box does need a repair/rebuild, personally I would fit one of TheGrubb's kits to change to an isuzu box, or adapt to bellhousing to fit an R380.

Your box seems to have needed a lot of rebuilds for an NA engine. Did it do a lot of towing? My engine has ~380k km and the box has only needed 1 rebuild.

[Blknight.aus]

ticking from an lt85 at idle is not a good thing....

theres a few checks you can do to isolate it out BUT you need a helper some time and axle stands or enough tools to remove the PTO plate.

[Svengali0]

The oil I'm running is VMX-M. I'd prefer synthetic but maybe next time- actually unsure where to get it. I figure changing the mineral oil every 10k might be a pain but better than leaving it there.

Just discovered the rear U/V joint on the front propeller shaft is dead. I bought this shaft complete on eBay about four months ago - the sticker from a prop shaft rebuilder was still on it IE, the shaft should have been 'as new' but after no more than 10k, the rear Universal on the front shaft is now dead and clicking its head of on a trailing throttle. I'm wondering if the U/V is the same for the County as those fitted to defender five speed as this is the where the rebuilt shaft came from originally. Guess I'll fit the old shaft back up and organise to R/R a new U/V sometime soon.


The gearbox: Thanks for the quick advice. The noise is less a 'tick' than a rumble- only really noticeable when you apply the clutch pedal and it goes away entirely. Maybe I'm being a bit neurotic but any noise kind of worries me. However this car aint quiet in any way shape or form. Nature of the beast.

I guess that the stethoscope or large screwdriver diagnostic is a good idea. Will try that when I can get someone to sit in the cab and apply the pedal on and off.

Anyone know of a trustworthy mechanic nearby to the ACT that can look at the thing and provide a best guess??

The bloke up at Mitchell seems to never get back to me when I call and I can't seem to get past his wife/receptionist nazi who seems to think that speaking to the mechanic is simply unreasonable. Maybe they have too much business to handle and now choose to turn business away if the customer isn't a rich D3 owner who hates to get his hands dirty. I'm guessing....maybe I'm just a bit crusty and cynical. I kinda hate not being able to speak to someone directly who knows more about the mechanics of the car than I do. But at the end of the day, time is money I guess.
Anyway, moving along - can anyone identify a suitable L/R specialist down here in the ACT???


Which oil are you using??? VMX 75-85??? (VMX-M?)

It may just be a noisy throwout. Might be worth getting under the (secured) vehicle at idle with the old stethoscope (screwdriver etc.) and see if the noise is coming from the bellhousing or the box. Also remove the bellhousing drain and see if the noise gets louder,

I run Syntrans in mine, which I have found superior to VMX80 or similar oils.

If the box does need a repair/rebuild, personally I would fit one of TheGrubb's kits to change to an isuzu box, or adapt to bellhousing to fit an R380.

Your box seems to have needed a lot of rebuilds for an NA engine. Did it do a lot of towing? My engine has ~380k km and the box has only needed 1 rebuild.

What is 'The Grubb's' kit? I'm guessing its a kit to fit a KS (or similar) gearbox to the LT230- a plate at the back end- but what about the overall length issues that this involves? (mounts on the engine and transfer box)... And the clutch/flywheel?
Just wondering is all...

[Blknight.aus]

only really noticeable when you apply the clutch pedal and it goes away entirely.

inputshaft, layshaft or center support bearing.

select N on the tcase and let the clutch out.

if the noise is present when you select all gears in the main box its typically going to be the input bearing

if its not there in 4th then the odds are its the center support bearing for the input to the output shaft

if it changes with selection of first second and 3rd but is the same with 4th and 5th then its likely to be the layshaft bearings.

[isuzurover]

Just discovered the rear U/V joint on the front propeller shaft is dead. I bought this shaft complete on eBay about four months ago - the sticker from a prop shaft rebuilder was still on it IE, the shaft should have been 'as new' but after no more than 10k, the rear Universal on the front shaft is now dead and clicking its head of on a trailing throttle. I'm wondering if the U/V is the same for the County as those fitted to defender five speed as this is the where the rebuilt shaft came from originally. Guess I'll fit the old shaft back up and organise to R/R a new U/V sometime soon.



[FONT=Arial Narrow]What is 'The Grubb's' kit? I'm guessing its a kit to fit a KS (or similar) gearbox to the LT230- a plate at the back end- but what about the overall length issues that this involves? (mounts on the engine and transfer box)... And the clutch/flywheel?
Just wondering is all...

I recently posted a thread on UJs: http://www.aulro.com/afvb/technical-chatter/119353-uni-joints-longevity.html . The county should have larger UJs (K5-13XR) whereas a RRC/Defender/Disco has the smaller ones.

Syntrans is available at most places which sell (castrol) oils. It only comes in 1L or 20L containers though, and costs ~$30/L!!! You can always drop a small amount of oil to check for water or contaminants.

For the gearbox stuff - all you need to know is here:
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/isuzu-landy-enthusiasts-section/90033-isuzu-msa-gearbox-lt230-10.html
This is the gearbox from an NPR truck or similar. No change in length.

[Svengali0]

inputshaft, layshaft or center support bearing.

select N on the tcase and let the clutch out.

if the noise is present when you select all gears in the main box its typically going to be the input bearing

if its not there in 4th then the odds are its the center support bearing for the input to the output shaft

if it changes with selection of first second and 3rd but is the same with 4th and 5th then its likely to be the layshaft bearings.

Thank you for this.
I have proceeded to test- and after putting transfer in N, found that:
1st was moderately noisy; 2nd less so, and; 3rd not at all, and; 4th quite noisy at revs as well as idle, less so at revs- and; 5th was not noisy either at revs or at idle....

So, not sure what this means. I can't provide an absolute reference point for 'low, moderate or high' in terms of noise level- what would I use to compare that we could all agree on?

In any event, the difference in noise level may indicate that a bearing may be faltering inside the LT85- not at the point of descruction yet but perhaps not that far off.

Which bearing it actually is (is) academic.
It'd be nice to have a timeframe though as the car is in use and is relied upon for everyday transport....

[justinc]

Almost certainly input brg. I am going to throw a cat in the pigeons here and suggest you fit a LT95 4spd, and taper roller brg transfer case mods. This is the trans you would've had in your civi 6x6, except the 6x6 had a lower high range. The 4x4 version uses .996:1 high range, with 255/85 tyres about 2000rpm at 100km/h. A great gearbox IMO.

JC

[Blknight.aus]

what he said input bearing.

heres a link to a thread to show you how bad it can get.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/technical-chatter/56461-smashing-gearbox-bearing-7-bigish-off-site-images.html

or you could just sell it to me as is.

:)

[Svengali0]

Almost certainly input brg. I am going to throw a cat in the pigeons here and suggest you fit a LT95 4spd, and taper roller brg transfer case mods. This is the trans you would've had in your civi 6x6, except the 6x6 had a lower high range. The 4x4 version uses .996:1 high range, with 255/85 tyres about 2000rpm at 100km/h. A great gearbox IMO.

JC

Kinda noticed that the 3.9 tends to vibrate the hell out of everything at idle- and the shear/hammering at the gear faces would indeed stress the bearings- poor little things- I guess they put up a fight but are bound to heroically collapse after a time. So bringing the idle up to even out some of that terrific vibration would help, even just a bit.

To go down the LT95 route, I need another bell housing and transmission tunnel cover to suit. I would have preferred the four speed but the five speed was in the car when it was sitting forlorn at the vender- at least it wasn't an LT77!
As it happened, the '86 6x6 I had all those years ago (1990) killed it's box- an LT85 as I recall while it was under my ownership. Damn thing just collapsed without warning too. I just figured that after all those years carting tons of fish up and down Fraser Island on the soft sand just wore it out along with the tappered roller bearing intermediate gear in the transfer.
The LT95 in my stage 111 just kept on going. I liked the ratio provided by 3rd gear (750/16 crossplies). The current setup I use doesn't subjectively feel all that right at times- 4th being kind of ok for most hills but changing down to 3rd every now and then is kind of embarrassing- esp when a daggy old rustbucket 60 series cruiser on petrol just passes you going up the one of those ranges between here and Brisbane so fitting an LT95 to this car would be best as the headache of fitting an Isuzu box seems too much for the present time. I am not a fan of non-factory conversions....

I'm wondering when the army 110 isuzus are going to start trickling onto the market- Does any one know what kind of timeframe this is?
I guess all of us are waiting for some of those bits and pieces.
I'm guessing it will be a steady phasing out over time. I like the Benz G Wagon but have real reservations about their longevity- The ex-army blokes I used to work with used to tell me all sorts of stories about what kind of punishment the 110's got at the hands of cowboy army drivers.

Oh and you are right, the 6x6 high range was quite low. And fuel economy was pretty bad as well but pulling around all that chassis and extra axle will do that. From memory, the 4BD1T power band was also pretty thin too. I remember struggling with the car for miles on the soft sand on Stradbroke island trying to keep 3rd and 2nd gear within the turbo's power range. Road speed was best kept at about 90km/h on the highway- fifth gear being damn useless 90% of the time.

[AdsLandies]

"Anyone know of a trustworthy mechanic nearby to the ACT that can look at the thing and provide a best guess??" Quote
I'd give Ray at Mitchell another try, but ring first thing in the morning, after about 8am. He seems to be there on his own so will probably answer the phone - if anyone knows, he should.
My LT85 is starting to concern me too, so will likely be going down the same road soon.

[slug_burner]

"Anyone know of a trustworthy mechanic nearby to the ACT that can look at the thing and provide a best guess??" Quote
I'd give Ray at Mitchell another try, but ring first thing in the morning, after about 8am. He seems to be there on his own so will probably answer the phone - if anyone knows, he should.
My LT85 is starting to concern me too, so will likely be going down the same road soon.

Book it in for him to give it the once over instead of trying to get a diagnosis over the phone.

[Svengali0]

"Anyone know of a trustworthy mechanic nearby to the ACT that can look at the thing and provide a best guess??" Quote
I'd give Ray at Mitchell another try, but ring first thing in the morning, after about 8am. He seems to be there on his own so will probably answer the phone - if anyone knows, he should.
My LT85 is starting to concern me too, so will likely be going down the same road soon.

I believe that I will stick with the LT85 for the time being.
There are a few downsides to this but maybe down the track a good (late) R380 or LT95 will come up and then I can perform the conversion when I have the bits gathered over time ('Bower bird'). Buying everything all at once can end up making the car (overall) too expensive (over-capitalising)- and as good as the car is (ie fit for purpose), it aint perfect and there are other modification/additions/improvements that I want to do so 'running project' it is and likely will remain....

The previous owner informed me that he spent well over $5k haviing this box reconditioned and modified with larger bearings where possible. This may or may not have been worth it (from his perspective) but I am certainly curious to see what is happening inside the box before too many miles are racked up.

I'm thinking removing the gearbox from the vehicle and separating it from the transfer case and presenting the box to either CMW (Ray) or similar venue. This seems sensible. This would lower the all up cost (removing the remove/refit element of the invoice) quite significantly perhaps to the tune of $800 or so, maybe more...The job would take about three to four or so hours (removal). It's a pretty straight forward job but best performed by two. Anyone interested in assisting? This is a two way street of course.... :)
Just wondering....

[Svengali0]

inputshaft, layshaft or center support bearing.

select N on the tcase and let the clutch out.

if the noise is present when you select all gears in the main box its typically going to be the input bearing

if its not there in 4th then the odds are its the center support bearing for the input to the output shaft

if it changes with selection of first second and 3rd but is the same with 4th and 5th then its likely to be the layshaft bearings.


When I say 'apply the pedal' I mean engage the clutch- meaning take foot of pedal as you would when selecting a gear and driving along. Just to confirm is all.

[SheldonA]

I believe that I will stick with the LT85 for the time being.
There are a few downsides to this but maybe down the track a good (late) R380 or LT95 will come up and then I can perform the conversion when I have the bits gathered over time ('Bower bird'). Buying everything all at once can end up making the car (overall) too expensive (over-capitalising)- and as good as the car is (ie fit for purpose), it aint perfect and there are other modification/additions/improvements that I want to do so 'running project' it is and likely will remain....

The previous owner informed me that he spent well over $5k haviing this box reconditioned and modified with larger bearings where possible. This may or may not have been worth it (from his perspective) but I am certainly curious to see what is happening inside the box before too many miles are racked up.

I'm thinking removing the gearbox from the vehicle and separating it from the transfer case and presenting the box to either CMW (Ray) or similar venue. This seems sensible. This would lower the all up cost (removing the remove/refit element of the invoice) quite significantly perhaps to the tune of $800 or so, maybe more...The job would take about three to four or so hours (removal). It's a pretty straight forward job but best performed by two. Anyone interested in assisting? This is a two way street of course.... :)
Just wondering....

I assume you are looking to do this in the ACT? Otherwise if your up Brisbane way I could give you a hand.....

[Svengali0]

I assume you are looking to do this in the ACT? Otherwise if your up Brisbane way I could give you a hand.....

Mate ur a champion. It's very good to see people who don't mind chronically dirty fingernails, grease and grime in the creases etc lmao...

ATM I'm in Canberra where I spend most of my time due to work. I really appreciate the offer and Brisbane has so much to offer in terms of options for advice and parts- different story down here but the tap water is better lol.... what more can I say...

Wouldn't mind catching up at some point- you seem to have all manner of projects on the go- brave and cunning:D.

So what's this kit of yours worth (isuzu box to LT230) and what does it include? Is the converter plate fully milled flat mag alloy, or steel?

I ask 'cause there was recently a full isuzu MWB 4.3L tray including rego down this way for just over 2.5k which appeared a bargain though I didn't check it out.

Sometimes things come up and if I know where to get the bits, then conversion may not be the full 'bells and whistles' headache that it can sometimes (read: tend generally) to be. I've done two engine conversions personally prior and have seen enough of em to wonder why some people put the time and effort into the job in the first place.... Bit chary about them now but in principle, an isuzu box with an isuzu engine does make sense as long as the ratios are workable.
Cheers mate.

[ScottW]

The 'tick' noise at idle in my LT85 gradually got worse, to a state where it was very loud and rattles in 2nd gear, and most others as well. This happened rather quickly. I picked up a spare LT85 and fitted that. Problem solved (for the short term).

I'm still to see an isuzu lt95 come up for sale (taper bearing or not) so I'm wondering where people get them from :)

[Svengali0]

The 'tick' noise at idle in my LT85 gradually got worse, to a state where it was very loud and rattles in 2nd gear, and most others as well. This happened rather quickly. I picked up a spare LT85 and fitted that. Problem solved (for the short term).

I'm still to see an isuzu lt95 come up for sale (taper bearing or not) so I'm wondering where people get them from :)

Any LT95 would do the job, its the bellhousing that is dedicated. The tapered roller bearing referred to prev relates to the transfer intermediate gear on an LT230 to wit.

Over the last couple of months someone (possibly around here) listed an LT85 (says it was rebuilt) that was prev fitted to an Isuzu Rover on eBay, and two other listings for Isuzu/Rover bellhousings from Tasmania were put up on at least two occasions. At the time, a listing occurred for an SD 33 (nissan 3.3 six) diesel county and a 101 forward control (by appearances, same vender selling for a friend). So they come up from time to time.

I've heard that the Dept Of Def army tried to get Land Rover AU to continue to supply bits to keep the 110 Isuzus up and running but Land Rover AU refused (economies of scale not big enough and god only knows what happened to the old tooling- which beggars the imagination as casts and die for things like bellhousings are hideously expensive from a car manufacturer's perspective) so hence full tender was put out (that Benz won)- thats my understanding. So at some point bits and pieces as well as whole vehicles should be coming up but (correct me if I'm wrong) no one knows _or is not willing to say_ where or when such items will appear. So much for democracy when competition is in town! ;)

I came across a wrecked 110 Isuzu at Wanless wrecking at Salisbury (QLD) some years ago (ok, over 15 years ago) and on at least five occasions have seen a vehicle for sale elsewhere including a Military 6x6 wide cab that sat on the same car lot for about 6 weeks (they wanted about $29k as I recall) where I sold my civilian 6x6 on commission. FWD motors (QLD) have or used to sell bits for our cars as well and they sometimes obtained oddments from surplus auctions so sources are definitely out there...

[SheldonA]

Mate ur a champion. It's very good to see people who don't mind chronically dirty fingernails, grease and grime in the creases etc lmao...

My parents didn't nick name me 'the_grubb' all those years ago for nothing :)


So what's this kit of yours worth (isuzu box to LT230) and what does it include? Is the converter plate fully milled flat mag alloy, or steel?

The kit includes everything needed to drop out the current box and swap in the Isuzu box - engine, driveshafts and original levers all bolt up in the same position. If you source your own gearbox there are three cuts with an angle grinder and one weld required. Otherwise if I supply the gearbox everything is 'bolt up'.

The adaptor b/n the gearbox and the transfer case is a steel weldment that is machined, with a EN26 shaft that bolts to the output flange of the gearbox to feed into the input gear of the LT230.

What's it worth.... to me, in my vehicle, a lot of piece of mind... prices and other info is here;

Landrover: Isuzu 4BD1 Transmission - Home (http://www.isuzuadaptors.com/)



Sometimes things come up and if I know where to get the bits, then conversion may not be the full 'bells and whistles' headache that it can sometimes (read: tend generally) to be. I've done two engine conversions personally prior and have seen enough of em to wonder why some people put the time and effort into the job in the first place.... Bit chary about them now but in principle, an isuzu box with an isuzu engine does make sense as long as the ratios are workable.
Cheers mate.

I hear you. My first car was a holden powered Series IIA. When I bought the 110 I swore to leave it stock standard. So bought a 90 to 'play' with - which now has an Isuzu 4BJ1-T, ZF auto and hilux diffs. So yes, know the fun and games of conversions. Given I want to keep my beloved Isuzu 110 for ever (ie. an investment), having rebuilt and knowing the strength issues with the LT85 and eventaully wanting to get a bit more power from it with a turbo, I decided it would be worth the effort for this conversion.

The plan was to make it reliable, simple, user friendly and as 'bolt upable' as possible. This has been achieved. The hardest thing to do is to pull out the spigot bush in the end of the crank (which really isn't that hard), eveything else is the same as any other gearbox removal and refit. I have had mine in my vehicle for 6 months now and is a daily driver. No problems at all and I think it shifts alot smoother than the LT85 but it has been awhile since I have driven one of these now. The ratios are very workable, with a lower first and a just slightly higher 5thed. If anyone who buys my kit ever has a problem I can tell you I want to know about it. I don't wont to be stuck out in the middle of the NT and I certainly don't wont to be the cause of someone else either. Actaully any feedback is good (GarrySeriesIII has been excellent with this) as I am just a simple Mechanical Engineer (no degree in Landrovers... just a specialty in aerospace automation and lasers).....

[AdsLandies]

"I'm thinking removing the gearbox from the vehicle and separating it from the transfer case and presenting the box to either CMW (Ray) or similar venue. This seems sensible. This would lower the all up cost (removing the remove/refit element of the invoice) quite significantly perhaps to the tune of $800 or so, maybe more...The job would take about three to four or so hours (removal). It's a pretty straight forward job but best performed by two. Anyone interested in assisting? This is a two way street of course.... :)
Just wondering...." [/QUOTE]

If you'll be working on it in Canberra, give us a yell. Don't mind crawling around under a Landy, even if it's someone elses!

[Svengali0]

"I'm thinking removing the gearbox from the vehicle and separating it from the transfer case and presenting the box to either CMW (Ray) or similar venue. This seems sensible. This would lower the all up cost (removing the remove/refit element of the invoice) quite significantly perhaps to the tune of $800 or so, maybe more...The job would take about three to four or so hours (removal). It's a pretty straight forward job but best performed by two. Anyone interested in assisting? This is a two way street of course.... :)
Just wondering...."

If you'll be working on it in Canberra, give us a yell. Don't mind crawling around under a Landy, even if it's someone elses![/QUOTE]

Poor bastar.. Most people run away from this sort of thing lol
Will contact after getting further opinion on the symptoms in two weeks. I haven't done this on a 110 before.

[SheldonA]

If you'll be working on it in Canberra, give us a yell. Don't mind crawling around under a Landy, even if it's someone elses!




Poor bastar.. Most people run away from this sort of thing lol

Actaully I prefer someone else's vehicle... when it is your own you start thinking/worrying about all the stuff you see that should be fixed. When it's some one else's you can just poke and laugh :)

[Svengali0]

Hi Everyone.

I'm new here but have been reading the various posts for a while. Great to see this is a good community to share and find advice:).

I am however not new to L/R and my current car, an '85 County LT85 standard 4BD1 is the 4th Isuzu powered L/R. Previous cars include civilian 6x6 4BD1T, a stage 111 ute 4BD1 (sans baffle kit on the engine and it was a 'chirpy' little thing too...) and a conversion 4BA1 into a Ser111 ute over 15 years ago (that was fun- the conversion plate was a 'Zenith' engineering kit (Milton, Brisbane) that left a bit to be desired).

I won't mention how many Ser 1, 11, 11a and 111's I have had. I couldn't help myself for a few years there and I just bought 'em no matter where they were- mostly diesels too. But my days of putting up with the old Rover diesel have long passed....


Anyway, the '85 County is getting just on 800km to it's 75 litre non standard tank (255/85/16 BFG muddies) so mileage is good.

This car has been all over Australia (previous owner used to take photos in the outback, and he sent through pics of the vehicle being featured in an Indian Cigarette commercial at one point about 12 or so years ago). I can dig up these pics and post if any one is interested...

Turns out that while the blessed 4BD1 has had nill work performed to it outside regular oil and filter changes, and pump/injector overhaul at about 365k's (now 540k's and still won't use oil or get hot)- the LT85 has been rebuilt about three times- and the last rebuild (unsure when, possibly early 400k) included modifying the bearings to take larger, beefier items more suited to load requirements.

This was apparently done in far North QLD.


I've been reading the threads regarding experiences with the LT85 and this has proved very useful.

Through this, I have taken note of opinions that the gearbox primary input shaft bearings appear to get stressed out especially through sustained running in fifth gear (I do a few long trips every now and then- mostly in fifth as you do...).

I have a symptom that is some cause for concern.

I can't tell if the throwout bearing/clutch release bearing is noisy of if the primary input shaft bearing is about to die. There is a noticeable metallic clicking at idle that disappears when I depress the clutch. Fairly recent onset (within the last 3k). The clutch itself is about at the point of it's half life by appearances.

Does anyone have advice about diagnosis? If one or more of the bearings inside the box is about to go then it would be sensible to pull the thing down and have it addressed- but there are significant costs in this even if I do it myself....
What to do...

Oh, gearbox oil recently replaced with 75/85 grade castrol mineral oil improved gear shifts significantly. There is almost no noise coming from the drive train apart from a distant muted whine (it is land rover after all).

The gearbox oil was fairly dark, appeared to be correct grade oil- and there was noticeable brassy elements in the bottom of my collection pan when the drained out oil sat over night.


Opinions???:):question:


I paid a considerable amount of money to Canberra Motor Works (Ray) to assess the gearbox short of pulling the thing down and undressing it to the last bush and circlip and he says that it's good as far as he can tell. Reckons the thing is 'In pretty good condition for a County'
So- thats probably good feedback. Hope I can take it to the bank in relative terms- Better to be a worry-wort than being stuck at some god forsaken point between Dunedoo and Cowra with a dead gearbox though....
So this is the good news. Maybe upgrading the LT85 is worth the effort? Time will tell.
Ray also said (when asked) that a turbo motor should not overload the present transmission arrangement if it's a low blow item <7psi or so.

[justinc]

Ray certainly seems to know his stuff, so I am in no doubt that he has given good advice, BUT I have still seen and heard of many of these LT85's both NA and Turboed, fail earlier than they should behind a 4BD1. I would still consider an LT95 or better still a Grubb MSA conversion.

Another school of thought is that some bellhousings/ engine adapter housings to suit the LT85 to 4BD1 were machined out of centre, up to .040" apparently, which is a sure reason for front input brg failure. My uncle had 3 rebuilds with his LT85, finallly at 300K it had the bellhousing etc measured for concentricity and it was found to be out, it was then rectified and it did a further 150,000 trouble free km before vehicle was pulled apart. The trans was then fitted to a 4BD1T that pumped out some serious torque, and after towing 2+ tons in 5th a LOT, it finally gave up by spinning 5th on the mainshaft and then was substituted for a LT95. I agree ratios etc are better, but overall reliability in my book is paramount.

Just my feelings on the subject:(


JC

[Jesse.s]

I paid a considerable amount of money to Canberra Motor Works (Ray) to assess the gearbox short of pulling the thing down and undressing it to the last bush and circlip and he says that it's good as far as he can tell. Reckons the thing is 'In pretty good condition for a County'
So- thats probably good feedback. Hope I can take it to the bank in relative terms- Better to be a worry-wort than being stuck at some god forsaken point between Dunedoo and Cowra with a dead gearbox though....
So this is the good news. Maybe upgrading the LT85 is worth the effort? Time will tell.
Ray also said (when asked) that a turbo motor should not overload the present transmission arrangement if it's a low blow item <7psi or so.


can any one tell me how this all turned out? I have same setup same problem. Except mine only dose it after a bit of a drive when everything is warm. It's a kind of rattling ticking noise
I'd be interested to know if the noise ended up amounting to more or if it turned out to be because of some thing else.

[Svengali0]

can any one tell me how this all turned out? I have same setup same problem. Except mine only dose it after a bit of a drive when everything is warm. It's a kind of rattling ticking noise
I'd be interested to know if the noise ended up amounting to more or if it turned out to be because of some thing else.


sorry mate..I'm between LR at the moment and this old post was ancient history. No the LT85 was fine, it was me worrying. THe rattling on idle, going away when the clutch depressed was completely normal, and each oil change demonstrated nil abnormal inclusions, no gear change issues or dropping under trailing throttle.
Note however that this box had been modified at great expense by the previous owner...having suffered no less than three catastrophic events over the several years of ownership prior to him going to an a transmission and engineering firm in FNQ following the last failure. He was no certain exactly what they did but it never failed after that last rebuild and through the years that I had it.