Fires in Perth

[CraigE]

Big fires raging in the Perth foothills at the moment.
So far 59 home lost completely and many more damaged.
Thoughts are with these people as they are with the people recovering in Qld, NSW, Vic and other parts of WA.
:(:(:(

[klappers]

Big fires raging in the Perth foothills at the moment.
So far 59 home lost completely and many more damaged.
Thoughts are with these people as they are with the people recovering in Qld, NSW, Vic and other parts of WA.
:(:(:(

:(!

[The ho har's]

Mother nature has sure cracked a hissy fit this year and last:(:(


Menopausal perhaps:wasntme:

Mrs hh:(

[justinc]

Yes not good at all, I know several people who have lived/ still live there, will try and contact them
Hope they are OK.

Wife spent a lot of her childhood in Kalamunda etc, when we went back there some years ago she was horrified that the place was STILL at risk of fire disaster due to poor clearing and management of fuel. Hope it doesn't reach there with a BIG wind, it'll be an even bigger disaster:(

JC

[LandyAndy]

At least 3 of the fires are now known not to be lit by firebugs.
Redhill fire was branches falling on pwerlines.
Roleystone/Kelmscott fire was grinder sparks,ON A TOTAL FIREBAN DAY WHERE HOT WORK OUTSIDE IS BANNED.
The Dandaragan fire was a re-alighting of a bushfire from last weeks storms.
Andrew

[richard4u2]

At least 3 of the fires are now known not to be lit by firebugs.
Redhill fire was branches falling on pwerlines.
Roleystone/Kelmscott fire was grinder sparks,ON A TOTAL FIREBAN DAY WHERE HOT WORK OUTSIDE IS BANNED.
The Dandaragan fire was a re-alighting of a bushfire from last weeks storms.
Andrew
total fire ban, people who move from the city out to special rural have no idea what that means, also people who come here from europe have no idea about our summers

[CraigE]

68 or 69 houses now lost and another couple of hundred damaged.
We really need better fire fighting resources in this country. Shame the emergency services levy that was supposed to alleviate this is being misused.

[KarlB]

News reports this evening put the number of houses lost at 72 with another 32 damaged. No doubt there would be hundreds of properties suffering other significant damage including lost fencing, sheds and garages, cars, etc. A very significant fire indeed. News reports are also indicating that the angle grinder user is believed to have been an off-duty police officer. His where-abouts are unknown and fears have been expressed for his welfare.

Not so cheery
KarlB
:(

[CraigE]

News reports this evening put the number of houses lost at 72 with another 32 damaged. No doubt there would be hundreds of properties suffering other significant damage including lost fencing, sheds and garages, cars, etc. A very significant fire indeed. News reports are also indicating that the angle grinder user is believed to have been an off-duty police officer. His where-abouts are unknown and fears have been expressed for his welfare.

Not so cheery
KarlB
:(
The police officer last I heard was talking with police. He may have done the wrong thing but there was no malice and I would reckon he would be feeling quite unwell.

[MickS]

Why TF do they state "an off-duty police officer.." Sensationalism. Had it been a vet surgeon or a cleaner, I suspect their occupation would not have been mentioned. ****wit journalists...https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/02/980.jpg (http://planetsmilies.net)

[KarlB]

Why TF do they state "an off-duty police officer.." Sensationalism. Had it been a vet surgeon or a cleaner, I suspect their occupation would not have been mentioned. ****wit journalists...https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/02/980.jpg (http://planetsmilies.net)

I would have thought that a police officer is a person in a position of particular responsibility and the expectations of the community as to their behaviour is higher. The same way that the community expects better of the clergy and school teachers when it comes to appropriate behaviour with children.

Cheers
KarlB
:)

[MickS]

"I would have thought that a police officer is a person in a position of particular responsibility and the expectations of the community as to their behaviour is higher. The same way that the community expects better of the clergy and school teachers when it comes to appropriate behaviour with children."

Ordinarily, I would not have seen this comment thanks to the "ignore" facility, but I wasn't logged in and I did see it.

Drawing parallels between the use of an angle grinder and rock spiders. Yup.

I would have suggested a lack of common sense perhaps..and as we know...the only problem with common sense is that it's not that common.

Perhaps as well as a "working with children" form, the police should also be made to fill out a "working with angle grinder whilst off duty form"...

[MEANZ06]

i heard this on the news here a day or two ago...

all you blokes go from epic floods to epic fires in a month???

thats hardcore weather! :o

[richard4u2]

i wouldnt mind betting 80% of peoples on here have used an angle grinder and how many have stoped and given it a second thought as to where the sparks were going , some will most of the time but not all the time ???

[kenleyfred]

I remember once using a grinder to get the drum out of a broken front loader washing machine to use as a fire place.
Geez it's getting hot I started thinking after a while. Kept going and then ran to jump in swimming pool. I had set my favorite flanno shirt on fire.

[Ferret]

I had set my favorite flanno shirt on fire.

Well, you were wanting a fire place. :D Anyway, I started a fire in my garage using an angle grinder once. Yep, never gave a second thought to wear the sparks were going.

[LOVEMYRANGIE]

At least 3 of the fires are now known not to be lit by firebugs.
Redhill fire was branches falling on pwerlines.
Roleystone/Kelmscott fire was grinder sparks,ON A TOTAL FIREBAN DAY WHERE HOT WORK OUTSIDE IS BANNED.
The Dandaragan fire was a re-alighting of a bushfire from last weeks storms.
Andrew

The Roleystone Kelmscott grinder incident with the off duty cop, wonder if he's gonna write himself up....
What a pillock, should know better....


Sent from my backyard TeePee using smoke signals.

[LSD_AUTOMOTIVE]

The police officer last I heard was talking with police. He may have done the wrong thing but there was no malice and I would reckon he would be feeling quite unwell.

It's been reported they can't locate him now and there are fears for his wellbeing...:(

[richard4u2]

was he really breaking the law , as i see it aramadale/kelmscott shire is a metro shire and they dont issue total fire banns just high fire risk , therefor he can use an angle grinder and was not doing any thing illegal , thats the way i see it . is there a lawyer in the house ?

[Bushie]

was he really breaking the law , as i see it aramadale/kelmscott shire is a metro shire and they dont issue total fire banns just high fire risk , therefor he can use an angle grinder and was not doing any thing illegal , thats the way i see it . is there a lawyer in the house ?


https://internet.fesa.wa.gov.au/totalfirebans/Pages/TotalFireBanWhatCantIDo.aspx

Pretty much spells it out for WA, don't see anything there that would routinely exempt a 'metro' shire.

btw They are also different to NSW which are different to Vic and different again to Qld.


Martyn

[JDNSW]

i heard this on the news here a day or two ago...

all you blokes go from epic floods to epic fires in a month???

thats hardcore weather! :o

Not in the same place - Perth is over a thousand miles from the closest flood areas, although I do recall having seen bushfires and flooding rain only a few kilometres apart on one occasion (on each side of a divide).

Just to put it in perspective, in Southern Australia it is summer - typically when we get bushfires, but in tropical Australia, we have a wet season, not a summer. And the wet season is when we can expect both floods and cyclones (hurricanes in N.America). The floods in Victoria at this time of the year are unusual, but related to the cyclones in the north, and the floods in western NSW are simply the water from the Qld floods a month or two ago moving downstream - most of inland Australia is pretty flat, and it takes a long time for water to get to the sea!

John

[MickS]

Police officer charged with starting bushfire that destroyed 72 homes | News.com.au (http://www.news.com.au/national/huge-blaze-sparks-evacuations-in-perths-northeast/story-e6frfkvr-1226002918162)

When he does turn up again, it may well be hanging off the end of a rope...

[Ace]

I would have thought that a police officer is a person in a position of particular responsibility and the expectations of the community as to their behaviour is higher. The same way that the community expects better of the clergy and school teachers when it comes to appropriate behaviour with children.

Cheers
KarlB
:)

He is a police officer, not a bloody firefighter. If he had been a firefighter then yes he should have known better.

In this case his chosen employment has nothing to do with it. As Mick said if he had been a vet or something they wouldnt have mentioned his employment. Police officer or not, he is still human and like all human beings they make mistakes. Sure this turned out to be a big one but there was no malice intended and the fact that he has gone missing would indicate that he is having alot of trouble dealing with it.

[THE BOOGER]

I like good accurate reporting, original reports just said an off duty police officer started the fire no mention of the grinder:mad: typical jurnos

[CraigE]

i heard this on the news here a day or two ago...

all you blokes go from epic floods to epic fires in a month???

thats hardcore weather! :o

Yep, problem with WA is it is so large and ranges from sub tropical to temperate. We can have cyclones in the North that can cause flooding anywhere in the state and 2 days later be tinder dry with 40-50 deg c days. The south is generally tinder dry in the summer.

[CraigE]

Not in the same place - Perth is over a thousand miles from the closest flood areas, although I do recall having seen bushfires and flooding rain only a few kilometres apart on one occasion (on each side of a divide).

Just to put it in perspective, in Southern Australia it is summer - typically when we get bushfires, but in tropical Australia, we have a wet season, not a summer. And the wet season is when we can expect both floods and cyclones (hurricanes in N.America). The floods in Victoria at this time of the year are unusual, but related to the cyclones in the north, and the floods in western NSW are simply the water from the Qld floods a month or two ago moving downstream - most of inland Australia is pretty flat, and it takes a long time for water to get to the sea!

John

John,
close but not quite. Carnarvon is 904kms from Perth not 1000 miles. Also we got our major flooding in Ravensthorpe in January as the water came down from Northern Goldfields and ran all the way down.
But as I have said WA is a big state with huge temp and weather differences.

[CraigE]

He is a police officer, not a bloody firefighter. If he had been a firefighter then yes he should have known better.

In this case his chosen employment has nothing to do with it. As Mick said if he had been a vet or something they wouldnt have mentioned his employment. Police officer or not, he is still human and like all human beings they make mistakes. Sure this turned out to be a big one but there was no malice intended and the fact that he has gone missing would indicate that he is having alot of trouble dealing with it.

As a copper he should be aware of fire ban rules as they are the HMA.
But as said he is going to be suffering for something we all have probablly done. I would ask how many of us would not even think twice about picking up an angle grinder on our suburban block (was not a farm or big property) and do a little bit of grinding on a trailer? I would guess most even those that know fire ban rules. Would we light a fire I doubt it.
The fire rules are a bit vague and often do not apply depending on what and where. Mining for example is exempt to a lot.
As far as I can read there is no ban on using power tools in c grinders and welders.

[JDNSW]

John,
close but not quite. Carnarvon is 904kms from Perth not 1000 miles. Also we got our major flooding in Ravensthorpe in January as the water came down from Northern Goldfields and ran all the way down.
But as I have said WA is a big state with huge temp and weather differences.

Actually I was thinking of the floods in Qld, NSW and Victoria - I'm afraid the floods in Carnarvon have barely made a ripple in th eastern states! The fires in Perth have though.

John

[LandyAndy]

Why TF do they state "an off-duty police officer.." Sensationalism. Had it been a vet surgeon or a cleaner, I suspect their occupation would not have been mentioned. ****wit journalists...http://planetsmilies.net/angry-smiley-17162.gif (http://planetsmilies.net)


The man in charge has been charged.
A Sargeant SHOULD have some idea of the real world and what actions cause.
Try and convince a police officer you didnt know it was illegal to grow dope plants.
Try and convince the general public that a Sargeant wouldnt understand that you are not allowed to use an angle grinder in the open when they are banned during a TOTAL FIRE BAN.
Andrew

[MickS]

The man in charge has been charged.
A Sargeant SHOULD have some idea of the real world and what actions cause.
Try and convince a police officer you didnt know it was illegal to grow dope plants.
Try and convince the general public that a Sargeant wouldnt understand that you are not allowed to use an angle grinder in the open when they are banned during a TOTAL FIRE BAN.
Andrew

What do you mean "the man in charge"..in charge of what? The angle grinder?

And he's actually been summonsed...not charged...two different things. See my earlier post.

The point made earlier was that they felt they just HAD to identify him as a cop..again, see my earlier post.

"Police officer charged with starting bushfire that destroyed 72 homes.."
"Perth bushfires were 'started by cop'..."

Makes it sound deliberate. But I guess it sells papers as opposed to "Fire started by plant operator.."

Again with the comparisons...rock spiders and dope growers compared to a bloke using an angle grinder during a total fire ban.

I just love the way people expect cops to know everything :Rolling: like asking a truck driver in the air force how to fly a plane...makes me sick ....

[CraigE]

Actually I was thinking of the floods in Qld, NSW and Victoria - I'm afraid the floods in Carnarvon have barely made a ripple in th eastern states! The fires in Perth have though.

John

Fair enough.
Shows typical eastern states biased reporting once again. People in Carnarvon going through the same thing and not news worthy, hence why I have been a bit vocal. No difference what the people are going through. Gascoyne Junction is gone completely and unlikely to be rebuilt.

[CraigE]

From FESA

What is a Total Fire Ban?

A Total Fire Ban is declared by the Minister for Emergency Services on advice from FESA after consultation with relevant local shire councils that may be affected.

When a Total Fire Ban is declared it prohibits the lighting of any fires in the open air and any other activities that may start a fire.

The ban includes all open fires for the purpose of cooking or camping. It also includes incinerators, welding, grinding, soldering or gas cutting. Exemptions are allowed for domestic purposes with conditions applied.

The problem is it is a grey and vague area and FESA pamphlets and on line info is vague, even though the regulations are fairly clear, and the post above refers to it but the link below which says what you can not do does not
FESA - Total Fire Bans (http://internet.fesa.wa.gov.au/totalfirebans/Pages/TotalFireBanWhatCantIDo.aspx)
Very easy to get confused. From my interpretation it would come under this section in the link
Can I use a chainsaw, plant or grass trimmer, or lawn mower?

[CraigE]

OK straight from WA Bushfires Regulations

Part VIIA — Control of operations likely to create
bush fire danger
[Heading inserted in Gazette 22 Dec 1998 p. 6857.]
39BA. Operations likely to cause bush fires
Pursuant to section 27A(1)(a)(ii) of the Act the operation of —
(a) welding apparatus;
(b) power operated abrasive cutting discs,
in the open air, are hereby specified as operations likely to
create a bush fire danger, generally and at all times.
[Regulation 39BA inserted in Gazette 12 Nov 1982 p. 4463.]
39C. Welding and cutting apparatus
(1) A person shall not operate —
(a) welding apparatus of any kind; or
(b) power operated abrasive cutting discs of any kind,
in the open air, unless —
(c) at least one fire extinguisher is provided at the place
where the welding or cutting operation is carried out;
and
(d) the place referred to in paragraph (c) is surrounded by a
firebreak which is at least 5 metres wide.
[(2) deleted]
(3) A bush fire control officer may, subject to the directions, if any,
of the local government by which he was appointed, issue to a
person operating —
(a) welding apparatus referred to in subregulation (1)(a); or
(b) a power operated abrasive cutting disc referred to in
subregulation (1)(b),
or to the owner or occupier of the land upon which those
operations are carried on, such directions as he considersnecessary for the prevention of fire on that land and the person,
owner or occupier, as the case may be, shall comply with those
directions.
[Regulation 39C inserted in Gazette 12 Nov 1982 p. 4463;
amended in Gazette 22 Dec 1998 p. 6857 and 6858.]

[Bushie]

Fair enough.
Shows typical eastern states biased reporting once again. People in Carnarvon going through the same thing and not news worthy, hence why I have been a bit vocal. No difference what the people are going through. Gascoyne Junction is gone completely and unlikely to be rebuilt.

The floods around Carnarvon got good coverage in the east, (at least on Sydney networks), trouble is this is a bloody big country.
John would be covered by regional news, so would regional news that covers Carnarvon have shown much about the flooding that affected Dubbo (NSW) the regional area that John is probably getting his news from.

Martyn

[digger]

https://internet.fesa.wa.gov.au/totalfirebans/Pages/TotalFireBanWhatCantIDo.aspx

Pretty much spells it out for WA, don't see anything there that would routinely exempt a 'metro' shire.

btw They are also different to NSW which are different to Vic and different again to Qld.


Martyn


SA, (one of the country biggest states for those of you who don't seem to recall or know about us ?!) also has a different set up... maybe an assessment of all states bushfire laws (they are not "wildfires"!!= I hate that term which was stolen from the yanks for no apparent reason) and a summary of what needs to be covered and then issue uniform laws across country!!! (shock horror!!)

as for the emergency services levy, in SA at least it replaced a lot of fire stations, ses sheds etc (combining new facilities in a lot of cases) and allowed updated vehicles/uniforms etc..) No frontline petrol vehicles finally became a full reality !! Seems to be dropping off now, but then our state govt has gone on a spending spree and wasted that much moolah we are all going to be suffering from "cutbacks" for years to come (but still they will spend money on stuff like "guitar festivals" and crap!! :mad: so wonder if they are "dipping" into the fund...

digger



Meanz,
On one day we had the remnants of flooding in Qld, Nsw, Vic, a cyclone in Qld, bushfires in WA and snow in the aussie alps. We love our "sunburnt country" !! (look for a poem by dorethea mckellor - "I love a sunburnt country") :)

[MickS]

Meanz,
On one day we had the remnants of flooding in Qld, Nsw, Vic, a cyclone in Qld, bushfires in WA and snow in the aussie alps. We love our "sunburnt country" !! (look for a poem by dorethea mckellor - "I love a sunburnt country") :)

Or there is Austen Tayshus' scrabbled version....:eek: for those that have his Australiana album....