Daytime Running Lights

[101RRS]

Any one put daytime running lights on their RRS? - if so where did you get them from and were they difficult to fit? A local supplier would be good.

I like the look of these ones.

Cheers

Garry

[sniegy]

Garry,
This is a 10MY Sport with its Headlights & the LED Signature which are the "Park Lights" as with all 10MY vehicles that have Bi-Xenon lighting. (same as my Sig pic).
Daytime running lights are only available with Northern European vehicles.
The only way to turn them on is to set up the vehicle for that particular market, which changes other things, like eng tune, fuel requirements etc etc.

Cheers

[Duck's Guts]

You could run a seperate power supply to the DRL's via a relay triggered by a supply spliced into the parkers/signature LED's.

[bobzed57]

Garry

You could always drive around with your flog lights on like everyone else in Canberra does.;)

Bob

[oldsalt]

Garry

You could always drive around with your flog lights on like everyone else in Canberra does.;)

Bob

and the Western Ring Road (AKA the racetrack) in Melbourne ... w**kers !!!

[discojools]

yeah sorry to go slightly off topic but what is this thing with 70% of drivers here in Victoria using their foglights at night (and sometimes during the day!) when it rarely foggy.. Seems to only add to glare for oncoming drivers.

[101RRS]

Garry

You could always drive around with your flog lights on like everyone else in Canberra does.;)

Bob

What like you do :o.

I am right against the use of ****** lights in the wrong conditions but I have recently had a couple of occasions where cars have pulled out in front of me and I have had to take corrective action to avoid a collision so was thinking about DRLs - I think these will have to be fitted to all new cars in the UK from next year.

Garry

[bobzed57]

Harsh Garry, harsh, and I thought we were old shipmates.

My 2005 Touareg had a DRL option through the onboard computer system and all it seemed to do was run the headlights at a lower intensity. maybe the simplest solution is to drive with your lights on.

I bet no one pulls out on the 101 mate.

Cheers

Bob

PS Off to Oxley Wild Rivers NP tomorrow. Looking forward to it and hopefully won't need the flog lights.

[It'sNotWorthComplaining!]

here in Victoria there was ALL TALK the the coppers were going to police and fine people with those ****** lights, But as usual it was all talk, just like policing lunatics on mobile phones and texting whilst driving. All daraconian laws that may be writing in the statues but never enforced because we do not have the police man power to get out into the world and police it

[101RRS]

I bet no one pulls out on the 101 mate.

Yes they do and things get interesting with the drum brakes - it is the olive drab paint - they cannot see it when in shadows. I am going to get some strip LEDS for the front bumper on it as DRLs - much easier to wire up.

Have a good trip. It will be comfortable in the luxobarge - I suppose your fuel consumption will go up with all that nice new gear you have.

Garry

[101RRS]

here in Victoria there was ALL TALK the the coppers were going to police and fine people with those ****** lights, But as usual it was all talk, just like policing lunatics on mobile phones and texting whilst driving. All daraconian laws that may be writing in the statues but never enforced because we do not have the police man power to get out into the world and police it

Up on the F3 on the NSW Central Coast the NSW RTA have big electronic signs warning that fog lights are only to be used in poor visibility and that fines apply if used at other times.

garry

[bobzed57]

[QUOTE=garrycol; It will be comfortable in the luxobarge - I suppose your fuel consumption will go up with all that nice new gear you have.
Garry[/QUOTE]

It's so heavy now, I've almost got herself convinced of the need for a chip or ECU mods.:D

[101RRS]

I have been spending some time up on the central coast cleaning up a property and going to the Woy Woy tip and getting weighed - the RRS with none of the type of gear that you have weighs 2.7t with half fuel, and me (no comments please) - you must be getting up near 3t with all your standard stuff before you even start loading it up.

[bbyer]

Here in Canada, DRL's are the law now so all vehicles run with them all the time. For the most part, GM, Ford, and Dodge just use the regular low beam headlights. In the past, the headlights would run at a somewhat lower intensity, (barely noticeable), as I presume the idea was to increase bulb life. I think now however, the low beam lights illuminate at full intensity if there is no other lighting arrangement.

Mercedes, Audi, and the like, run a special pair of LED bulbs, but to my mind, if safety was the idea, (it is not), I tend to think that the regular headlights do the job better. I am not certain what the LR4 arrangement is - so few around I have not noticed, but I think only the decorative LEDs are on during the day.

I have noted that Dodge tends to have their headlights and signal lights bunched together so in the day when the signal light is actuated, the headlight tuns off for the short period that the signal light is in operation - one dipped beam stays off for the duration of the flash and not flash operation of the signal light bulb. At night, both headlight bulbs remain lit all the time.

Also in the case of the LR3 in Canada, when the DRL's are on, the tail lights and front side lights are also illuminated. This I believe is not so for Sweden, the other country that is programmed into the 2005 Car Configuration File.

Also once configured for Canada in the DDF, the only way to turn the headlights off with the engine running is to put the 3 in either Park, Neutral, or apply the EPB, (Electronic Parking Brake). In other words, the low beam lights and tail lights are on even if the headlight switch is off.

I do not know if the programming is in the 3's shipped to Oz but I suspect some variation of it is. My understanding is that not much else changes other than how the head light switch operates if DRL's are activated for whatever country.

I find that not being able to turn the headlights off with the transmission in gear can at times be inconvenient and note that the Police have a bypass as a part of their domestic Police package so the lights can be turned off.

In operation, the lights being on can be an aid on the highway, particularily during snowstorms, (or dust storms), when approaching vehicles can create an effective whiteout for maybe 1 to 10 seconds as the most one might see is the headlights of following vehicles.

The bright rear "fog" light function on the Land Rover is not required here but I would say should be. Normal brightness tail lights during the day in whiteout, (or not), conditions are simply not visible and serve no purpose. I should note that illuminated tail lights are not a legal requirement of the DRL laws as written here and most vehicles do not have their tail lights routinely illuminated.

In summary, probably the best way to get DRL's is what it sounds like you are doing already - just turning your headlights on when you think it would be a good idea.

[connock]

Up on the F3 on the NSW Central Coast the NSW RTA have big electronic signs warning that fog lights are only to be used in poor visibility and that fines apply if used at other times.

garry

I know of two guys that have been booked here in Adelaide for having there wa##er lights on , on nice sunny days of coarse. It was around $200 fine plus one demerit point. Im not a big lover of the OOO look at me lights either. Just drive with your head lights on , you know the ones that are ajusted correctly and stay there so as oncomming dont get blinded with missaligned lights.;)

[101RRS]

I do not mind front ****** lights as they generally do not blind you - it is the bright red ones at the rear that are a pain when you are following them. They almost seem to be burning your eyeballs out.

Hyundais seem to be the worst so maybe there is an issue with having them on and not knowing about it.

[superquag]

My favourite beef...

The whole purpose of vehicle lighting is to see your way as clearly as possible... WITHOUT causing other drivers to become dazzled, distracted or enraged by your lights.

For the purpose of discussion, I'm only referring to low beam useage, not open road with no-one in front coming or going.

Forget the theory, the reality is that too many headlights are improperly aligned, or in the case of some newer cars, don't meet the current ADR's - well, maybe the letter of the Law, but *not* the spirit of it !
Then there is the issue of dust & deposits and discolouration of lenses and covers which all scatter the (now much brighter light of HID's..) low beam.

Mis-alignment also applies to around 70% of the masturbatory lights fitted to an increasing number of newer cars...

Because of this, even running in daylight with only the low-beams on can dazzle oncoming traffic, and annoy the person in front of you.

Some manufacturers have gone to strings of LED lights around the front of the car, but because each LED emits from such a tiny area, the eye perceives this as glare / uncomfortable. And is distracted.

The best daylight running light was the old VW idea of illuminating the interior of the headlight with a 5W lamp, you could see the light.... without being dazzled by it.

Add to the mix the fashion for 'projector' style low beams... coupled with the insane brightness of HID lamps and you have virtually no gain in overall road safety and a huge increase in road frustration and rage. - Never mind the unfortunates being dazzled and distracted.

Parting comment... Volvo, best known for its interest in (boring) safety, used to run 21W white lights (parking lights?) as their DRLs, on their 200 series cars (I think) but after only a few years quietly dropped them. - and I have'nt seen them since.

Wonder if they know something that the law-makers don't.

James in Gosnells.

[gghaggis]

Hang on - aren't "fog" lights supposed to be aligned as a "low dipped" lamp so as to reduce scatter from fog? So they should blind less than standard low beam. I thought the blinding lights you see on on-coming vehicles (other than some idiot on high-beam) were generally "driving" lights, not specifically fog lights.

Cheers,

Gordon

[101RRS]

Hang on - aren't "fog" lights supposed to be aligned as a "low dipped" lamp so as to reduce scatter from fog? So they should blind less than standard low beam. I thought the blinding lights you see on on-coming vehicles (other than some idiot on high-beam) were generally "driving" lights, not specifically fog lights.

Cheers,

Gordon

Yes but many are out of alignment and can blind oncoming drivers. Some of the low down lights are driving lights and also blind - some people do not know whether these low down lights are drivers or fog.

The fog lights on my RRS at nothing to lighting the road when on low beam (have not tested in fog yet) so I see little point (if I was a ******) to drive around with these ****** lights on. I have my lights set to auto anyway so the fog lamps are not an option while auto is selected.

Garry

[bbyer]

You bring up a good point.

I actually think the small round bright things in each corner of the front bumper are marketing devices to differentiate the high line from the not so high line of vehicle, regardless of manufacturer.

As such, on my 3, I changed out the "white" bulbs and put in yellow bulbs so I now claim that they are "snow" lights. I then aimed them so they kind of illuminated down low and into the ditch. If I really had my way, in a real snow storm, I would like to be able to turn off the HID dipped regular headlights and just run on the yellow lights. I find that with yellow, the flashback from the light reflecting off the falling snowflakes is reduced.

The reality is that the flat pattern at the top of the HID dipped beams helps alot. There really is not a lot of flashback compared to regular USA type headlights that are closer to stadium flood lights - light everywhere and nowhere.

The only real experience I have had with the flat top pattern yellow headlights is while driving around Noumea in New Caledonia back in the early seventies. It seems that yellow was the law for headlights. At night it was like approaching vehicles were just running their park lights except that one could see the road well. In fog at night, the yellow was a pleasure, if driving in fog ever is fun.

[101RRS]

Some DRL options are available on ebay day running lights, Car, Truck Parts items at low prices on eBay.com.au (http://cars.shop.ebay.com.au/Cars-Bikes-Boats-/9800/i.html?_trkparms=65%253A12%257C66%253A4%257C39%253 A1%257C72%253A2390&rt=nc&_nkw=day%20running%20lights&_dmpt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&_sticky=1&_sop=10&_sc=1&_trksid=m194&ssPageName=STRK:MEFSRCHX:SRCH)

Garry

[Gaviatrix]

You bring up a good point.

I actually think the small round bright things in each corner of the front bumper are marketing devices to differentiate the high line from the not so high line of vehicle, regardless of manufacturer.

As such, on my 3, I changed out the "white" bulbs and put in yellow bulbs so I now claim that they are "snow" lights. I then aimed them so they kind of illuminated down low and into the ditch. If I really had my way, in a real snow storm, I would like to be able to turn off the HID dipped regular headlights and just run on the yellow lights. I find that with yellow, the flashback from the light reflecting off the falling snowflakes is reduced.

The only real experience I have had with the flat top pattern yellow headlights is while driving around Noumea in New Caledonia back in the early seventies. It seems that yellow was the law for headlights. At night it was like approaching vehicles were just running their park lights except that one could see the road well. In fog at night, the yellow was a pleasure, if driving in fog ever is fun.

I have been driving with my dipped beam headlights on all the time for 25 years, ever since I read that they reduced your chance of having a collision by about 25-30% even on a sunny day. Seemed like cheap insurance to me. The only time I didn't used to do so was when I had a car with non-adjustable lights/no self levelling and was heavily loaded, as I didn't want to dazzle other drivers (and risk being called a w**nker). I'm going to ask my local dealer about programming in the DLR function next time my D3 is in for a service, as the handbook says this is possible. Of course if it changes other Oz-specific settings then I'll just do what I've always done and turn the switch.

Your comment about foglights being a marketing device made me laugh - it's so true, expecially in WA! My personal experience is that yellow foglights are much better in proper fog or heavy snow. In fact, the best car I ever had in those conditions was a Citroen 2CV6 that I had in France in the early 80s and which had the old French vertical-dip yellow headlights. They were totally useless in any other conditions, mind - you'd have been able to see better with a helmet torch.

[connock]

Fog lights should be yellow the same as dust lights are orange this is to help cut through the water patricals / dust particals with less glare. the fog lights they use today are a high intense light aimed low to go under the fog so other people can see you , NOT so you can see , hence rear fog lights. So if they are not to see where you are going , why do ******* use them ? ( sorry just answered my own Question ). The mounting of **** lights is not much differant to spotties , the reason why they move around , often up into oncomming traffic, this being the reson they are illegal to have on when not in fog. ;)

[jonesfam]

I believe that some manufacturers call W**ker lights "Puddle Lights"?

Anyway, our holiday home is just outside Ravenshoe on the Atherton Tableland & the fog lights do work as fog lights in fog.
They shine directly in front & to the side & allow you to see the white or yellow line on the side/edge of the road & they also light up the "Cats Eyes" just in front of you, where they have bothered to fit them.
I have driven through very thick fog around Milla Milla & found that the fog lights really do help, mind I nearly drove int someones driveway because the line curved into it slightly before I saw that it was not the road.
Very slow going that night but at least I knew where the road went.
The rear fogs also gave me some piece of mind that some clot that knew the road really well would not cream me from behind.
In really thick fog I found side lights & fogs are best, any headlights & the glare back sends you silly, we sillier.
Jonesfam

[gghaggis]

so:
IF the lower lamps are true fog lamps, &
IF the fog lamps are correctly aligned, &
IF you believe that driving with your lamps on reduces the accident rate due to greater visibility,

THEN

shouldn't you use the fog lights, rather than the headlamps? From a purely logical stance, not taking into account the legality or practicality of doing so.

In that case, I don't understand the "W**K*R" term being bandied about? I could understand it if they were driving lights.

Cheers,

Gordon

[bbyer]

I enjoyed all the "ifs" above.

In practice, at least here in the New World, Daytime Running Lights are apparently whatever the manufacturer designs - or not.

For many years, GM, rather than run the headlights on their pickups, added a couple of frosted lens oblong things which contain wedge base 3157 28 watt / 8 watt dual filament "brake" light bulbs. Only the 28 watt filament is illuminated and if one is lucky, lasts perhaps a year.

As far as aiming is concerned, if one can argue that a rear facing common brake light bulb is aimed, then I guess one could say the front facing DRL is aimed to the same degree.

GM also tried dimmed versions of the high beam and now for the most part, uses the dipped beam at full intensity. I am now starting to see LED setups which I presume are DRL to the lawyers and sales features to the marketing types.

As to safety, it appears that areas which are predominately snow covered seem to show some decrease in daytime accidents; sunny places, well that is not so clear.

All I would say for certain is that when DRL were not the law, having ones headlights on gets you noticed as I have pretty much always driven with my low beams on and many people flashed their lights back at me - so for good or bad, they noticed. I would also say that on hot bright sunny days where the road is reflecting back at you, if you can see the headlights of a distant vehicle, then one is pretty certain it is coming at you rather than that you are following it. That can matter when passing on a two lane highway.

As a matter of practice these days, I only run my actual fog lights in bad weather on the highway, (and almost never in the city), as I believe that their use makes one stand out to the speed trap types - particularily given that my lights are yellow, a bit unusual here.

[harlie]

You could run a seperate power supply to the DRL's via a relay triggered by a supply spliced into the parkers/signature LED's.

DRLs are now a requirement under EU. However I think you will find that for Aus (and EU) it is expected that they go out when parkers and full head lights are turned on, they turn on with the ignition.

Hella and Narva now do kits that are ADR approved.
http://www.narva.com.au/products/browse/led-daytime-running-lamps (http://www.narva.com.au/products/browse/led-daytime-running-lamps)

[sniegy]

I believe that some manufacturers call W**ker lights "Puddle Lights"?
Jonesfam

Puddle lights have (from my LR years) always been the lights that are on the bottom of the doors when you open them.
Referring to the "Puddles" you may step in once the door is opened.
Cheers:p

[Graeme]

so:
IF the lower lamps are true fog lamps, &
IF the fog lamps are correctly aligned, &
IF you believe that driving with your lamps on reduces the accident rate due to greater visibility,

THEN

shouldn't you use the fog lights, rather than the headlamps? From a purely logical stance, not taking into account the legality or practicality of doing so.
Well-mounted fog lights are mounted low so that they are aligned almost parallel to the ground to light a lot of area without glaring the driver. But that means they are very susceptible to pointing directly at and thus glaring on-coming traffic in non-fog conditions, which does not occur in fog because of lack of distance penetration. Even using high beam in thick fog does not glare on-coming traffic until the vehicles are very close due to lack of penetration. Fog lights (without low or high beams) can provide excellent visibility in very thick fog, having lived in an area prone to such fogs.

I have 3000K (yellow) HID lights in my D4's halogen lights to provide improved lighting in rain. They provide very good immediate visibility through the spray left when trucks pass the other way, whereas white light reflects until the spray has dissipated. They should work well in dust too.

[bbyer]

I have 3000K (yellow) HID lights in my D4's halogen lights to provide improved lighting in rain. They provide very good immediate visibility through the spray left when trucks pass the other way, whereas white light reflects until the spray has dissipated. They should work well in dust too.

I got to looking at the bulbs I installed in what I call my snow lights, the pair of small round illuminated things in the lower corners of the bumper of my 3.

The bulbs are 55 watt 2500K yellow/amber coloured halogen H11 bulbs made by PIAA. They just replace the Land Rover supplied clear H11 halogen bulbs.

For some reason, I also think that the yellow lights to not "soak" into wet pavement at night as the white seems to - maybe that is just my imagination, but the yellow certainly illuminates well for snow driving.

[101RRS]

Has anyone used these as a replacement for their fog lights??
Universal Car Angel Eye Projector Fog Light Day Running (eBay item 270653205664 end time 22-Mar-11 14:28:17 AEDST) : Cars, Bikes, Boats (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/Universal-Car-Angel-Eye-Projector-Fog-Light-Day-Running-/270653205664?pt=AU_Car_Parts_Accessories&hash=item3f04302ca0)

If so - are the outer rings very bright and how do they work as fog lamps?

Garry

[101RRS]

Does anyone know if the headlight housing on a RRS/D3 can be split - to remove the front glass - and gain access to the inside of the light without wrecking them?

Thanks

Garry

[bbyer]

Does anyone know if the headlight housing on a RRS/D3 can be split - to remove the front glass - and gain access to the inside of the light without wrecking them? Thanks Garry If I have it correct, your wife can do it for you. I say that as per the link below, you will need either an hair dryer, oven, or I suppose if you do it yourself, a heat gun - that sounds masculine I suppose.

There are quite a number of pages of material and sub links on this disco3 thread, but many of the guys have been quite successful.
The main additional requirements are some blankets and clean hands, and or clean light gloves.

DISCO3.CO.UK - View topic - Headlamp opening and modification in photos (http://www.disco3.co.uk/forum/topic36286.html?highlight=%2Bheadlight)

[bbyer]

If so - are the outer rings very bright and how do they work as fog lamps? Garry I have not actually installed them, but have been watching the thread for quite a few months now.

As best I can determine, in the daytime, the rings are quite visible, but that is not the same as providing illumination. They are the same rings as used in various BMW's for their angel lights. The rings fit behind diffusers within the BMW factory lights. At night, with the fog lights off, the rings are even more visible if that is good - I suppose so. I am always concerned about the cop bait bit but ....

What is unique about the install, is that whatever H11 bulb you now have in the factory fog light can stay in there and the wiring setup remain stock so that you still have fog lights when you want them. The LED rings you power separately from somewhere somehow with or without a separate switch, as you desire, again the cop bait concern. Being noticed in a Land Rover - well it is not the FFRR so maybe.

[Hymie]

yeah sorry to go slightly off topic but what is this thing with 70% of drivers here in Victoria using their foglights at night (and sometimes during the day!) when it rarely foggy.. Seems to only add to glare for oncoming drivers.


Oh FFS!!!
Don't get me started on my favorite rant:twisted:
Coppers here in Warragul are having a "Road Safety Blitz" at the moment, so I was asking a copper if they were going to book driver for having fog lights on when it's not foggy. All I got was a blank look.....

[Hymie]

Hang on - aren't "fog" lights supposed to be aligned as a "low dipped" lamp so as to reduce scatter from fog? So they should blind less than standard low beam. I thought the blinding lights you see on on-coming vehicles (other than some idiot on high-beam) were generally "driving" lights, not specifically fog lights.

Cheers,

Gordon


As foglights are supposeddly aimed lower to shine under fog on wet roads they reflect up off the wet bitumen and dazzle people.

[Graeme]

Nah, good fog lights are mounted lower and aligned almost parallel with the ground, which means they are more likely to shine into oncoming traffic when there's no fog to block the light.

[jonesy63]

Nah, good fog lights are mounted lower and aligned almost parallel with the ground, which means they are more likely to shine into oncoming traffic when there's no fog to block the light.Unless the boot is weighed down with 200kg of subwoofer boxes! :wasntme: Then foglights shine up instead of parallel to the ground. :mad:

[Mike_S]

That link to removing the lense is great, I've just cracked the n/s one on mine & LR want over £500 for a new unit :eek:

I might now be able to buy a cheap 2ndhand lamp off fleabay and swap the lense over, rather than hunt for the correct part number'd unit. There seems to be a vast plethora of different part numbers for RRS headlamps :mad:

[Basil135]

Just a random thought, what about drilling :o into the reflector, and inserting a LED?

This could also give you the option of leaving it on if you are parked in a dark area on the side of the road for a long period.... thinking Merc here.

The same could also be done in your tail lights.

If you got really clever, why not make the LED's dimmable, so that during the day, you can have them on max brightness, and when parked up at night, dimmed down as a marker light.