Puma fuel economy

[n plus one]

So, I normally get somewhere between 13l/100km and 14l/100km out of my Puma.

She's normally got a bit of gear on board (storage drawers filled with camping and recovery gear), mud tyres and I often have a rooftop tent (Maggiolina) fitted.

Figured that this wasn't great - not as good as some others report - but not shockingly bad either.

Anywho, long story short, the other day I followed a guy in another Puma down some country roads and then maintained the same driving style when he turned left and I turned right and headed onto the highway.

Turns out his driving style returns 10.5l/100km in my fully laden truck..:eek:

Moral of the story: if your Puma's economy ain't what you think it should be - it's proabably your fault.

[LR D4]

Yeah I can almost set my watch to my 10.5/11 ltrs per 100km... I also don't get bogged;) with all that extra weight...

[Allan]

13-15ltrs per 100km full load 13ft boat behind. I did 530km before the light came on going north a couple of months ago but the load was way up.

Allan

[pc3]

On a long trip recently wit ha lot of flat roads and fully loaded Driving just under 100km an hour mate and I worked out it used 10L per 100km except for the bit before and after Hillston it did over 10 litres on that bit....more hills.

When actually on the property I did aproximately 400km just crawling around looking for feral pigs no more than 40km and often 20km or 30km an hour unloaded and it was amazing on fuel somewhere between 6 and 6.5 litres. It was also brilliant off road.

[Drover]

Last July, on my Simpson desert trip I travelled just under 9000k's and averaged 13L/100k's.

PUMA was fully loaded and had roofrack on as well.

No complaints...

[Naks]

Unladen with BAS remap I once got 9.5l/100km. Usually I get 10l/100km.

Fully laden, on a 6000km trip to Namibia we got 10.4l/100km running the standard map with EGR-shut.

[Drover]

Excellent figures Nak's,

I didn't have my BAS map installed back when I did the desert trip and haven’t had the map installed long enough to work out fuel consumption figures, yet.

cheers

[TonyC]

So, I normally get somewhere between 13l/100km and 14l/100km out of my Puma.

She's normally got a bit of gear on board (storage drawers filled with camping and recovery gear), mud tyres and I often have a rooftop tent (Maggiolina) fitted.

Figured that this wasn't great - not as good as some others report - but not shockingly bad either.

Anywho, long story short, the other day I followed a guy in another Puma down some country roads and then maintained the same driving style when he turned left and I turned right and headed onto the highway.

Turns out his driving style returns 10.5l/100km in my fully laden truck..:eek:

Moral of the story: if your Puma's economy ain't what you think it should be - it's proabably your fault.

So what's "his" driving style and what's your (old) driving style that's worth a 3 L/100 or 20% improvement?

Tony

[n plus one]

So what's "his" driving style and what's your (old) driving style that's worth a 3 L/100 or 20% improvement?

Tony

His style is/was 90-100kmh slowing slightly on the hills, easing back up to speed on the straights, etc.

My style is foot-to-the-floor, 120kmh, overtake anything I can, chase and pass cars on windy roads, etc :twisted:

Can't for the life of me see why they would result in such different fuel figures...

[PAT303]

Is the BAS upgrade worth it. Pat

[Naks]

Is the BAS upgrade worth it. Pat

IMHO, only if you have the spare cash lying around and don't know what to do with it. In my case I was retrenched and got a nice package, so what the heck.

The best benefit from the BAS unit is the ability to read & clear fault codes. Also, the remap keeps the EGR shut, helping to lower fuel consumption and improving engine durability.

[Drover]

Is the BAS upgrade worth it. Pat

Hey Pat,

I have had the BAS remap for about a month, only done about 1000k's with it loaded but....

I love it, it has really brought the PUMA to life. It is hard to appreciate the driveability (if that’s a word) that this map has brought. The difference is noticeable as soon as you let the clutch out.

Power increase is right across the rev range and very very smooth.

I regularly tow a 2t off road van and the improvements here are what I was after and I am not disappointed.

Does the PUMA need it.... no, but it so so much better with it.

increase is about 80-90NM and 30-40KW.

(I replaced the intercooler at the same time) (De-cat pipe to follow soon)

Cheers

[85 county]

following a defender is the best way to improve your economy.
convoying out of Adelaide with a number of LRs this becomes really noticeable. i know of a 200 tdi that just bettered 7ltrs per 100 a 300 tdi bettered than 8lts per 100. this is fully loaded all around the 3 ton mark
as with the 95-100klm seems to be the sweet spot, any more than that you are really just push a heap of air.

[PAT303]

IMHO, only if you have the spare cash lying around and don't know what to do with it. In my case I was retrenched and got a nice package, so what the heck.

The best benefit from the BAS unit is the ability to read & clear fault codes. Also, the remap keeps the EGR shut, helping to lower fuel consumption and improving engine durability.

Keeping the EGR shut is the bit I like. Pat

[PAT303]

Hey Pat,

I have had the BAS remap for about a month, only done about 1000k's with it loaded but....

I love it, it has really brought the PUMA to life. It is hard to appreciate the driveability (if that’s a word) that this map has brought. The difference is noticeable as soon as you let the clutch out.

Power increase is right across the rev range and very very smooth.

I regularly tow a 2t off road van and the improvements here are what I was after and I am not disappointed.

Does the PUMA need it.... no, but it so so much better with it.

increase is about 80-90NM and 30-40KW.

(I replaced the intercooler at the same time) (De-cat pipe to follow soon)

Cheers

Drover,were abouts on the central coast are you?,I'm driving mine over at Xmas to Gosford so it would be good to compare my stock one to your modded. Pat

[Drover]

PM sent

[Beckford]

Drover,were abouts on the central coast are you?,I'm driving mine over at Xmas to Gosford so it would be good to compare my stock one to your modded. Pat

Pat,

I live in Ourimbah, just up the road from Gosford. Give us a shout (PM) when you are in town, if you want to talk Landrovers over a beer.

My landrover nut relatives will be in town over Xmas too most likely.....

Beckford.

[PAT303]

We can do that. Pat

[Gidget]

My 2 cents worth. Our puma has been in our possession for 6 months now. 13 odd thousand kms on it.
Have been monitoring the fuel usage via a phone app believe it or not :eek:
Now it is my daily driver, the short 15 km return each day to work, throw in a few hunting trips, some extended weekends away with the family & camper in tow & you have our sort of usage.

Overall average for it's life to date is 12.8l/100km.

Gets low 10's on the highway with out the camper.
Around the mid 12's with the camper in tow.
13's around town.

I am hoping the l/100km will drop a little into the 11's with the camper in tow once it gets a few more kms on it ;)

But still fairly happy with what we have so far :D

[MTB]

Well, I just completed an 8,000km Sydney to Cape York return trip.
Running Mud Terrains, Roof Tent and full "expedition load" and returned 11.8L over the 5 week period.

Frank
Landy Build (http://web.mac.com/frank_shazzie/Site/Landy_Build.html)

[Phoenix12]

Hey Pat,

I have had the BAS remap for about a month, only done about 1000k's with it loaded but....

I love it, it has really brought the PUMA to life. It is hard to appreciate the driveability (if that’s a word) that this map has brought. The difference is noticeable as soon as you let the clutch out.

Power increase is right across the rev range and very very smooth.

I regularly tow a 2t off road van and the improvements here are what I was after and I am not disappointed.

Does the PUMA need it.... no, but it so so much better with it.


increase is about 80-90NM and 30-40KW.

(I replaced the intercooler at the same time) (De-cat pipe to follow soon)

Cheers

Drover,

Can you recall the approx cost of the Remap ?

Thanks

[Drover]

PM sent.

Cheers

[Naks]

Can you recall the approx cost of the Remap ?


Phoenix, if you're a member of Defender2.net there is a discount. IIRC with UPS 3-day shipping the total was 460pounds or so.

[Chops]

Rehashing an old thread I know, but it's the closest thread I can find to what I want.

How many clicks do you get till your fuel light comes on as an average? Both with and without remap if you can. Mine has no mods at all for the motor, and has just had a new pump and injectors installed. I have RTT and a Roof Rack on.
I see Alan gets 530 whilst towing and loaded. Is every body else similar to this, or different?

Cheers guys.

[ATH]

I get about 10.5/100 around town with some crap in the back but no beer in the Engels.:(
That increases to 13/100 when towing our small van of around 1.7t. It has a BAS remap and that works well when towing which is what I wanted it for.
AlanH.

PS. I've never let the fuel light come on so couldn't say how many kays I do until it does.

[LR V8]

Mine is stock & I get just over 600km when the light comes on.

Usage since new.... and yes, I have noticed the improvement after a good tow...

(C = City, H = Hwy, T = Towing)

21 Jun 14 - 67.3l / 635 km - 10.67/100km C
01 Jun 14 - 69.1l / 509 km - 13.47/100km T
24 May 14 - 63.8l / 573 km - 11.13/100km C
03 May 14 - 61.0l / 592 km - 10.31/100km C
19 Apr 14 - 62.8l / 504 km - 12.46/100km T
17 Apr 14 - 46.7l / 442 km - 11.06/100km C
05 Apr 14 - 66.8l / 570 km - 11.73/100km C
16 Mar 14 - 13.5l / 115 km - 11.71/100km C
13 Mar 14 - 65.2l / 579 km - 11.26/100km C
01 Mar 14 - 55.1l / 479 km - 11.50/100km C
20 Feb 14 - 61.6l / 543 km - 11.35/100km C
08 Feb 14 - 68.4l / 617 km - 11.09/100km C
27 Jan 14 - 48.6l / 430 km - 11.31/100km C
15 Jan 14 - 61.6l / 559 km - 11.03/100km C
03 Jan 14 - 62.9l / 592 km - 10.63/100km C
26 Dec 13 - 56.3l / 435 km - 12.95/100km T
20 Dec 13 - 47.8l / 425 km - 11.00/100km H
15 Dec 13 - 52.7l / 483 km - 10.91/100km H
11 Dec 13 - 60.9l / 529 km - 11.51/100km C
30 Nov 13 - 47.3l / 430 km - 11.01/100km C
24 Nov 13 - 55.2l / 493 km - 11.20/100km H
19 Nov 13 - 53.7l / 453 km - 11.85/100km C
12 Nov 13 - 52.0l / 454 km - 11.45/100km H

Pete

[muddy]

Chops

Marcus i have approx 10 lts when the light comes on in 110 then the distance depends on city/ towing or highway

[85 county]

Mine is stock & I get just over 600km when the light comes on.

Usage since new.... and yes, I have noticed the improvement after a good tow...

(C = City, H = Hwy, T = Towing)

21 Jun 14 - 67.3l / 635 km - 10.67/100km C
01 Jun 14 - 69.1l / 509 km - 13.47/100km T
24 May 14 - 63.8l / 573 km - 11.13/100km C
03 May 14 - 61.0l / 592 km - 10.31/100km C
19 Apr 14 - 62.8l / 504 km - 12.46/100km T
17 Apr 14 - 46.7l / 442 km - 11.06/100km C
05 Apr 14 - 66.8l / 570 km - 11.73/100km C
16 Mar 14 - 13.5l / 115 km - 11.71/100km C
13 Mar 14 - 65.2l / 579 km - 11.26/100km C
01 Mar 14 - 55.1l / 479 km - 11.50/100km C
20 Feb 14 - 61.6l / 543 km - 11.35/100km C
08 Feb 14 - 68.4l / 617 km - 11.09/100km C
27 Jan 14 - 48.6l / 430 km - 11.31/100km C
15 Jan 14 - 61.6l / 559 km - 11.03/100km C
03 Jan 14 - 62.9l / 592 km - 10.63/100km C
26 Dec 13 - 56.3l / 435 km - 12.95/100km T
20 Dec 13 - 47.8l / 425 km - 11.00/100km H
15 Dec 13 - 52.7l / 483 km - 10.91/100km H
11 Dec 13 - 60.9l / 529 km - 11.51/100km C
30 Nov 13 - 47.3l / 430 km - 11.01/100km C
24 Nov 13 - 55.2l / 493 km - 11.20/100km H
19 Nov 13 - 53.7l / 453 km - 11.85/100km C
12 Nov 13 - 52.0l / 454 km - 11.45/100km H

Pete

about the same as an isuzu, but more than a 300 dti

[mark_coffey]

I have a 2008 130, lucky to get 440km before the light comes on, has been as low as 370 towing. It really hasn't changed from new, just clocked 135000kms

[Chops]

Cool stuff guys, thanks so much.

Your figures confirm what I initially thought.

Essentially, the 600 marks sort of average, which is what I was getting for the first 12K until they swapped out the ECU and injectors. Then I was getting around the 530 mark. Not good, but thought it was due to putting on the rack etc when I finally got it home.

So they've swapped out the injectors and fuel pump, and the ECU again at 80K, and now I'm getting 450. But I'll confirm that when I get back to Melb tomorrow :-/

Mark, I'd be looking into your figures I think. Are you running smaller diameter wheels at all?

[mark_coffey]

I have been mindful of the fuel economy ever since I bought it.
I was fitted with 7.50x16" for the first 25000km, got ripped off after the first 40+deg day, the blocks started moving around really bad at 100km/h, the whole truck felt it was on 4 flat tyres, bloody un-nerving.
I currently run 265-75 x 16".
I can roughly average 13.5l/km and drive generally most distances without worrying about if I can make it to the next servo.
Interestingly with Torque I can read the fuel usage per hour, at 110 speedo, 102 gps I pull 18l/h but at 100 speedo I pull 14l/h

[FeatherWeightDriver]

One of the primary reasons I installed my UltraGauge was to keep an eye on fuel consumption.

Getting real time feedback of 80L per 100km teaches you what not to do. :angel:

On the other hand, it is surprising how hard it can be driven with quite reasonable numbers.

[PAT303]

Cool stuff guys, thanks so much.

Your figures confirm what I initially thought.

Essentially, the 600 marks sort of average, which is what I was getting for the first 12K until they swapped out the ECU and injectors. Then I was getting around the 530 mark. Not good, but thought it was due to putting on the rack etc when I finally got it home.

So they've swapped out the injectors and fuel pump, and the ECU again at 80K, and now I'm getting 450. But I'll confirm that when I get back to Melb tomorrow :-/

Mark, I'd be looking into your figures I think. Are you running smaller diameter wheels at all?

After 16 years of defender ownership I've found road speed is everything with fuel economy.Both mine get better millage around town up to 80km/hr than they do at 110-120,defenders push alot of air which really hurts on fuel,I've travelled alot in the interior and the wind is a killer,I pushed into a headwind from north of Alice all the way to Port Augusta and struggled to get 400k's before the light came on if I even tried to go over 90,it's better to back off and suck it up than try to force your way forward. Pat

[pannawonica]

Just driven up from Perth home 1500k,s heavily loaded pulling a 2 ton double axle trailer ( 1.5 ton) I recorded 12k,s to the litre. Generally from full, I get 62/64 litres of fuel burn (Puma 110) before the light comes on. As Pat indicated there is a big difference staying at 100k,s than 110, 90 is evan better in high winds but not always practicable. I have an Alive map, decat, centre pipe removed. :D

[Chops]

Am just about to leave, will let you know in the morning how we went, but my normal driving is to sit "on" the speed limit, so I will change nothing for the trip home.

Cheers for now.

[Rustbucket]

My 2 bobs worth. Have 2010 110 Defender. Have watched consumption fairly closely since purchase. When completely stock was getting mid 9s to mid10s per 100 km.
Since then have added bulbar, roof rack and drawers and other various heavy stuff. This has affected economy by about 1 to 1.5 l/100.
About 9 months ago got BAS remap which has not had any noticeable affect on economy, but has improved drivability.
Have just returned from Flinders, Oodnadata, Simpson trip fully loaded. Over whole trip average was 11.5 l/100km. Best was 9.3 , worst was 12.4 across the desert. That was between 2 and 14 litres /100 better than fellow travellers.
My observation is that the moment you try to sit at 110 kph you had better start looking for a service station.
One last observation; I have spoken to a few people who run mud tyres and all terrains depending on their trips, and the common findings are that muddies cost 2to 3 l/100, especially if wider or over standard size

[Naks]

I struggle to get 450km out of the main tank these days - just goes to show what driving 3km to work and back does to the fuel economy :(

[Psimpson7]

I struggle to get 450km out of the main tank these days - just goes to show what driving 3km to work and back does to the fuel economy :(

Cant imagine the Defender is enjoying that. Buy a bike!

We seem to be getting very low 10l/100km consistently.

10.16 was the last tank I think.

5500km in 3 months and I think every tank apart from the first one has been between 10.1 and 10.9 l/100

[ProjectDirector]

I am averaging 11s since I bought mine. Am running winch and LR roof rack and wrangler tyres. Never got under 10.
80467

[Witchdoctor]

I get mid 10 l/100 & do not drive it for fuel economy

[quaddrive]

Mine is a 2009 with 285/75 mud tyres 4" lift. Bar, drawers, winch etc and roof bars. I drive from Perth to Albany twice a week. It has a BAS remap, intercooler etc. Around town I get 12's and on the run to Albany I get between 13-14's. Up to 100kmh is OK but 110 or over uses more juice. We are pushing bricks through the air remember. I usually sit at the 110kmh end of the scale

:-)

[spudfan]

I struggle to get 450km out of the main tank these days - just goes to show what driving 3km to work and back does to the fuel economy :(
If you do a lot of stopping and starting which involves a lot of first gear use the fuel consumption does suffer. I have two 2.4 Puma's and both do significantly better fuel consumption wise on long journeys at 80 - 100 kms.
Fuel consumption can be a guide healthwise as to the health of your engine. If your consumption starts going up with normal usage you know you have a problem somewhere. So it does pay to keep an eye on the consumption in a general sense.

[voltron]

I will get 500km out of a tank. Might be lucky to get 530km's.

On long trips I wouldn't get over 105kms, but average a 100km's easy.

A modern engine should be able to do 105km's/hr efficiently I think.

[Grappler]

I monitored instantaneous fuel consumption today with Ultragauge. on 2.2 130

On a flat road at a steady 100 k/h : 5th gear the value stabilised around 11 litres/h

6th gear used about 9 litres/h

To get stable readings I had to drive the throttle very carefully. Since I dont usually make careful adjustments intentionally the values are probably lower than "normal" driving

[PAT303]

I will get 500km out of a tank. Might be lucky to get 530km's.

On long trips I wouldn't get over 105kms, but average a 100km's easy.

A modern engine should be able to do 105km's/hr efficiently I think.

It's the box shape that determines fuel use not the motor,I feel the TDCi uses more fuel simply because the extra performance allows for higher speed. Pat

[Holmesy68]

Have been reading what you guys have written and I am there or thereabouts, until my last trip. 32l/100 towing a 2t camper at 90-100km/h dirt road and bitumen.
I made a point of filling before leaving to track the fuel usage. I knew it was bad but nearly fell over when I did the figures on my return.

Any clues? I have been contemplating tweaking it. This trip will help my cause.

[AndyG]

Pure arsed guesses:
Trailer brakes not binding or other defect?
In too high a gear and engine lugging. I imagine with 2 t behind you want max torque, rather than min revs.

Good luck

[PAT303]

Have been reading what you guys have written and I am there or thereabouts, until my last trip. 32l/100 towing a 2t camper at 90-100km/h dirt road and bitumen.
I made a point of filling before leaving to track the fuel usage. I knew it was bad but nearly fell over when I did the figures on my return.

Any clues? I have been contemplating tweaking it. This trip will help my cause.

I think you need to check that figure,around 14 per 100 is about right for that type of driving,or you have a hole in the tank.Mine did 542k's with 58ltrs this weekend. Pat

[voltron]

The thing about the figures based off the speedo is that the speedo seems to be out by about 5-8km depending on what speed you do. I find 105kms/hr is doing 100 on the gps.

[n plus one]

Have been reading what you guys have written and I am there or thereabouts, until my last trip. 32l/100 towing a 2t camper at 90-100km/h dirt road and bitumen.
I made a point of filling before leaving to track the fuel usage. I knew it was bad but nearly fell over when I did the figures on my return.

Any clues? I have been contemplating tweaking it. This trip will help my cause.

Bad maths?

So you can only go 200kms before you need to start looking for a service station?

[Chops]

Just as a point of interest for some.
I was told by the assessor that Ford have a similar issue in aligning they're ECU/injectors too.
I have no idea on the economy side of things for them, but maybe if your worried, and LR can't fix you up, it may be well worth your while checking in with a Ford dealership to see what, if any, info they have on the subject.
Running a Transit Van I wouldn't think would be much different to running our brick ;)

[85 county]

Just as a point of interest for some.
I was told by the assessor that Ford have a similar issue in aligning they're ECU/injectors too.
I have no idea on the economy side of things for them, but maybe if your worried, and LR can't fix you up, it may be well worth your while checking in with a Ford dealership to see what, if any, info they have on the subject.
Running a Transit Van I wouldn't think would be much different to running our brick ;)

ford had issues with the terratory not the puma.

most of the problem was attatude. a bit like taking a jakaroo to a holden dealer, thay sort of do not want to know becouse its an isuzu

[TonyC]

Have been reading what you guys have written and I am there or thereabouts, until my last trip. 32l/100 towing a 2t camper at 90-100km/h dirt road and bitumen.
I made a point of filling before leaving to track the fuel usage. I knew it was bad but nearly fell over when I did the figures on my return.

Any clues? I have been contemplating tweaking it. This trip will help my cause.

That is 32-35 litres an hour.
I would be surprised if it's possible to put that much fuel through that motor.
I would be looking for an error in the maths or a fuel leak.
One of the engineers on here should be able to give us an idea how much power 35 litres an hour should give.

Tony

[PAT303]

About enough to raise the EGT's high enough to burn the turbine off the turbo. Pat

[TonyC]

About enough to raise the EGT's high enough to burn the turbine off the turbo. Pat

I was thinking in a motor some what larger than a Land Rover:angel:

But your right, the EGTs in a Puma at that fuel burn would right up there.

Perhaps the above mentioned engineer could tell us how much boost the Puma would need to get the air fuel mix right.

Tony

[PAT303]

Enough to blow the compressor off the turbo............................................. .... .Sorry mate ,couldn't resist. Pat