101 Club - UK

[101RRS]

Information for 101 Owners.

I have been a member of the 101 Club in the UK for a few years and found their forum quite good and like most people was happy to provide information and accept information given.

Being on the other side of the world, the main attraction of the club is access to its parts - however I never found the service to be particularly good and I prefer to pay a little more and get good service (they still owe me parts after 2 years and I have given up on them - but did pay 2 years ago). As a result, for 2011/2012 I decide not to renew my membership.

I just went to the 101 forum and there is announcement that the 101 club has decided to allow non Club Member registered users "read only" access for the main areas - no longer can non members post.

101 club • Login (http://www.101club.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5311)

While I appreciate it is their forum and they can do what they want - it is not the most forward looking decision and in the long run will possibly damage their membership and knowledge base. Non members can still search posts etc but not contribute to discussion.

Garry





101 club • Login (http://www.101club.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=5311)

[Mick_Marsh]

Fair point.
Would you like this posted up on their forum?

[101RRS]

Fair point.
Would you like this posted up on their forum?

No thanks - I have sent an email to the Secretary expressing my concerns.

Cheers

Garry

[stuee]

I've read the various posts on there about difficulties obtaining parts, and have been very hesitant myself when it comes to ordering parts from them. Most are available from vendors like John Craddock so I will leave only specialised items that no one else has to the club, if I ever need them.

[Sleepy]

I am still waiting on parts, but gave Darren an email (well 3 in fact) and he says they are on the way. Sounds like they have a big demand and Darren does it all in his "spare" time.
I always wonder if they (we) would be better served by investing some money into the parts section (ie: pay someone part time to despatch the orders - 10 to 20 hours a week?), I am sure they'd (we'd) recover the costs. Set up a decent web order form and the thing would virtually run itself (like the LRSERIES web site)

Yes seems a good technical forum and seems unusual to allow only members to post. Not sure why they (we?) made that decision, it was apparently at the AGM.

[101 Ron]

I managed to put up a post and pointed out the possible draw backs of restricting it.
see what happens ?

[101 Ron]

They wiped the post and it last about 30 mins.

[101 Ron]

I am think they can stick there little club where it hurts.
I have given freely information about, lockers, LPG conversions, on board air, steering, overdrive fit up and parking brake mods.( I checked my old posts)
The poms suffer from a lack of real life off road useage of these vehicles and lack some of the lessons we have learnt
This weekend my 101 mixed it on and off road with modern 4wd vehicles doing 800 km and cruising at 100kph for hour after hour up hill and down dale
It cost me some light globes as the filaments broke with the rough road viberations and the front diff pinion oil seal due to the continous high tailshaft rpms.
I dont think they would strike those problems too often and get there 101s performing like ours in the distances we have in Aust or they have the real off road work for them.
I am currently PM a bloke from that site about links to this one on how to fit the ARB diff locker.
How fair is that.
It is the last time I help any one from that part of the 101 world.
I hope other aussie members here if they are a member pull the pin on it.
I would have considered membership in the future if I was in a real pickle for parts, but so far locally produced stuff or ex aust army parts have come though.
Ron
.PS I will not be letting any of my winch cable/wide wheel=tyre info out to them , they can sort it out themselves....if they so clever.

[Sleepy]

Ron,
They (ptsteer) moved your post to another thread where others (incl Mick) have been avidly posting their disagreement with the change.
http://www.101club.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=5301&start=40
I will write directly to the comittee, it seems posting is only upseting the forum mods.
It seems 101 club voted to change this at the 2010 AGM and it took them nearly 12 months to implement the change.
Bit hard to get to an AGM if you are O/S.....I wonder how many members are O/S?:mad:
Seems an arse about move IMHO, you should encourage forum member to join. Rather than penalise them for not.:angel:

Maybe we need a South Pacific Sub Unit (Chapter?) of the 101 Club....:D

[bobslandies]

Hi Ron,

Ask them to remove all your posts. See how that goes down with them.

Bob

[101 Ron]

Have done.
Just to show I have got the s###s I will join AULRO when I find some spare money .....what its worth.
This site AULRO is one of the best friendest I have ever been posting on and the knowleage and help is great.
ron

[ptsteer]

Hi just thought id drop by as Ron was kind enough to give me the link. I thought id clear up a few questions you may have with regards the club although i know some of you being club members still have access the current discussion. Im not here to stir up or enrage just to act as a contact for the club & provide imformation first hand.

The forum moderators are all committee members.

Posting isnt upsetting the moderators, they are doing a fair job of redirecting(rather than deleting) any opinions expressed.

As club secretary i am able to pass on any views to the full committee, or required person, that are neccessary

The proposal to change the forum access rights was voted on by the full paid up club membership at last years AGM. Technical & personal problems were responsible for the delay, which through pressure brought by areas of the membership came into action recently. Ive tried to give a fair right to reply, as well as support the change as it needs to succeed or would be pointless changing it in the first place. It will be reviewed at some stage, but only after a fair time allowing for things to settle.Ive also posted relevant imformation of forum/club numbers to allow justification of the decision & how hard it will be to overturn at present.

If anyone has any further questions then ill be happy to answer them.

[101RRS]

All the club has done is unnecessarily alienated a number of people who have contributed more than their fair share through the forum - whether they are members or not. It is not the way to grow your club.

The way to do it is you did previously - open areas and areas for members only is the way to do the forum.

As far as the AGM in 2010 - I was a member then (and was until a couple of months ago) I certainly did not participate and was not aware of the outcome but I appreciate that was probably my fault through not reading the agenda and minutes - but the decision certainly did not get a lot of visibility in the forums at the time.

As a result of this decision I would expect your international membership to grow at a slower rate than it did previously but then who knows - the main attraction of the club for international 101 owners was the forum - parts less so due to ongoing issues that the club seems not to want to address - simply it is not reliable or service so I now buy most of may parts locally or from commercial businesses as you know you will receive what you have ordered within a reasonable time frame.

I certainly respect the right of the club to do what they want, but to block comment from those this decision can impact is basically censorship. You have allowed "registered users" to introduce themselves but the club should also have one section that allow registered users to post threads on this topic - maybe the club membership would then understand how this decision is actually going to be detrimental to the club.

As mentioned, maybe the people who over the years contributed to the knowledge base and are not now members but are still registered users, should be asked if they want their posts removed - afterall the club seems to think non members are leaching on the club forum when in fact from my observations the opposite is the case - non members have contributed to the information base in the forum and brought a wider perspective to 101 ownership. Most UK based 101 owners seem to be locked into doing things as they have always been doing things and have their views widened by international input - of course the same applies the other way around.

Off my box now.

Garry

[ptsteer]

As secretary i have given a right to respond through me.

101 club • View topic - Wanted ....access to the forum (http://www.101club.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=5305)

This was purely to allow anyone who didnt think the club action wise to post to club members. Yes it was censorship but was designed to control reponses & keep order, but not alter the text or meaning in any way. There are club members who also feel it was a bad decision, but one that was made with good intention.

I acknowledge the spares operation isnt as good as it should be & this is mainly because of volumes, technical issues & personal problems, but now we have solved a few of these online ordering is being worked on as a priority to rectify the situation. There is very little profit margin on parts to keep prices low, so no funds to pay "staff" as its all done voluntarily. Online ordering will ease pressures & after which it can be looked at again.

One aim of the club is to remanufacture parts to original specification. This is not cheap as large numbers are quite often needed to make an order. The club therefore relies on membership subscriptions to both fund this & keep the club going. There arnt many landrover clubs,if any that have the spares supply that the 101 club has & when working prpoerly should be fairly efficient worldwide.

I recently quoted membrship figures in club decussion. (End of year is normally about 500) My conclusions are to date that 114 paid up members out of 276 arnt even on the forum. 162 are on the forum. 188 are on the forum but havnt renewed. One main gripe in the membership is "why should i pay my membership when i can get most things for free" Looking at the figures then it does seem a large part of the club are moving in that direction which isnt supporting the club in its aim at all.

There are lots of arguments either way & it will go on for a long time im sure, but for the present the club membership has decided to restrict forum access & thats what has been implimented.

There are a lot of people with 101 knowledge, for which the forum is a great way to exchange & store for future use. There cant be any difference though between suppliers & recievers as we all give & takeat some stage. There also shouldnt be any difference in the way its all funded either, so in 10 years time & you want the specific part craddocks & the rest no longer have, yet the club has then it will be available to all, the ones paying membership now & the ones paying in the future.

I see investing in the 101 club by membership subscriptions, will allow me access to the parts when i need them, not neccessarily this year, & to know that if i need help then there are a fellow band of enthusiasts ready to help. I give freely, not counting the cost, in the hope the3 101 will outlast me & have a rosey future. £30 is half a tank of lpg, takes me about 100 miles, hardly a vast sum to secure the future, each year.

Some of this is a personal view, the facts are the facts. I hope this helps to understand the bigger picture.

[Sleepy]

Thanks for posting up the info ptsteer.


One main gripe in the membership is "why should i pay my membership when i can get most things for free"

Aulro does not have a parts or a regular magazine.....many of us "subscribe" because we want to see aulro survive. We dont begrudge those that dont subscribe, but it is amazing to see how many subscribe once they see how helpful this place really is.

One suggestion - Use automatic renewal - I have an automatic subscription renewal here and this avoids my temptation to put the renewal off.

I guess, being new to 101's, there only a relatively small number of 101's and therefore only a limited membership you will attract.

It will be great to see the spares section become more streamlined. I have been exchanging emails with Darren (nice bloke..... for a pom:p) and I am sure he is trying bloody hard. It would be great if the club could make it easier for him.

Paul

[ptsteer]

Darren is a great bloke, who has worked hard for many years in the spares. It is a victim of its own success with a turn over of just under £67,000 last year whilst £47,500 in 2009. The committee is working hard to help & improve the system but like all change its hard going as people quite often prefer the old ways not modernisation & it takes technical know how.If the right people arnt available then it stalls, as simple as that. We are making efforts to make it work for everyone worldwide, & it will require patience, with the aim that you purchase spares online just the same as everywhere else, this year & for many years to come.

There will always be mistakes, errors etc because noone is perfect, but as a club we are trying to show transparency in the way things run, which is why im quite happy to listen as well, as give our membership chance to view your opinions.

Automatic renewal would be a good idea, ill bring that up with the rest of the committee. We are tightening up on renewals as in previous years it was often 6 months or more before people eventually renewed, sometimes not even bothering as they were still getting everything. Thank you all for listening.:)

[ptsteer]

I should add also that there were only 2600 (roughly) 101's ever made so it is a rather restricted audience, hence why the spares remanufacturing is & is going to be a very important aim of the club. That along with the magazine (several £1000 an issue), is why the subscription is higher than normal & its most important to continue at as high a membership level as possible, after all 10 stainless steel tanks require £4000 to put them on the shelf..

[Sleepy]

Cant dispute anything you have said ptsteer and understand the reason for the clubs change in policy.

I am pretty keen although still a new member. For me the value in membership is not just parts but knowledge. I am concerned that exluding valuable input (like Ron's) will only restrict the knowledge base. {Luckily I know where to find him:D;)}

Being new, I am not sure on the procedure but I'll see if I can get together my thoughts and put them in a working paper for the committee to consider.

[ptsteer]

All input/new ideas are welcome. I can post submissions for a full committee to evaluate. I can also submit proposals from club members to the AGM, for consideration by the committee & club members present. Any ideas worthy of a club vote can then be actioned through the sixstud magazine.(being the most cost effective way of doing it)

As a club member your opinion is valued. If you are not a club member then i can convey your opinions to the club, but they wont in anyway carry the same weight as a paid up club member obviously.:)

As for losing people like Ron, then although a loss, one has to remember "You cant please everyone, all the time!". We expect to lose a few, & already the signs are that we are gaining a few too, so if you have the same 101 desires as i have then please jump on board too!

[Reads90]

Darren is a great bloke, who has worked hard for many years in the spares. It is a victim of its own success with a turn over of just under £67,000 last year whilst £47,500 in 2009. The committee is working hard to help & improve the system but like all change its hard going as people quite often prefer the old ways not modernisation & it takes technical know how.If the right people arnt available then it stalls, as simple as that. We are making efforts to make it work for everyone worldwide, & it will require patience, with the aim that you purchase spares online just the same as everywhere else, this year & for many years to come.

There will always be mistakes, errors etc because noone is perfect, but as a club we are trying to show transparency in the way things run, which is why im quite happy to listen as well, as give our membership chance to view your opinions.

Automatic renewal would be a good idea, ill bring that up with the rest of the committee. We are tightening up on renewals as in previous years it was often 6 months or more before people eventually renewed, sometimes not even bothering as they were still getting everything. Thank you all for listening.:)

Having know Darren for the last 23 years ( meet him in the RRR and then ran a land rover club for 12 years with his brother Ashley. He is a top and hard working bloke who is a very busy chap. But he is very commited to his 101's and land rovers in general. Even if I do take the Micky out of him for keep buying new V8 landies ( Uk thing )



And having run a club people tend to think that , that is all you do. I had it several times that people who phoned wanted to Know why they had not had stuff 2 days after the applied. They don't realize that you do it for the love and have a real job too.

Ali

[101RRS]

Criticisms of the parts service of the 101 club are not directed at Darren but the process. It just does not work.

Instead of having an inward looking club as evidenced by this decision to close off the forum so limiting the development of the knowledge base and new members, why not turn around and be outward looking - the forum as it was (like most club sites - basic areas open to all and restricted areas for club members - most clubs work this way quite well.

As far as parts are concerned the 101 club is in a unique position to support its finances through parts sales - open it up to registered users as well - current "discounted" pricing for members and a "premium" price for others.

By giving access to sections of the forum and access to "premium" price parts for registered users I am sure membership would grow as would finances. Too much work for Darren - for sure but I am sure assistance in the form of a retired member or hiring a junior to assist would work - there are of course other options.

Garry

[ptsteer]

The parts service will develope & be efficient as it is one of the priority aims of the club, at this time. Darren is the front man & obviously recieves the flack but there is a group of workers under him storing parts, actually posting & packing, all donating time & space free of charge.

Pricing of parts is being looked into, but why charge craddock prices as there then is no reason to join the club???

There are plenty of ideas floating around by non club members it seems, which then asks the question why arnt you in the club supporting & promoting improvements?

If you want change then the first step is always to start it yourself.....:)

[101 Ron]

All I know ptsteer it would have been easier if all this was posted on the UK club site and explained why in detail for everyone to understand.
Regards Ron

[Mick_Marsh]

There are plenty of ideas floating around by non club members it seems, which then asks the question why arnt you in the club supporting & promoting improvements?
At the risk of being improper (which is not my intention), why is this discussion happening on this forum?
I would like to see it on the 101 forum. (For obvious reasons, I can't)
Sorry if I have offended but that is not my intention.

A thought just occurred.
The membership on AULRO has increased as a result of this decision. Although it's a plus for AULRO, I can't help thinking it is the 101 club's loss as the forum members move to other sites.

[Sleepy]

I am more comfortable speaking my mind here. (Still a newbie there!)

[101RRS]

As of yesterday I have removed the site from my bookmarks and have asked to be de registered and to have my posts removed but no response as yet.

I can get what I require here and elsewhere - where I believe my contributions are worthy of consideration.

Aust members of the 101 Club should consider what real value they get for their club membership that they cannot get here.

Garry

[Mick_Marsh]

Aust members of the 101 Club should consider what real value they get for their club membership that they cannot get here.
It's a good point Garry. That goes through my mind each time I renew a membership.

The 101 Club is more expensive than the Mercedes club even with these good exchange rates. The value I get from the Mercedes club is so much more. The Mercedes club can do it as they have a much larger membership base. I even get more value from AULRO which is not surprising looking at it's membership base.

For the foreseeable future, I'll stay with the 101 Club and hope they see the error of their ways.

Peter, How do I put forward a motion to rescind this childish decision?

[ptsteer]

Ive registered on this forum specifically to put the record straight as there seemed to some confusion as to why the changes were made & how the club is run. Ive also given you all chance to ask further questions.

I will also do this on any other forum that invites me to respond, whether deliberatly or by accident.

If you are a club member then you have as many chances as you want to question the decision or ask for further reasoning behind it, if there is something you dont understand as being part of the club gives you that right of opinion.

Every club offers something different depending on its aims, location & number of members, only an individual can decide which clubs are the best for themselves. Ive tried to explain a little bit more of how the 101 club runs in its aims, & what it has to offer.Comparing two clubs generally isnt in my opinion that ideal as there will always be things in one that another wont offer, which will suit one person but not another.

The decision has been made, & will stand. Ive explained in 101 club discussion how it could be overturned but realisticly looking at the numbers & being there to judge reactions of active club members face to face i cant see any change due.

Why is the discussion taking place here? Purely because ive taken time to come here & take part in it. If you are in the club then you can & should post your views in the right place. If you arnt then you dont have many rights to complain about it, on our forum, but please feel free to carry on elsewhere.

We, as a committee are looking at both Rons & Garys request to delete all posts & history on the forum. Initial reactions are that all submissions to the 101 club hosting site then belong to the 101 club. In the interests of all, both guests & club members its deemed better to keep the knowledge base complete rather than start deleting sections leaving them incomplete. Everyone has the option to stop contributing & visiting the 101 club forum as its purely voluntary.

I think ive covered all outstanding points?

[stuee]

I am more comfortable speaking my mind here. (Still a newbie there!)

As a paid member, I just put my thoughts up there and I've only had two other posts to my name. From the discussion on the forum it appears the 101 club doesnt care for how much technical knowledge you contribute, just how many dollars you put forward at the end of the day.

Not really happy with the move at all as the forum is really the only asset I use from the club. As others have said, being overseas members you really cant take advantage of the full club experience.

For comparisons sake, I pay nearly the same amount each year for my AULRO subscription. From that I get local events, a good local second hand parts trade, technical knowledge on both my land rovers and the best bit is that there's no annual meetings to miss!!

[Mick_Marsh]

As a paid member, I just put my thoughts up there and I've only had two other posts to my name. From the discussion on the forum it appears the 101 club doesnt care for how much technical knowledge you contribute, just how many dollars you put forward at the end of the day.

Not really happy with the move at all as the forum is really the only asset I use from the club. As others have said, being overseas members you really cant take advantage of the full club experience.

For comparisons sake, I pay nearly the same amount each year for my AULRO subscription. From that I get local events, a good local second hand parts trade, technical knowledge on both my land rovers and the best bit is that there's no annual meetings to miss!!
And AULRO is not a club.
But, from my observations, it supports many clubs.

[101RRS]

The next 101 Club AGM is on 29 Oct 2011 starting at 10.30am (UK Time). Written submissions close 21 October 2011.

[101 Ron]

I noticed these blokes are still taking information from this site on the there detroit thread.
I am so cranky.
If they were more open in club thinking I would be helping them instead of hating them more.
They have more 101s over there and information/parts yet this little sub site of Aulro seems to get things sorted and helps as friends instead of being so narrow in thinking.

[Mick_Marsh]

Yes.
I thought that was more than a little cheeky.
Their posting rate is down a lot too.
Not a very dynamic forum now.
Sad really. A true example of "Cutting off the nose in spite of the face."

[101RRS]

Since leaving that site I have never been back so have no idea what is happening over there. Did anything come up on this issue at the October AGM?

Oh by they way they are claiming copyright on anything posted up on their forum so in their view they can use information on there as they see fit - hence using older Detroit information.

Garry

[Mick_Marsh]

But Gary, they are linking directly to the AULRO website.

Some time ago, I posted something that upset a few of them. I was sent a few PM's that gave me the impression they wanted me to keep my opinion to myself. In amongst those PM's, there was one that suggested a large proportion of the club were "handbags". I was not familiar with the term, but after recent events, my understanding of the term is becoming more and more succinct.

[Sleepy]

G'day guys,
Yes haven't seen anything about the AGM yet. They'll probably save it for the mag. I must admit i got the detroit thread rolling again, cause mine arrived in the mail. Although most of the useful info is from Ron. To tell the truth I bought the diff based on your positive comments , Ron.:angel:.

Having joined in August when I bought the 101, I hope things improve on the forum, I still come here when I have an issue.

I still will put through a formal request to reopen the forum, just havent got around to it yet.;)

Paul

[Sleepy]

"handbags". I was not familiar with the term,....
Not heard of that one either Mick.
Urban Dictionary: handbag (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php'term=handbag)

I presume it is definition #6;)

[Mick_Marsh]

Not quite Sleeps. The definition I'm beginning to understand aint there.
I typed more but deleted it. I might have upset some of them.
Now that they're linking to AULRO, I must be careful. I don't want another barrage of hate PM's.
Mind you, not all are like that. I've made a few good friends on various UK sites, some of them were or are members of the 101 club..

[Sleepy]

Not quite Sleeps. The definition I'm beginning to understand aint there.
I typed more but deleted it. I might have upset some of them.
Now that they're linking to AULRO, I must be careful. I don't want another barrage of hate PM's.
Mind you, not all are like that. I've made a few good friends on various UK sites, some of them were or are members of the 101 club..

You dont know how much I agree with you Mick.
<<<rant withdrawn>>
Ahhh the internet, you "meet" a helluva lot of great people that you may have never met otherwise. Unfortunately, when you throw out a large net........:angel:

[101RRS]

The definition I'm beginning to understand aint there.
I typed more but deleted it. I might have upset some of them.
Now that they're linking to AULRO, I must be careful. I don't want another barrage of hate PM's.



But Gary, they are linking directly to the AULRO website.

In amongst those PM's, there was one that suggested a large proportion of the club were "handbags". I was not familiar with the term, but after recent events, my understanding of the term is becoming more and more succinct.


Not heard of that one either Mick.
Urban Dictionary: handbag (http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php'term=handbag)

I presume it is definition #6;)

I take the term 'handbag' in this context is a 'hanger on' - someone who takes information but does not contribute - certainly not a term I would apply to Aust members (ex) of the 101 Club.

I have no issues them referencing our posts - we certainly do it with other internet references.

Mick, as far as narky PMs go - that is not allowed on the 101 Forum (and certainly not permitted on AULRO) - if aggrieved I would be reporting the forum administrators demanding action

Garry

[Sleepy]

<<rant part 2 withdrawn>>

[Mick_Marsh]

Garry,
Don't really want to say much as it is possible to link this thread back to the 101 site, but, the term was made in reference to some club members over in the UK, not about any foreigners.

[101RRS]

Mike - you are quite correct - the club decision was not targeted at any one group. Now I was in the club up until Aug this year but did not consider it value for money - if I lived in the UK different.

There was a concern by members of the clicky inner circle that people were using the forum for their own benefit and not joining the club. They perceived these people as handbags - now clearly some people do get info etc but many also contribute - but you know that already - old ground.

I am a member of many club based forums and not a club member and there are no issues - just cannot buy spares or contribute to club business.

Any way as highlighted - it is their club, they can do what they want.

Garry