Is it worth restoring?

[Warb]

I've just discovered that a neighbour of mine has a bunch of old Land Rovers stashed in his mechanical dumping ground. Most have been used as farm trucks or shooting hacks until they broke down, then for parts to keep others running.

I've already extracted a SWB 2A (Holden+overdrive) which should be an easy fix (it's probably better than my current SWB 2A project), and have agreed to pick over the other 8 or so 2A's to see what can be salvaged.

However I've also extracted a Series 1, pictures attached, serial number 57661035 that he was just about to take to the scrappie. This is an 86", and looks like the original motor etc. There is also another Series 1 that I haven't looked at in any detail, with a tray (?) and in poor shape with at least the rear brakes in pieces after being scavenged.

So the questions.

1/ Is it worth extracting the second vehicle (front end loader is available) for parts? I have no idea about parts availability for the Series 1, I'd never considered one before yesterday!

2/ Are there any particular things that put a Series 1 beyond sensible economic restoration?

[series1buff]

2/ Are there any particular things that put a Series 1 beyond sensible economic restoration?

Hmmm... welcome to the mad world of series 1's

That's like asking how long is a piece of string . You can sink $10K into one of these things before you know it .

If the chassis and bulkhead are sound, relatively rust free. then yes save it .....

Some parts you just have to obtain from the UK, there is no choice . The best thing is: to find 2 or 3 of them and make up one from the 3 .

[Warb]

The best thing is: to find 2 or 3 of them and make up one from the 3 .

Whilst the one pictured above may be worth saving (I haven't inspected it in detail yet), I very much doubt the other one is.

From you comment, I suppose the best plan is to drag the other one out as well - it's only about 8km up the road. If neither turn out to be worth a restoration attempt, or don't give me enough good parts to combine, I'll return to his original plan of $80 each at the scrap yard.

Should've ignored them and concentrated on the 2A's rather than opening an entire new can of worms!

[series1buff]

Don't want to put you off. If you can weld , panel beat aluminium , have the equipment to fold new aluminium panels up , spray paint, do auto electrical repairs and assemble engines and gearboxes , do carby repairs . Then yes, go for it . You will need new:

Tyres , brake linings, front axle repair kit, probably an engine rebuild , new brake pipes, new exhaust system, new seat covers , new windscreen glass, petrol tank sealed, springs reset, new wheel cylinders and master cyl., rear axle hub bearings and seals , canvas top plus about 1000 hours of labour . :wasntme:

[Dinty]

G'day All, Ditto plus a few more hours, it would be a shame to see them scrapped, but I know only too well that you can't save them all, maybe put it out to pasture if you have the space, some one, some where, some time, will ask "anyone know of any Series 1's and you could be in the box seat for more than $80.00 scrap, I tried to buy a S2A 88"GS for scrap value last year, but the owner was after $500.00 scrap value, I said to them 'good luck' with that, anyway the decision is yours, cheers Dennis:angel:

[Warb]

If you can weld , panel beat aluminium , have the equipment to fold new aluminium panels up , spray paint, do auto electrical repairs and assemble engines and gearboxes , do carby repairs . Then yes, go for it .

I've never tried panel beating aluminium, but the rest of it is no problem.



You will need new:

Tyres , brake linings, front axle repair kit, probably an engine rebuild , new brake pipes, new exhaust system, new seat covers , new windscreen glass, petrol tank sealed, springs reset, new wheel cylinders and master cyl., rear axle hub bearings and seals , canvas top

Out of interest, why new windscreen glass? Is there a requirement for laminated glass, or just an assumption that the existing glass will be fogged?

[Warb]

One more question. Are the wheels the same stud pattern as the 2A's? If they are I'll just put a couple of spares on it (the front tyres have rolled off the rims) and roll it in to a shed. It looks like it would be fun to do, so I'll probably start collecting bits and do it when I've finished the 2A, unless my son remembers we were going to do a Moke for him!

[series1buff]

If you can find an original glass that will pass a roadworthy ... then I would go and buy a tatts ticket , you will win it .:o

The wheels are the same pattern, actually, Morris-Commercial is the same too as are WW2 Bofors gun carriage rims.

For that price I would grab them...if you have the space to store them , try to keep the weather off them. At least you don't travel far to pick em up, unless your neighbour owns 3000 acres .

Mike

[Warb]

OK, decision made. The first one is already here, and I'll get the second one as well. The shed behind the vehicle in the "side view" picture isn't doing much, so it can now become the LR storage facility.....

Which just leaves the question of how many other bits I want to take from the pile of 2A's....

[Dinty]

G'day All,
All of them, and store them for me until I can get there to relieve you of them:p, seriously whatever you think you need, cheers mate Dennis:angel:

[series1buff]

. The first one is already here .

That was quick :clap2::TakeABow:

[digger]

grab any bits that look usable especially straight panels, non rusty bonnet (frames), lights, grills etc etc... diffs etc etc how much room you got?? :)

these chances are slowly disappearing....

[slug_burner]

Things like instrument panels can be hard to come by. Look out for PTOs and governors they also appear to attract interest. Seat frames and harware items to attach doors/tailgates. You can always replace the skins but the hardware is a little more difficult to replicate. Under the bonnet the engine(unless holden)/carbie/distributor/air cleaner/radiator/front grill. If you score an original tool roll you will be lucky as there are few about.

It comes down to how original you want your resto. Some people are happy to slap in any old carbie and air cleaner.

[rayhyland]

If you have the room I would definitely say to grab any old series one, rather than letting them go for scrap. You could probably recoup the $80 by selling one door. At least that way someone is getting something they need, rather than it all getting melted down to make soda cans.

[newhue]

I agree with previous post, grab whatever is on offer. It it means another tip or a bit more cost to get a bigger transport arrangement than so be it.
I remember it took 3 cars to make 1 for my first resto. It was a Mazda and wasn't as old, but more available parts on hand the better. Once your done sell left overs for scrap or parts.

[The ho har's]

I am a tragic land rover collector I will admit:)....If I found a couple of series 1's laying would have them here in a flash, then think about it afterwards on what I would do with them...at least the are saved for someone else if not you to restore:)


Mrs hh:angel:

[Warb]

My name is now firmly on the second vehicle, to be collected after the school holidays. The plan is to fork it straight on to a trailer (there's no way it will be rolling on!) and bring it back. I'll also be spending some time up there extracting the 2A bits that I want.

Whilst the look of the Series 1 is growing on me, I still find the cab to be strangely tall. Is there any reason why the vehicle shouldn't be restored as an open top, like an old Jeep?

[isuzutoo-eh]

Cab bits are simply bolt on, so if you want to go open top, leave the roof etc off, over winter if the weather is foul, bolt it all back on. Best of both worlds!

Good on you for saving them.

[chazza]

Nice find Warb!

Panel beating aluminium is not difficult - in fact I find it easier than steel. Panel beating flat panels I find next to impossible but they are of course easy to make :D

My brother and I have great plans to start making new wing-outers for S1's soonish (I at least will be delayed whilst I fix the Disco; grrr!)

Cheers Charlie

[series1buff]

My brother and I have great plans to start making new wing-outers for S1's soonish (I at least will be delayed whilst I fix the Disco; grrr!)

Cheers Charlie

I have had the same thoughts for some time ..I will PM you with my ideas ..MIKE

Two heads are better than one :eek:

[slug_burner]

I have had the same thoughts for some time ..I will PM you with my ideas ..MIKE

Two heads are better than one :eek:

Are you Tasmanian:eek:

[wrinklearthur]

Two heads are better than one :eek:
Oh No! Mike

You've let the cat out of the bag!

Cheers Arthur

[series1buff]

Well, I do enjoy the odd kangaroo meat sausage or two, but I draw the line at possum meat . That disquailfies me as qualifying as being a genuine Taswegian. :wasntme:

[bulletproof]

After trying to get stuff all over the world for my 1949 restoration and the prices I had to pay for small items, I would grab any early parts and hold on to them.

A flat 4 spoke steering wheel is a $1000
A 20/20 amp meter $300

And the list goes on

I have just wrecked 2 early 51 for parts and sold the rotten chassis for as much as I paid for the whole truck.

So Grab as many as you can is my advice

Cheers Richard

[series1buff]

After trying to get stuff all over the world for my 1949 restoration and the prices I had to pay for small items, I would grab any early parts and hold on to them.

A flat 4 spoke steering wheel is a $1000
A 20/20 amp meter $300

And the list goes on

I have just wrecked 2 early 51 for parts and sold the rotten chassis for as much as I paid for the whole truck.

So Grab as many as you can is my advice

Cheers Richard

Richard

Those would be NZ prices . The early models are fairly common over here . The number of 80" sales in Australia is just under 10,000. The Snowy scheme bought around 2000 1950 models alone, If I am correct. Just around my locality , I know of quite a few 80" models . A few months ago, I missed the 49 model in town here - I kept my eye on it but somebody ELSE got under the radar ! Actually, the free wheel models are easier to find here in my region than the later select type when I think about it. The local agents in town must have sold quite a few. I bought two 1950 parts donors for $150 each 6 years ago... Mike

[bulletproof]

Richard

Those would be NZ prices . The early models are fairly common over here . The number of 80" sales in Australia is just under 10,000. The Snowy scheme bought around 2000 1950 models alone, If I am correct. Just around my locality , I know of quite a few 80" models . A few months ago, I missed the 49 model in town here - I kept my eye on it but somebody ELSE got under the radar ! Actually, the free wheel models are easier to find here in my region than the later select type when I think about it. The local agents in town must have sold quite a few. I bought two 1950 parts donors for $150 each 6 years ago... Mike

Hi Mike
That is not NZ prices. If you go to the "Series one shop" in Victoria you will find a Flat 4 spoke steering Wheel cost $1350 Australian dollars

Cheers Richard

[series1buff]

Hi Mike
That is not NZ prices. If you go to the "Series one shop" in Victoria you will find a Flat 4 spoke steering Wheel cost $1350 Australian dollars

Cheers Richard

Well, some people do like to dream Richard . I could ask $50,000 for a wheel nut if I wanted to :eek:

[bulletproof]

The main Point I was making is that you want to grab as many parts as possible now while they are available because they won't be in the future.

For my 49 restoration I still can't find things I need. I am missing a complete set of Hydrostatic brakes . I am missing a 3/49 wiper motor. a 3/49 regulator and a 3/49 carburettor so parts are getting harder to find.

Cheers Richard

[russellrovers]

The main Point I was making is that you want to grab as many parts as possible now while they are available because they won't be in the future.

For my 49 restoration I still can't find things I need. I am missing a complete set of Hydrostatic brakes . I am missing a 3/49 wiper motor. a 3/49 regulator and a 3/49 carburettor so parts are getting harder to find.

Cheers Richard
hi richard you forgot to mention the speedo and petrol gauge :wasntme: jim

[bulletproof]

hi richard you forgot to mention the speedo and petrol gauge :wasntme: jim
Hi Jim
It is good to hear from you.

Regarding the petrol Gauge. What is wrong with it ? It is the correct number and type and the original with the truck.

The Speedo is a 1948 one for the 4.88 diffs but once again that was the original with the truck. I think Rover were mixing and Matching for a while after they changed to the 4.7 diffs and that is why I kept it even if it does read wrong for the 4.7 diffs.

This is why you think my speedo is wrong because I fitted my spare later 1500 one to test the speedo reading and then went back to the original 48 one

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/10/863.jpg

Here is a photo of the original 1948 speedo and petrol gauge fitted and now being used

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/10/864.jpg

By the way. What do you charge for a Flat 4 spoke Steering Wheel ? I have people from Europe asking me to repair theirs.

Cheers Richard

[russellrovers]

hi richard you forgot to mention the speedo and petrol gauge :wasntme: jim
hi richard you got me wrong on the gauges iwas talking of the cost of replacing them ps i have 3 flat steering i was going to restore they are easy restosregards jim :wasntme:

[Warb]

Following the advice above I have just collected another pair of Series 1's.

One has a 6 cylinder motor and no gearbox etc.

The other seems largely complete, but has doors with no external handles, and the rear edge of the door slopes backwards. The side lights (or whats left of them) were on the bulkhead, which has no vents. I'm guessing its old!

Now I have four!

[tom the pom]

Following the advice above I have just collected another pair of Series 1's.

One has a 6 cylinder motor and no gearbox etc.

The other seems largely complete, but has doors with no external handles, and the rear edge of the door slopes backwards. The side lights (or whats left of them) were on the bulkhead, which has no vents. I'm guessing its old!

Now I have four!


If it has no vent panel, it could be quite an old 80", here in australia the vent panel was droped in favor of the openin vent panel in mid 1949, if you can find any chassis numbers that would be interesting. either on the little plate on the near side of the firewall, in the engine department, or if that is missing it on the near side enging mount on the chassis.

[The ho har's]

Following the advice above I have just collected another pair of Series 1's.

One has a 6 cylinder motor and no gearbox etc.

The other seems largely complete, but has doors with no external handles, and the rear edge of the door slopes backwards. The side lights (or whats left of them) were on the bulkhead, which has no vents. I'm guessing its old!

Now I have four!


No door handles, door slops backwards, sidelights on bulkhead...

Congratulations you have found yourself a very early series 1 80":D

want to sell it to me:D

Mrs hh:angel:

[Warb]

Having unloaded the new machines, I have a number that CALVIN does not recognise. The old sloped door vehicle has a plate in the engine compartment on the passenger side of the firewall that states

"Car Number 06108468"

as well as some patents blurb.

Any ideas?

[JDNSW]

Having unloaded the new machines, I have a number that CALVIN does not recognise. The old sloped door vehicle has a plate in the engine compartment on the passenger side of the firewall that states

"Car Number 06108468"

as well as some patents blurb.

Any ideas?

1950 basic models should start 061 or 0611(CKD) but should have a prefix either R or L for right or left hand drive according to James Taylor. Number of digits is correct. That would fit with the other details mentioned. At this stage of production I would not guarantee the prefix always got stamped - in fact John Smith does not mention it.

John

[Warb]

More details.

The inlet manifold has 4 branches.

The transfer box has the "normal" two levers and a push knob (does this mean late 1950 after the freewheel system was dropped, or that the drivetrain has been replaced?). Between the seat and the gearlever is a hinged flap to access what looks like a filler (much dirt and rubbish in here!)

The grille is of flat metal mesh (woven) with holes for the headlights.

The passenger guard is one piece, but the driver side has a seam as per the post 1954 Series 1, with holes where a light/reflector was mounted.

Is there anything else I should look for to confirm its year?

[wrinklearthur]

Hi Warb

If original, the radiator should have a disk about the size of a ten cent piece, soldered on the top tank, across from the radiator cap.

The month and year of manufacture of that radiator, is stamped into the disk face.

Cheers Arthur

[JDNSW]

More details.

The inlet manifold has 4 branches.

So did all Series 1 unless I am mistaken!

The transfer box has the "normal" two levers and a push knob (does this mean late 1950 after the freewheel system was dropped, or that the drivetrain has been replaced?).

The yellow knob came in (1949) before the freewheel was dropped - have a look at the forward extension of the transfer case - if it is in one piece and looks pretty much the same as it did up to the end of S3 production, it is selectable four wheel drive. If it has a join and change in size of the housing part way along, it is free wheel constant 4wd.
Should have been freewheel from the serial number, but the transfer case is not necessarily the original!
Between the seat and the gearlever is a hinged flap to access what looks like a filler (much dirt and rubbish in here!)

All Series 1 (and possibly Series 2) had an access hatch for the gearbox filler and dipstick.

The grille is of flat metal mesh (woven) with holes for the headlights.

Correct for 1950, I think

The passenger guard is one piece, but the driver side has a seam as per the post 1954 Series 1, with holes where a light/reflector was mounted.

Sounds like a replacement guard!. Not unusual.

Is there anything else I should look for to confirm its year?


The chassis number is all that is needed, but you should look for this stamped on the engine mount as suggested - the bullkhead and/or the tag with the number on it may not be original.

John

[Warb]

John (or anybody else!)

Just to try and avoid wire brushing half the chassis, when you say "the near side engine mount" do you mean the actual protrusion from the chassis to which the rubber block is attached? Or the chassis itself in that area? And, because the vehicle is in long grass and it's snake season, to avoid any needless crawling underneath the vehicle, do you happen to know which way the number faces (do I need to be in front, behind, above, below etc.!).

[JDNSW]

John (or anybody else!)

Just to try and avoid wire brushing half the chassis, when you say "the near side engine mount" do you mean the actual protrusion from the chassis to which the rubber block is attached? Or the chassis itself in that area? And, because the vehicle is in long grass and it's snake season, to avoid any needless crawling underneath the vehicle, do you happen to know which way the number faces (do I need to be in front, behind, above, below etc.!).

It should be on the top of the actual protrusion from the chassis, but I think it is on the RH engine mount. Unfortunately at that stage of production things were not necessarily well organised, and I would not be at all surprised if it were somewhere else! (Saw my second snake of the season yesterday!)

John

[123rover50]

If its an 80" it is on top of the short LH engine mount that is welded to the chassis. It can be read from over the mugguard from the LHS and is right beside the rubber. It may have 4 digits before it which is the build number. Ignore those. Some 50,s did not have the R in front so just start with the 061 etc. If its not there some knockdowns had them stamped along the top of the chassis and again I have one I cant find a number anywhere.

[digger]

Richard

Those would be NZ prices . The early models are fairly common over here . The number of 80" sales in Australia is just under 10,000. The Snowy scheme bought around 2000 1950 models alone, If I am correct. Just around my locality , I know of quite a few 80" models . A few months ago, I missed the 49 model in town here - I kept my eye on it but somebody ELSE got under the radar ! Actually, the free wheel models are easier to find here in my region than the later select type when I think about it. The local agents in town must have sold quite a few. I bought two 1950 parts donors for $150 each 6 years ago... Mike


SLIGHT THREAD DEVIATION... :)

I need virtually all the front of an early 80!!
I have a holden engine, late radiator support fitted to my '49.

Need radiator support, @ correct period engine, and front guards... (mine has some from an 86") so if you do come across some of these feel free to PM me..

Cheers
Digger


end of detour... thanks

[Warb]

Saw my second snake of the season yesterday!

As the friend who "found" this Series 1 and it's owner were leaning on it having a chat, the farmer pointed at the ground between them and said "now you just behave yourself". My friend was confused, but then looked down and watched a brown snake slowly uncoil itself and slither away!

At this point I can't see any numbers on or around the front passenger side engine mount, and the driver side mount is hidden by other parts. However there is a great deal of dirt and old paint etc. so there might be a number in there somewhere, but it will have to wait a while!

There is, however, a brass disc on the radiator, with a large 2 in the middle and a small 50 underneath. From what Arthur said earlier I imagine this means the radiator was made in February 1950. So the number on the bulkhead and the radiator agree!

I've now learned that the Coke bottle wired to the windscreen was the "fuel tank" to gravity feed it when it was shown with the engine running at a clearing sale 15 years ago, after which is was never touched. However my trusty starting handle tells me that the engine isn't seized!

And pouring diesel in the bores of a '59 Series 2 I picked up at the same time has unstuck that motor, so it's spinning freely too! It had been driven in to a shed many years ago, so I suspected it had just glued up in the bores.

But now I must spend a few days farming..!