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solmanic
3rd March 2011, 04:25 PM
Got a phone call from the local Mercedes dealership yesterday to let me know that they had a G-Wagen on the floor. "Is it the diesel?" I asked - of course. Why would they have a $220K AMG one sitting about?

After my morning meetings I thought why not - so I popped in for a tyre-kick and test drive.

Firstly - here's a pic (from the interweb, not one of mine) just to keep the "must be pics" crowd happy...
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

Anyhoo - I turned up and had a good sticky-beak before a salesman came over. I don't know what kind of customer he thought I was but he must have attempted to profile me as he walked across the room and just plain got it wrong. "Look at this bad boy..." he said - I presume he was referring to the car and not me. He then proceeded to show me the engine (didn't know where the bonnet catch was) and the in-car entertainment system before I barraged him with more meaningful questions concerning ground clearance, towing capacity, cargo area, suspension etc etc.

The sales manager moved the vehicle out of the showroom and we went for a drive... and here are my impressions, specifically compared to the Defender...

Engine - what engine. It is probably the least diesel sounding diesel I've heard. It in fact sounds like a rough running petrol engine. Once you get inside it's like stepping into the cone of silence. They might as well be TV screens placed all around the car simply showing you pictures of what's outside. When you stab the throttle however, you remember it is a diesel, and modestly sized one at that (2.9l). It is a 7 speed automatic that moves up through the gears smoothly but does get a bit violent when kicking down.

The driving position is probably the single most impressive thing about this car. It is without a doubt, the closest thing to the Defender in so far as you have that clear view of the corners of the vehicle and feel for where everything is at. Both diffs line-up directly under the driver's left leg, nice and easy for when you need to place them over an obstacle. And you will need to place them as ground clearance is some 30-40mm less than the Defender. Still, it's pretty good. Suspension is reassuringly simple and mechanical - solid axles, coil springs and the biggest trailing arms and stabiliser bars I've seen. The exhausts also exit sideways, forward of the rear wheels but don't stick right out like the AMG ones.

With the flattish sides (like the Defender) and frogseye indicators on the front, I felt very comfortable manoeuvring the vehicle confident that I knew exactly where things were around me. The cabin is surprisingly compact but certainly not short of space where it's needed. I could reach across and open the passenger's door if I had to. The only weakness is the massive blindspots at the rear corners where there are no windows, but of course there is a panoramic reversing camera mounted over the centre of the rear door.

The G-Wagen has diff-locks front, centre and rear as standard! All push button. High-low range is also push button and easy to use. Since the salesman knew nothing I just guessed that you needed to put it in neutral to do this and sure enough that was how you did it. Double pushng the gear lever to the left jumps straight from drive to low gear. Low-low is not quite as slow as the Deefer, but still impressivey slow. Holds well downhill and you can also use the cruise control to set a fixed speed if you want from 30km/hr. Uphill the automatic doesn't pull at idle, you need to use the throttle, but in low range it is extremely easy and has immense travel for good control.

On the highway the power is fine. Not mind-blowing but more than enough. Brakes are the same as the AMG version and will pull you up faster than if you hit whatever it was you were trying to avoid. The brake pedal was however, adjusted up way too high so I kept catching my shoe on it. The first 1/4 of its travel did nothing then your eyeballs popped out of their sockets.

Inside there was all the standard climate controlled, iPod audio, memory seat fluff Range Rover and Discovery 4 owners are probably used to. Not really my cup of tea and I could do without most of it but I'm sure the wife will love it. Even though the European models have cloth trim in base spec. we only get leather here. Cloth is a special order and it remains to be seen if that reduces the price at all or they charge more for the inconvenience.

Mercedes offer a lot of useful accessories like towbar and rubber mats as well as plenty of not-useful ones like ambient mood lighting (WTF). There is apparently a standard Merc bullbar but I suspect it is the Euro-spec one that turns into a pillow if it hits a pedestrian. We'll wait and see if ARB offer anything in future. The sales manager assured me that this is now a standard line item and their dealership allocation is three per month. If this is true at least we may see useful numbers of G-Wagens coming onto the market so aftermarket mobs have a reason to develop some stuff.

When we got back to the dealers, I asked some more probing questions about loadspace and how big a dog I could fit in with the seats down. The salesman, and sales manager couldn't work out how to fold the rear seats forward so I'll have to go back next week to find out more. The sales manager got a bit excited to think that they may have a customer who was actually going to use the thing off-road. I told them I had a place I wanted to test it properly if they didn't mind a few scratches - they did.

Price? About $160K with GST and luxury car tax. Insurance? Don't ask. You wouldn't believe me.

Would I buy one? If my accountant told me I could, in a heartbeat. It's like a Defender and a Range Rover rolled into one but better built, and with better coffee at the service centre.

And finally, if I did, does that mean I can't hang out here anymore? I'll keep my Land Rover keyring.

juddy
3rd March 2011, 04:45 PM
Whys it so expensive here compared to Europe, i would say do Mercedes Australia think they will sell any at that price, but come to think of it, all those people " Example " on the gold coast without brian's who buy Porsche Cayenne turbos and the like, will love this thing, perfect for the school run, and getting one up on G500 next door, and most of all get some 22" chrome rims on there baby, well bling, oh lower the suspension too.

PAT303
3rd March 2011, 04:56 PM
Trouble is the thing would be 15 years old before someone who would use the diff locks could afford it. Pat

isuzurover
3rd March 2011, 04:56 PM
does that mean I can't hang out here anymore? I'll keep my Land Rover keyring.

Yes, but you may have to hang out in the REMLR section, which will soon be renamed REMLRAMB (And Mercedes Benz).

So how much trade in did they give you on the Puma?

Ranga
3rd March 2011, 05:25 PM
The worst thing is the yuppies who buy this thing will actually have a capable off-roader, unlike an X5 or Cayenne, plus all the luxury. :(

solmanic
3rd March 2011, 05:30 PM
Whys it so expensive here compared to Europe

In one word - TAX. The list price is about $120K which compares to the EU80K price on M-B's German site. There is $40K GST and luxury car tax added on.


Trouble is the thing would be 15 years old before someone who would use the diff locks could afford it. Pat

I know. It's a shame - so I see it as my duty in a way to buy one and then break it on the road up to our property :p.


So how much trade in did they give you on the Puma?

The sales manager was pretty keen to push me to trade in but we didn't talk numbers. Besides, experience has taught me that it is better to sell privately for a realistic price that still far exceeds a trade-in offer. I look after my cars and feel good when they go to a new home with an appreciative buyer.

...now where has Aaron gone? He must be just about finished with the last Defender I sold him.

drivesafe
3rd March 2011, 05:34 PM
The worst thing is the yuppies who buy this thing will actually have a capable off-roader, unlike an X5 or Cayenne, plus all the luxury. :(

And don’t forget to add the L322 ( MY06 on ) Range Rover Vogue to that list of fake 4x4s

solmanic
3rd March 2011, 05:37 PM
The worst thing is the yuppies who buy this thing will actually have a capable off-roader, unlike an X5 or Cayenne, plus all the luxury. :(

I know - there should be a law against it, or maybe a license needed... (http://www.aulro.com/afvb/general-chat/94568-off-road-license-3.html#post1138017) to restrict ownership to only those who have skills.

(do you like the way I ever so subtly steered this thread back onto THAT old chestnut?)

Naks
3rd March 2011, 07:06 PM
G-Wagen here has a list price of R850K. If I won the lottery tomorrow, I'd sell that POS Puma and get a G-Wagen. :angel:

x-box
3rd March 2011, 08:01 PM
I also think the G-wagon is pretty cool, a very capable vehicle, and the only thing i'll ever sell the fender for........ but for the price?? never.....!
If i won lotto however..........

solmanic
4th March 2011, 07:19 AM
It's disappointing that with the volumes being delivered to the army, Mercedes haven't got a more basic model on offer - cloth trim, no sat-nav command centre or electric seats, rubber floor matting, that sort of thing. I guess the G-Wagen has just gone too far upmarket to fit in with the rest of MB's product line.

Having said that, why couldn't a utiliy model line up alongside MB's commercial vans? $80-$90K wouldn't be an unreasonable price.

Michael2
4th March 2011, 07:25 AM
I think if you're going to compare it to a Defender, then you should compare it to a Defender with $80K worth of accessories on it. In which case I'd keep the Defender.

I wonder how soon before ex-NATO RHD versions become available at EU auctions.

x-box
4th March 2011, 07:26 AM
I agree, base spec model "no frills go nearly everywhere" will be nice.
I always liked their idea of coming standard with 3 diff locks (centre being a given anyway), just makes it very capable and useful for guys that go offroad

Jojo
4th March 2011, 08:41 AM
It's disappointing that with the volumes being delivered to the army, Mercedes haven't got a more basic model on offer - cloth trim, no sat-nav command centre or electric seats, rubber floor matting, that sort of thing. I guess the G-Wagen has just gone too far upmarket to fit in with the rest of MB's product line.

Having said that, why couldn't a utiliy model line up alongside MB's commercial vans? $80-$90K wouldn't be an unreasonable price.

There is the no frills G-Professional (http://www.mercedes-benz.de/content/germany/mpc/mpc_germany_website/de/home_mpc/passengercars/home/new_cars/models/g-class/_w463_crosscountry/facts/model_variants/g-class_professional.html) model available (probably not in Oz, though), exactly what you are looking for. It even comes with plain steel rims.
Prices start at € 65.000 for the SW and about € 60.000 for the HT and include German GST. Now, how's that???
Cheers

cols110
4th March 2011, 02:48 PM
http://mercedes4x4.pl/download/GWagon_Professional_range.pdf

Mercedes-Benz Malta - Model variants - G-Class Professional (http://www.mercedes-benz.com.mt/content/malta/mpc/mpc_malta_website/enng/home_mpc/passengercars/home/new_cars/models/g-class/_w463_crosscountry/facts/model_variants/g-class_professional.html)
There is also a PDF at the bottom of the second link.

Here is a better link, once they establish the G in OZ it would not be unrealistic to rock into you local dealer and place an order for one of these, once the army starts getting theirs and there are a few other high spec ones on the road there is no reason they could not supply them by special order.

solmanic
4th March 2011, 06:03 PM
There is the no frills G-Professional (http://www.mercedes-benz.de/content/germany/mpc/mpc_germany_website/de/home_mpc/passengercars/home/new_cars/models/g-class/_w463_crosscountry/facts/model_variants/g-class_professional.html) model available (probably not in Oz, though), exactly what you are looking for. It even comes with plain steel rims.
Prices start at € 65.000 for the SW and about € 60.000 for the HT and include German GST. Now, how's that???
Cheers


http://mercedes4x4.pl/download/GWagon_Professional_range.pdf

Mercedes-Benz Malta - Model variants - G-Class Professional (http://www.mercedes-benz.com.mt/content/malta/mpc/mpc_malta_website/enng/home_mpc/passengercars/home/new_cars/models/g-class/_w463_crosscountry/facts/model_variants/g-class_professional.html)
There is also a PDF at the bottom of the second link.

Here is a better link, once they establish the G in OZ it would not be unrealistic to rock into you local dealer and place an order for one of these, once the army starts getting theirs and there are a few other high spec ones on the road there is no reason they could not supply them by special order.

EXCELLENT! Thanks for those links. That's exactly what I was hoping for. They even come with the freaky tartan cloth seats like the older G-Wagens.

I will make enquiries although I don't expect the dealer to know much.

Interestingly, even though the list price in Germany is €80K or thereabouts, most dealers are advertising G350s discounted to around €65K on various websites.

With regard to comparing a Defender optioned up to around $80K to my hypothetical, dream G-Wagen, I would probably still opt for the G-Wagen as the build quality is seriously worth another $20K I reckon. How much would it cost in real world terms to strip down and re-build a Defender properly? (Bundalene?) I'm thinking mainly about the bodywork and lack of precision in aligning anything as well as the incomparable NVH between the two vehicles.

As far as capability goes, I would agree a fully locked Defender beats the G-Wagen hands down. The Deefer's extra ground clearance even with stock wheels and suspension is unbeatable. But if I had to choose between two types of moon rocket, I would want the one that was airtight.

PAT303
4th March 2011, 06:25 PM
For 160K you could buy a defender,have a LR specialist strip it and fit just about any motor/drivetrain you want and fit it all back together with whatever options you want and still be in front. Pat

wagoo
4th March 2011, 07:46 PM
Is the civilian G wagon really aimed at the Defender market or the Disco one?
Wagoo.

isuzurover
4th March 2011, 07:49 PM
There is the no frills G-Professional (http://www.mercedes-benz.de/content/germany/mpc/mpc_germany_website/de/home_mpc/passengercars/home/new_cars/models/g-class/_w463_crosscountry/facts/model_variants/g-class_professional.html) model available (probably not in Oz, though), exactly what you are looking for. It even comes with plain steel rims.
Prices start at € 65.000 for the SW and about € 60.000 for the HT and include German GST. Now, how's that???
Cheers

Thanks! The German links at the bottom have detailled tech specs. They do have drum rear brakes, however no mention of leaf springs (discussed in another thread). Coils all round on the 4x4, and the 6x6 seems to have the same suspension.

A good bit of kit - it would be great if they sell them here.

wagoo
4th March 2011, 08:30 PM
Thanks! The German links at the bottom have detailled tech specs. They do have drum rear brakes, however no mention of leaf springs (discussed in another thread). Coils all round on the 4x4, and the 6x6 seems to have the same suspension.

A good bit of kit - it would be great if they sell them here.
I couldn't see anything about transfercase ratios, but a nice low 4.38:1 first gear in the auto, 4.38:1 diff ratio, say 2:1 for the torque convertor and a guess at 2:1 low range gives a very useful 76:1 offroad crawler ratio.
Wagoo.

abaddonxi
4th March 2011, 08:34 PM
There is the no frills G-Professional (http://www.mercedes-benz.de/content/germany/mpc/mpc_germany_website/de/home_mpc/passengercars/home/new_cars/models/g-class/_w463_crosscountry/facts/model_variants/g-class_professional.html) model available (probably not in Oz, though), exactly what you are looking for. It even comes with plain steel rims.
Prices start at € 65.000 for the SW and about € 60.000 for the HT and include German GST. Now, how's that???
Cheers


Anyone got an idea about the spare on the model pictured in Jojo's link? The wheels on the car are steel, but the spare looks odd.

isuzubob
4th March 2011, 09:03 PM
I think you'll find the spare is flipped on the back door, and it's just a plastic insert that makes it look odd. There are two Professionals in Australia currently undergoing compliance testing as well as standard for Oz D&P airbags & ESC testing - on sale later in the year. A local stealer in Melb was offering test drives as well.

English Car have a good overall review.

Mercedes G350 Bluetec LWB (2011) CAR review | Road Testing Reviews | Car Magazine Online (http://www.carmagazine.co.uk/Drives/Search-Results/First-drives/Mercedes-G350-Bluetec-LWB-2011-CAR-review/)

Rob W

PAT303
4th March 2011, 09:23 PM
Is the civilian G wagon really aimed at the Defender market or the Disco one?
Wagoo.

A bit of both?.Base spec defender and the higher one gets into the disco.Then there's the AMG which is Overfinch RR. Pat

spudboy
4th March 2011, 11:09 PM
That was a good in-depth review. Thanks for posting all that info.
Cheers
David

Celtoid
4th March 2011, 11:41 PM
Got a phone call from the local Mercedes dealership yesterday to let me know that they had a G-Wagen on the floor. "Is it the diesel?" I asked - of course. Why would they have a $220K AMG one sitting about?

After my morning meetings I thought why not - so I popped in for a tyre-kick and test drive.

Firstly - here's a pic (from the interweb, not one of mine) just to keep the "must be pics" crowd happy...
http://i256.photobucket.com/albums/hh191/solmanic42/gwagen200009.jpg

Anyhoo - I turned up and had a good sticky-beak before a salesman came over. I don't know what kind of customer he thought I was but he must have attempted to profile me as he walked across the room and just plain got it wrong. "Look at this bad boy..." he said - I presume he was referring to the car and not me. He then proceeded to show me the engine (didn't know where the bonnet catch was) and the in-car entertainment system before I barraged him with more meaningful questions concerning ground clearance, towing capacity, cargo area, suspension etc etc.

The sales manager moved the vehicle out of the showroom and we went for a drive... and here are my impressions, specifically compared to the Defender...

Engine - what engine. It is probably the least diesel sounding diesel I've heard. It in fact sounds like a rough running petrol engine. Once you get inside it's like stepping into the cone of silence. They might as well be TV screens placed all around the car simply showing you pictures of what's outside. When you stab the throttle however, you remember it is a diesel, and modestly sized one at that (2.9l). It is a 7 speed automatic that moves up through the gears smoothly but does get a bit violent when kicking down.

The driving position is probably the single most impressive thing about this car. It is without a doubt, the closest thing to the Defender in so far as you have that clear view of the corners of the vehicle and feel for where everything is at. Both diffs line-up directly under the driver's left leg, nice and easy for when you need to place them over an obstacle. And you will need to place them as ground clearance is some 30-40mm less than the Defender. Still, it's pretty good. Suspension is reassuringly simple and mechanical - solid axles, coil springs and the biggest trailing arms and stabiliser bars I've seen. The exhausts also exit sideways, forward of the rear wheels but don't stick right out like the AMG ones.

With the flattish sides (like the Defender) and frogseye indicators on the front, I felt very comfortable manoeuvring the vehicle confident that I knew exactly where things were around me. The cabin is surprisingly compact but certainly not short of space where it's needed. I could reach across and open the passenger's door if I had to. The only weakness is the massive blindspots at the rear corners where there are no windows, but of course there is a panoramic reversing camera mounted over the centre of the rear door.

The G-Wagen has diff-locks front, centre and rear as standard! All push button. High-low range is also push button and easy to use. Since the salesman knew nothing I just guessed that you needed to put it in neutral to do this and sure enough that was how you did it. Double pushng the gear lever to the left jumps straight from drive to low gear. Low-low is not quite as slow as the Deefer, but still impressivey slow. Holds well downhill and you can also use the cruise control to set a fixed speed if you want from 30km/hr. Uphill the automatic doesn't pull at idle, you need to use the throttle, but in low range it is extremely easy and has immense travel for good control.

On the highway the power is fine. Not mind-blowing but more than enough. Brakes are the same as the AMG version and will pull you up faster than if you hit whatever it was you were trying to avoid. The brake pedal was however, adjusted up way too high so I kept catching my shoe on it. The first 1/4 of its travel did nothing then your eyeballs popped out of their sockets.

Inside there was all the standard climate controlled, iPod audio, memory seat fluff Range Rover and Discovery 4 owners are probably used to. Not really my cup of tea and I could do without most of it but I'm sure the wife will love it. Even though the European models have cloth trim in base spec. we only get leather here. Cloth is a special order and it remains to be seen if that reduces the price at all or they charge more for the inconvenience.

Mercedes offer a lot of useful accessories like towbar and rubber mats as well as plenty of not-useful ones like ambient mood lighting (WTF). There is apparently a standard Merc bullbar but I suspect it is the Euro-spec one that turns into a pillow if it hits a pedestrian. We'll wait and see if ARB offer anything in future. The sales manager assured me that this is now a standard line item and their dealership allocation is three per month. If this is true at least we may see useful numbers of G-Wagens coming onto the market so aftermarket mobs have a reason to develop some stuff.

When we got back to the dealers, I asked some more probing questions about loadspace and how big a dog I could fit in with the seats down. The salesman, and sales manager couldn't work out how to fold the rear seats forward so I'll have to go back next week to find out more. The sales manager got a bit excited to think that they may have a customer who was actually going to use the thing off-road. I told them I had a place I wanted to test it properly if they didn't mind a few scratches - they did.

Price? About $160K with GST and luxury car tax. Insurance? Don't ask. You wouldn't believe me.

Would I buy one? If my accountant told me I could, in a heartbeat. It's like a Defender and a Range Rover rolled into one but better built, and with better coffee at the service centre.

And finally, if I did, does that mean I can't hang out here anymore? I'll keep my Land Rover keyring.



A cross between a Deefer and a Rangie...but better built? At $160K....I'm lost!! Those comparisons just don't equate. You could rebuild and "Improve"...in some people's mind, a Deefer how many times over for that $$$$ Is that effort actually possible? Isn't a Deefer the best at what a Deefer is designed to do!

Have you driven a D4? or RRS?.....for another $60K + on top....Jesus, it could fly to the moon.....or you could just add bars and side steps and hybrid wheels and, and, and...still have $$ in your pocket.

Or as I suspect anybody who shells out $160K would do....never take any of these things into consideration.....and decide on how 'Flash you want it to look'.....a G wagon compared to a LR.....LOL!!!!!

Sorry mate, just don't get it!

Best I go drive one....Just for a chuckle....

andyperth
4th March 2011, 11:49 PM
Hi all just wanted to let you know I copied this outstanding review on to the Jeep forum ausjeepoffroad.

solmanic
5th March 2011, 11:01 AM
A cross between a Deefer and a Rangie...but better built? At $160K....I'm lost!! Those comparisons just don't equate. You could rebuild and "Improve"...in some people's mind, a Deefer how many times over for that $$$$ Is that effort actually possible? Isn't a Deefer the best at what a Deefer is designed to do!

Have you driven a D4? or RRS?.....for another $60K + on top....Jesus, it could fly to the moon.....or you could just add bars and side steps and hybrid wheels and, and, and...still have $$ in your pocket.

Or as I suspect anybody who shells out $160K would do....never take any of these things into consideration.....and decide on how 'Flash you want it to look'.....a G wagon compared to a LR.....LOL!!!!!

Sorry mate, just don't get it!

Best I go drive one....Just for a chuckle....

DON'T DO IT! You may come out of the test drive contemplating how much you'll get if you sell the kids for scientific research.

I have driven a D3 and RRS and have to reiterate, my main reason for being impressed with the G-Wagen is the driving position. The D3 & RRS both feel too big. Yes, the seating positon is nice and high, but I still feel like there is just too much car around me in them. The Defender has a unique driving position where you are basically looking down on the front corners of the vehicle and the flat sides (albeit pressed against your right leg) just make you feel more in control of where everything is on a track.

The G-Wagen has more of this feel than anything else I've been in. So taking the fact that I chose the Defender over anything else on offer, if the price was in any way realistic I would choose the G-Wagen too.

But I agree - the price is the thing that doesn't compute. That's why this possibility of the G-Wagen Professional is so intriguing. THAT would be a vehicle I want to see compared directly to the Defender in some sort of measured test.

Celtoid
5th March 2011, 11:21 AM
DON'T DO IT! You may come out of the test drive contemplating how much you'll get if you sell the kids for scientific research.

I have driven a D3 and RRS and have to reiterate, my main reason for being impressed with the G-Wagen is the driving position. The D3 & RRS both feel too big. Yes, the seating positon is nice and high, but I still feel like there is just too much car around me in them. The Defender has a unique driving position where you are basically looking down on the front corners of the vehicle and the flat sides (albeit pressed against your right leg) just make you feel more in control of where everything is on a track.

The G-Wagen has more of this feel than anything else I've been in. So taking the fact that I chose the Defender over anything else on offer, if the price was in any way realistic I would choose the G-Wagen too.

But I agree - the price is the thing that doesn't compute. That's why this possibility of the G-Wagen Professional is so intriguing. THAT would be a vehicle I want to see compared directly to the Defender in some sort of measured test.

It'll be interesting to see how many of these things hit the street in their $160K guise....:eek:

Cheers.

solmanic
5th March 2011, 11:48 AM
It'll be interesting to see how many of these things hit the street in their $160K guise....:eek:

Yeah... with pimped out wheels and black tinted windows, and a complete ****** in the driver's seat who has no clue what all the other buttons do!

Ace
5th March 2011, 08:36 PM
For that money I'd buy a nice D4 and a Defender for weekend play and still have change left over.

Celtoid
6th March 2011, 07:24 PM
Forgot to ask.....$160K.....traction control? Did it have TC and all the other safety bits and bobs?

Cheers,

Kev.

wagoo
6th March 2011, 07:37 PM
For that money I'd buy a nice D4 and a Defender for weekend play and still have change left over.

Going for quantity over quality aye Ace?
Wagoo.

Ace
6th March 2011, 08:59 PM
Going for quantity over quality aye Ace?
Wagoo.

Something like that, I am sure Merc's are good quality, just not for me thats all. I feel the D4 would be alot better value for money. I cant see the value $160000 for something that is essentially a blinged out defender with higher quality control during manufacturing.

Panya
6th March 2011, 10:56 PM
I'm with Ace here. Just a quick look on google UK landrover (in UK pounds) RR from 69K, D4 from 36K, Defender from 20K and G-wagen from UK official website 81K? Holy smoke! Buy the highest spec Defender you can get plus locking diffs plus just about every other mod and accessory you can and you'll still have change for a spare Defender or two! QC can't be that much better, surely?

cols110
7th March 2011, 02:16 AM
One of the blokes in our 4x4 club out here in Dubai has a G55 & a G500. The G500 was his daily drive and is now his off roader, it has done a lot of work off road in the desert and has somewhere between 350-400k on the clock it still looks like it is in show room condition, it has always been well maintained and look after but on the same token well used.

There is no way in the world a Defender would be in the same condition with over 350k on the clock, they really are built to last.

If you are planning on buying a vehicle and keeping it for 20 years, this is one of the vehicles to do it with.

Panya
7th March 2011, 02:50 AM
Yes but I could buy 4 Defenders now and throw one away every 5 years!:p:D:wasntme:

Naks
7th March 2011, 04:55 AM
It amazes me that the G-wagen is hand-built, but when you compare the build quality with a Defender, there is a world of difference.

You really cannot fault the Germans for the quality of their work and their attention to detail :angel:

solmanic
7th March 2011, 09:33 AM
Forgot to ask.....$160K.....traction control? Did it have TC and all the other safety bits and bobs?

Yes. Of course that's unsurprising since Mercedes invented ABS. And the airbags can be switched off manually by a switch on the dashboard (not pulling a fuse). Also, whilst there is good engine braking in low range, there is some sort of automatic hill descent control even in high range that prevents the speed getting away downhill. If you touch the brake when idling down a hill it seems to take this as an indication you don't want to go any faster and holds that speed (or thereabouts, it does creep up a bit).


It amazes me that the G-wagen is hand-built, but when you compare the build quality with a Defender, there is a world of difference.
You really cannot fault the Germans for the quality of their work and their attention to detail :angel:

I'm not sure how hand built the G-Wagen is. I don't think it's anywhere near as manualy assembled as the Defender. The body shell is a much more integrated unit (but not monocoque) on top of the chassis unlike the Defender which is a lot of bits rivetted and bolted together.

toad
7th March 2011, 11:27 AM
Well now, thats a big statement! My Defender is only ten years old with 400 000 km on it and is still in good nick and looking for the next 400 000.

However my Dads 86" brought new in 1955 I must admit is looking a bit forlawn, over 1 million kms, 1 engine/gearbox rebuild in 1980 (and about 7 exhaust valves bit) and almost no paint, but I get the feeling it will out last my Defender. Time will tell, as will a bit of salt air and water on those steel panels.

[/QOUTE] There is no way in the world a Defender would be in the same condition with over 350k on the clock, they really are built to last.

If you are planning on buying a vehicle and keeping it for 20 years, this is one of the vehicles to do it with.[/QUOTE]

Ace
7th March 2011, 05:37 PM
One of the blokes in our 4x4 club out here in Dubai has a G55 & a G500. The G500 was his daily drive and is now his off roader, it has done a lot of work off road in the desert and has somewhere between 350-400k on the clock it still looks like it is in show room condition, it has always been well maintained and look after but on the same token well used.

There is no way in the world a Defender would be in the same condition with over 350k on the clock, they really are built to last.

If you are planning on buying a vehicle and keeping it for 20 years, this is one of the vehicles to do it with.

Sorry mate, but a well maintained Defender with the money that bloke has to spend on servicing and repairs as soon as needed should do 400000km easily.

Im sorry, but for one I have never liked mercedes, dont think they have ever made an attractive one, and secondly I just dont see value for money in the G-wagon. I just cant see how its worth $160000, for that price i'd want it to climb mount everest and have a specially built lodge for me and other G-wagon owners to enjoy because we are the only ones who can get there because of our $160000 defender look alike.

I imagine they can charge that much because of the badge but its a badge I never intend on having on the front of my vehicle.

lambrover
7th March 2011, 05:57 PM
For 160K you could buy a defender,have a LR specialist strip it and fit just about any motor/drivetrain you want and fit it all back together with whatever options you want and still be in front. Pat

Yeah Pat but it would still leak ha ha

cols110
7th March 2011, 06:40 PM
Sorry mate, but a well maintained Defender with the money that bloke has to spend on servicing and repairs as soon as needed should do 400000km easily.

Im sorry, but for one I have never liked mercedes, dont think they have ever made an attractive one, and secondly I just dont see value for money in the G-wagon. I just cant see how its worth $160000, for that price i'd want it to climb mount everest and have a specially built lodge for me and other G-wagon owners to enjoy because we are the only ones who can get there because of our $160000 defender look alike.

I imagine they can charge that much because of the badge but its a badge I never intend on having on the front of my vehicle.

Dont get me wrong I cannot justify 160k for any vehicle let alone a 4x4, as mentioned earlier on in the thread if they could release something like the professional series G in Australia for 80-90k then to me it would be a real proposition. Over here in the UAE G's are a dime a dozen, they are everywhere and sell for much less than what Merc AU are trying to flog them to the Aussies for. Over here you will pick up a new G500 for under 100k which is realistic, the G55 is much dearer and sadly they don't sell the diesel one here at all.

The Australian government is one of the real reason people in OZ get ripped off blindly for products like this as they are trying to protect the un-competative Australian car production industry.

PAT303
7th March 2011, 06:55 PM
It amazes me that the G-wagen is hand-built, but when you compare the build quality with a Defender, there is a world of difference.

You really cannot fault the Germans for the quality of their work and their attention to detail :angel:

My defender is 13 years old,has near 450,000k's on it,has never been in a shed,always parked outside and everything works.The doors haven't fallen off,it start's first time everytime and I spend bugger all on it.All my defender gets is good serving when it's due and nothing more.I like the G wagon and always have since my dads mate owned one for years when I was young but 50K compared to 160?.They are good but not that good. Pat

Celtoid
7th March 2011, 10:03 PM
It amazes me that the G-wagen is hand-built, but when you compare the build quality with a Defender, there is a world of difference.

You really cannot fault the Germans for the quality of their work and their attention to detail :angel:


They used to say that about BMW....but you read some woefull stories about those these days....

solmanic
8th March 2011, 10:52 AM
At $160K it really is a "if money wasn't a factor" option.

Just spoke to the dealer and quizzed him about the G-Wagen Professional. No, it's not planned to release it in Australia, not even alongside Mercedes trucks and vans as a commercial vehicle. They are however, happy to down-spec a G350 with cloth seats but you still get all the electronic reversing camera, sat-nav, computer stuff as standard. Carpet is also forced as standard so you have to fork out more money for rubber mats.

I mentioned that there was a big price gap between the Professional and G350 (25% cheaper in Eurpoe) and he made an interesting comment... "We've got a sale on this week only and could look at getting the price closer to the G-Wagen Professional" with the reduced specification I'm after. Yeah, right! That would mean knocking $40K off the price and that ain't gonna happen. I may however take advantage of their coffee whilst I sit there and he does the maths.

solmanic
8th March 2011, 11:13 AM
I just want to explain some of my more detailed thinking as to why I'm even looking at the G-Wagen...

Like a lot of people here, I'm very aware that 2014 is coming and we still have no teasers from Landrover as to what form "Project Icon" is going to take. I am concerned that when eventually the time comes to move on from this current Defender, the only available option from the green oval will be very much at the beginning of it's design life and may be more Discovery than Defender.

I broke my own rule of never buying the first version of anything and bought an 07MY Defender. Although the fact that it was still 90% previous Defender and only 10% Ford has been discussed at length, there have still been far more bugs to iron out than a customer should expect. I also feel like I got lucky as mine has had nowhere near as many issues as some and many of the ones I have had were dealer created anyway.

The list of solid-axled off-road vehicles is steadily diminishing. Short of going over to a 70-series Landcruiser (shudder) the G-Wagen is one of the few other options. It is also not in the early stages of its design life.

As some of you are frustratingly aware, I am also not a big fan of aftermarket accessories. I like designs that are fully integrated and work straight out of the box. Again, the Defender fitted this bill. Several people here have said "just get a Defender and put lockers and this and that onto it". Well the G-Wagen has the lockers and this and that already on it. All designed for the vehicle by the manufacturer and standard equipment. I prefer this to the Frankenstein approach.

But yes, it is unrealistically priced.

So here's an idea...

If we all go down to our local Mercedes dealer and test drive a G-Wagen - Get the salesman all excited that he has a real, potential customer - Then tell him that we want a base spec one for around $80K. Maybe, just maybe, they will get the message and consider importing the Professional for sale as an actual off-road vehicle instead of an urban pimp-mobile.

VladTepes
8th March 2011, 11:25 AM
But we don't !

We want a base spec one for $50K !

isuzurover
8th March 2011, 11:33 AM
So let me get this straight? You want us to help you get a cheaper merc, just because you don't like accessories and think the defender has no future. :p

solmanic
8th March 2011, 11:39 AM
But we don't !

We want a base spec one for $50K !

$50K is fine by me too. :BigThumb:


So let me get this straight? You want us to help you get a cheaper merc, just because you don't like accessories and think the defender has no future. :p

Ummm... yes. :angel:

flagg
8th March 2011, 06:03 PM
There is no way in the world a Defender would be in the same condition with over 350k on the clock, they really are built to last.


Mine has 420k on the clock.. and is going just fine :p

flagg
8th March 2011, 06:09 PM
So here's an idea...

If we all go down to our local Mercedes dealer and test drive a G-Wagen - Get the salesman all excited that he has a real, potential customer - Then tell him that we want a base spec one for around $80K. Maybe, just maybe, they will get the message and consider importing the Professional for sale as an actual off-road vehicle instead of an urban pimp-mobile.

That's actually a really good idea. I'm sure they have all sorts of sales reports they have to full out which no doubt are in different coloured books so they can provide feedback to HQ about how things are going.

If 967 people came in a test drove one and then went and purchased the same other car M-B would have to pay a consultant to come in and explain why.

Considering I actually have a bit of respect for M-B A I think they would actually listen. As opposed to LRA which would, well, not.

PAT303
8th March 2011, 06:15 PM
Or we could hassle LR to produce the defender we all want. Pat

Naks
8th March 2011, 08:28 PM
Or we could hassle LR to produce the defender we all want. Pat

never going to happen. they don't care about the Defender, all they care about is making megabucks off the blingy D3/RR/RRS/Evo

wagoo
8th March 2011, 09:58 PM
never going to happen. they don't care about the Defender, all they care about is making megabucks off the blingy D3/RR/RRS/Evo
I agree, but why don't they discontinue it? The poor reputation of the later defenders surely must hurt D3/RR/RRS by association.
Wagoo.

Hoges
8th March 2011, 10:01 PM
Hmmm ... maybe the mini-moke wasn't so bad after all:p:p:twisted:

Naks
8th March 2011, 10:03 PM
I agree, but why don't they discontinue it? The poor reputation of the later defenders surely must hurt D3/RR/RRS by association.
Wagoo.


The same reason no one would buy designer wear if skinny supermodels did not display them on the catwalk. :angel:

IMHO a lot of people only buy a D3/RR/RRS/REvo because the ancestor is a Defender - they like the emotional appeal of the Defender in the African bush but would never give up the comfort/bling.

The poor rep of the Defender is of no concern to LR, they have been making a loss on it since the 80's (when the UN switched to Patrols & LCs) - it is simply the skinny supermodel LR uses to attract customers ;)

rijidij
8th March 2011, 10:19 PM
Apparently this is the first ‘civilian registered’ G350 in Australia.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/866.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/867.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/868.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/869.jpg

wagoo
9th March 2011, 07:10 AM
The same reason no one would buy designer wear if skinny supermodels did not display them on the catwalk. :angel:

IMHO a lot of people only buy a D3/RR/RRS/REvo because the ancestor is a Defender - they like the emotional appeal of the Defender in the African bush but would never give up the comfort/bling.

The poor rep of the Defender is of no concern to LR, they have been making a loss on it since the 80's (when the UN switched to Patrols & LCs) - it is simply the skinny supermodel LR uses to attract customers ;)

Good analogy.
But once the skinny supermodel becomes a right old incontinent boiler with mascara running down her face, hairy legs and armpits, one or two teeth missing,who breaks her high heels and stumbles every time she goes out on the catwalk,she wouldn't attract too many buyers for the products she is promoting.;)
Wagoo.

PAT303
9th March 2011, 10:36 AM
Naks how do you know they are making a loss on the defender?.I find it impossible to believe they are losing money on them for the last 30 years.I would actually go as far to say that they would make good money on them simply because R&D and tooling are the two biggest costs in manufacturing and the defender hasn't had any for quite some time.The UN uses Japanese vehicles and they are eveywhere because Japan runs in surplus so gives equipement such as vehicles as foreign aid instead of money. Pat

Jamo
9th March 2011, 10:49 AM
The worst thing is the yuppies who buy this thing will actually have a capable off-roader, unlike an X5 or Cayenne, plus all the luxury. :(

Sorry Ranga, my Cayenne has diff locks centre and rear (and they've been used a few times:cool:) and more ground clearance than my D3 had.

No snorkel or bullbar, but that hardly declassifies it as a 'capable' 4WD.

I considered a G wagen but they obviously weren't released in time for me to get the "Rudd bucks". Plus, are they made in North America like the other Merc 4WD and the X5?

miky
9th March 2011, 01:16 PM
...
The UN uses Japanese vehicles and they are everywhere because Japan runs in surplus so gives equipment such as vehicles as foreign aid instead of money.
Pat

What a fantastic idea. I never knew that.
Our government should buy Australian products and send them as aid rather than just handing out cash.



.

Naks
9th March 2011, 06:37 PM
Naks how do you know they are making a loss on the defender?

From Land Rover Defender - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia@@AMEPARAM@@/wiki/File:Question_book-new.svg" class="image"><img alt="Question book-new.svg" src="http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/9/99/Question_book-new.svg/50px-Question_book-new.svg.png"@@AMEPARAM@@en/thumb/9/99/Question_book-new.svg/50px-Question_book-new.svg.png so not sure how reliable/accurate:


New methods of building the Defender have made the model profitable again (since the 1990s, the hand-built vehicle had been made at a loss), so its replacement has been less of a priority. Total replacement will be needed by 2015, when new regulations regarding crash safety for pedestrians will render the current design obsolete.

PAT303
9th March 2011, 06:48 PM
They probably did in the 80's but that was 30 years ago,they didn't make much on the RR TD also because VM charged top dollar for thier POS engines,it's the reason the Tdi,Td5 etc were born.LR would make money on the defender,if they didn't they wouldn't be bringing out the new one.If you ever get the chance have a good look over the workmate LC and see what ''quality'' you get for $72,000,making the new defender on the disco platform will give it a quality above and beyond it's competitors but to me it won't be a defender. Pat

solmanic
10th March 2011, 09:28 AM
I guess one of the big advantages Mercedes have is that the company is fully self supporting and owns everything in its production cycle.

Land Rover have suffered as part of the Rover group, then British Leyland. They got a bit of a boost when BMW owned them with most of their current crop of good vehicles developed in that period. Then they got manhandled by Ford, and now Tata. I mean, we currently have a Defender with the engine from a Ford Transit, and air vents from a Ford Fiesta! God only knows what parts bin Tata will raid to save money when they produce the next one.

At least you know that any standard parts on a G-Wagen have only come from another Mercedes and were designed to fit from day one.

cols110
10th March 2011, 03:36 PM
I had a look at the list prices of the Gs here in the UAE as quotes by one of the car mags today and it makes you laugh at how much Merc AU & the Australian Government is really ripping off the average punter who is buying vehicles in OZ.

The G500 comes at around 95k and the AMG G55 goes for about 138k.

So to put it bluntly the top of the range AMG supercharged G55 sell here for less than 20k cheaper than the cheapest spec oil burner they are flogging in OZ.

Couple that with the strong AUD compared to the euro someone is making a killing.

Celtoid
10th March 2011, 08:18 PM
The same reason no one would buy designer wear if skinny supermodels did not display them on the catwalk. :angel:

IMHO a lot of people only buy a D3/RR/RRS/REvo because the ancestor is a Defender - they like the emotional appeal of the Defender in the African bush but would never give up the comfort/bling.

The poor rep of the Defender is of no concern to LR, they have been making a loss on it since the 80's (when the UN switched to Patrols & LCs) - it is simply the skinny supermodel LR uses to attract customers ;)

Certainly not the reason I bought my D4. Having driven lots of Military 110s, and old Series trucks, I was pretty aware of what they are like.

But the thread is accurate....to a point. A LR's ability offroad was a key but for me having owned 'luxury' sedans (meaning Berlinas and the like...LOL), the D4 was the difference between owning one or two cars. I go camping alot and often get it dirty. It has quite a few scratches and torn mudflaps. I don't care if that isn't considered 'Hard Core'.....if I needed that, I'd have two cars!

I could have bought a Nissan or a Toyo but the combo wasn't there...the D4 surpasses on the 'Sedan' front and we know they aren't too shabby off-road either.

If I bought a Deefer and another car as my daily drive, the Deefer would be loved but extremely under-used.

Makes no sense at all.

Cheers,

Kev.

Tomo
11th March 2011, 04:12 PM
Quote
New methods of building the Defender have made the model profitable again (since the 1990s, the hand-built vehicle had been made at a loss), so its replacement has been less of a priority. Total replacement will be needed by 2015, when new regulations regarding crash safety for pedestrians will render the current design obsolete.

With the amount of recalls and warranty claims since 2007 and relatively small sales base I doubt the Puma model Defender has been overly profitable........

Naks
11th March 2011, 05:53 PM
With the amount of recalls and warranty claims since 2007 and relatively small sales base I doubt the Puma model Defender has been overly profitable........

True that.

Considering the average Puma requires 3 rear diffs, 2 vacuum pumps and 5 clutches :D

Ace
12th March 2011, 07:02 PM
Apparently this is the first ‘civilian registered’ G350 in Australia.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/866.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/867.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/868.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/869.jpg


and other than price, there is one other major reason why I would never buy one (assuming I could ever afford one)....they are fugly.

BigJon
12th March 2011, 07:29 PM
..they are fugly.

No worse than a Defender :angel:

isuzurover
18th April 2011, 03:31 PM
Since the other G-Wagen thread has gone - we still have this one. Have a read of the tech specs on Page 2 (german link).

Unfortunately the best articles and tech specs are in German (funny that!)


Die Mercedes G-Klasse feiert 30. Geburtstag. Längst ist der Geländegänger zum großen Liebling in der Stuttgarter Modellpalette geworden. Neben Jägern, Szenegirls und US-Rappern ist die G-Klasse besonders für das Militär von großer Bedeutung.

Das schönste Geschenk machte sich die bei Magna-Steyr in Graz produzierte Mercedes G-Klasse zum 30. Geburtstag selbst. Nach langem hin und her holte man im Sommer vergangenen Jahres einen kapitalen Großauftrag an Land. Die australische Armee, seit Jahrzehnten fest mit dem Hause Land Rover verbunden, entschied sich nach umfangreichen Ausschreibungen und Tests für die Mercedes G-Klasse. Das besondere ist dabei nicht nur das gewaltige Auftragsvolumen von zunächst 1.200 Fahrzeugen, sondern auch die Tatsache, dass Mercedes zusammen mit Magna-Steyr eigens für die Aussies in Down Under eine völlig neue 6x6-Variante mit drei angetriebenen Achsen entwickelte. Die Hälfte der bestellten Fahrzeuge hat daher einen Sechsradantrieb und kann bis zu neun Personen mit Marschgepäck oder schwere Lasten transportieren. Die anderen 600 Rechtslenker sind normale Armee-Modelle der Baureihe 461 mit langem Radstand.

"Die Chancen stehen zudem nicht schlecht, dass wir vielleicht noch eine Auftragserweiterung um weitere 1.000 Fahrzeuge bekommen", erzählt Nikolaus Hecker, seit Anfang der 90er Jahre für den Verkauf von Sonderfahrzeugen der Mercedes G-Klasse zuständig. Spezialeinheiten aus der ganzen Welt gehen auf der Suche nach flexibel einsetzbaren Geländewagen bei Hecker und seinen Kollegen seit Jahren ein und aus. "Derzeit sind Armeen aus 34 Nationen mit unserem G-Modell unterwegs", berichtet Axel Harries, Produktmanager des rustikalen Klettermaxen nicht ohne Stolz.
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Mercedes G-Klasse für die australische Armee

Das neueste Schmuckstück ist dabei die Eigenkreation für die australische Armee. Die Anforderungen des Kunden seien nicht ganz einfach gewesen, so hört man bei Mercedes. Land Rover, Renault und die mittlerweile in britischer Hand befindliche Firma Pinzgauer wollten den Großauftrag auf dem fünften Kontinent ebenfalls an Land ziehen. Doch Land Rover musste angesichts der schwierigen technischen Vorgaben frühzeitig die Segel streichen; Pinzgauer und Renault gerieten durch das hohe Gewicht und die erforderliche Geländegängigkeit zu breit und klobig. So machte Mercedes mit einer G-Klasse das Rennen, die es abgesehen von einem Prototypen in der Realität noch gar nicht gab. "Ich bin mehrfach in Australien gewesen und wusste recht schnell, was die Australier für ein Fahrzeug suchten", erzählt Nikolaus Hecker, "persönliche Gespräche bringen dabei meist mehr als dicke Anforderungslisten, die man abarbeitet."

6x6-Modell der Mercedes G-Klasse

Das fertige 6x6-Modell der Mercedes G-Klasse - im dezenten Farbton "Sandbeige" gehalten - ist allemal ein Hingucker. Auffällig sind nicht nur die drei angetriebenen Achsen, sondern auch die große Ladefläche hinter dem nackten Fahrerhaus. "Wir hatten die Anforderungen, dass der 6x6 die 3,20 Meter lange Arbeitsplattform der Australier transportieren konnte. Je nach Aufbau und Beladung wiegt das Ungetüm somit bis zu neun Tonnen. 6,5 Tonnen Leergewicht steigen durch die optionale Panzerung nochmals deutlich an.

30 Jahre Mercedes G-Klasse

Die 30jährige Geschichte der Mercedes G-Klasse ist eng mit dem militärischen Einsatzgebiet verbunden. 1975 wird die Serienproduktion des Modell G als Nutzfahrzeug beschlossen. Der der erste Großkunde steht mit dem Schah von Persien, damals Groß-Aktionär von Daimler-Benz, ebenfalls fest. Er will 20.000 Fahrzeuge. Doch die Revolution im Iran macht der Planung einen Strich durch die Rechnung. Doch schnell kommen die nächsten militärischen Aufträge. "Als erstes kamen damals die Argentinier, die für ihre Armee 1.000 Fahrzeuge mit zumeist offenem Aufbau bestellt haben", so Nikolaus Hecker, "danach folgten Norwegen, Österreich und die Schweiz. Die deutsche Bundeswehr kam erst später. Sie waren damals noch mit dem Iltis und Munga unterwegs." Der Falkland-Krieg brachte eine Reihe von Militär-G-Klassen Mitte der 80er Jahre sogar als "Kriegsbeute" nach England. In Argentinien sind eine Reihe der alten Mercedes G 230 seit den frühen 80ern noch immer im Alltagsgeschäft unterwegs. Vor einiger Zeit gab es sogar eine Anfrage, die alten Modelle mit modernen Dieseltriebwerken auf einen neuen Stand zu bringen. Auch die Bundeswehr fährt seit Jahren Mercedes G-Klasse - mit der internen Bezeichnung "Wolf".

Mercedes G-Klasse mit Verkaufsrekorden

Seit Jahren ist die G-Klasse eine der imagestarken Stützen der Mercedes-Modellpalette. Mehrfach sollte sie eingestellt werden und immer wieder durfte man am Produktionsstandort Graz weitermachen. Im Jahre 2000 entschied man sich ein weiteres Mal gegen eine Einstellung. Stattdessen sollte der kantige G erstmals auch in den Nordamerika auf den Markt gebracht werden. Seither eilt die G-Klasse auch in wirtschaftlich schweren Zeiten von Verkaufsrekord zu Verkaufsrekord. Axel Harries: "Pro Jahr verkaufen wir zwischen 5.000 und 5.300 Fahrzeugen. Rund 20 Prozent der Modelle gehen als 461er-Modell in den militärischen Dienst. Der größte Markt ist mit ebenfalls rund 20 Prozent der deutsche." Aber auch in den USA ist das G-Modell nach wie vor ein Topseller. Hier gibt es jedoch keinen Dieselmotor. Weltweit verkaufen sich die PS-starken V8-Modelle Mercedes G 500 und Mercedes G 55 AMG mit Abstand am besten.

Mercedes G-Klasse auch als Panzerversion

Die Motorleistung ist für die Spezialfahrzeuge von untergeordneter Bedeutung. Wahlweise ist der G auch als Panzerversion in den schweren Schutzklassen B6 und B7 zu bekommen. Wenn das in Krisengebieten nicht reicht, gibt es drei weitere Schutzstufen mit militärischer Panzerung. Viele Armeen setzen besonders bei ihren Kommandofahrzeugen auf schwer gesicherte G-Modelle. Sind die gepanzerten Zivilversionen für Märkte in Russland oder Südamerika mit Komfortdetails wie belüfteten Sitzen, DVD-Entertainment oder weichem Leder ausgestattet, geht es bei den Fahrzeugen für den diplomatischen Dienst oder im Bereich Personenschutz puristischer zu. Hier gibt es mit lieblosen Stoffsitzen oder wenig anheimelndem Kunstleder nur Hausmannskost.

Wichtig ist nur: man kommt auch in Krisengebieten wie Afghanistan oder dem Irak mit einer gepanzerten G-Klasse sicher ans Ziel. Die meisten Fahrzeuge sind mittlerweile mit modernsten Dieseltriebwerken ausgestattet. Der G 280 CDI wird von einem drei Liter großen Commonrail-Sechszylinder mit 184 PS und 400 Nm Drehmoment angetrieben. Genug Leistung, um auch mit schwer gepanzerten Modellen bis 160 km/h schnell zu sein. Neben Stahlplatten und schusssicheren Kunststofffasern sorgen Notlaufsysteme von Hutchinson dafür, dass man auch mit zerstörten Reifen weiter fahren kann.

Mercedes G-Modell ist ein echter Offroader

Legendär ist die Mercedes G-Klasse seit drei Jahrzehnten für seine Geländegängigkeit. Das maximale Steigvermögen liegt bei bis zu 80 Prozent und die seitliche Fahrstabilität bei 54 Prozent Schräglage. Eine Bodenfreiheit von 21 Zentimetern sowie große Böschungswinkel von 36 Grad vorn und 27 Grad hinten lassen einen abseits aller befestigten Straßen voran kommen. Das fordert seinen Tribut an den Fahrkomfort. Der Geländewagen hat statt Blattfedern Schraubenfedern sowie Längs- und Querlenker an seinen Starrachsen. Wird das Gelände allzu schwierig, aktiviert man zuerst die zentrale Sperre. Wenn man richtig in die Bredouille gerät, kann man auch die beiden Räder von Vorder- und Hinterachse starr miteinander verbinden.

Bei dem neuen 6x6-Modell der australischen Armee können für härteste Geländeeinsätze sogar alle drei Achsen gesperrt werden. Die Chancen stehen übrigens nicht schlecht, dass die ungewöhnliche 6x6-Version bald auch als Linkslenker erhältlich sein wird. Unzählige private G-Fans haben ebenfalls starkes Interesse bekundet und hoffen auf eine zivile Version der Baureihe 463. Welches automobile Geburtstagskind kann das zu seinem 30. Geburtstag schon von sich behaupten?


I will give you a translation later...

or now:
It says that Land Rover, Renault and Pinzgauer all wanted to tender vehicles. Land Rover were the first to pull out as they couldn't meet the technical specs. Pinzgauer and Renault were too wide and heavy.

It also says the 6x6 was specially developed from scratch for the contract. Which means the tech specs of the 6x6 Professional are probably (almost) identical to the australian army version.

Blknight.aus
18th April 2011, 03:49 PM
Landrover never even tendered.

isuzurover
18th April 2011, 04:47 PM
Landrover never even tendered.


Fail reading and comprehension Dave???


It says that Land Rover, Renault and Pinzgauer all wanted to tender vehicles. Land Rover were the first to pull out as they couldn't meet the technical specs.

Blknight.aus
18th April 2011, 04:57 PM
nope.

landrover never wanted to tender, very hard to pull out of a tender you never submit...

isuzurover
18th April 2011, 05:05 PM
nope.

landrover never wanted to tender, very hard to pull out of a tender you never submit...


And of course you would know... :angel:

You can (initially) want to submit a tender, then decide your base vehicle (puny) needs too many mods to meet the tender when the specs are released...

UncleHo
18th April 2011, 05:12 PM
G'day Ace :)

Is that LED headlights that I see on the Merc, if so do you know if they are ADR compliant????? I have read the write-ups in the UK Landrover mags and they look impressive,expensive but impressive, and they also seem to be gaining favor with US truckers


cheers

Didge
18th April 2011, 06:14 PM
I'll bet it leaks just like a Def :)

isuzurover
18th April 2011, 06:29 PM
G'day Ace :)

Is that LED headlights that I see on the Merc, if so do you know if they are ADR compliant????? I have read the write-ups in the UK Landrover mags and they look impressive,expensive but impressive, and they also seem to be gaining favor with US truckers


cheers

Have a read here UncleHo:
LED Headlights - AUSJEEPOFFROAD.COM (http://www.ausjeepoffroad.com/forum/showthread.php?t=102712)

I believe I have read somewhere that these are ADR compliant...

However I think they are about $3k for a pair :eek:
Might wait till they come down in price personally...

spudboy
18th April 2011, 06:58 PM
Available in Aust. $3266 a pair: http://www.aulro.com/afvb/general-chat/123418-led-replacement-headlights-better-than-hid-but-sit-down-price.html

Ranga
18th April 2011, 06:59 PM
....they are fugly.

agreed!

Didge
18th April 2011, 10:27 PM
My old girl doesn't go fast enough that I need super duper headlights

isuzurover
19th April 2011, 06:18 AM
agreed!

Also agree, but form over function and all that... Once they come down by a factor of 10 I will buy some...

wagoo
19th April 2011, 06:49 AM
Also agree, but form over function and all that... Once they come down by a factor of 10 I will buy some...

LandRover blinkers off folks.:) Ugliness is in the eyes of the beholder an all that and to me a D3-4 typifies ugliness.I also reckon the large vulnerble expanses of unsupported un ribbed sheetmetal of a Defender is ugly in a practical sense, and they've never looked quite right since adopting the one piece windscreen.
I think the Gwagon styling is attractive.It looks and probably is very strongly built, and at least in station wagon form as pictured above, would offer occupants much better protection in the event of a collision or rollover than a defender would.
Wagoo.

spudboy
19th April 2011, 07:04 AM
My old girl doesn't go fast enough that I need super duper headlights

Mrs Ho Har's opinion of the super-exy HID lights was - "why not drive in the daytime?", which I reckoned was quite a good thought :p

isuzurover
19th April 2011, 07:07 AM
LandRover blinkers off folks.:) Ugliness is in the eyes of the beholder an all that and to me a D3-4 typifies ugliness.I also reckon the large vulnerble expanses of unsupported un ribbed sheetmetal of a Defender is ugly in a practical sense, and they've never looked quite right since adopting the one piece windscreen.
I think the Gwagon styling is attractive.It looks and probably is very strongly built, and at least in station wagon form as pictured above, would offer occupants much better protection in the event of a collision or rollover than a defender would.
Wagoo.

Agree - quite like the look of the G-wagen. If the body was aluminium and the wheels were a bit bigger it would be just about perfect IMHO.

My better half thinks d3s and D4s look hideous (but quite likes her D1). I tend to agree.

kenleyfred
19th April 2011, 07:11 AM
My old girl doesn't go fast enough that I need super duper headlights

My high beam is fantastic. But low beam illuminates maybe 5 or 6 meters ahead and that's it. It's dangerous in my opinion and I wonder if legal. Surely there must be minimum standards that they have to achieve.
Once the price comes down I will be looking into them more seriously.

Didge
20th April 2011, 11:33 PM
Saw a pic of the g-wagen in military camo dress and I reckon it looked pretty good; very defenderish but just a bit different.

ozscott
21st April 2011, 05:52 AM
agreed!

Yes they look like they have been designed with plastercine on a hot day. Seriously they look just terrible. Cheers

stig0000
21st April 2011, 06:26 AM
id love to drive one,,, but only in AMG spec, you cant go past that sound:twisted::twisted::angel::angel:

spudboy
16th February 2015, 09:37 AM
Solmanic - I've tried to send you a PM but your mailbox is full, so I'll post here instead:

Am looking to buy a 2011 G350 GWagen (perhaps) and thought I'd ask how you've gone with yours.

I can't remember if you have the diesel or petrol G, but either way, would be interested about your impressions of:
- reliability
- parts availability/service costs
- on road driving
- off road driving
Compared to a Defender (I have a PUMA).

I've found one with 26,000Kms on it, and they want about $100K. Am off to test drive it in an hour or so.

Cheers
David

spudboy
16th February 2015, 09:45 AM
Actually - cancel some of that, I just went to page 1 of this thread and read your excellent comments on comparisons with a Defender.

Still interested in your comments about reliability and servicing/parts costs though.

KarlB
17th February 2015, 12:43 PM
I have not read the whole of this thread so may be repeating what others have already said, but the G-wagon is not built by Mercedes. It is built by Magna Steyr (formerly Steyr-Puch) in Austria. Steyr-Puch amongst other things, was the manufacturer of the formidable Haflinger and Pinzgauer vehicles. Magna Steyr is a Canadian owned company (see Magna: Vehicle Engineering & Contract Manufacturing | Capabilities (http://www.magnasteyr.com/capabilities/vehicle-engineering-contract-manufacturing)).

STI Steyr, which was part of the Steyr-Puch conglomerate prior to it being broken up, markets a range of military oriented vehicles (see High mobility tactical armored vehicles for all missions and terrains (http://www.sti-steyr.com/sti-tactical/)), currently sourced (in part) from IVECO or Bremach. STI Steyr is part of the Italy based CNH conglomerate.

Cheers
KarlB
:)

solmanic
18th February 2015, 10:59 AM
This makes fascinating reading four years on.

I have sent Spudboy this link (http://www.aulro.com/afvb/european-manufactured/170914-done-something-crazy-4.html#post2089693)to my one year review of the G-Wagen. But it is interesting to re-read some of the comments made back when I first test drove one...


I'll bet it leaks just like a Def :)

No. No they don't.


I agree, but why don't they discontinue it? The poor reputation of the later defenders surely must hurt D3/RR/RRS by association.
Wagoo.

Behold, Wagoo the prophet.


So let me get this straight? You want us to help you get a cheaper merc, just because you don't like accessories and think the defender has no future. :p

I stand by my decision and Land Rover appear to have supported it.

But, I have recently come across a very annoying issue with the G. You cannot turn off the damn sensor alert when reversing in long grass...

http://imagizer.imageshack.us/v2/640x480q90/913/10CTG8.jpg (https://imageshack.com/i/pd10CTG8j)

spudboy
18th February 2015, 03:04 PM
Yeah - big thanks to Solmanic for his advice.

I took one for an extended drive a few days ago, and was pretty impressed in general. Not sure if I could live with one, and the dealer and I are about $10K away from each other on price.

The good things were:
- Solid as - Makes my PUMA look flimsy. Reckon it will do 1,000,000 Kms!
- Driver environment - very plush
- Looks - Reckon it looks great

The not so good:
- It is HEAVY - with heavy vague steering and feels like it is always understeering.
- Acceleration not huge - for a 3.0L (the weight does not help of course)
- Noisy when pressing on - at higher revs some fan must kick in as it 'howls' above 3000RPM
- Fuel economy - gauge showed an avg of 16.1L/100 for a 60Km round trip from Adelaide up to the farm (in the hills) and back again. My Puma is consistently 10 to 10.5L/100 on the same drive.
- Load space in the rear is not that big
- The brake pedal is set too far forward - you really have to lift your foot off the accelerator to brake.
- Seat doesn't have enough legroom if you are tall like me
- Just HEAVY and ponderous all round, which is not so joyful on tight windy roads.

That sounds like a big list of negatives, which is a bit unfair as it is a great car. But I think at the price they sell for, I can see why they hardly sell any.

We'll see what happens if the dealer reconsiders on the price!!

Cheers
David

isuzurover
18th February 2015, 03:38 PM
Also, devaluation of the merc is about 0.5 defenders per year.

spudboy
18th February 2015, 04:41 PM
That's true! This one was $161K in 2011, so in 4 years it has lost (at least) $60K, so about $15K per year.

It had 30,000Kms on the clock, so that cost someone $2 per Km just in depreciation :eek:

4x4 MORE
18th February 2015, 05:31 PM
Yeah - big thanks to Solmanic for his advice.

I took one for an extended drive a few days ago, and was pretty impressed in general. Not sure if I could live with one, and the dealer and I are about $10K away from each other on price.

The good things were:
- Solid as - Makes my PUMA look flimsy. Reckon it will do 1,000,000 Kms!
- Driver environment - very plush
- Looks - Reckon it looks great

The not so good:
- It is HEAVY - with heavy vague steering and feels like it is always understeering.
- Acceleration not huge - for a 3.0L (the weight does not help of course)
- Noisy when pressing on - at higher revs some fan must kick in as it 'howls' above 3000RPM
- Fuel economy - gauge showed an avg of 16.1L/100 for a 60Km round trip from Adelaide up to the farm (in the hills) and back again. My Puma is consistently 10 to 10.5L/100 on the same drive.
- Load space in the rear is not that big
- The brake pedal is set too far forward - you really have to lift your foot off the accelerator to brake.
- Seat doesn't have enough legroom if you are tall like me
- Just HEAVY and ponderous all round, which is not so joyful on tight windy roads.

That sounds like a big list of negatives, which is a bit unfair as it is a great car. But I think at the price they sell for, I can see why they hardly sell any.

We'll see what happens if the dealer reconsiders on the price!!

Cheers
David

Interesting considering it's such an old design..

rar110
18th February 2015, 07:39 PM
That's true! This one was $161K in 2011, so in 4 years it has lost (at least) $60K, so about $15K per year. It had 30,000Kms on the clock, so that cost someone $2 per Km just in depreciation :eek:

You could go back to a L322 tdv8 2011 model for less money.

solmanic
19th February 2015, 09:57 AM
...
The not so good:
- It is HEAVY - with heavy vague steering and feels like it is always understeering.
- Acceleration not huge - for a 3.0L (the weight does not help of course)
- Noisy when pressing on - at higher revs some fan must kick in as it 'howls' above 3000RPM
- Fuel economy - gauge showed an avg of 16.1L/100 for a 60Km round trip from Adelaide up to the farm (in the hills) and back again. My Puma is consistently 10 to 10.5L/100 on the same drive.
- Load space in the rear is not that big
- The brake pedal is set too far forward - you really have to lift your foot off the accelerator to brake.
- Seat doesn't have enough legroom if you are tall like me
- Just HEAVY and ponderous all round, which is not so joyful on tight windy roads.



Hmmm, that fuel economy doesn't seem right. I think every single tank I've put in mine has averaged 11l/100km give or take a bit. Like the Defender, city & highway driving seem to return similar figures due to wind resistance at speed.

Can't say I've noticed the heavy steering since my other car doesn't even have power steering. You're right about the ponderous nature of it though. I always need to take it easy around round-abouts.

I've never had issues with the acceleration. A few times I've actually chirped all 4 tyres. Sure, it's no V8, but it's a hell of a lot more than I ever had in there Defender.

As for the noise, there is an electric fan that tends to go on and off a bit with a mind of its own. The fan sometimes stays on for 5 minutes after you switch the car off but I'm buggered if I can work out why as it happens whether it's hot, cold, dry or wet.

As for the leg room, are you sure you pressed all the seat buttons? Depending on which option yours has, some have a bunch of additional seat adjust buttons on the side of the bottom cushion, but the main ones are on the door.

THE most important thing to ask though is whether the one you're looking at has had the sump service measure done, and when was it done? As I mentioned in the other thread, one of the guys on the AGOA forum had his engine replaced due to a dropped cylinder liner. This was put down to the fact that the sump service measure was done a lot later in his vehicle's life than most.

spudboy
20th February 2015, 08:07 AM
I was surprised at the fuel consumption too. I gave it a bit of stick up through the Adelaide Hills, which is a very steep climb. A few quick take offs to test acceleration and the wheels did do a little chirp, but I think trying to shift 2.5 tonnes is not so easy for the diesel engine - but in general performance was entirely adequate. Better than my PUMA for sure.

When I got to my farm and turned it off, the fan stayed on for about 5 minutes, so I figured it was a hot engine situation from climbing the hills.

There was a "4-way" button on the base of the seat, but I couldn't figure out what that did. Assumed it was lumbar support or something.

Haven't heard back from the dealer, so I am obviously too far away from what they want for it.