Dual battery in P38A

[glenhendry]

I am keen to install a dual battery setup in my 2000 HSE.

I have seen good guides and info for other models on this forum, but not RRP38. Specifically I want it to be invisible and I have LPG in the spare wheel bay. My questions are:

- Is it legal, and safe to store a battery in with LPG tank?
- Has anyone done it? Can you please show pictures?
- Any recommendations on battery charging regulator boxes? default seems to be Traxide SC-80.
- Is there any peculiarities with the P38 electronics that complicates this?
- Has anyone mounted two batteries under the bonnet in a Thor P38? Pics?

Main purpose is to run accessories while camping, esky fridge, small tvs etc.

Thanks!
Glen

[33chinacars]

I have the same enquiry same reason fridge but for a 1999 HSE Gems

Gary

P.S. No gas

[weeds]

the battery in itself is not an ignition source (its the connecting and diconnecting of leads which is the problem) and one would assume you would never have a leaking tank therefore i could not see a problem

i am sure there would be a whole range of electronic in and around the gas tank that could be come an ignition source

wheather its legal or not i haven't a clue

[Junosi]

Is it legal, and safe to store a battery in with LPG tank?

I hope so, that's where mine is ! One very important thing to note about any dual battery system is to put a fuse at both end of the red wire - right next to the pole of both batteries ! Was talking to one member at greendale that had an under the bonnet fire due to insulation wearing through, shorting and igniting fuel lines - all due to lack of fuses :(

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/


Any recommendations on battery charging regulator boxes? default seems to be Traxide SC-80.

Redarc SBI12-100amp (or SBI212-200amp if you're going to winch) is a great bit of kit - they're bulletproof and very good value for money. They don't look glamourous but they do the job.



- Is there any peculiarities with the P38 electronics that complicates this?

None that I found.

[p38arover]

Mine is next to the LPG tank in the wheel well. I'm using a Traxide SC40 with circuit breakers at both ends of the cable.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/732.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/733.jpg

[Keithy P38]

I was thinking of making a cubby for mine on the opposite side to the stacker/sub unit in the back, although I think that with some minor mods to the battery box i'll fit two in there... Anyone for a triple battery setup :-p

Cheers
Keithy

[p38arover]

A good spot for it Keith. Put it in a battery box to contain any acid, etc.

I have a storage box in that location.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/03/725.jpg

[Keithy P38]

My thoughts exactly!

[81stubee]

If you have a gas tank, then the spare wheel well is the go. But from my research. If there is to be a battery inside the Vehicle (spare wheel well is inside) then it must be a sealed unit. ie you can't use a conventional car battery in there. Most of the deep cycles these days are sealed anyway.

The only reason I haven't got mine in there is because i'm not on gas yet and still use the tool thingy to store the jack etc.

You can also get all different sizes of batteries 2nd hand off ebay. You definately don't need to spend $400 dollars on a new one. I picked one up off a mate for a Slab. It is 100mmX350mmx300mm and is a 96Ah 12V.

Apparently CTEK have actually started making a dual battery system that is a 3 stage charger for Deep Cycle batteries and actually boosts the voltage. I'm sure drivesafe knows more.

Cheers
Stu

[glenhendry]

Thanks all. Great info and pics.

My question is now about the cabling. I am sure that I can earth the negative terminal of the aux battery straight to the body or chassis at the back, but what size cable running through the cabin to the isolator unit? The pictures below seem to have large thickness cables and I dont understand why. It should only be ~14v with low current coming into the aux battery for charging it, and then only relatively low draws of power from the aux battery for accessories - why the big cables?

The traxide image here (http://www.traxide.com.au/trax1sc80_2.html)shows small wires going to the aux battery from the isolator unit.

Thanks again! Im excited. Picked up my powered camping fridge today.

[Junosi]

Bigger is better is the rule of thumb for the wiring, if in doubt go bigger. I went with gauge 3awg which is 25mm², some go gauge 0 (53mm²) or more . Basically the smaller cable you go the more voltage drop you have and slower the battery will charge, if at all. There's a bunch of voltage drop calculators around - http://redarc.com.au/handy-hints/calculators/voltage-drop-calculator (http://redarc.com.au/handy-hints/calculators/voltage-drop-calculatoretc) etc.

My used about 5.5m of gauge 3 twin cable running along the left chassis rail.

Also it's always better if you can earth your second battery directly back to to the earth on the primary - chassis etc can't be relied on to be a good earth unless you have to. Use a sealed AGM type battery if you can (rather than a wet type) - primarily because they recharge 3-5 times faster than other types (assuming your wiring is good), they're good in every other way too.

[p38arover]

If you have a gas tank, then the spare wheel well is the go. But from my research. If there is to be a battery inside the Vehicle (spare wheel well is inside) then it must be a sealed unit. ie you can't use a conventional car battery in there. Most of the deep cycles these days are sealed anyway.

I have an AGM in mine.

[Keithy P38]

Thicker wiring will also help in the event your primary battery has discharged and you need to get your car going!

[p38arover]

Thicker wiring will also help in the event your primary battery has discharged and you need to get your car going!

I assume you are not expecting to draw starting current through it and the dual battery controller. :p

[Scouse]

I was thinking of making a cubby for mine on the opposite side to the stacker/sub unit in the back, although I think that with some minor mods to the battery box i'll fit two in there... Anyone for a triple battery setup :-p

Cheers
KeithyThe 1996 Calvert Expedition RRs had 2 batteries (stacked) where the subwoofer sits. They fitted in nicely, and they were big batteries.

[glenhendry]

I have bought the battery and the dual battery kit. Final question is where to mount it. I much prefer the thought of under the bonnet as it will simplify the cabling.

I realise that some batteries are specifically contraindicated under the bonnet, but I bought a fully sealed 98AH battery that is fine to install under the bonnet or in the spare wheel well.

It looks to me like if I bust out the battery tray in my 2000 HSE that there will be enough room for two batteries side by side there. All I would need is an interesting tray to hold both as the 'floor' isnt level there. The compartment aft of the current battery is empty as the ECU was moved for Thor engines, so I think I have room for the entire dual battery system and isolator unit under bonnet.

Has anyone done this? Why did all the installs below chose the boot option?

Thanks for any more great input before I bite the bullet and trash my OEM battery tray.

[p38arover]

Has anyone done this? Why did all the installs below chose the boot option?

I have seen two fore-and-aft batteries in the underbonnet location on a post-99 model. I thought I had pix.

With the GEMS (like mine) that box contains the engine management system so there is little spare room.

[996TURBO]

The 1996 Calvert Expedition RRs had 2 batteries (stacked) where the subwoofer sits. They fitted in nicely, and they were big batteries.

What's this vehicle? Never heard of it before.

[p38arover]

What's this vehicle? Never heard of it before.

See Land Rover Calvert Expedition (http://www.ebroadcast.com.au/ecars/Places/Au/Calvert/LandRover.html)

[glenhendry]

OK, I am going to go for the underbonnet system and I will document it.

Anyone care to comment on where I connect the positive terminal of the auxillary battery to? In the following two links here (http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=390295175620#ht_4341wt_1139)and here (http://www.traxide.com.au/trax1sc80_2.html), the diagrams suggest connecting the aux battery positive terminal to the 'accessories' or 'auxillary load'. For me, I want that to be all of the cig lighters and radio etc. Can I just wire that straight back into the fuse box so all the cig lighters (front and back) are powered by the aux battery when the engine is off. Surely I dont have to run a separate circuit?!

[drivesafe]

OK, I am going to go for the underbonnet system and I will document it.

Anyone care to comment on where I connect the positive terminal of the auxillary battery to? In the following link here (http://www.traxide.com.au/trax1sc80_2.html), the diagrams suggest connecting the aux battery positive terminal to the 'accessories' or 'auxillary load'. For me, I want that to be all of the cig lighters and radio etc. Can I just wire that straight back into the fuse box so all the cig lighters (front and back) are powered by the aux battery when the engine is off. Surely I dont have to run a separate circuit?!

Hi glenhendry, I make and supply the SC80 and the two “thin” wires are 6mm2 marine cables. Note thats not 6mm AUTO ( 4.5mm2 ).

So the two outputs are nearly the same size and current capacity as a single 6B&S cable.

Next, for what your planning, you can simply run a new supply cable from the auxiliary batttery, via a circuit breaker to the vehicle’s existing fuse panel and replace the original vehicle's supply cable coming from the ignition switch.

This will not only supply the power for your accessories from the auxiliary battery but it will bypass the ignition switch so you don’t need to leave your keys in the vehicle.

Last but not least, you only need to run 6B&S cable to be able to jump start your RR from the auxiliary battery, and that includes where the battery is mounted in the rear.

[glenhendry]

OK people. I am afraid that it wont work (for me). I tried hard, and although I can get the batteries in there, side by side, under the bonnet with the OEM battery tray removed, there just isnt enough room to get the batteries flat and level due to the inner guard slope AND get the bonnet closed.

This may work better if you have slightly smaller batteries, but I have a 950CCA main (335mm long) and a 650CCA 95AH deep cycle auxillary (305mm long) and they were too tight.

See photos. It looks like I will be relegating the aux batt to the spare wheel well next to the LPG tank. I am not looking forward terribly to running the cables, but at least it will be invisible and leave the OEM battery tray and cover which looks nice!

Stay tuned.

34297

34298

34299

[rofosixone]

if not under bonnet and not in spare tyre well , type photobucket on your google search box ,than type p38a once in it and click most viewed page"s and see my set up if helps ? ,click that rear battery fit pic for story underneath it ,how i did on mine if helps.
footnote ,yes rear neg earth cable to body (under rear side window) but dont forget to fit extra neg cable from frount battery to alternator if realy want it to charge up as i found and must be sealed battery if used inside the cabin /safety or roll over wise .
currently right now ,pic no 8 on page one of popular p38a page is what you might be interested to see the most.

[p38arover]

OK people. I am afraid that it wont work (for me). I tried hard, and although I can get the batteries in there, side by side, under the bonnet with the OEM battery tray removed, there just isnt enough room to get the batteries flat and level due to the inner guard slope AND get the bonnet closed.

I didn't say the ones I saw were big batteries! :p

I think they were Optimas.

[Hoges]

Placing the aux. battery under the bonnet can have less desirable consequences... heat sink effects on hot days (reduced battery life) and an additional 26kg over the front axle :o ... probably get more service life and better suspension compliance if placed in the 'cubby' space above the floor in rear compartment on RHS.

BTW what's the red cylindrical thingo beside the fuse box in the engine compartment?:confused:

cheers

[glenhendry]

NoS cannister. NOT. :)

Its my hot water transfer for camping showers. It steals a feed from the cabin heater hoses before they get to the heater or the LPG converter. Since install, I have smelled LPG from the car a few times :( but that's another story. Hopefully it is as simple as giving the converter more hot water flow, otherwise I have buggered something up...

[Rat_RR02]

Hi,

I was thinking of doing a dual battery in my truck a few years back (never did though) and I am certain there was plans/drawings for a dual battery tray to replace the single battery tray over in rangerovers.net forums. I will see if I got a copy of it and post back here later on. I ended up just running heavy wires to the back along the frame with an anderson plug and a heavy duty connector in the boot for my camper and fridge.
cheers, Mick

[996TURBO]

OK people. I am afraid that it wont work (for me). I tried hard, and although I can get the batteries in there, side by side, under the bonnet with the OEM battery tray removed, there just isnt enough room to get the batteries flat and level due to the inner guard slope AND get the bonnet closed.

This may work better if you have slightly smaller batteries, but I have a 950CCA main (335mm long) and a 650CCA 95AH deep cycle auxillary (305mm long) and they were too tight.

See photos. It looks like I will be relegating the aux batt to the spare wheel well next to the LPG tank. I am not looking forward terribly to running the cables, but at least it will be invisible and leave the OEM battery tray and cover which looks nice!

Stay tuned.

34297

34298

34299

Hi,

Is it a fire extinguisher you have there?
:angel:

[glenhendry]

Hi,

Is it a fire extinguisher you have there?
:angel:

Ah, better. See 3 posts down, it is hot water transfer for camping showers.

[996TURBO]

Ah, better. See 3 posts down, it is hot water transfer for camping showers.
Very interesting. Have you tested it yet? I'd like that under my hood but i'm not sure i have a place to install it.
Already have some LPG converters and HD air compressor in there :cool:

[glenhendry]

It works fine. I have commandered a 12v feed from an empty relay slot in the fusebox which gives me an under bonnet cigarette lighter and then we just stick a jerry can next the front wheel and its all go. The wife loves having herself and the kids showered with hot water while we are camping. It has a

Except some scumbag came into my camp while we were out wheeling and stole my jerry full of water last time we were camping at Teewah beach near Double Island point.

My LPG converter is over the other side of the engine, so I had just enough room on the drivers side (RHD).

The red valve next to the coolant overflow chamber is the heat control. The black and white wires coming from the fusebox lead to the 12v power point.

[p38arover]

Placing the aux. battery under the bonnet can have less desirable consequences... heat sink effects on hot days (reduced battery life)

Do we need an airscoop to direct external air onto the battery as was done on EA Falcons?

[p38arover]

It works fine. I have commandered a 12v feed from an empty relay slot in the fusebox which gives me an under bonnet cigarette lighter and then we just stick a jerry can next the front wheel and its all go. The wife loves having herself and the kids showered with hot water while we are camping. It has a

<snip>

The red valve next to the coolant overflow chamber is the heat control. The black and white wires coming from the fusebox lead to the 12v power point.

More Pics! More Pics!

[glenhendry]

Pics now available at original shower heater thread:
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/showthread.php?p=1542426#post1542426

[taffy]

I have mine second battery mounted in a box in the rear.

It is removable with Anderson style plugs that connect to the controller under the bonnet and also for auxilliary supply to run the 12 v fridge in the camper when traveling. It also has battery charger bolted onto the side and 240/24v fridge supply for Waeco .

[Hoges]

I hope so, that's where mine is ! One very important thing to note about any dual battery system is to put a fuse at both end of the red wire - right next to the pole of both batteries ! Was talking to one member at greendale that had an under the bonnet fire due to insulation wearing through, shorting and igniting fuel lines - all due to lack of fuses :(

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachments/p38a-range-rover/33886d1299190725-d2-vs-p38-p38-side-second-battery.jpg



Redarc SBI12-100amp (or SBI212-200amp if you're going to winch) is a great bit of kit - they're bulletproof and very good value for money. They don't look glamourous but they do the job.


None that I found.

Just reviewing this post 'cause I need to get serious about transferring a battery from the camper into the P38. Then I saw the above photo:eek:

Junosi: maaaate..., in the "right" circumstances, that's the best example of a 'slow blow' Lucas fuse I have seen :eek::twisted: can you at least insulate the DIY battery strap?:wasntme:

[996TURBO]

I have mine second battery mounted in a box in the rear.

It is removable with Anderson style plugs that connect to the controller under the bonnet and also for auxilliary supply to run the 12 v fridge in the camper when traveling. It also has battery charger bolted onto the side and 240/24v fridge supply for Waeco .

Is it a drawer system part next to the battery box? If not what it is?:angel:

[It'sNotWorthComplaining!]

After having a battery nearly explode, I decided I'd never put one inside a vehicle. Didn't Ean have a battery explode on his trawler?

[Junosi]

Junosi: maaaate..., in the "right" circumstances, that's the best example of a 'slow blow' Lucas fuse I have seen :eek::twisted: can you at least insulate the DIY battery strap?:wasntme:
lol true - it was temporary fitment and miles away from the terminals - the photo is deceiving - since been replaced with something more appropriate :P

[RoverHse]

Hi,

I have a 104A/h Gel battery inside a battery box mounted in the back. The battery charges off a National Luna dual battery system. The battery had to be a sealed unit to be installed inside the car, so that no fumes/ gases will be released.

[taffy]

Is it a drawer system part next to the battery box? If not what it is?:angel:
They are tie down rails There are tie down threaded holes which I use to anchor this frame. I have carefully cut the carpet and when removed you can hardly notice where the holes are. I can still open the spare wheel cover. I use this for tie down the fridge and recovery box I put in when travelling.

[996TURBO]

They are tie down rails There are tie down threaded holes which I use to anchor this frame. I have carefully cut the carpet and when removed you can hardly notice where the holes are. I can still open the spare wheel cover. I use this for tie down the fridge and recovery box I put in when travelling.
Any photos of your travel setup?:cool: