some 80" questions...

[digger]

Just started this as I have some questions and anticipate more as time goes on..

appreciate any knowledge that can be imparted and would really appreciate any photos that can be added to assist....

1) are the 80" and 86" front panels interchangeable? (or does the front wheel end up sitting to far back in the arch?)

2) what differences between original chassis and 51/52 chassis (all 80") are things like front and rear chassis rails interchangeable?

3) when installed do the butler head lights allow the full grill (lights behind) to sit flat or is it 'spaced' forward somehow to allow the lights to be fitted?

4) has anyone converted the front parker lights to also be/or just to be indicators?

5) how does the vent operate in the 80" (photos of mechanism please)

6) is the steering wheel the same as on later 80" or even later s1's?

thats the start....just trying to get my head around stuff...appreciate any useful input !!!!

cheers
Digger


<<edit:- fixed my bad numbering...more proof that theres 3 types of people in the world, those that are good with numbers and those that aren't!>>>

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Just started this as I have some questions and anticipate more as time goes on..

appreciate any knowledge that can be imparted and would really appreciate any photos that can be added to assist....

1) are the 80" and 86" front panels interchangeable? (or does the front wheel end up sitting to far back in the arch?)

2) what differences between original chassis and 51/52 chassis (all 80") are things like front and rear chassis rails interchangeable? ,

3) when installed do the butler head lights allow the full grill (lights behind) to sit flat or is it 'spaced' forward somehow to allow the lights to be fitted?

3) has anyone converted the front parker lights to also be/or just to be indicators?

4) how does the vent operate in the 80" (photos of mechanism please)

5) is the steering wheel the same as on later 80" or even later s1's?

thats the start....just trying to get my head around stuff...appreciate any useful input !!!!

cheers
DiggerImages later. Yes they are interchangeable except the 86 mudguard is made of 3 parts, inner, front and outer while the 80 are only inner and outer. the 88/109 have the wheel arch in the wrong place.

1951 and 1952 are pretty much the same, the differences are mainly in 1950 or before.

Butler headlamps are 5" and stopped being fitted mid-1950 they sit behind the mesh grill. 7" headlamps were introduced very late 1950 and are installed in the regular bucket fitted to the front of the radiator support "grill" panel. The late 1950 and 1951 "full grill had 9" wire bordered holes in the mesh for the headlamps to poke through.

Are you talking about the side lights on the firewall of the 1948 to late 1951? If yes, no I haven't heard of anyone actually doing it. Most people usually fit amber lamps to the front of the front mudguard, or use motorcycle lamps on little stalks off the bumper bar. Holden's in the UK market a fitting for side lamps on other classic cars that have a clear bulb and also an amber one off the side, but you would have to modify the holder to fit the fittings. You could also fit some high intensity amber LED.

The vent is full width, with a full width hinge. They are held closed by 3 brackets that clamp to the pipe frame above and below the vent and are tightened with wing nuts. They hold open with a pair of knee like supports that use the friction created by their rivets.https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/05/588.jpg

The steering wheel on the late 1950 carries through to series 2 and has three groups of 4 spokes. The 1948 and 1949 steering wheel had 3 groups of only 2 (thicker) spokes.Diana

[digger]

Images later. Yes they are interchangeable except the 86 mudguard is made of 3 parts, inner, front and outer while the 80 are only inner and outer. the 88/109 have the wheel arch in the wrong place.
thanks
1951 and 1952 are pretty much the same, the differences are mainly in 1950 or before.shouldve been clearer sorry Im looking at 49 being assisted from bits off a 51-all relate to that point

Butler headlamps are 5" and stopped being fitted mid-1950 they sit behind the mesh grill. 7" headlamps were introduced very late 1950 and are installed in the regular bucket fitted to the front of the radiator support "grill" panel. The late 1950 and 1951 "full grill had 9" wire bordered holes in the mesh for the headlamps to poke through. I have the "full grille" just wasn't sure about the lights... has had a T grill fitted and has one "butler bucket" and one later (bulging) 7"(?) light

Are you talking about the side lights on the firewall of the 1948 to late 1951? If yes, no I haven't heard of anyone actually doing it. Most people usually fit amber lamps to the front of the front mudguard, or use motorcycle lamps on little stalks off the bumper bar. Holden's in the UK market a fitting for side lamps on other classic cars that have a clear bulb and also an amber one off the side, but you would have to modify the holder to fit the fittings. You could also fit some high intensity amber LED.

The vent is full width, with a full width hinge. They are held closed by 3 brackets that clamp to the pipe frame above and below the vent and are tightened with wing nuts. They hold open with a pair of knee like supports that use the friction created by their rivets. The bits seem to be mostly there but I cant get the "ovals" to turn? and the one small bent knee shaped arm (that sounds very silly) is on pass side and "floating free" so I cant see how it should be

The steering wheel on the late 1950 carries through to series 2 and has three groups of 4 spokes. The 1948 and 1949 steering wheel had 3 groups of only 2 (thicker) spokes.
so would an older morris have one of these steering wheels or is there some other vehicle I may be able to source them from?
Diana


Thanks Diana, I am trying to see what I can manage and assess just what Im getting myself into!

(and fixed my shocking numbering!! (I can only count to 2a!!)

[123rover50]

The Tickfords have twin filament bulbs in the firewall parkers. This enables them to be used as indicators as well. However the small park light of the standard 80 has been replaced by a 488 which is bigger.
Didiman

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Digger

There are a lot of differences between the 1949 and the 1951 chassis. Firstly the front spring hangers are reversed.

The fish plate brackets on the 49 to hold the bumper bar.

The rear tow plate has different hole count and is removable on the 1951.

Even the bolt that holds the rear shock absorber is different.

The steering wheel. I don't know if another brand car will fit, but outside the two Vs 4 spokes you can likely fit any Land Rover steering wheel right up to 1967, so long as you remove the drum for the turn signal as it won't fit over the collar on the 80 column.

The radiator support "grill" panel on a 1948 - early 1950 is quite different. In the top 2/3 it basically has 2 vertical separators making 3 large vertical rectangular openings. There are also 2 "top hat" brackets spot welded under the top panel to support the headlamps.) https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/03/959.jpg

The 1951 has four openings of various sizes, a basically square aperture between the headlamps, below, a similar one to the 48 below the horizontal separator and a vertical rectangle one on each side below the headlamps and 2 round openings for the headlamp buckets. The 1951 and 1952-53 have the holes/captive nuts for the mesh grill in different places the 51 being too wide for the inverted "T" grill of the '52. (wider apart in the 51) The horizontal inside top panel in a 51 often doesn't go far enough across to hold the butler headlamps. https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/05/584.jpg

I am not sure what you mean about the ovals for the side lamps turning. The metal housing poking through the firewall should be welded in place. There is a single screw in the top of this which allows the lamp fitting to come out (you hinge it down and pull out at an angle) however if the housing is damaged you may have difficulty removing it. (Anthony Pearson in Adelaide - Classic and Vintage Bulbs - had replacement side lamp fittings for the 1948 - 1951 side lamps.)

Diana

[series1buff]

You can do the 3 relay trick , turns your single filament parker into a blinker / parker . Will post the circuit here

[digger]

Digger

The radiator support "grill" panel on a 1948 - early 1950 is quite different. In the top 2/3 it basically has 2 vertical separators making 3 large vertical rectangular openings. There are also 2 "top hat" brackets spot welded under the top panel to support the headlamps.)
The 1951 has four openings of various sizes, a basically square aperture between the headlamps, below, a similar one to the 48 below the horizontal separator and a vertical rectangle one on each side below the headlamps and 2 round openings for the headlamp buckets. The 1951 and 1952-53 have the holes/captive nuts for the mesh grill in different places the 51 being too wide for the inverted "T" grill of the '52. (wider apart in the 51) The horizontal inside top panel in a 51 often doesn't go far enough across to hold the butler headlamps.

I am not sure what you mean about the ovals for the side lamps turning. The metal housing poking through the firewall should be welded in place. There is a single screw in the top of this which allows the lamp fitting to come out (you hinge it down and pull out at an angle) however if the housing is damaged you may have difficulty removing it. (Anthony Pearson in Adelaide - Classic and Vintage Bulbs - had replacement side lamp fittings for the 1948 - 1951 side lamps.)

Diana

Cheers!
the "oval" I reffered to was in reference to the front vent fittings.. which I see by the photo youve put in the top post is to secure the vent... as mine wont turn from the horizontal looks like I have some work ahead there too!! (as well as everywhere else! may be too much to save yet :( should hold off for a gunbuggy (hint hint diana/numpty!!:) ) )

looks like I have a later radiator support (which I was afraid of -I assume the correct ones are hard to find?)on the plus side I have a complete and unmolested grille and badge...

[outback jeff]

Cheers!

looks like I have a later radiator support (which I was afraid of -I assume the correct ones are hard to find?)on the plus side I have a complete and unmolested grille and badge...


Digger is the radiator support your looking for like the one in this picture,

36324

I know it not the best picture , but I think the is the type your looking for sitting on the back of that ute.

Cheers Jeff

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Jeff

To me that panel looks like the one for the suffix H SIIa around 1971.

The outer openings don't go high enough for a 1948-1950 model. :(

Diana

[outback jeff]

Jeff

To me that panel looks like the one for the suffix H SIIa around 1971.

The outer openings don't go high enough for a 1948-1950 model. :(

Diana

Now that I have another look at it it doesn't have the oval at the bottom center either

Cheers Jeff

[JDNSW]

I agree with Diana.

John

[digger]

Does anyone have a photograph of a butler headlight suitable for an early 80" (behind the grille)

If possible can I get photos in situ (close up front and under bonnet)

and

one "free" of the radiator support panel?
.
After much head scratching I've been put out of my misery and advised that the horizontal loop on the base of the windscreen if for the "trafficator" switch (so it pivots with the trafficators and screen) Does anyone have photos of the appropriate switch?


sorry to be a pain but trying to get everything sorted "in my head"!

"DROPSHORT" has very generously given me some reference books so I will be bothering you guys less but none the less I will still be bothering you!
but I have both a workshop(48-58) and parts manual (48-53) and an 86-107 instruction manual! Already last night I answered a heap of my own questions! (DROPSHORT also has advised me re: correct paint combinations etc as from factory vehicle and wheels etc etc therefore cutting even more questions out!)


digger:D

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Butler headlamps - The lens at the bottom. They were also used on Ferguson Te20 tractors - but you need to get them with hi and low beam. Some only had a single filament.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachments/series-i-land-rover-enthusiasts-section/36417d1306968858-some-80-questions-butler-lamps.jpg

Some who are more pragmatic (unable to count rivets), get reproduction tractor lamps and fit Q.H. bulbs.
http://www.bareco.com.au/pics/genrlpic/g48c.jpg
http://www.bareco.com.au/files/massey2001/mf67c.htm
--------------------------------
Cant find one of the switch

Its on this one: https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/06/1433.jpg

Similar to NR6 038 (2nd from R)

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/06/1434.jpg

[123rover50]

Here are images of the Tickford lights