Anyone running Liquid LPG on their D3?

[Gullible]

Just as the title said, is there anyone running their D3 on liquid LPG?

Just wondering as it was supposed to be the next big think but I've not heard much about it recently.

[bee utey]

Ask this mob:

Australian LPG Warehouse - Systems (http://www.australianlpgwarehouse.com.au/Products/Systems/JTG-Liquid-Injection.aspx)

They have a Land Rover link but it seems to be broken.

[shining]

Petrol or Diesel? There doesn't appear to be too many places to put a tank.

[Gullible]

I've seen the systems advertised.
I was wondering if anyone was using one on a petrol V8 and what their verdict was?

[Mike_S]

I have my 4.4 V8 RRS running on LPG here in the UK, is there anything in particular you want to know ?

Gas tank is in place of the spare wheel, it's the same on UK D3's converted to LPG as well.

[Gullible]

Hi Mike_S,
Are you running liquid?
if so what system?

[ozscott]

I wouldn't hold your breath for a kit for the d3 d4. My understanding is that it is complex and likely to be developed in the early stages by manufacturer's of vehicles. If it goes aftermarket it may not be profitable to develop it for disco's given there are so few disco and rr v8s. Cheers

[vnx205]

Just as the title said, is there anyone running their D3 on liquid LPG?

Just wondering as it was supposed to be the next big think but I've not heard much about it recently.

Is liquid LPG something you buy with money withdrawn from an ATM machine after entering your PIN number? :p:p:p

[chuck]

One of the Independent Landrover specialists in the Eastern Suburbs of Melbourne has done it & the vehicle was for sale a while ago.

I cant remember which one.

Regards

Chuck

[Mike_S]

Bit of a long winded reply here, but it's possibly worth the effort so grab a coffee.

It's an eGas system with a 95 litre tank mounted under the back where the spare wheel normally lives, so I now have a couple of tins of puncture repair mousse instead of a spare wheel. The ecu's mounted in the 2nd battery box under the bonnet and it's a 'piggy back' ecu, replicating the signals from the main ecu. They have to be a learning ecu otherwise it causes no end of problems. It's switchable, so I can run on either LPG or petrol but if I leave the LPG system switched on, it automatically switches over onto LPG when the engine reaches (I think) 40 degrees. It also switches off the LPG system if a sudden heavy load occurs, so hard acceleration or towing a heavy trailer uphill etc. I've now covered about 30 thousand miles on LPG with the remaining 22 thousand miles on petrol (car was converted at 12k miles, now has 53k miles on the clock), I'm not religious about running it on LPG and generally run 3 tanks of LPG to one of petrol, I use the LPG on long runs rather than round town.

To be honest, I bought the car already converted and had I done it myself I'd have had a different system installed, the 4.4 is very sensitive and the engine management light often comes on, looking back through the fault codes it's always for the same things (running weak or running rich) and that's just one of the issues you can face. I've done a fair bit of research into the conversions just for my own information really, speaking to a couple of the major installers here in the UK about their solutions. The chap who converted mine had never done a Sport before and thought it still had the BMW 4.4, rather than the Jag unit so although he knows his stuff, he did admit to not knowing anything about the issues that affect the Jag engine when running on LPG.

I'm assuming you chaps know about the valve seat recession issues on the Jag engines and to that end over here there are 2 ways of dealing with it (I'm not sure if this is problem with the Oz spec engines, so forgive me if the next info is irrelevant).

JE Engineering change the exhaust guides & valves to a harder material due to the higher burn temperature of LPG eating the valves & guides, that's a cure to the issue of recession but it's pricey, when I visited them it was about £1500 for the cylinder heads + fitting + the LPG system. Costly, but it's a solution to the problem and I'm convinced by what they told me. As mine is an early 2005 engine the issue isn't as prevalent and I may be lucky, but JE are aware that Land Rover changed the spec of the cylinder heads in late 2005 and those engines are far more susceptible to failure. As JE did investigation work for Land Rover on the viability of LPG I consider them to be expert enough to have come up with the correct solution. I spent a couple of hours with them one day discussing it and they had a good poke around the installation on my car, deeming it to be 'OK' but not ideal. By the way, JE will not convert a supercharged engine without changing the guides & valves. A neighbour of mine had his S/C Range Rover converted without having the heads done and I can see where they're coming from, his heads lasted less than 10 thousand miles before they were destroyed.

The 2nd and much cheaper way of dealing with it is an electronically controlled 'Flashlube' valve protection system that sprays oil in with the gas, that's about £400 over here and as I see it, it's a workaround for an issue, it's not a cure. The cure is the new cylinder heads, but the valve protector would likely do the same job although for how long I couldn't say. I'm going to have my system looked at by an installer here in the UK who swears by the valve protector system, to be fair the emails I've had from him are very convincing and there's no doubting he knows his stuff.

I'm getting about 17mpg on LPG, I get about 19mpg on petrol so at the moment with LPG being about 60% of the price of petrol I'm making quite a big saving, it's an average of near on 30mpg equivalent cost. There's no noticeable drop off in power and I've towed a 2 tonne load quite happily on LPG.

I would say though, if you're considering the conversion then do your homework and be 100% confident in the person doing the work, they're fully conversant with the equipment they're installing and that it's a proven system. Mine definitely isn't on all counts and I'm expecting to have to replace the cylinder heads at some point in the future. I'm not concerned by this but it is annoying all the same.

Happy to try and answer any questions, but they'll only be my opinion on it. It's worth looking at JE Engineering's website and also that of 4-Tech who are the 2 companies I've spoken to.

LPG Conversions | Products (http://www.jeengineering.co.uk/products/lpg-conversions.html)

4-Tech (http://www.4-tech.org.uk/)

As far as I'm aware there won't be a conversion for the D4 or new RRS, the engine management systems are just too complex and they'll shutdown when they detect the LPG.