A Winch from the Wench.

[jonesfam]

Ok, I have convinced the wife that an excellent X-mas pressie for her beloved & loving husband (otherwise know as that bald old git) would be a winch for the D3.
Clever, Hey?
Anyway, what sort or brand of winch would fit the D3's ARB bar? Is it worth changing the wire for rope? Will I have to get an Auto Lecy to install it.
BTW the budget is around $800 to a grand, closer to the bottom end so she can buy me some cashews & licorice as well.
I look forward to you advice & to no more hand winching.
Jonesfam

[oldsalt]

I've got a Tigerz11 - 12,000lb winch with plasma rope, was about $750 from memory - fits in the ARB bullbar no worries - works for me !!!:D
cheers

[oldsalt]

Here 'tis ... https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

[clubagreenie]

I can X2 the Tigerz 12lbr.

[rmp]

Ok, I have convinced the wife that an excellent X-mas pressie for her beloved & loving husband (otherwise know as that bald old git) would be a winch for the D3.
Clever, Hey?
Anyway, what sort or brand of winch would fit the D3's ARB bar? Is it worth changing the wire for rope? Will I have to get an Auto Lecy to install it.
BTW the budget is around $800 to a grand, closer to the bottom end so she can buy me some cashews & licorice as well.
I look forward to you advice & to no more hand winching.


Hand wenching?

But as the others said a Tigerzz is good. Also Ironman. But the very best are the top-end Warns, but they are expensive. Do get synthetic rope for safety's sake, and you only need 20m.

[steveG]

Hand wenching?

But as the others said a Tigerzz is good. Also Ironman. But the very best are the top-end Warns, but they are expensive. Do get synthetic rope for safety's sake, and you only need 20m.

Whats the reason behind only needing 20m. Something special with synthetic ropes, or in general?
All the emails I get say longer is better :p

Steve

[clubagreenie]

I'd stuff as much as it'll fit safely. You need to consider if you're using a snatchblock.

Another bonus with the tigrez is they have the option of coming with synthetic.

[DiscoWeb]

jonesfam,

The attached link (which is to a manufactures website) might be useful as it includes a link to a recent "4wd Action" mag winch comparison test that could give you some help.

Avenger 4x4 Accessories (http://www.avenger4x4.com.au/)

Will not help withe ability to fit in an ARB bar but seems like a few have give advice on that already.

George

[rmp]

20m because:

a) it's cheaper than 40
b) easier to get on the drum
c) allows some pulling at high fleet angles
d) less turns on the drum means you need less power
e) in the bush if you pull out all 40m it's a pain to put away properly. Easier to use 20m and straps. Imagine the situation....dark, driving rain, 40m of rope out on a muddy hill and you're trying to wind it back on right and it must be just right otherwise it won't fit. No thanks, with 20m you can get it on any which way and sort it out when you have time.

And carry extension straps/rope anyway if you need extra length.

If you must have 40m cut it and create an extension rope of it instead, it'll go around snatch blocks nicely enough. Works for me.

[Owl]

jonesfam,

The attached link (which is to a manufactures website) might be useful as it includes a link to a recent "4wd Action" mag winch comparison test that could give you some help.

Avenger 4x4 Accessories (http://www.avenger4x4.com.au/)

Will not help withe ability to fit in an ARB bar but seems like a few have give advice on that already.

George

I have an Avenger 9.5T fitted in an ARB bar on my D3. I selected this over the TJM (and similar) winches because of the external brake.

[clubagreenie]

The Tigerz (is the only one to) use a electromechanical brake also external to the drum.

My new dilemma is do I keep the Tigerz 12lb'r or put the Warn high mount I just got (and am rebuilding) on the D2? Then keep the Tigerz for next project, use for a rear mount or sell?

[Owl]

The Tigerz (is the only one to) use a electromechanical brake also external to the drum.

My new dilemma is do I keep the Tigerz 12lb'r or put the Warn high mount I just got (and am rebuilding) on the D2? Then keep the Tigerz for next project, use for a rear mount or sell?


My mistake - I lumped the Tigerz in with a bunch of imported winches with various brand names. I'll edit my post!

[101RRS]

20m because:

a) it's cheaper than 40
b) easier to get on the drum
c) allows some pulling at high fleet angles
d) less turns on the drum means you need less power
e) in the bush if you pull out all 40m it's a pain to put away properly. Easier to use 20m and straps. Imagine the situation....dark, driving rain, 40m of rope out on a muddy hill and you're trying to wind it back on right and it must be just right otherwise it won't fit. No thanks, with 20m you can get it on any which way and sort it out when you have time.

And carry extension straps/rope anyway if you need extra length.

If you must have 40m cut it and create an extension rope of it instead, it'll go around snatch blocks nicely enough. Works for me.

20m is just too short in most circumstances, particularly if you have to double up. Most electric winches have 28m and that is too short. Currently I have about 50m on my 101 (can go to 60m) and I have had to use the winch extension strap on most of my recent winching efforts.

Garry

[clubagreenie]

Even with dragging the extra length around, I'd rather respool 40m that be reconfiguring straps every 10m.

[rovercare]

The Tigerz (is the only one to) use a electromechanical brake also external to the drum.

My new dilemma is do I keep the Tigerz 12lb'r or put the Warn high mount I just got (and am rebuilding) on the D2? Then keep the Tigerz for next project, use for a rear mount or sell?

Keep the 8274!

[LowRanger]

I can also vouch for the TDS,I have had my TDS12 for quite a while now and have used it to haul a lot of people,and have used it when others have stopped working due to overheating and have had no problem.I run Dyneema rope,and the most you will spool on a typical low mount winch is 30mts,but I also have a 20mt Dyneema winch extensionThe TDS winches come standard with sealed solenoids,something most of the cheaper winches don't,even though some advertise that they are,and even the Warn winches don't come standard with sealed solenoids,and need updating to Albrights or similar. If you are only ever going to use the winch very occasionally then one of the cheaper winches should be ok,if you intend to travel a lot,where you are more likely to have to use the winch,then buy something that will do the job.There is nothing worse than being stranded when the winch stops working,and thinking that you should have spent a couple of dollars more and saved on having to spend a lot more in the future.

Wayne

[jonesfam]

I have instructed the Old Girl to buy the Tigerz with 25 meters of synthetic rope.
I might hit her up for a new recovery kit to go with it, the old one is fairly tired from lack of care & maintenance.

So, do I have to have it fitted or could I do it?
Jonesfam

[Owl]

I have instructed the Old Girl to buy the Tigerz with 25 meters of synthetic rope.
I might hit her up for a new recovery kit to go with it, the old one is fairly tired from lack of care & maintenance.

So, do I have to have it fitted or could I do it?
Jonesfam


Fitting a winch is not rocket science, but I believe you will need to remove the bull bar to fit it. If this doesn't turn you off, then go for it!

[Owl]

The Tigerz (is the only one to) use a electromechanical brake also external to the drum.




I've just been surfing. Tigerz internet site specifications for 12,000lb, 10,000lb, & 9,000lb winches state:


Braking Action Two-way Automatic In-The-Drum

Tigerz11.com.au (http://www.tigerz11.com.au/winches.html)

I know the 4WD Action test report stated differently, but you would expect the manufacturer / importer to know. I'm confused!! Does anyone here know for sure?

Ian

[roverfan]

I'd never trust a cheap Chinese winch to save me or my family, Warn all the way tigerz are junk.

[roverfan]

Buying an expensive vehicle then cheeping out on a vital piece of equipment like a winch makes no sense to me.

[CaverD3]

It was discovered that some of the chinese ones did not grease the gears and it was found if you packed them with grease it lasted a lot longer.
Cheap chinese is ok for occasional use but not if you are going to be regularly winching.

[clubagreenie]

Tigerz are far from cheap by comparison to some others. And while not the fastest, coolest running etc, like anything it comes down to how it's treated. The 8274 I just bought was only $300- because the guy was a tool and "burned out the motor mate, I'll cost a thousand to fix that". New set of brushes and off it went.

[jonesfam]

It will be occasional use. I think I have used the hand winch about 3 times & the winch on the work Tojo didn't get used for 12 months before we got stuck at the dump.
So I would expect that it may be used once a year.
Then again having a winch & 17" Coopers might make me more adventurous.:D
Jonesfam

[NomadicD3]

Hey Jonesfamily, Just a quick note in regards to dyneema ropes, makes sure you keep it as clean as possible particularily if you are using it in sand as the sand can get inside the outer layers of the rope and will chaff through the internal syntheic threads especially under heavy loads. The real issue is that a visual inspection shows no outer signs of wear but can part whilst in use. We've actually stopped using dyneema for this reason, {WA has alot of sand:D}at least with wire a visual inspection is easy.
NB. I'm not saying don't buy it just look after it as for occasional use it'll be fine.

[disco4now]

Hi Jonesfamily,
I have the Tigerz11 12000lb single speed winch on a D4. I installed it myself so it can be done. It comes with dyneema rope and somtimes with some accessories depending on what the current ad in 4*4 mags is saying. I got my via ebay from a 4x4 place in Victoria with no issues. Not hard to install after you have done it, but a bit of a worry you might be wasting your $845 bucks before you do it. I just though I was having it so I could say I had one, but I might be still on the CREB track if I did not have it. That was a good day! Tree trunk protector, winch extension strap, dyneema rope, got them all out of their shrink wrap that day. Also used the driving lights as it was dark by the time we got out of there and got back down the Bloomfield track. Salesman was right again, never know when you need good lights!


The areas to consider.

1. Physically mounting the thing.
I managed to get mine mounted without taking the ARB Bar off. Had to lower the holes about 3cm to miss the body work, but means I can get it on an off without taking the ARB Bar off. A useful thing I got off another forum is to cut heads of some 3/8 bolts to put in place temporarily to help position the winch and stop the nuts falling out as you try to put it in place. Once in place just unscrew them one at atime and put the real ones in.
The bit of aluminium was my template to locate where to drill the new holes.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=39868&stc=1&d=1317895861

I mounted the control box flat like this, just removed the little angle bracket.
http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=39869&stc=1&d=1317897160

2. Offset Fairlead Hawse and dyneema rope.

This is the aluminium thing that rope goes thru. The one that comes with the winch is what is seen in Old Salts picture. I put an offset one on as below. I think this gets the rope in a better position in relation to where the drum is. Old Salt might be able to comment of his. If you want to do this negotiate the swap as you buy the winch as its $90 after.i.e get it instead of the normally supplied one.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=39866&stc=1&d=1317894574

I don't leave the rope on the winch. I successfully put it on when I needed it when I got stuck on the CREB track on recent Cape York trip.

What I did was file the sides off grub screw on winch drum that holds the rope, and also slotted the eye in the end of the rope so I can push it though the fairlead hawse and hook it up when I need it.(Put a bit of loctite on the grub screw so it goes nowhere)
Also you can give it a bit of a wind to check its still going with worrying about the rope. Have read somewhere giving a bit of a wind it good maintenance.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=39867&stc=1&d=1317895202


3. Rotating the gearbox on the winch
You will need to rotate the gearbox about 3 holes worth of the 10 holding it on to get it around about 108' so it in the correct place.
This uTube shows how to do it.

Tigerz11 12000lb Gear Box Turning 2009 Winch - YouTube

4. Wiring the electrics.
This is pretty straight forward. The control box has 3 short cables, colour coded red,black and yellow from memory. These go to three terminals on the winch with matching colours. The long red cable on the control box goes to the battery. The extra long black cable goes from the earth point near the battery to the winch case. They were all the right length and did not have to change any of them. The ones up to the battery/earth point I ran in some conduit up past the windscreen washer bottle.
You can see here how I connect to the battery. The black thing with the grey tape unscrews to isolate the power to the winch. You screw it up to give power to the winch. It is supplied as part of the winch.
Its a bit dirty in there, have not cleaned it up since being to cape York and back.
Only other wire is a small gauge black wire they goes from the winch case to the control box case to make sure it is earthed.

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/attachment.php?attachmentid=39865&stc=1&d=1317893899

Hope this is helpful, a bit of payback for all good stuff I have gotten off here.



Regards,
Gerry

[jonesfam]

Disco4now
Thanks so much for your very good post & instructions.
I think I will see if I can fit it myself, partly for the experience & partly because it would be cool to do.
The other factor is I would have to wait till after the wet to have someone else fit it. The roads are usually closed here by then.
Thanks again.
Jonesfam