Shopping Bag Ban in the ACT

[101RRS]

The current ACT Labor government needed the support of the Greens after the last election and one of the deals done was to phase out plastic shopping bags. This kicks in from next month for the whole Territory.

Now there is no doubt that these shopping bags as used now are not good for the environment but they are normally used more than once before being disposed of and research has shown that because of this reuse, other higher grade plastic use is reduced - ie use shopping bags for rubbish vs specialist high grade plastic rubbish bags - shopping bags break down in UV light (sunlight) within a couple of months (thousand years when buried) but high grade plastics take years even in full sunlight.

In the ACT we will all have to buy those "green" shopping bags to use which are an even worse environmental issue - most will be disposed of after a "few to quite a few uses" due to loss, dirt, damage and do not have a lifetime of use as the Greenies would have us believe. When disposed of, these bags are a real environmental disaster.

Working in Natural Resource Management for a number of years I have read a lot of reports and reviews on the use of plastics in these circumstances and the whole story is never published - like the first major review in Ireland quite a few years back that showed that shopping bags could be banned but there is a direct correlation in the increase in high grade plastic bags.

I certainly accept that plastic shopping bags are a blight but I wish the ACT government, instead of banning them introduced legislation requiring the composition of the bags be changed so that they "biodegraded" in say 1 or 2 weeks - this is possible for minimal additional cost where at the point of sale these new bags are exposed to extreme levels of UV light that sets off a chemical reaction in the bag and it self destructs - this technology already exists.

Just think how many "green" bags are going to be bought for a spur of the moment purchase and then thrown away when no longer required. I really do not think this is the solution to the problem.

Garry

[digger]

Nation urged to follow SA bag ban - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2009-05-04/nation-urged-to-follow-sa-bag-ban/1671386)

you may be surprised we changed in 2009 and at the time I thought it stank but now I reckon its OK, you get used to it quicker than you think and the bags usually end up stuffed inside another in boot/back of car ready for when you go shopping etc... also used lots for carrying fruit/clothes/toys etc etc etc (you name it! ) You'll find these bags given away as promo bags for govt departments, businesses etc etc as they will last and be used repeatedly (usually) . (they also do chiller bags etc)

Dont write it off, it may be OK (and Im not a greenie in case anyone is wondering... :) )

something else to consider bring in the 10c deposit on cans, bottle and cartons... makes a huge difference.

[Allan]

What I find nuts is most stuff you buy at the supper market is wraped in plastic anyhow. If they were serious thay would insist on brown paper begs for veg. ect. Its all out of control:(.

Allan

[Graeme]

I was in SA briefly yesterday. Got charged 10 cents for a bag. Who gets the money - the shop or the govt? If the shop then its a rip-off, if the govt then it probably costs more in govt jobs to collect than 10 cents.

[bob10]

Nation urged to follow SA bag ban - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2009-05-04/nation-urged-to-follow-sa-bag-ban/1671386)


something else to consider bring in the 10c deposit on cans, bottle and cartons... makes a huge difference.
I agree, when you see how many bottles, cans, etc., are laying around after being carelesly thrown down around Qld., it makes a lot of sense. Bit of a bummer about the plastic bags though, [ no pun intended :)], I would have to find something else to pick up the dog crap when I take them for a walk, Bob

[bee utey]

I agree, when you see how many bottles, cans, etc., are laying around after being carelesly thrown down around Qld., it makes a lot of sense. Bit of a bummer about the plastic bags though, [ no pun intended :)], I would have to find something else to pick up the dog crap when I take them for a walk, Bob

I agree, making litter a cost to the consumer works. As for doggy doo bags, many parks around Adelaide have little roll dispensers next to a bin. In those areas where the bag posts are frequently vandalised the dog owners generally don't give a **** anyway.

It used to be a feature of the SA countryside for every small-town dump to have hundreds of single-use plastic bags draped around the local fence wires. You hardly see plastic bags littering the scenery now. The "green" cloth bags generally last over a year around our house and our two cars always have a few stuffed in the back. As for paying 10 cents for a compostable bag, gee willikers, WE WUZ ROBBED not. It's worked for SA.

The most common litter around my area now is Mc D****ds takeaway cups and bags carelessly thrown out of bogans' cars, at least they're paper and generally don't last long outdoors.

[Barney2803]

AMEN to all those SA supporters. Yep it was a pain when they went but nowadays, you'd be surprised how much you can actually fit in a new hitech green plastic bag... Like HEAPS!

We had the same issue with the dog poop but we solved it two ways.
1. We are renting a dodgy place while the new place is being built and it has a hammerhead block out the back that the owners wanted to flog off, bad move where we are, and they're major di##heads, so we let him poop anywhere he dam well likes in the back block and the owners will never know until it's too late! No more picking up dog poop for the short term.
2. My dad visits from NSW (yes Gods country) and everytime he brings a bag or 3 full of plastic bags, so our supply never runs out.

We also do Coles online shopping delivered to the door and they incorporate the bag cost into the delivery cost. Yep it's a little more expensive than doing it at the local foodland/IGA but with two carpet commandos like we got, grocery shopping for an hour or two simply don't work!

Anyway, the canvas green bags are also very very handy as the have a solid base and we use them for heaps and heaps of things and rarely chuck them out, but pfffft we got so many it doesn't matter.

You also get used to remembering to grab a couple when you park the car before going into the shops, so leave a few in the boot or glove box.

Enjoy!

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

[Ausfree]

I agree, making litter a cost to the consumer works. As for doggy doo bags, many parks around Adelaide have little roll dispensers next to a bin. In those areas where the bag posts are frequently vandalised the dog owners generally don't give a **** anyway.

It used to be a feature of the SA countryside for every small-town dump to have hundreds of single-use plastic bags draped around the local fence wires. You hardly see plastic bags littering the scenery now. The "green" cloth bags generally last over a year around our house and our two cars always have a few stuffed in the back. As for paying 10 cents for a compostable bag, gee willikers, WE WUZ ROBBED not. It's worked for SA.

The most common litter around my area now is Mc D****ds takeaway cups and bags carelessly thrown out of bogans' cars, at least they're paper and generally don't last long outdoors.
I know it's a side issue to the main topic of this Thread but I find it very annoying that around the MCD****ds takeaways you find litter on the roads thrown from bogan's cars. Just goes to show the mentality of some of their customers. I know McD****ds do their best to clean up around their premises.;)

[p38arover]

you get used to it quicker than you think and the bags usually end up stuffed inside another in boot/back of car ready for when you go shopping etc...

I have a number of the bags in my car and nearly always forget to take them with me when shopping - besides they are too damn hard to get to as they always end up in the rear loadspace which means opening the wheel-carrier then the tailgate.. So I get some more recyclable plastic bags.

[p38arover]

I would have to find something else to pick up the dog crap when I take them for a walk, Bob

Our council gives us hundreds of green bags every few months. They apparently break down quicker and are meant to put the kitchen scraps into before putting it in the green bin. We use those for the dog.

[sashadidi]

Interesting here in NZ the same thing, great arguments over who gets the money and I read a article that said that you can get bio degradable "plastic type" bags made from corn starch (not sure if this is true) but if it is the cynical side of me says the supermarkets here are charging 10 cents for a plastic bag that costs 1.5 cents, pocketing the rest and pretending to care, surely if they really cared and its true about those bio degradable bags (which cost more) they would be selling them instead of plastic. :confused:

[101RRS]

So those who have already been through it find it Ok.

However these green bags will live for ever - no one has touched on the technology that makes the the special plastic bags bio degrade in a few days to a week. To me that is the best solution.

No shopping bags clogging the water ways, no green bags being found by archaeologists in 5000 years time and if they make the new shopping bags last long enough for them to be used for rubbish to go into the next garbage pick up then less high grade plastics being found by those mentioned archaeologists.

Garry

[George130]

Theshopping bags we have get used for lots of things. They get tossed once they have fallen apart. Guess when it happens here I will have to buy more plastic bags to do the same job.

[Bundalene]

I guess we are similar to a lot of others. We have the re-usable shopping bags and they are always in the back of the car - it's just a case of remembering to take them out. But we are getting better at remembering!.

Just as a matter of interest, in almost all communities in Arnhem Land, NT - including Gapuwiyak where we go each year - there are no plastic bags supplied at the shop. Large brown paper bags, like we used to use years ago, are supplied to carry groceries.

Bunnings, Aldi and Target don't supply plastic bags here in NSW.

Erich

[Basil135]

The re-useable bags are great, IF you remember to take them with you.

A recent survey found that the sales of bin liner bags in SA has increased by something like 60% since SA introduced the bag ban.

Personally, I think the ban is pointless. I now buy plastic bags to line the bin, pick up the doggie droppings etc. Apparently, so does a large amount of the SA population.

Oh, and can someone please tell me how the experts that our governments like to quote, can say that a plastic bag will take thousands of years to break down in landfill, when celluloid was only invented (discovered) around the mid 1800's???

Don't get me wrong, I am not a litterbug, and I will do my bit to look after the environment, however, these "facts" that the governments keep sprouting, are usually like a used nappy.

The 10c deposit scheme thou, has worked a treat. Kids, clubs and even adults now collect their cans, bottles & cartons. I even did the calculations on bringing over a trailer full from my brother-in-law in Melbourne to see if it was worth while. :D

[Chucaro]

Aldi's system is good enought to me, no bags at all, just fron the trolley to your car.
I found extrange that are trying to ban the plastic bags for shopping but they have heaps of bags for sale on the shelves. What, the ones that you pay are friendly to the enviroment? :angel:

[Benz]

omg stop your whinging!

you see those horrible plastic bags every! and i hate picking them up. even hate it more when you find a dead animal that has needlessly died a very slow death because it has eaten a plastic bag...
and what for? so you can pick up some dog ****?

[101RRS]

omg stop your whinging!

you see those horrible plastic bags every! and i hate picking them up. even hate it more when you find a dead animal that has needlessly died a very slow death because it has eaten a plastic bag...
and what for? so you can pick up some dog ****?

But at least the shopping bags break down in the sun reasonably quickly so saving more animals from dying - in the future it will be high grade plastic that takes a lot longer to break down killing even more animals.

As I indicated above a small change to the composition of the shopping bag allowing it to self destruct in a short period of time after activation of the process by extreme UV at the point of sale would be the best option of the lot - every one would be happy (except the wowsers) and the animals will be OK and landfill will be happy.

Garry

[Basil135]

But at least the shopping bags break down in the sun reasonably quickly so saving more animals from dying - in the future it will be high grade plastic that takes a lot longer to break down killing even more animals.

As I indicated above a small change to the composition of the shopping bag allowing it to self destruct in a short period of time after activation of the process by extreme UV at the point of sale would be the best option of the lot - every one would be happy (except the wowsers) and the animals will be OK and landfill will be happy.

Garry

This is a very valid point.

There are some shops here, mainly take-aways etc, that supply biodegradable plastic bags, free of charge, to their customers. Now, if a small business owner can afford to do this, why cant the major chains?

And, I know from experience, these bags do break down fairly quickly... call it an unintentional, uncontrolled, unwanted experiment... :angel: