Project Serenity

[turkeybrain]

Hi all,

It's about time I posted what I've been up to with Serenity, my '62 109". As I'm currently on holidays from Uni (I'm studying mechanical engineering) and quit my job, I've found a lot of free time, so getting Serenity back on the road seems like a good task. Finishing Serenity also means I can move onto Kaylee, my '53 Series 1 80"...

Some before shots...

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/702.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/703.jpg

I've mostly been stripping her off so far, I'm intending to take her back to the chassis to make sure she survives a while longer.

I'm getting sick of the flat head screwdriver heads on the bolts, that combined with rust and square nuts is just painful. As much as I like originality, I'm not nut counter, so they'll most likely be replaced with hex heads. The angle grinder has been getting a bit much of a workout for my liking. The previous owner also liked silicone and paintbrushes. From what we can tell Serenity was orignally white with a pair of red pinstripes down each side, but later in life was brushed green and then somebody added the hideous black camo effect. While I'm OK with people painting things when they start to rust, I'd have preferred it if he'd bothered to treat the rust before painting! It appears they've just gone straight over the rusty parts without doing anything. Suffice to say, it didn't help much, the door tops are completely shot as is the bulkhead. I'm also guessing he had some leaks in the passenger floor at some point, because there's a layer of silicone on EVERYTHING!

The intent is to do her up as a tourer/camper with a bed in the back plus storage space for camping gear. I'd also like to fit a thermofan (I doubt the current fan does anything), dual batteries, a winch, and, if the budget streches far enough (it won't), diff lockers.

When I bought her back in May I was wearing some fancy rose coloured glasses... I completely missed the rust in the bulkhead, something I still regret to this day.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/704.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/705.jpg

The good news is the chassis is far better than I ever imagined, with only minor surface rust that I've seen so far. (Needless to say I've got the roof and tub off so far) These were taken after I took her out and washed her with the Karcher.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/706.jpg


https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/707.jpg

The other good news is the engine seems to be in really nice shape. It starts easily and runs really nice and smooth. I still intend to do some work on it while it's out of the car, but it shouldn't require a full rebuild.

We took a video of her final movements before I completely disable her, it makes for a nice record of how she sounds right now.

Serenity's Last Drive (Before Restoration) - YouTube

My mate Rob (Jawapro) is holding the petrol can for me while I drive. He owns 4 G60 Patrols which he intends to restore, so it's sort of a time swap thing with him working on Serenity and me working on his Patrols once he gets to them.

Serenity has no brakes, with the pedal sitting on the floor full time and the handbrake doing nothing. Last time I drove her I rolled out of control into the clothesline, so I get a bit worried when it comes to rolling backwards and things. It explains the terrible driving displayed here, I swear I'm not normally this bad!

I'll try to keep this thread updated as I do things. Inevitably I'll have plenty of questions to ask too, as I progress. (Mods, would you prefer I keep all my questions in the one thread, or make a seperate one each time?)

Speaking of which, is there any easy way to get a wheel off when a stud has come free and won't pull out? On the front left wheel one of the studs is free spinning and wobbling around (the nut is still holding fast on the stud), but it won't pull free. I can't get my trusty grinder in there to chop off the nut without damaging the rim, but I'm not sure what else to do. Any suggestions?

Oh, there's some more photos in a gallery on my website, turkeybrain's photography (http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/index.php'sfpg=U2VyZW5pdHkvKipkMTFjYzUwZWU3YzAzMDI 1YWJiODliN2MyNzI3Nzk0OA). There's also some of Kaylee hiding on there.

Cheers,

Martin

[Dinty]

G'day All,
I would start by removing the axle cap, remove split pin from castellated nut, undo the 6 bolts that hold the drive flange (depending on whether it is on the front axle, if it's on the rear, leave axle cap insitu just undo 6 bolts and remove axle etc complete)
now back on track, once you have removed the the drive flange, (jack the vehicle up so the wheel spins freely, make it (the Land Rover) safe by chocking the wheels and use a body stand,) loosen the other wheel nuts.
Bend the tab back on the large hex/nut (stub axle) remove the hex nut and locking tab, undo the other hex/nut, remove it, and if your brakes are not dragging on the brake drums, if so back off the cam adjusters, and by wriggling the road wheel it should come free from the stub axle, bringing brake drum and hub all in one go. Don't allow wheel bearings to drop on the concrete, place a potato sack or something to help catch them or have some else help you, no point in making extra work by having to clean n repack the bearings LOL.
I would then try to get the offending wheel stud back into place, and put a heavy tack weld on it, also soak the wheel nut in penetrating oil, use heat from Oxy/acetylene to break the rust grip, hope thats reasonably clear enough for you to understand, cheers mate Dennis:angel:
ps If this is successfull in removing the wheel nut/s, you will need the then get the brake drum off the hub, the screws (Csk 3/8"Whitworth thread) are a P.I.A, you might have to center dot them and drill them out, to separate the hub from the drum,,.

[korg20000bc]

No power in the 'Verse will stop you from restoring this vehicle.
Its a gorram good one.

Top name for you Landy. Treat her right and she'll keep flying.

[turkeybrain]

Good to find another Browncoat on here!

In regards to the stuck stud, it's the front left wheel. It has Warn free wheeling hubs fitted. I'll take a look at them tomorrow and give it a go. Thanks for the advice, it all seems to make sense.

[jawapro]

I'm new to AuLRO and making the required post so my account doesnt get deleted.

I've helped Turkey find, transport, and now strip down Serenity - so I'm very keen to watch this thread as it develops. Sadly I'm at the wrong end of the state to help consistantly, but I do what I can (that's me in the video holding the temporary fuel tank) when I can get down there.

And just to keep on topic, here are some photos of when we picked Serenity up the day Turkey bought her.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/638.jpg

110km down the highway - possibly the fastest she's ever gone.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/639.jpg

She'll be awesome when she's finished.

Browncoats forever!

[korg20000bc]

G'day jawapro,
Where in the state did Serenity come from?
You know your not too far from Land Rover heaven at Loongana? Any parts required for this vehicle are available there.

Keep it shiny.

[jawapro]

Serenity came from Launceston.

What's at Loongana?

[turkeybrain]

She originated up the back of Ravenswood, Launceston. I suspect that may explain her old war wound...

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/637.jpg

I've heard rumours of a place with 50 odd Land Rovers laying dormant, but haven't managed to track it down just yet. Would that be the place at Loongana?

[korg20000bc]

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/1262076-post48.html
I bought my 2a from him. A real gentleman.

[turkeybrain]

A small progress update...

I've been a bit busy with running around to different social occasions over the past couple of weeks, so I haven't managed to get much done. I did manage to get that wheel bearing apart, thanks very much for the clear instructions, Dinty. Other than that not much has happened until today.

I conned Dad into giving me a hand (he wants his shed back eventually as he's got grand plans to restore his '27 Chev 4 truck) and we managed to pull off the front wings.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/146.jpg
Note the rust holes visible in the footwells! It's a worry how much dirt has found a home stuck between joins over the years.

A few more photos of the damage - but I'm not sure they do it justice sadly.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/147.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/148.jpg

I had a look through your thread Korg, it's a nice looking machine you've got there! It's also nice to see a thread with a conclusion for once, too. I've also had a chat to David (thanks for filling in his last name for me) and he's invited me up to have a look for some parts some time in the new year. I'm certainly looking forward to that trip!

Cheers,

Martin

[turkeybrain]

Another progress update.

I've been plodding along slowly, tinkering here and there, pulling bits and pieces off for the past few weeks. I didn't do anything major, but I was slowly making progress. It all came to a head tonight, where I finally removed the bulkhead.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/01/42.jpg

The removal didn't quite go according to plan though. The bolt securing the bulkhead to the chassis on the drivers side has rusted itself solid over the years, A breaker bar, heat and a sledgehammer couldn't loosen it. Thankfully the bulkhead has rusted itself loose over the years, so with a bit of a rock it just broke off the mount.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/01/43.jpg

My apologies for the quality of the photos. I left my proper camera inside so had to use my phone.

I've been told by a friend that the bulkhead is so bad that it's not worth repairing, which I must admit I'd have to agree with, so I guess tearing this part out isn't a big problem. I just need to source a replacement...

The next fun part will be getting the engine out. It doesn't look like too much work (I've been wrong before), but ironically I have to reassemble the wheel bearing so I can shift the motor underneath my fixed lifting point in the shed.

I have no idea what I'm doing, but I sure am having a lot of fun doing it. I'm loving my Landies!

-Martin

Edit: Here's a timelapse from when Jawapro was helping me remove the tub from Serenity, which I should have posted earlier.

Removing the tub from Serenity - YouTube

[turkeybrain]

Another update, followed by a perceived moral dilemma...

We'll start with the update.

With a little bit of fiddling, the engine came out yesterday. I'm getting nice and close to being able to start painting, repairing and reassembling now, which is really nice. I've really enjoyed the project so far, and I'm sure the next part will be even more enjoyable.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/857.jpg

The engine, gearbox and transfer case were all removed as one piece before being lowered onto a wheeled pallet for extra convenience. Dad insisted I should use a drip tray under it too, I can't really blame him for that!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/858.jpg

There's not much left on the chassis now! The stuff down the back is just resting there as storage space is limited.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/859.jpg

Now for the dilemma...

I've been speaking to David Benson in regards to purchasing a replacement bulkhead as mine is terrible. He has suggested that I would be better off buying another vehicle which has got a sound bulkhead and chassis in it, as I would probably end up spending a lot less money on it in the long run, plus it would be far easier to source as the good ones are becoming rare these days. As I suspect some of you would have already noticed, he's got an ex-mil IIA ambulance for sale at the moment. He also mentioned he has another ex-mil engineers car(?) for sale which will be listed in the coming days. He said they're probably just a good service and possibly changing a few seals away from being registerable.

A quick and easy solution to get a working Landy appeals to me, as I'm dying to get to drive one of my Landies, but at the same time I'm torn for a number of reasons. Firstly, I'm kind of attached to Serenity, and I'm really enjoying working on her. To give up the project now would be difficult. That being said, if I do stop working on Serenity, I would still be able to move onto Kaylee, my 80" (or Dad's '27 Chev truck, it would be a race!), which honestly has a little more appeal to me than Serenity. Not that Serenity is unappealing!

The second problem is that I would then own an ex-military vehicle. While that's kind of a dream for me, it's also a big responsibility in my eyes. If I've got a civvy one, if I accidentally do something stupid and break it, while it is the loss of another great old Landy, it's not a loss of part of our nation's military history. I bought Serenity with the intention of using her to tour both the state and potentially the nation in the future, using her off road as she was originally intended. While I'm not the sort of person who thinks bogging a vehicle for kicks is a good plan - I prefer to go places than just play in puddles all day, I would potentially modify Serenity in the future with bigger wheels, lockers, a dual battery system and a winch. I would probably feel a bit bad about making similar modifications to an ex-mil vehicle, and potentially also feel bad every time I hit the undercarriage on a rock off road.

Basically, I'm wondering what other Landy enthusiasts think. Would it be wrong to buy an ex-mil given what I want to do, or would using them for their originally intended purpose, driving off the beaten track, rather than mothballing it, be a fitting tribute to the vehicle? I see this has thread has a lot of views but not too many comments, but I'd really appreciate some input on this one. I'm really not sure what to do.

[isuzutoo-eh]

I had the same dilemma, seeing plenty of ex army Series Landies for sale that I almost bid on. In the end I bought a civvy 2a for the same reasons as you did, so I didn't have to barstardise a military one in my pursuit of adventure. I bought a 2¼ diesel and ancilliaries to put in it, a steering protector bash plate, bigger tyres, Defender rims, driving lights, a comfier seat...
Turns out my civvy 2a has history too-ex NSW Police and in fairly good original nick, so I don't want to damage it if I can help it. I then bought my County for the tracks.

Lets see what some others do: Geoff takes 'THE BOOGER', his ex army S3 GS off road a lot, it hasn't had many modifications done but when driven carefully is still capable. Another formerly active member here Panda used her ex army S3 GS off road with gusto, it has lockers front and rear but still only 7.50R16 tyres. She is probably a harder taskmaster to her Landy than the army blokes were!
Both these ex-army Landies are still rag tops, with original engines, they are scratched, dented and bruised-most of which was from active service. The main thing is neither of these vehicles has been modified in a way that can't be reversed. The unique parts are all there and not modified.
The above examples are both GS (the most basic format) ex army Landies. When you look at the specialist vehicle variants-ambos, workshops, fire tenders etc their usefulness without modifications goes down drastically.

An ambo isn't really much of an offroad toy at the best of times seeing as it has a higher centre of gravity and so much more weight and wind to push with the diminunitive 2¼ petrol. They may have a big interior but without cutting window in the sides they're not so good for using as a camper.
The workshop (Engineer's) Landies have a fairly rare canvas canopy that would be an absolute pain to set up for camping-the rear extends out into a monster sized tent. It'd have to be used as a table top if you didn't want to modify it. You can't fit a standard hard top to one.

I'd personally go another civillian vehicle, even though many of them have history worth saving too.

[wally]

I don't see anything wrong with modifying an ex-mil vehicle as long as those changes are reversible. I certainly don't like to see them bastardised and abused (eg. lots of beach driving by the previous owner in the case of my 2A GS). If I wanted one for touring, camping, playing I'd go civvie. It is nice to see respect being shown for the military Landies.

It is a shame to abandon a project having gone so far. I know how much trouble I would have with that. Personally I would search far and wide for a firewall. Rusty firewalls seem to be the most frustrating part of series Landy restorations. I've spent a fair bit of time out in the arid parts of the country and I've seen a lot of old, abandoned Land Rovers around cattle station rubbish dumps etc. In most cases their firewalls would still be good. There must be many, many good firewalls out there. They just need to be sniffed out.

[The ho har's]

G'day TB,


can't actually see how much rust is in your firewall by the pics..


Have you seen my 'bessie' rebuild thread

http://www.aulro.com/afvb/remlr-projects/105160-mrs-hhs-bessie-112-290-will-alive-last.html

Now that is a serious amount of rust:(:o


Plan and put your mind to it and most things can be achievable;)

As for the ex-mil think about it for now:)

Mrs hh:angel:

[turkeybrain]

Thank you all very much for your input. It's nice to know that what I was thinking is roughly in line with what the rest of the enthusiast community thinks as well. I've decided that I'll continue on with Serenity, as it sounds as if an ex-military Landy won't suit me at this point in my life. I won't rule one out in the future though! It also struck me that I don't need a bulkhead this exact moment. I can probably spend a year looking for one without delaying the project at all.


can't actually see how much rust is in your firewall by the pics..

Have you seen my 'bessie' rebuild thread

I hadn't seen your thread before, but have since read it all. Very impressive progress indeed, in fact it was quite motivating. From the photos I think that my bulkhead is worse, as there is more damage throughout the whole unit, rather than just in the one location. I'll let you judge though. I've gone though and taken a lot of photos tonight, particularly of rusty areas in the bulkhead. I've also taken photos of the chassis, to give everybody a proper understanding of the overall condition of Serenity. I'll attach a few low res pics below, but all the photos I took (there's 94 of them at twice the resolution of the ones attached) can be seen here: Index of /images/serenity (http://www.turkeybrain.com/images/serenity/)

Here's some of the important ones I've singled out.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/743.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/744.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/745.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/746.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/747.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/748.jpg

Thankfully the chassis looks really good.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/749.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/750.jpg

Remnants of the bulkhead I haven't othered removing yet.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/751.jpg

And just because I think it's hilariously dodgey

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/752.jpg

Cheers,

Martin

[korg20000bc]

Dave Benson also has a 2A Ex-Army Panel van in very unmolested condition.
The army only bought, I think, between 30 and 40 of them ever. So, if you wanted to get an ex-military vehicle this would be a highly desirable vehicles.
But, of course, it is a vehicle that should be kept that way and looked after.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/02/659.jpg

[Radical]

Awesome to see the enthusiasm you have for your project, also what you have in mind. I have several landies that I would like to rebuild but not able at the moment, I suffer with chronic disabling pain, one day I will be able I hope,it is giving me many hours of research including meeting up online mainly with other like minded souls. my boy Malcom 8 just came and had a look and said "Dad I love Landies" so I showed him your video of driving yours when you had it hooked up to the can of petrol, he was so wrapped up in it he nearly exploded. "Dad maybe I can learn to drive in one like you did" he mentioned. Stay with the dream, when you get annoyed walk away for awhile and come back later, you will find it's a love hate relationship, all of a sudden you start noticing them hidden in back yards, farms etc. I say live the dream!!!! (Nightmare some times!!) You are really doing a great job in what you are sharing and it's appreciated.
Cheers Konrad

[turkeybrain]

Dave Benson also has a 2A Ex-Army Panel van in very unmolested condition.
The army only bought, I think, between 30 and 40 of them ever. So, if you wanted to get an ex-military vehicle this would be a highly desirable vehicles.
But, of course, it is a vehicle that should be kept that way and looked after.


Thanks for the tip. It looks like it would be a really awesome vehicle, something I'd really like to own in the future sometime. Heck, I'd like to own one now, but finances won't allow me to have too many Landies at this point, so I think I'll just stick with Serenity (and Kaylee). I don't think I'm able to properly care for an ex-military vehicle just yet. Hopefully that day will come soon though!

I'm up the North West (of Tassie, for you mainlanders) at the moment, I've bought an exhaust manifold off David, but he needed to come out to the coast to visit a sick friend, so he dropped it off at his daughters place for me. I was hoping I'd get to go and visit him, but it didn't happen. Maybe some other time!


Awesome to see the enthusiasm you have for your project, also what you have in mind. I have several landies that I would like to rebuild but not able at the moment, I suffer with chronic disabling pain, one day I will be able I hope,it is giving me many hours of research including meeting up online mainly with other like minded souls. my boy Malcom 8 just came and had a look and said "Dad I love Landies" so I showed him your video of driving yours when you had it hooked up to the can of petrol, he was so wrapped up in it he nearly exploded. "Dad maybe I can learn to drive in one like you did" he mentioned. Stay with the dream, when you get annoyed walk away for awhile and come back later, you will find it's a love hate relationship, all of a sudden you start noticing them hidden in back yards, farms etc. I say live the dream!!!! (Nightmare some times!!) You are really doing a great job in what you are sharing and it's appreciated.
Cheers Konrad

Thanks very much for you comment, Konrad, you made my day! Given how much fun I was having yesterday, that's a seriously impressive feat! (I'll explain in a moment...) I really appreciate the feedback, knowing others are enjoying watching me progress is really nice. It's a great joy to bring pleasure to others. Say hi to your son for me, he sounds like an awesome little man! All the best for your recovery, hopefully I'll be able to watch you restore your Landies shortly!

As I mentioned earlier, I'm up the north west, about to head to the west coast camping and exploring. Yesterday Rob (jawapro) and I went part hunting, him for G60 Patrols, me for Series parts. He bought his fifth G60, I bought a reasonable bulkhead, but we've also found another bulkhead which I would describe as good to excellent, which also comes with a complete body, including a nice straight set of parts including a LWB tub, ute canopy and guards. I haven't bought them yet, but I fully intend to. I'm amazed at how easily I've managed to come up with something, given less than a week ago I was thinking about throwing the project away as I doubted I'd be able to source a good one. It's amazing how quickly things all change. Rob makes a big difference though. You tell him you need something, the following day he'll send you an email with about 6 different options. It's very handy.

Once I return I'll probably do a full trip report, as I'm sure many of you will be interested in the photos of Blitzes, Series 3s, G60s, bulkheads, steam engines (already seen all this!) and any other cool stuff we find along the way.

Have a good one!

-Martin

[turkeybrain]

Time I actually told you what I found!

I returned to uni this week, so I expect I'll have a lot less time to tinker in the shed and post update here over the coming months. Ah well, that's the way it goes.

So, the trip itself... As Rob was working on Friday, the plan was for me to head up to his place and we'd try to get away sometime on Saturday. I had also organised to visit my cousin on the way up to check out a growing collection of vehicles I'd kept hearing about. I have to say, it was definitely worth a visit! With a Blitz, a Kombie, Series 3 SWB and a Mini in the shed, I had a ball!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1371.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1372.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1373.jpg

It took me over 9 hours to make what is normally a 3-3.5 hour trip due to a bunch of stopovers. I also detoured through Launceston to check out renovations on an uncle's house, plus inspect an old 80" some friends had found for sale. I really don't need a 3rd Landy right now though, plus the front cross memeber had been replaced, so I left it where it was. (No pics, sorry)

Anyway, Saturday arrived, and Rob had arranged to go and buy his 5th G60 Patrol. Nutter :p Anyway, as the owner had specified a one-day low price, we headed out and collected it.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1374.jpg

It turns out the seller has good taste, owning a Series 3 and a Defender, plus and an excellent collection of interesting piles of rust in a paddock. And he smokes a pipe. I figured that asking whether he had any Series 2A bits would be an excellent idea. Turns out he had a 109 suffix B ute body which he was prepared to part with, as it was only earmarked for scrap. I had a look and told him I'd get back to him as Rob had found another bulkhead which we were planning on taking a look at. My father is also looking for a Commer Knocker to restore, it turns out he has one of those too! It's like a old vehicle supermarket!

We went and checked out the other bulkhead, and we met another interesting guy! I don't recall his name, but it sounds like he's potentially well known in the Tassie Land Rover community for those hunting parts. He had a lot of axle and diff parts for Series 1s and other Landies, plus more G60s and other interesting things. He intends to restore two of these, the 86 is a parts car though.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1375.jpg

I ended up purchasing both the bulkhead plus the complete body. All up it set me back $300, $150 each. The one with the body is really nice down the sides, but the footwells aren't great. The other one I bought has excellent footwells but the rest isn't so great. And I have a welder!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1376.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1377.jpg

Chassis number 25313211B

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1378.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1379.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1380.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1381.jpg

The complete body also came with great array of spares. I got wings, a bonnet, radiator, windscreen, ute cab, tub, seat box, steering column, steering wheel, indicator stalk, plus possibly other stuff I haven't noticed yet. I'm pretty thrilled, as it means I can pick the best of what I've got and get the best finished product possible. It should also save me a lot of time, as hopefully it will mean less repairs.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1382.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1383.jpg

I hope this post isn't a bit too all over the place... I'll try to get some better photos of the condition of the white bulkhead once it arrives in Hobart either tomorrow or Saturday.

We did also manage to go camping for a while. We snuck out Sunday arvo, returning on Wednesday afternoon. We camped at a beautiful place called Trial Harbour, absolutely brilliant spot to pitch a tent. On the way out on Wednesday I "bumped" (read: spotted, turned around and surreptitiously approached) into a 130, piloted by Ranga. I think it's the first forum member I've come across in real life, so that was a nice surprise. I also managed to pass through the Road to Nowhere, C249, which runs from Corinna to Arthur River and claimed the diff in my Ford Laser this time last year. It was a good feeling taking a car I rebuilt myself through the road that broke it. Hopefully Serenity will make the trip one day...

It's interesting that as a 21 year old, I have 3 vehicles with an average age of 43 years old, the youngest of which is 20...

I'll leave you with that thought!

Cheers,

Martin

[wrinklearthur]

Hi Martin

I live just up the road not far out of Brighton, I wouldn't mind meeting up for a chat and a look see.
Its sad though, all of your Landy's are about ten years younger than me!
.

[turkeybrain]

Hi Martin

I live just up the road not far out of Brighton, I wouldn't mind meeting up for a chat and a look see.
Its sad though, all of your Landy's are about ten years younger than me!
.

It would be nice to meet you, I'll send you a PM, see if we can organise a time to catch up.

Cheers,

Martin

[turkeybrain]

Just a quick update with some extra photos of my new bulkheads. They arrived in Hobart at 7:30 this morning, courtesy of Rob's housemate.

Now its off the trailer, here are some better pictures of the inside of the bulkhead.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1282.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1283.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/03/1284.jpg

Cheers,

Martin

[Landie333]

Loving the resto, mate. I'm looking forward to the finished product

[korg20000bc]

So, Malcolm...
How's Serenity, still stuck in the Persephone docks?

[turkeybrain]

Sadly she is.

Uni has been stupidly busy recently, so the last time I managed to do any work was weeks ago. I'm hopeful I'll manage to do something over my easter break, but with lab reports, assignments and tests looming, not to mention the gf wanting to spend time with me, I'm not even sure that will happen!

The current focus is building up frames for a rotisserie for the chassis. I've finished one but the second one still needs to be welded together yet. Once that's done it's off with the axles and onto sand blasting and painting.

Can't wait to graduate!

Martin

[turkeybrain]

Well, it's exactly one year today since I bought Serenity. She would have made it home by now. I'd love to celebrate this day by going out and working on her for a few hours, but sadly assignments still call...

The good news (or bad, depending on your view) is I'm only about a month away from finishing up this semester where I can have a good few weeks to work on her. I still need to get the chassis sandblasted, sooner rather than later probably, so I can start painting as soon as I've finished exams.

I'm wondering where you guys would move to after finishing up the chassis. I'll be able to work full time on her for about two weeks, maybe more depending on how things go, so a lot of work will hopefully get done. I'm thinking that the axles and suspension are probably the next important step right after the chassis, followed by a major service of the engine. Should I do things in a different order to that? I'd like to get some bits and pieces ordered now so they're ready for me when I get time to work on her again.

I've got some fairly specific questions about diffs, so I might start a new thread on that...

Engine wise, what would people suggest I replace? As far as I can tell the engine is mechanically sound, it doesn't blow smoke or use any oil. She fires the moment the fuel makes it through to the carby, and when running there's no evident tappet noise at all, nor does it miss. What I was thinking was basically a major service, so change the timing chain etc, water pump, revamp the ignition system with plugs, points, leads and maybe a new coil. I need to go through and check for leaks, so I might have to change some seals too, depending on what I find. I was also thinking of a carby rebuild kit, just for completeness sake. If you want to know what the engine sounded like, have a look at the video I've posted previously, as that has a decent record of how everything sounds. So you don't have go go back and find it, here it is again:

Serenity's Last Drive (Before Restoration) - YouTube

I start her at 1:40, but she wasn't happy for a little while as a little water had got into the fuel pickup when I pressure washed her.

Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

Cheers,

Martin

[wrinklearthur]

Hi Martin

As far as most of the engine is concerned, if it aint broke don't fix it. :D

Clean the sump out and the oil pickup gauze. Test; the thermostat, the temperature gauge sender and the oil light switch for correct operation, do a wet and dry compression test.

While you can get at the motor relatively easily, the rear main and front seals would be a good thing to replace, with an eye run over the condition of the clutch plate, then with a fresh set of gaskets to keep oil in, give the block a nice coat of duck egg blue.

Have a look at the welsh plugs and the alloy housing where the top radiator hose sits. I would need to look at the condition of the radiator before making a decision to get it serviced as it maybe a lot cheaper to get a brand new one first up.

If you are short of anything give me a hoy, as I know someone that has a yard full of junk! :wasntme: I will try and get down to see you while you have your uni break.
.

[turkeybrain]

A nice coat of duck egg blue... I should have seen that coming! :p

I'd totally forgotten about the clutch. I noticed that slipping when I was towing the series 1 round the yard, so that most likely will require replacing.

By the way Arthur, did you work for PMG/Telecom/Telstra in the past? My father Colin reckons he used to work with you, or at least in the same building or something... Small place this Tasmania!

Cheers,

Martin

[turkeybrain]

Alright, I've finished exams now, so it's time for an update!

Reading back, it seems I haven't mentioned what I found out about the cream coloured bulkhead I had photos of a few posts ago... What looked to me at a cursory glance to be an exceptionally solid bulkhead actually turned out to be a fairly rusty bulkhead with bog over the dents from the crash it was in. Me and my rose coloured glasses again!

It's still not all doom and gloom though, I have 3 bulkheads, one of which still looks reasonable, and it should be readily repairable. I know a guy who has got more than enough skill to do it for me (assuming he's prepared to take it on), or if I'm being stingy, I might even give it a go myself. I haven't decided just yet.

Arthur was a welcome visitor today, he's had a good look around and I think he enjoyed himself! He has also pointed out a heap of jobs I was hoping I could just ignore, but really should get done. For example, I wasn't sure if I would need to mend the cross members, but it sounds like it will have to be done. It shouldn't be too much of a drama though.

Speaking of the chassis, I've almost completed my rotisserie stands and holders. The stand for each end is all made up, I've just got to cut the pipe (which will be placed through the PTO holes) to length, weld in my retaining plates (see below) and stick it all together.

Rotisserie stand
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/505.jpg

These plates will be welded into each end of the pipe and will be used to hold it all together. The weight of it all will sit on the top of the frame rather than the bolt, the bolt is only there to maintain position. I used a bit of pipe to get the shape and size right.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/506.jpg

After the chassis is stripped down, it's off the the sand blasters before any necessary repairs and a few coats of paint. It doesn't feel like I did much today, but at least I did something, better than the past 2 months!

Dad is really giving me curry to get out of the shed, as he's gone and bought himself a 1929 Chevrolet Roadster (to complement his 1927 Chev Truck) which he wants to put in the shed and get running again. A 12x5m shed is not really big enough for 3 cars, particularly if you want to do any work to them!

Here's a photo of the '29 he's bought (the same vehicle) from about 30 years ago. It has been kept under cover since then, so it shouldn't be in too bad condition. I haven't seen it yet though. https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/507.jpg

For Arthur's benefit, here's a photo of what's under that tarp. This is the '27 truck.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/508.jpg

What a very un-Landy post...

Cheers,

Martin

[stevep]

we used to have a 1927 Chev truck when I was a kid. We still had it up till about 1962, I think. It went to some kids on a property in central Qld.

looked just like your photo. wooden spoked wheels, 4 cylinder, battery used to be on the passenger running board, crank start - don't remember a starter motor, no windscreen wipers - only a split windscreen (horizontally) so that you could fold one half up to look out, had square box sides & roof on the back & 5 kids would pile in the back to drive from Brisbane to Noosa for holidays - took all day to do a 100 miles.

good memories.:)
thanks

Steve

[turkeybrain]

It's been a few days since I last posted, I've been working long hours trying to get as much work done as possible. It's been fairly successful actually, the chassis is now sitting on the rotisserie and looking quite bare. There's only a few little things to remove before I'm prepared to send it out for sandblasting. A friend from uni has been helping me for the last couple of days, he's a useful kind of guy to have around, thankfully he seems to know one end of a spanner from the other! More than I can say for most of my friends, sadly...

Now I can swing the chassis over, I can take some decent photos of the damage as I find it. A few things I hadn't noticed before have come up, so that's a little disappointing, as there's more work there than I had anticipated. Overall it's OK though, I'm just going to have to polish up my welding skills a bit.

Anyway, here's some photos:

Front left spring hanger has taken a bit of a beating over the years.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/194.jpg

As have both the cross members underneath the gearbox. The one just in front of the gearbox cross member is actually very badly damaged, so I imagine that will need to be replaced.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/195.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/196.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/197.jpg

There's a bit of rust in the front cross member which might actually be reasonably serious, but I'm hoping it will come back looking OK after blasting.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/198.jpg

One of the outriggers has also taken a beating, but it doesn't appear to be particularly serious.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/199.jpg

The rear cross member is where I've been most surprised. Lurking underneath it was actually quite a lot of rust and damage. Arthur believes it has been repaired in the past, but even then it looks like I'll need a new one, as it's bent pretty badly in a number of places, particularly near the tow point mount. The plate was actually hiding a fair bit of rust too, so it looks to be in fairly bad shape.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/200.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/201.jpg

It's hard to see in this photo, but the corner around the PTO tube has rusted out so there's now a gap.
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/202.jpg

More damage...
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/203.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/204.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/205.jpg

Chassis on rotisserie plus extra help.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/06/206.jpg

It might look a little bad, but it could be so much worse. I'm still a little annoyed with myself for not noticing all of this when I inspected the vehicle, but what can I do now! I'm still happy I bought it, so I guess that's the important bit. I just get to play with the welder a lot more...

Cheers,

Martin

[turkeybrain]

It's approaching 5 months since I last posted on here. Not much Landy related has happened in the mean time either, it's predominantly been uni uni uni. However, exams are over for another year, so it's time to get back into Landies in a big way!

I'm working full time over summer this year, which means I have less time but more money to work on Serenity. The plan is to do the usual 9-5 desk job during the day and come home and get stuck into restoration work during the evenings. To be honest though, I can't really complain about the desk job. For a start, I'm expecting a lot of field work, and that field work includes playing with steam trains, so I'm a happy chappy!

In the last post I mentioned Dad had just purchased another Chev, a 1929 Roadster. Since then we've picked it up, and had to completely reshuffle the shed to get it to fit. Basically everything came out, including my 80" Kaylee, and the Chev was rolled to the back of the shed, with Kaylee being returned to its side. They make a lovely pair!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/493.jpg

My apologies to those of you who are here for the Landies, but I've got to post another couple of pics of the Chev...

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/494.jpg
Note the lever action damper with leaf spring suspension arrangement.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/495.jpg
1929 saw the introduction of the very first Chev 6 cylinder motor, the "Stovebolt Six"

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/496.jpg
Rolling it out of its old home. Dad bought it off his brother (seen here in the hat), who has owned it for many years.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/497.jpg
Roadster body - two seats inside plus another two in the dickie seat out the back.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/498.jpg
Dad with his new pride and joy all ready for the trip home.

So, any ideas why Dad wants me out of the shed? I just can't work it out! :angel:

Anyway, back to the Landies...

During the great shed reshuffle, Serenity got evicted to live on the driveway for a few months. She was all tarped up, and it doesn't seem like anything has rusted too badly in the short trip outdoors.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/499.jpg
That helper is back again...

What's most impressive is that even with a 3rd car in the shed, there's actually a lot more room than there was with 2.

I've been concentrating on the axles and chassis in my latest return to the shed. I initially removed the rear diff, but had some issues with the front axle. Pulling apart the rear diff indicated some significant damage in the past. The pin which holds the two smallest planet gears in position has been sheared off in the past, and during the rebuild they didn't even bother to remove the pin. That in turn has taken some nasty chunks out of the outer edge of the crown wheel. I'd show you a photo of the pin I removed, but I left it at Arthur's place on Saturday. I took the rear diff up to see him, and while he didn't have his hands in the bowels of a TD5, he was most helpful in showing me what to look for in a good diff, and what makes a bad diff. We both agree that the rear diff isn't really serviceable, not only because of the chunks taken out, but also as it has quite a lot of backlash (I hope I'm not mixing my terms here), plus side to side slop in the bearings, and the thrust washers have disintegrated and disappeared. However, all hope is not lost, Arthur handed me a set of spanners and pointed me at a paddock, and I removed a diff from an old S/W he's stripping down. Thankfully that diff was in top condition, so we struck a deal.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/500.jpg
The old and replacement diffs, bottom and top respectively. It's a bad photo, but you can just make out some of the damage around the edge of the crown wheel on the old diff.

While we were at it, he also 'lent' me a replacement rear cross member, with the promise that I would provide him with a like for like replacement. The reason for that deal is because I have a cousin who is more talented with a welder than I am, who has kindly volunteered to weld bits into my chassis, and I want to have the bits ready for him when he comes to do it! All in all a big thanks to Arthur for his wisdom, generosity and trust!

I've since managed to get the front diff apart too. The issue I had was that the front half shafts wouldn't simply pull out of the swivel hubs, as indicated would happen in my workshop manual. We assume there is a bearing holding them in place, so we simply split them off at the flange rather than disassembling the swivel to go bearing hunting.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/501.jpg
Swivel hubs with half shafts still in place.

Given how little oil I found in the front diff, and the colour of that which I did find, I'm quite impressed by its condition. I've done the checks Arthur has told me to do, and I think it might be fine to use, but I might still get his experienced eyes to have a look for me at some point.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/502.jpg
Front diff as removed tonight.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/11/503.jpg
Note the delightful colour of the oil.

It's about to the point in the project where I get to start de-rusting, repainting and replacing components, so I'm thoroughly looking forward to that. It will be nice to begin the reassembly phase, after so much stripping and disassembly.

Cheers,

Martin

[Mike_S]

Best of luck with it. You're at the point I was 4 years ago with our Triumph Spitfire, down to a bare chassis and boxes full of rusty bits all over the garage. I did look at it all a few times and wonder if I'd ever manage to get it all back together again :eek:

Patience is a virtue I'm not blessed with and now it's all back together, there's a few things I'll never be happy with so my advice would be that if it's something hard to get at or difficult to redo (chassis painting for example), then be 100% happy before re-assembly, because once it's back together the last thing you ever want to do is faff about getting it right again :mad:

Enjoy it though :cool:

[wrinklearthur]

What have I done, did I pass on a enthusiastic expectation bug to another hopeful?

I hope I have shown Turkey Brain a practical way of drawing a line in the sand, as to when to write something off and then find it's replacement.

Commitment is what it is all about and getting to the end of a well orchestrated restoration is the best feeling of all, when you turn the key to start your cumulation of sweat and tears with a set of shiny new rego plate attached.

But hey! don't forget to stop to smell the roses.

[turkeybrain]

Best of luck with it. You're at the point I was 4 years ago with our Triumph Spitfire, down to a bare chassis and boxes full of rusty bits all over the garage. I did look at it all a few times and wonder if I'd ever manage to get it all back together again :eek:

Patience is a virtue I'm not blessed with and now it's all back together, there's a few things I'll never be happy with so my advice would be that if it's something hard to get at or difficult to redo (chassis painting for example), then be 100% happy before re-assembly, because once it's back together the last thing you ever want to do is faff about getting it right again :mad:

Enjoy it though :cool:

Triumph Spitfire, nice choice! :thumbsup: I have a fairly large soft spot for pretty much anything British, hence the Landies.

Your advice to do it right the first time seems most logical, and probably couldn't come at a better time. I'm on a fairly tight budget and have fairly strict time restrictions, so it's useful to be told to make sure I do it right the first time.


What have I done, did I pass on a enthusiastic expectation bug to another hopeful?

I hope I have shown Turkey Brain a practical way of drawing a line in the sand, as to when to write something off and then find it's replacement.

Commitment is what it is all about and getting to the end of a well orchestrated restoration is the best feeling of all, when you turn the key to start your cumulation of sweat and tears with a set of shiny new rego plate attached.

But hey! don't forget to stop to smell the roses.

I'm not sure this restoration can be called well orchestrated yet! I've tried to do a little planning in regards to what order I'll do everything, but I just ended up getting frightened by how long the to-do list was!

But yes, you've managed to pass on some enthusiasm to me! I'm not too bothered by the length of the list, I just want to make it shorter now.

So much to do...

-Martin

[Landy Smurf]

if you still have not finished by januaryish 2014 i can come and give you a hand if you want

[turkeybrain]

I'll never turn down the offer of help! That being said, I'd like to have it done by next year, but that may only be a bit of a dream.

What's bringing you down to Tassie anyway?

[Landy Smurf]

the fiance is doing exchange at hobart or launceston(or devenport i cant remember) uni

[turkeybrain]

Ah, nice. I'm on the Hobart campus, but I've heard the Launceston one is a really nice place to be and study. The Cradle Coast campus is pretty tiny.

You'll love Tassie though. It's a great place to live.

[dreamin']

[QUOTE=turkeybrain;1801041. The Cradle Coast campus is pretty tiny.

You'll love Tassie though. It's a great place to live.[/QUOTE]


We prefer to call it 'intimate' - great staff/student ratio

But I agree with turkeybrain - top place to live, and plenty of old landies

Let us know if you're coming this way

Roger

[wrinklearthur]

Sending a PM.
.

[turkeybrain]

It's been far too long since I last posted here... I guess it's a combination of gallivanting around the countryside, an ongoing injury and 'work' to blame... I call it 'work', as it's pretty much gallivanting in and of itself, the only difference is I get paid for it. It's also pretty hard to call it work when you go for joy rides in steam locos...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYYnWlKsDbs (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GYYnWlKsDbs)

The comment at the beginning of the video was to the driver, who was wondering why I was filming. It was so I could sent the video to my best mate, who loves steamers and was stuck in an office in front of a computer. I know he'd return the favour when possible.

I'm loving work, so much better than uni! Only one year to go now. Mind you, this is a pretty awesome job with an excellent boss, so maybe the real world isn't quite this good...

Anyway, in my spare time I have been pottering around in the shed and doing the odd job or two. I've primarily focused my attention on the axles, as according to the pseudo Gantt chart I've whipped up, they appear very early on the critical path of this rebuild. I've had some 'fun' (read: manly tears of frustration have been shed), with half shafts which rotate freely but are completely seized within bearings located in the swivel hubs, plus so much rust and dirt it's not even funny. You also get the odd surprise...

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/522.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/523.jpg

I'm pretty sure those two pieces of the drum aren't supposed to be detached from one another... And people have told me that I won't need new drums!

I've also had some 'laughs' with hub nuts and stub axles. I had to pay Arthur a surprise visit last Saturday as I was struggling to get the hub nuts undone on one side of the rear axle. Turns out there was significant thread damage to the stub axle, and it took the two of us an awful lot of effort to get it undone. Good thing he's got all the tools I need just up the road! He also reckons the stub axle is stuffed, so I need a new one.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/524.jpg

This photo is with one of the two hub nuts removed. It's pretty hard to see, but you can see some of the damage to the end of the stub axle. I'll take a better photo when it's fully disassembled, but that's not a high priority any more. Read on...

Arthur also took a look at the rear axle casing. His attention was drawn to the pumpkin.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/525.jpg

One of the previous owners has obviously hit something and the diff sprung a leak. Or maybe it's from when the diff exploded, as mentioned in a previous post. Speaking of which, I finally remembered to take a photo of the pin they left floating around inside when they rebuilt it in a hurry.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/526.jpg

[happycry]

No prizes for guessing why the crown wheel has lots of chips taken off the outer edge.

Anyway, with the welded repair on the pumpkin, Arthur reckons it has probably warped the whole axle, and has recommended replacement.

I also took the opportunity to get him to check the diff I removed from the front. I'm pretty sure I said in the past that it seemed OK to me, turns out I was wrong. I missed the end float, which is apparently pretty bad according to Arthur. He also reckons somebody has fiddled with the backlash, making it reasonable, which is why I thought it was OK.

So at this point, I have 1 good quality Rover diff which will nicely bolt in the front and a completely ruined back axle. I'm now on the hunt for a salisbury. I wasn't going to bother with that upgrade yet, but I need an axle anyway!

Thankfully the front axle casing is in significantly better condition, and I've cleaned that up and started painting it. I forgot to take a photo before painting (or even beginning preparation), but it's looking good now. Just need to put on a top coat.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/527.jpg

I've managed to get some parts in from the UK, mostly revolving around the two early critical components, axles and the chassis. I've got all new bearings and seals for both axles, as well as a completely fresh set of brake goodies, including springs, adjusters, slave cylinders and shoes. I still need to order new drums, as I really do need some new ones. I've also shipped in a new rear cross member (as some of you may recall from a previous post, it has a lot of rust in it), a front left dumb iron (which shows signs of past repairs) and a pair of bulkhead pillar repair sections. I was pretty happy with a shipping bill of just over A$300 for all that from the UK!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/528.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/529.jpg

I've also managed to con my technically competent (that is to say, he is very competent when it comes to technical things, not that he is by some obscure method considered somewhat competent, but I digress) cousin to weld all these bits and pieces on for me, as I don't quite trust my welding enough. His workmanship, however, is truly awe inspiring. I'm not sure when he's going to be able to do it for me, but hopefully it's not too far away.

I made the comment to Arthur recently that I find it most disheartening to see the threads on here where somebody buys a car, brings it home and strips it to a bare chassis in a single weekend. It took me a whole year! I consider getting 6 bolts undone a good night's work, as typically they're so badly rusted or clogged with dirt that 6 can take over an hour with two men working on it! The more I see of this car, the more I realise how badly it's been neglected, and just how bad its condition is. Knowing what I know now, there's no way I'd have bought it, but I did, and I'm still having fun (genuine fun this time) working on it. It's going to take a lot more time off me yet though.

I also need to publicly thank Arthur, he's been very kind in allowing me to show up and use his expansive collection of both tools and knowledge at very short notice. He's a real asset to have living nearby, and I really do appreciate his help, particularly when he patiently answers all my newbie questions. He also makes a pretty good spare parts dealer!

Anyway, that's it for tonight. I don't expect I'll do much work done on it next week either, I'm getting paid to play with steam trains again for 4 days. I'm only slightly excited!

-Martin

[turkeybrain]

Sigh. Posting the photo of the front axle housing reminds me that I forgot to fix the dents before painting.

Ah well, it isn't tagging the crown wheel anyway.

-Martin

[Landy Smurf]

I cant wait to get down there and check it out myself.

[wrinklearthur]

I also need to publicly thank Arthur, he's been very kind in allowing me to show up and use his expansive collection of both tools and knowledge at very short notice. He's a real asset to have living nearby, and I really do appreciate his help, particularly when he patiently answers all my newbie questions.

Hi Martin

Thanks for the bouquet, it sure has brightened up my day.

I am really passing on the time and help that was once given to me by a long time deceased friend, Les Wells. He was the consummate tinkerer always building and modifying, but was never too busy to answer my questions about Land Rovers.

Les owned a 80" Land Rover with some special features that he had delight in showing me.
The cab was tin, pop riveted over a soft top truck cab frame.
Hanging by a piece of wire from a nail in the pole holding up the shed roof was, a pair of brass swivel pin housing balls that Les had rebuilt by brazing and then worked back to their correct shape, the clutch and brake foot petal plates were also brass.
I have never seen one since, the badge that was on his Land Rover, it was the words Land Rover cast on a brass plate that was shaped like a folded ribbon.
Les had also told me that his 80" chassis never had a chassis number stamped on it anywhere, unlike the later 80" that he had wrecked for parts, it's number was easily visible.

I do hope I can be lucky enough to find the remains of Les's Land Rover someday, in time for Les's One Hundred and Tenth Birthday.
.

[chazza]

Arthur,
It sounds as if Les's 80" was a pre-production prototype!

I have been lucky enough to see L48, which the owner pointed out to me, has bronze swivels and bronze pedals,

Cheers Charlie

[wrinklearthur]

Arthur,
It sounds as if Les's 80" was a pre-production prototype!

I have been luck enough to see L48, which the owner pointed out to me, has bronze swivels and bronze pedals,

Hi Charlie

I wish that I had taken better notice then, as there where other details that didn't show up on the later production models.
One thing that I can remember was, Les could swing up the head light to shine back into the engine bay, that was hinged like a WW2 Jeep's light, I couldn't say if that was made at the factory like that or if Les had thought the Jeep idea was handy and had modified it.

I also remember the Five ignition coils he had fastened around the engine bay which included the one that Les had wound by hand.

Poor Martin, I had better stop as this is your thread !

[turkeybrain]

No, you're right, I find it most interesting. Feel free to continue, I'm still learning!

-Martin

[wrinklearthur]

Hi Martin

Managed to pull the old 2A chassis out of the horehound yesterday, that now means you could have a stub axle with a good thread !

.

[turkeybrain]

Hi Martin

Managed to pull the old 2A chassis out of the horehound yesterday, that now means you could have a stub axle with a good thread !

.

Ah, I had completely forgotten about that! I'm not sure when I'll be able to make it up to collect it though, there's plenty of things to do at the moment...

Part of the reason I forgot is I've been busy. Let me explain...

Last week I spent most of the week away for work. I spent the whole time playing steam trains, which, well, is a brilliant way to earn a crust! I spent a couple of days listening to a man named Nigel Day, who claims to be the only active man in the world who modifies steam locos to meet modern day efficiency and emission requirements. Very interesting guy. If people are interested, you can read a little on his work here: The Work of Nigel Day (http://www.martynbane.co.uk/modernsteam/nday/nigeldayhome.htm) I was also on the footplate of a loco again, this time with my hands all over the controls. A kindly fireman showed me the ropes, with something like 100 paying passengers hooked onto the back of the loco. It all went well though, which was good. By the end of the trip the fire and boiler were almost completely under my control, to the point of needing to get the fireman's attention to ask questions if I needed. I've heard people say that steam is addictive, I'd suggest they're correct. I'm thinking I might volunteer with the railway in my spare time...

The other reason I've been busy actually involves Land Rovers for once. I have been given a firm date for when my cousin will be down to repair my chassis for me, 8th - 9th Feb. I'm hoping he'll manage to get the rear cross member, the front left dumb iron and the bulkhead repaired, but I'm not holding my breath. It's going to be a big couple of days. I've been doing a little prep work to make his job quicker and easier, namely cleaning the weld areas up so there's no paint or rust present.

That was last Saturday's job, with Dad offering his assistance. We also took to a lot of the enclosed outriggers with a piece of wire and an air compressor. It's easily the biggest mess ever made in the shed, even significantly exceeding Dad's efforts with his wood lathe. I reckon we collected something like 4 litres of dust from outriggers though, with plenty more being floated around the shed to land on everything... The dust volcanoes were pretty awesome, although for some reason my mother wasn't happy when I wanted to come inside again.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/1.jpg

Completely unreasonable I say!

It has also recently struck me that it's all well and good to clean and paint the chassis externally, but I also need to look at getting the inside of it sorted as well. I've done a little bit of research, and have decided to use POR-15 to treat the inside. I want to have this all painted up before the rear cross member is welded back on, as I can cut holes in the old one to gain access. Like I did earlier tonight...

It's remarkably satisfying taking an angle grinder to the chassis of a vehicle which has given you so much grief in the past year or so.

I've cut holes into it behind each of the chassis rails, with the idea of being able to get a pipe cleaner nozzle attached to a pressure washer up though the chassis.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/2.jpg

It's impossibly hard to take a picture inside the chassis with enough light, so this is about as good as it's going to get until I come up with some other brilliant system... My first impression of shining a torch inside was that it actually looked pretty reasonable in there except for the cobwebs and layer of dirt.

For cleaning, we knew we had to let the water drain out somehow. Given the steps in the chassis, about the easiest thing I could think of was winching one end to the ceiling of the shed...

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/3.jpg

It seemed to work pretty well, we managed to get all surfaces sloping downwards, so it should drain OK. Starting with the pipe attachment on the pressure washer, a little progress was made on each chassis leg. Unfortunately two things happened... Firstly, we got stuck. About the same place in each leg. I expect it's probably crush tubes or something getting in the way.

Does anybody know the rough locations of crush tubes within the chassis? My workshop manual isn't quite that helpful...

The second issue is somewhat more concerning...

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/01/4.jpg

Lovely big chunks of rust... Hooray?

Tapping the chassis with a hammer still returns a nice sound, so Dad and I are both hopeful it's just the corroded rear cross member which is trying to trick us at the moment. I have a borescope as well, so we might crack that out tomorrow and get some answers to our questions.

It's all getting very tight time-wise. I need to clean the chassis out, degrease the chassis, wash the chassis, use a paint prep on the chassis, wash the chassis out, completely dry it out with no trace of water remaining and then paint it, all before Friday next week. While holding down a full time job. With events happening all weekend.

Ah well, keeps me on my toes!

-Martin

[turkeybrain]

So, working flat out at the moment trying to get the inside of the chassis rails painted out before Friday. Deadlines really make the world go round!

As I said last time, I've decided to go with POR 15 as my coating, as, well, you can paint over rust! I've heard good reports of the stuff, so I figured it's worth giving a good go, in an attempt to preserve this Landy for another 50 odd years.

The company who make the stuff say preparation is crucial for the paint to stick properly. So, deciding that I won't mess with it too much given what's at stake, I've gone and bought the whole system... For 1L of degreaser, 1L of preparation etcher stuff, 1L of paint and 1L of thinner, it set me back a fraction under $180. If this stops rust from occurring inside the chassis, it's worth an awful lot more than $180 to me! I was fortunate to find a local supplier, so I managed to get it the day after I decided it's what I wanted.

So far I've managed to get through the cleaning process. I also bought a pipe cleaner attachment for the pressure cleaner. The pipe cleaner has been invaluable so far.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/1363.jpg
Dad wielding the pipe cleaner.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/1364.jpg
Plenty of dirt.

We've washed each rail out with high pressure water maybe 4 or 5 times now, basically until we're convinced there's no more dirt coming out with the water. You'll notice in my last post that the chassis is raised to the ceiling of the shed, this is for drainage purposes during cleaning.

The most exciting and challenging part of all of this is actually getting the pipe cleaner through the chassis. There's a heap of crush tubes in there, it has a habit of getting stuck on all of them. It took a while, but we eventually devised a reliable system, based on what sparkies do. Might as well take inspiration from those who do this on a daily basis!

Yellow tongue from particle board flooring is what we ended up using, with a sinker for added bend. If left to its own devices, it has a habit of going over the top of things that you won't be able to get the pipe cleaner through, particularly the first crush tube where the front shock absorber mounts. So, to bend it that little bit further, it's time to go fishing.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/1365.jpg

This is a oval shaped sinker approximately 30-40mm long, taped to the end. The extra weight drags the yellow tongue down nicely, making it go where you want it. We found that taping the front down a little so it sloped up nicely also helped get through. A twist of the yellow tongue where you get stuck, and you can reliably get right through the chassis. Tape your pipe cleaner on gently, pull back through until you reach the dumb iron and then yank so the tape snaps, Bob's your uncle.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/1366.jpg

We also used a degreaser, Marine Clean, as recommended by the POR 15 people. The Karcher we have has a detergent pick up, but apparently that only works if you don't have a high pressure nozzle attached. Real useful. So we mixed the degreaser about 20:1 with water (as directed on the label) and used a short piece of hose to plumb it into the pump. Worked quite well eventually. After letting the degreaser sit for a while, we've gone back and washed it out.

The real issue is now moisture. I'm pretty sure the next step which is the etcher needs to be applied to a dry surface, so we need to get it dry. Paint obviously needs a really nicely dry surface as well. Which is just fantastic, as the instructions say to rinse the etcher off with water after about 30m as well!

It's OK though, we've got a solution! Hair dryers. $45 for a pair of 1800W units, perfect for my use. I decided to decline the offer of an extended warranty for some reason.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/1367.jpg

I went and checked them after about 1.5 hours of operation, the whole chassis varies from too hot to touch to nice and warm, with plenty of warm air flowing out all the holes along the whole length. I reckon it should comfortably be dry before Monday, even if I do turn them off overnight.

Now all we need to work out is how on earth we're going to get the etcher and paint in there. I'm currently thinking something along the lines of a pressurised insecticide sprayer with a really long hose. I'm definitely open to suggestions though!

I'll try to get some better photos of inside the chassis before I hit it with the etcher, then after as well.

I think I need more deadlines in my life. Really invigorates my work ethic!

Oh, in regards to the rust chunks I had a picture of last post, that's about all the rust we've found. There's been plenty of rocks, but very little rust. I'm quite thrilled by that actually. We suspect the rust chunks came out of the rear cross member which is about to be replaced anyway, so I'm really not bothered at all.

-Martin

[Chris72]

Make good progress there Martin looking good, I was thinking of doing my outer chassis with Por 15 and was going to use Fertan rust converter inside the chassis, but I'm interested to see how the Por 15 works out, I've heard you can hit it with a hammer and it won't chip, pretty hard stuff when it cures.

Cheers Chris

[turkeybrain]

I'll let you know how I go with it. If it works well internally, I'll be very happy.

Strangely though, I'm not planning on using it on the outside of the chassis. I'm planning on getting the chassis professionally sand blasted and as part of that process it will be sprayed with a zinc rich primer, giving it similar properties to galvanising. I assume that POR-15 isn't going to bond very well with this, so I'll probably go for a standard chassis black on the outside.

It's a bit of a pity though, the resilience of POR-15 would make an ideal coat under the chassis. At least I can reach to touch it up easily if needed.

-Martin

[turkeybrain]

So, I was trying to get myself some breathing gear for use when spraying POR 15. I went into my local PPE shop, and the guy who served me checked the MSDS (like I should already have done).

Turns out the stuff is pure evil.

Here's an excerpt from the MSDS:

(http://www.por15info.com/msds/POR-15MSDS.pdf)


A NIOSH approved air-purifying respirator with an organic vapor cartridge approved for use in isocyanate
containing environments may be permissible under certain circumstances where concentrations are
expected to exceed exposure limits. In spray applications you must protect against exposure to both
vapor and spray mist. Protection provided by air-purifying systems is limited. Use a positive pressure
air supplied respirator if there is any potential for an uncontrolled release, where exposure levels are not
known, or any other situation where air purifying respirators may not provide adequate protection.I'm definitely not spraying that.

[will d8r]

Hi I got this one blasted & painted with industrial grade Hi chem paint so far seems good. Can't remember price which means it must of been good. I think it was worth it came up really good.
Cheers Will

[Wolfman_TWP]

I'll let you know how I go with it. If it works well internally, I'll be very happy.

Strangely though, I'm not planning on using it on the outside of the chassis. I'm planning on getting the chassis professionally sand blasted and as part of that process it will be sprayed with a zinc rich primer, giving it similar properties to galvanising. I assume that POR-15 isn't going to bond very well with this, so I'll probably go for a standard chassis black on the outside.

It's a bit of a pity though, the resilience of POR-15 would make an ideal coat under the chassis. At least I can reach to touch it up easily if needed.

-Martin

If you are going to sandblast the outside of the chassis when you get it all repaired. You can paint it with Por15 without prep. It bonds directly to sandblasted surfaces.. I sandblasted a few of the suspension components of my Landy, and brushed it with Por15, and it's great. (Can't even tell that I brushed it on.) I dropped one of the components on the concrete floor by accident (After leaving it a week to cure. Although it cures in around 5 hours. And is better after 4 days) and it didn't even scratch it..(Phew) Just make sure you handle the chassis with gloves after it's sandblasted.. And it will bond OK..

Wolf

[turkeybrain]

Thanks for that, if it bonds well to sandblasted surfaces that will remove a lot of the preparation work.

I might see if I can get the sandblasting company to paint the chassis both internally and externally with POR 15. That way I get the good quality finish I want without any of the potential health risks. I assume any sand blasting firm worth their weight will have an air line feed for their employees.

-Martin

[turkeybrain]

It's been a long weekend in Hobart, and what a productive long weekend it has been!

Friday was the day my cousin was planning on coming down to replace the rear cross member and front left dumb iron. He arrived at about 7:50 am, had a cup of coffee, and we got into it.

First up was the front dumb iron.

You'll have to look back in the thread to see what it looked like before the repairs, it appears I didn't bother to take photos before he cut it off... I did however get back into it once he had removed it.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/738.jpg
Perhaps the biggest thing to notice about this is the severe lack of rust inside the chassis tube. We were both quite surprised by how little there was, and it was noted it was dry rust as well - all in all a very good sign!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/739.jpg
Old and new together

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/740.jpg
Tacking it on. There was an awful lot of measuring and re-measuring to ensure the new bit went back in exactly the right position. Note the writing in chalk all along the chassis - these were our measurements.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/741.jpg
All welded back up, looking very sharp.

The repair piece was a slightly different shape than the original, which means we did have to change the dip a little bit, but not by much. the hole where the suspension mounts, which as far as we're concerned is the most important part, remains exactly where it was vertically, horizontally and longitudinally.

Next up was the rear cross member...

Again I forgot to take any photos of it before, but I know I've posted a number of pictures a few pages back, if people are interested.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/742.jpg
The old and the new.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/743.jpg
Chassis sans cross member.

In this photo you can see we left the bottom section of the chassis intact. This didn't actually survive the repair, we removed it later. We were initially confused as the replacement cross member didn't have a bottom section on it. It did, however, come with plates which overlap and can be welded on afterwards. It's actually a neat system, we assume designed to allow flexibility with the variation of Land Rover chassis construction. A lot of seams weren't stitched the whole length, allowing you to bend the new bit to make everything match up nicely.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/744.jpg
Inside the chassis leg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/745.jpg
A closer shot.

I must say, given this is a 49 year old vehicle which clearly has spent most of its time off road, I'm very impressed with how rust free the chassis is. Everything I've seen of it makes me very pleased about its condition, I think I'll have a good base for my Landy for years to come.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/746.jpg
Starting to put it back together again. Tack welds holding it in place, allowing us to adjust the drop and angle, etc. A couple of "creative cuts" were required to get everything to line up just right, plus a little "bridge building". Very pleased I had a fully qualified and experienced welder doing this one!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/747.jpg
All done! You can see the plates welded on to the bottom as an overlap in this one as well.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/748.jpg
Very nice.

All measured up, the new rear cross member is less than 1 mm away from the position of the original one in every direction. Even the angle worked out to be exactly the same. That really is only possible if you've got a good quality reproduction. I didn't expect I'd say that about a Britpart product, but there you go. I'm quite impressed with the quality of their repair sections.

I have to say I'm extremely impressed by all this. In fact I think I'd go as far as saying I'm thrilled!

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/749.jpg
The new one looks a lot nicer!

So, by 1 pm on Friday, all of this was done. 5 hours is all it took.

There's still a little bit of work to do to the chassis, thankfully stuff that I'm once again capable of managing. Both the gearbox cross member and the one directly in front of it have both taken some serious hits on rocks, leaving them very bent and battered. I'm currently in the process of repairing these. I've started out with the gearbox cross member.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/750.jpg
Gearbox cross member deskinned. You can see some of the bends in it here, but it doesn't really show just how bad it was.

I've undone all the spot welds holding the bottom skin on, which I might add took forever, made much more difficult by plenty of bends. Thankfully once I had it off, I was very pleased with the condition of the metal inside.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/751.jpg
Lovely paint. Just a touch of surface rusts in the corners, which really isn't that serious.

Since these photos were taken, I've straightened it, stripped it back to clean bare metal, primed it and top coated it. I've also straightened the skin and painted that up as well. I'll weld them back up first thing tomorrow morning. Once that's all welded up, I'll be pulling the bottom of the other cross member, and straightening that up before welding it back up again.

Once that's all done, the chassis is complete! All it will need then is sand blasting and painting.

I'm liking all this progress at the moment, it's all going very well. It's nice to finally be out of the dismantling stage. It was a little disheartening I must say. All this progress is just fuelling my desire to do more work now. Pity there's paint drying at the moment, or I might still be in the shed, driving the neighbours up the wall!

I made mention of planned repairs to the bulkhead a few posts ago. My cousin didn't get to it, he had other things to attend to (like his wife and kids), so I'll be taking it up to his place in about a week, allowing him to work on it at his leisure. Given his propensity to work on his projects until 2 am most mornings, I should have it back very shortly... I'll be getting it sand blasted when the chassis is done so we're sure we don't miss any issues. Dad has been giving me a hand, he's stripped the bulkhead of all 'jewellery' so there's absolutely nothing left on it any more. I'm very thankful he has too, I thought it would take me maybe an hour, but he's worked on it for about one and a half days to get it finished. With that in mind, I'm not sure I'd have had the time to get it completed in time!

Dad has also been using my camera, primarily documenting the various bits he's disassembling. Downloading the photos tonight, apparently he's also been documenting me. So here's a photo of me pondering over something.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/752.jpg

-Martin

[turkeybrain]

No photos tonight, but the gearbox cross member is all welded back together again. My welding might not be brilliant, but I can say with some certainty that it isn't going to fall off any time soon...

I didn't manage to get to the other cross member today, so that will be tomorrow morning's job. It's a bit late to get the angle grinder out now, the neighbours probably won't be amused.

-Martin

[turkeybrain]

Turns out I completely forgot to take any photos of the gearbox cross member repairs I did. Probably a good thing, it wasn't my finest hour with a welder. Even hitting it with a grinder didn't make it look a whole lot better...

I did however manage to take some photos of the other cross member as I was repairing that.

The bottom was fairly badly damaged, so I took the grinder and cut it out. I wasn't entirely prepared for what I was about to find.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/654.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/655.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/656.jpg

Greasy mud. Delightful. As you can see, the cross member was entirely full of the stuff. What's really frustrating is that even though it was full of grease, it wasn't actually rust free. Thankfully though it was only minor rust, and after cleaning it out and degreasing, a rust converter has got it looking nice again. I've also hit it with a primer and top coat as well, while I still had access.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/657.jpg
This is how it was looking post treatment and painting.

I decided the old bottom wasn't worth reusing, so I used some sheet metal I purchased (which will primarily be used to repair the bulkhead) to add a new bottom section to the cross member. My process of cutting to size was a little odd, as even with panel beating, the gap for the bottom piece wasn't exactly even, partly to do with how straight my cut was. With a vernier caliper, tape measure and some chalk, I took width measurements at critical points along the cross member, transferred them to my new metal and trimmed accordingly. Shockingly, it worked remarkably well.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/658.jpg
Tacking up and bending to shape

A few whacks with a hammer sorted out the bends, but I did have to chop the new section into three bits, as I just couldn't convince it to get into the gap any other way.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/659.jpg
All ready for welding.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/660.jpg
All done.

I had forgotten just how good it was welding under an argon shield, I've had to survive with gasless MIG wire for the past few years as it's a bit hard to justify gas bottle rental all the time. While we've got the bottle we're also going to build some gates for the driveway and rebuild the trailer, which is looking very sorry for itself at the moment. Serenity is going to have to go on hold for a little while I think while that's all sorted out.

Speaking of trailers...

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/661.jpg
Loading up.

My unfortunate brother dropped in to pick up some cleaning supplies, and was quickly accosted to help me load the chassis up. His timing was truly superb, I had the chassis suspended and was actually just about to get the trailer and try to wrestle it on myself when he decided to poke his head in the door. A little man-handling and it was all ready to rumble.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/662.jpg
All ready for its 'big' (it was maybe 5 minutes if you're lucky) trip to the blaster.

The bulkhead has also gone down there as well, that should be back tomorrow afternoon without paint. The intent is to find all the hidden rust spots before repairs take place. The chassis should be back Wednesday next week, but timing there is somewhat irrelevant, as I'll be off gallivanting round the countryside on my annual holiday with my high school mates.

So, in short, I think I've hit a major milestone today. All chassis repairs are complete, and the chassis has been delivered for its coat of paint. Very exciting.

It's been a long week though, I'm exhausted. Totally worth it though!

-Martin

[wrinklearthur]

Hi Martin

I have just been offered another LWB 2A, it's down at Bruny Island, so very rusty but with good mechanicals.

How did you go with that Diesel you showed me the photo's of ?
.

[Landy Smurf]

looks good. I wish i painted the inside of my chassis parts.
I would recommend putting more and bigger holes in the chassis to let crap out as some of the spots they put holes are useless.
I wish we had gas for the mig as the gas less is a bit painful

[turkeybrain]

Hi Martin

I have just been offered another LWB 2A, it's down at Bruny Island, so very rusty but with good mechanicals.

How did you go with that Diesel you showed me the photo's of ?
.

A mate checked them out for me on Saturday. The two vehicles are in a pretty sorry state, I suspect much like your Bruny vehicle. There is a pair of salisburys, apparently they feel ok (to my untrained mate), but there is only one prop shaft, and that's badly damaged from when the chassis snapped. On learning this I turned them down, but during this week I've had a look online and it turns out I can import a brand new prop shaft for about A$110. The guy wanted "a couple of hundred" for them, bringing the total price to a bit over $300 for a complete rear salisbury conversion (and plenty of spare parts), assuming I can't knock him down a bit. I'll be up north at the end of next week, and I think I'll drop in and have a look-see, with a view to purchasing them.

If you PM me your email address, I'll send you through the photos my mate took for me.

-Martin

[turkeybrain]

looks good. I wish i painted the inside of my chassis parts.
I would recommend putting more and bigger holes in the chassis to let crap out as some of the spots they put holes are useless.
I wish we had gas for the mig as the gas less is a bit painful

I haven't done it yet, but I do intend to add a couple of large holes to the bottom of the rear cross member. If there's any other spots people would recommend, I'm all ears!

I'm still trying to work out how to get the inside fully painted out, I've been far too busy to properly prepare the chassis to get the sand blaster to paint inside for me with POR 15. As it was I'm about 2 days late getting it to the sand blaster.

You might be interested in a paint product I'm looking at, not quite as good as POR 15, but a little easier and much safer to use (I've read the MSDS this time). It's called Eastwood Internal Frame Coating. http://www.eastwood.com/internal-frame-coating-w-spray-nozzle.html It looks like a reasonable thing and very easy to use, which I like. I also reckon you could apply it to a fully assembled vehicle easily enough.

I'd have bought some by now, but Eastwood's Australian distributor doesn't import any hazardous or aerosol Eastwood products. I'm going to ask the New Zealand distributor if they will ship it to Australia, but I'm not holding my breath. After that, I'm not sure how I'm going to get it. I might have to get somebody in the US to buy it for me and surface mail it over.

-Martin

[Landy Smurf]

I have been wondering what i will use to treat the inside of my s1 chassis.
I put holes in anywhere that was closed
from memory the outriggers behind the front door was prone to getting crap in it so i put some holes in there.
I would concentrate on the 2 most rust prone areas of the chassis ie the front dumb irons and rear crossmember

[Ozdunc]

I've been using penetrol for the inside of my chassis. I used about 10 cans the first time I did it. It seems to cover pretty well (just bought an inspection camera from Jaycar).
It seems pretty robust with good capillary action.
I've also used it on the rusty bits of my bulkhead I'm yet to get round to fix and its certainly checked the rusts progress even on the externally exposed bits. I live by the sea as well.

I'm planning to spray 3-4 cans into the chassis each year as preventative maintenance.

[turkeybrain]

I've been using penetrol for the inside of my chassis. I used about 10 cans the first time I did it. It seems to cover pretty well (just bought an inspection camera from Jaycar).
It seems pretty robust with good capillary action.
I've also used it on the rusty bits of my bulkhead I'm yet to get round to fix and its certainly checked the rusts progress even on the externally exposed bits. I live by the sea as well.

I'm planning to spray 3-4 cans into the chassis each year as preventative maintenance.

My understanding of Penetrol was that it was an additive you added to other paint, much like a thinner. Is it also a proper covering by itself, or is its effect much like fish oil or Waxoyl, where it simply provides an water resistant covering?

[turkeybrain]

I got the bulkhead back from the sand blaster this afternoon. The chassis won't be done until next week though, but that's no problem at all.

I got the bulkhead blasted to find all the nasty surprises before the repair process. While it looks an awful lot worse than it used to, there doesn't appear to be any more rust in it than I already knew about. Admittedly I've only looked at the front of it, as I'm unable to get it out of my vehicle by myself, but I think the back should be all OK as well.

The driver's side is looking a little average.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/605.jpg
Pillar

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/606.jpg
Vertical surface of the footwell

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/607.jpg
Top of the footwell

The passenger side looks much better.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/608.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/609.jpg
There's still the odd hole though. I've got repair sections for both door pillars though, so I'm not bothered by that at all.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/610.jpg

The plan is to put the two pillars on and then just cut out the rusty sections of the footwell and add new metal in. I haven't bothered going for the repair sections for the footwells, for such simple shapes it doesn't really seem worthwhile.

By the end of this process I should have one excellent, rust free Land Rover!

-Martin

[Johnno1969]

I've been using penetrol for the inside of my chassis. I used about 10 cans the first time I did it. It seems to cover pretty well (just bought an inspection camera from Jaycar).
It seems pretty robust with good capillary action.
I've also used it on the rusty bits of my bulkhead I'm yet to get round to fix and its certainly checked the rusts progress even on the externally exposed bits. I live by the sea as well.

I'm planning to spray 3-4 cans into the chassis each year as preventative maintenance.


I haven't treated the inside of my Landy's chassis yet - but I plan to use Penetrol too. Brilliant stuff.

[chazza]

My understanding of Penetrol was that it was an additive you added to other paint, much like a thinner. Is it also a proper covering by itself, or is its effect much like fish oil or Waxoyl, where it simply provides an water resistant covering?

It is a paint additive but in my experience it leaves fish-oil for dead! Waxoyl and fish-oil do cover the surface, but Penetrol penetrates the rust and stops it completely. In my 12 month protection trial, only Penetrol looked the same at the end of it, all the others didn't work!

Cheers Charlie

[turkeybrain]

It is a paint additive but in my experience it leaves fish-oil for dead! Waxoyl and fish-oil do cover the surface, but Penetrol penetrates the rust and stops it completely. In my 12 month protection trial, only Penetrol looked the same at the end of it, all the others didn't work!

Cheers Charlie

Thanks for that information.

Would you recommend simply using penetrol by itself in the chassis, or put some form of paint inside before applying penetrol as an added layer of protection?

-Martin

[Ozdunc]

You apply penetrol first. The aerosol stuff I'm using is designed to be used under paint. It's capillary action gets it absorbed into the rust driving out air and moisture to completely deny the rust any oxygen. No oxygen no rust.
If the surface looks shiny when dry you've put enough on.

It's hard to tell that in a chassis, but I spray, wait a day or so then spray again figuring that the secondary sprays allow the penetrol to spread further.

I looked in the chassis with a camera probe last night and I can still see the penetrol coating, looking all nice and shiny after a year of being in there.

[turkeybrain]

The chassis is back! I picked it up yesterday. It took them a while, but to be honest I've been far too busy to really care about how long it took. I'm just pleased they took the initiative to top coat it for me as well. I really should have discussed the process with them better, but oh well, I got what I wanted.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/03/578.jpg

It's a little dirty as it's been outside for a week waiting for me to get around to collecting it.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/03/579.jpg

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/03/580.jpg

Time to go order myself some new bits I think. I've had a look at my springs and they aren't in great shape, showing broken leaves and the like. I'm thinking I might splash out and buy myself some parabolics, I've been told they're a good thing. So long as they don't make the prop shaft rub on the chassis, it would seem...

Looking forward to finally getting into the rebuild proper now. Unfortunately I'm back at uni (final year!), so I expect the process will basically grind to a halt again. I'll get it finished one day.

-Martin

[turkeybrain]

Looking forward to finally getting into the rebuild proper now. Unfortunately I'm back at uni (final year!), so I expect the process will basically grind to a halt again. I'll get it finished one day.

-Martin

I was more right about progress grinding to a halt than I knew...

After a short 3,197 day break (8 years and 9 months), Project Serenity is finally back on.

Plenty has happened since my last post.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5296.jpg

We're in a different shed.

Comparing old and new, the chassis is also sitting on the rotisserie differently. I don't think that counts as progress though.

Admittedly plenty has happened to get Serenity into that new shed; graduated for uni, couldn't find work as an engineer so worked as a teacher's aide for a year, found my first (and so far only; just ticked over 7 years) engineering job, got married, bought a house, made some necessary repairs to house that was thankfully in our budget, had a daughter, built a shed, broke and repaired my daily drive repeatedly, broke and repaired my wife's daily drive repeatedly, et cetera.

The breaking and repairing of our dailies has been foundational to the renewed enthusiasm for Serenity. My wife is fully supportive of my project car (as an example, she was happy for me build a shed specifically to work on cars) as she grew up four wheel driving with her family, and would like to do the same for our daughter. As such, Serenity is planned to be my daily drive, plus our camping and four wheel drive bus. We also hope to do a round-Australia trip at some point in Serenity

Given the insane price of cars at the moment, we're not real keen on buying a car, or cars, to only keep for a year or two. In other words I need to get my act together and get Serenity registered before both of our dailies become (more of) a burden.

I've set myself an aggressive timeline of taking Serenity camping in Summer 2022. No pressure... But one has to have goals.

I've also managed to secure the assistance of a good mate who has taken on the role of chief project manager. He believes his role is to harass me about project milestones every couple of days. I think I've created a monster there, but I do need to be kept accountable (see: 9 years without progress). Here's the project plan he wrote on the whiteboard in my shed.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5295.jpg

So, what has been happening with Serenity?

A few things. Some controversial. Please leave your pitchforks in the garden shed, decisions have already been made and won't be unmade.

As Serenity is going to be my daily, and also going to be a long range tourer, I need something that has a good range. Thinking about the petrol 2.25, I really struggled to deal with the projected fuel usage. It would be difficult to get the range up to over 1000 km without refilling. I looked into purchasing a 2.25 diesel, but I also would like to be able to go up hills with some degree of pace to not be a burden to other motorists. Throwing a turbo on a 2.25D seemed risky, as the bottom end apparently can take offense. As such, I've elected to do an engine conversion, changing over to a 300Tdi removed from a 1996 Discovery. The conversion is relatively unintrusive as far as conversions go as it will retain the original gearbox and doesn't require sweeping chassis modifications. I'm not going to discard the 2.25 though, I plan to retain it long term in case I ever want to return the car to original condition. I also plan to keep the exterior as close to standard as possible, I have zero interest in making it look like a modified 4x4. I'm honestly kind of upset with myself, I'm generally not a fan of modified cars, yet here we are.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5299.jpg

The donor car is a sad story. The people I bought it off had been looking around for a while, specifically for a Disco 1 for sentimental reasons, and thought they found a good one. They bought it sight unseen (unable to leave the state at the time) from NSW for quite a tidy sum. When trying to register it in Tasmania it was discovered that it had both airbag and ABS issues. Justin Cooper had a look at it and determined it would cost something like $6000 to repair, and the owners tossed in the towel. I've taken the engine and a few other bits, and have sold the body on to another fanatic nearby. I dropped the body off last weekend, and got quite distracted looking at their 2x Disco ute projects, TD5 powered Disco 1 (yes, you read that right), 2x Series, Defender, 2 door RRC, and 101 ambulance. I didn't take any photos. The body will be spare panels for the TD5, the axles are to be rebuilt to stronger specifications and dropped under a ute, and the chassis might end up under a Series body if they can make it legal.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20210313_182833.jpg

I always intended for Serenity to be lightly modified to make it more usable long term. This certainly wasn't what I originally considered, but I think it should be a good thing. You can all hold me to originality on my Series 1, I'll make up for what I'm doing to the 2A on the S1 project.

So a few other bits and pieces have happened on and off over the last few years.

I've bought a Salisbury for the rear, removed from a Series 3. That's been repainted in POR15. Twice, as I didn't like the finish I initially achieved. Same for the front axle, I took that back to bare metal (again) and repainted it in POR15.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5302.jpg

Unfortunately the axles were stored in less than ideal conditions while suitable sheds were constructed, and the stub axles on the Salisbury have a tiny bit of surface corrosion on them. I will have to clean them up and see if they're still serviceable. I think the other side of the stub is the worse side. I have managed to acquire a second Salisbury, so the stubs on that might get a guernsey.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5303.jpg

I also bought the roof and walls from the S3, and plan to use those bits to get rid of the shooting hatch that came with Serenity and to use the S3 upper seatbelt mounts. I think the walls and roof should bolt up OK to the 2A tub?

There's a set of parabolic springs hidden in the shed somewhere. I think I know where they are. I found the dampers.

The bulkhead which I showed in post #69 is fully repaired and is sitting around in primer.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5301.jpg

My first milestone is to get to the point of having a rolling chassis, so my attention is focused on axles, suspension and steering. Unfortunately the real first thing I have to do is figure out where everything is (9 years plus moving from one house to another really helps). It looks like I have some parts to finish building up axles, but also need a some more, in particular for the later addition Salisbury.

On the topic of axles and wheels, it seems that the S2 and S2A ran 9/16 BSF (~14.28 mm major diameter) wheel studs, and S3s ran M16 studs. From what I can tell from notes online and from experimenting with the rims and hubs I have on hand, it seems that both stud sizes worked on the same rims. Can somebody confirm this is correct, as that seems utterly bizarre to me! I believe the rims I should be running to suit either studs are 272309, where would I find this number stamped on the rim? I recall being shown ~10 years ago, but the specifics are no longer in my memory.

I think that ends this update. There should be more soon.

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

I'm in a weird position where I want to do things, but don't have a clue what I can do with the parts I have on hand, nor do I know what needs to be done. It's becoming clear that I'm going to need to buy a bunch of parts, but I'm holding off on making any purchases until after Christmas.

I found some Rover pinion seals in my stocks purchased 10 ish years ago, so the plan for tonight was to attempt replacing one of those. A quick review of the workshop manual this morning indicated I am missing a gasket, so that plan went nowhere fast.

OK... I've got swivel rebuild kits, I should be able to do those. Let's go!

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5305.jpg

I had a minor heart attack when i first looked at the outer spline, thinking it had been heavily damaged and basically stripped.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5307.jpg

I'm pleased to say that's just my bad memory at it again, and that the new drive flange fits on very nicely. For the record, I do plan to install it the right way round when the time comes...
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5310.jpg

The swivel and seals have seen better days, and it seems I made the right call however long ago to replace them with new units.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5312.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5313.jpg

The left hand side swivel and half shaft have been a mystery since I first removed it from the car. No amount of hammer blows (with a block of wood) would release the shaft from the hub. The other side came apart with zero effort. I think I've finally figured out what's going on...
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5314.jpg

Plenty of wear on the bearing sleeve, inevitably thanks to the fine grade of mud used as lubricant. It's not super clear in the photo below, but there's an obvious shoulder where the bearing used to run and where it didn't, and the rollers are getting caught up on this step. So now I know what's wrong, but that doesn't mean I'm any closer to resolving the issue. My neighbours probably don't want me to keep trying to remove it at this time of night... And anyway, this looks like I'm going to need more parts! Though hopefully I'll still be able to clean up and rebuild the swivels and offer the half shaft up later.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5315.jpg

Cheers,
Martin.

[turkeybrain]

A slightly better photo of the lip on the sleeve. Hammers alone have not worked, though there's evidence of some progress.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5327.jpg

Taking the lip off with a Dremel has done the job in the end. Still took a fair beating with a mallet though.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5329.jpg

Preparations for festivities are going to take up the rest of my week, hopefully I'll be able to get into tearing down the two swivels (if I can find the other...) early next week.

Cheers,
Martin

[gromit]

On the topic of axles and wheels, it seems that the S2 and S2A ran 9/16 BSF (~14.28 mm major diameter) wheel studs, and S3s ran M16 studs. From what I can tell from notes online and from experimenting with the rims and hubs I have on hand, it seems that both stud sizes worked on the same rims. Can somebody confirm this is correct, as that seems utterly bizarre to me! I believe the rims I should be running to suit either studs are 272309, where would I find this number stamped on the rim? I recall being shown ~10 years ago, but the specifics are no longer in my memory.



The wheels don't fit tight on the studs, the taper on the nut locates in the recess in the wheel. This means the stud size isn't critical.

Wheels are interchangeable regardless of the stud size.


Colin

[turkeybrain]

Thanks Colin,

Well done finding the question in that massive wall of text, and thanks for confirming my understanding. I can only imagine the joy the engineer who made the change to M16 felt when they realised the change would be backwards compatible.

If hubs are the same front and rear, I think I'll use the hubs from my spare Salisbury on the front to keep the threads common rather than mixed.

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

Festivities have concluded and work has resumed. With 17 days away from my day job, I thought I'd get lots done on Serenity... Nope!

I haven't wasted time though. While away visiting family, I put together a list of all parts required to get to the stage of rolling chassis and placed the order. Returning home, I've made a few quality of life improvements in the shed which will pay off in the long run, like mounting the parts washer on wheels prior to making it 50+ kg heavier. I've also kicked other cans down the road, for example some progress has been made on the boat winch concept for hauling the rolling chassis in and out of the shed when the time comes.

Anyway, I'm back onto Land Rovers once more. Last night I stripped the left hand swivel, and located and stripped the right hand swivel.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5331.jpg

As always with this car, it has been an archeological experience. It was abundantly obvious that the left hand swivel has been apart before.

Some of the seal retainer fasteners had spring washers, some of them plain washers, some even had both. One of them even had a different, full send, thread! Close enough for a government job, I suppose. As an aside, this is a saying I picked up from a lecturer at uni; it is a lament of mine that I work in private industry, but that doesn't stop me using it every day.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5339.jpg

At the bottom, the steering arm was held on with 4x bolts. At the top, we find 2x bolts and 2x studs. I also note the absence of any retention plate on the left hand side.http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5336.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5337.jpg

I only noticed that retention plates were a thing once I found them on the right hand side! (Photo taken after I undid all the tabs. I take photos as I pull things apart for my own reference as things go back together, I pick a selection to post on here. Some are better than others.) On this side we find 4 studs on the top.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5345.jpg

On the bottom, we find only 3 studs and a massive pile of grease. These were all finger tight. One wonders how much longer until there was only one or no studs left holding on the steering arm.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5348.jpg

From the research I've done since then, it seems that neither of these had the standard setup of bolts and studs. There should be 3x 531494 and 1x 531043 studs through the steering arm, and 4x 237357 bolts through the top Railko bearing. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

So, looks like I don't have enough bits to get to a rolling chassis as I don't know enough to go mucking with the setup engineered by Land Rover (though I have just remember I have another front axle of unknown origin that might have bits I can pilfer), so more buying parts it is. Postal services are unsurprisingly running very slow just at the moment, but when you live in regional Tassie, there's not too many other options, it is what it is.

Cheers,
Martin

[Johnno1969]

Great to see this thread kick off again. Sometimes a 3197 day break is just what we need. [smilebigeye]

[turkeybrain]

Great to see this thread kick off again. Sometimes a 3197 day break is just what we need. [smilebigeye]

Misquoting Jeff Goldblum in Jurassic Park, "Life, uh, gets in the way". It's nice to be in a position to work on it again.

Answering a question I had earlier in case it helps somebody in the future: where do you find the part number on a Land Rover Series wheel rim? It's on the outer face between stud holes. They are apparently easily covered by multiple layers of paint, hence not being able to find it on the first rim I looked at. To be fair, I still haven't found it on the other rim, but at least I know where to look.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5351.jpg

Not much progress today, just cleaning 65-odd years of gunge and grease off parts so they can be blasted and repainted. Hopefully this process will become much less time consuming once the degreaser for my parts washer arrives. I also need to purchase some softish brushes, screwdrivers and rags are only so good.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5353.jpg

Cheers,
Martin

[Tins]

You call all this "Serenity" ??

[turkeybrain]

The name is most certainly ironic.

"How's the serenity?"
-Darryl Kerrigan, The Castle

It's only in the last couple of months I've actually figured out the true appeal of pretty much any of my hobbies, thanks to "Mr. Happy Finds a Hobby (https://mrmen.fandom.com/wiki/Mr._Happy_Finds_a_Hobby)". I've never identified more with a character in a book than I did with Mr. Grumble.

Cheers,
Martin

[Tins]

Tell 'im 'e's dreamin'?

[turkeybrain]

From the research I've done since then, it seems that neither of these had the standard setup of bolts and studs. There should be 3x 531494 and 1x 531043 studs through the steering arm, and 4x 237357 bolts through the top Railko bearing. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

Looks like I was wrong. There are supposed to be 2x of each stud on the bottom of each swivel. The special stud 531043 has a larger diameter section in the middle and is used similar to a dowel to locate the steering arms.

Some new tools have arrived in the shed. A press, and some bearing drivers. Obviously the best thing to do is give them a go.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5354.jpg

Success! I even tried on actual bearing races. Both Series 3 hubs have finally had their bearings and races removed, ready to be tidied up and new bearings to be fitted.

I couldn't get a bearing press plate onto the the outer race of the inner bearing, so had to, ahem, manufacture a tool.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5355.jpg

Honestly, I can't believe that screwdriver has lasted as long as it has. It's copped a lot of abuse (and very few screws) over the past 15 years. Anyway, even without a handle it's still useful for removing bearing races, and axle hub caps. The poor screwdriver isn't as straight as it was at the beginning of today.

As I alluded to in my previous post, I have a couple of mystery axles which I picked up in a paddock. The only thing I know about them is that the Salisbury has a 4.7:1 diff in it (it would have stayed in the paddock if it didn't).
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5359.jpg

But it also has M16 wheel studs, so I'll clean these hubs up and press them (sorry) into service. I'm not super keen on 9/16 BSF on the front axle and M16 on the rear. I suppose I could get creative and use a cross pattern, but it probably doesn't have the same advantages as crossing different tyre compounds on your rally car.

I would show you photos of the hubs removed from the Salisbury as that has happened, but apparently I didn't take any photos. To be fair, I don't need that much oil on my camera. I'm wearing nitriles underneath my cut resistant gloves to keep my hands a bit cleaner, and have noticed I'm leaving hand prints on whatever I touch.

On the topic of mystery axles, I have some questions about the front mystery axle.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5367.jpg

It has drum brakes, 9/16 BSF wheel studs, and a later style swivel hub as the steering arms are on the bottom. I'm guessing it's from a Series 2A given the configuration of stud size and steering arm position. It also has some pretty serious reinforcing. Serenity's original housing does not have this. Would this reinforcing have been used on military vehicles? Is the stiffening worthwhile? I could swap to this housing, but I'm disinclined to do so without good reason as Serenity's original housing has already been cleaned up and is ready to have parts reinstalled.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20161110_170925.jpg

Just look how shiny it is! 3rd time's the charm.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20161110_170940.jpg

Anyway, back to the mystery axle, it also seems to have what may have once been some olive drab, which has certainly made me think military thoughts. I'm curious to know more.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5369.jpg

The mystery axle also has a sensible number of studs through the steering arms. Much less of a death trap. I'll have to pull these out and inspect to see if they're still serviceable. There' a lot of rust on them.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5365.jpg

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

Things have been quietly moving on Serenity (excepting a 5 week gap doing pro bono consulting on an interesting, yet completely separate from any of my normal hobbies and profession, project for a family member), but posting has been more difficult, not a lot has been worthy of photographs, and I've been so completely covered in grease I haven't been brave enough to touch my camera.

My 5 year (~35 cm) long beard is gone, replaced with a clean shaven face, all in the name of being able to properly wear a half mask respirator. My 4 year old daughter had to be involved in shaving that off so I didn't frighten her. The dog took a few days to warm back up too.

Having fired up my parts washer, I've been cleaning up axle components. Both original front stub axles are, in short, ruined. This yet again proves mud is a useless lubricant. Tidying up the swivel hubs, I have discovered a previous owner decided not to go out and buy the correct 7/16 BSF studs, but instead to send 1/2" UNC bolts in their place. The threads aren't particularly tidy, so I suspect they were formed with a bolt. I noticed the issue when the 7/16 tap fell into the hole I was planning to clean.

Instead of rushing out and spending money on parts, I've pulled down the mystery axle featured in my last post. even though it has obviously been stored outside for a long time, it has remained largely sealed and most internals are still good. The short side swivel seal has leaked and the UJ is corroded, but the inner seal has done its job and no water made it further than that. The long side swivel hasn't leaked, so I've got a spare UJ shaft in heaps better condition than my original. The external condition of all parts is really rough, but should still clean up OK. Both stub axles appear to be serviceable, as do both swivels. I think I'll need to replace a spacer on one of the stubs, but as far as I can tell they're practically consumable. All in all, I think I've got enough bits in good enough condition to continue.

I've also decided now, as I already had to break open some brake drums, is a good time to get rid of all the various possibly asbestos components floating around the shed. The engine and gearbox were separated last night and the clutch and clutch housing are in an asbestos bag alongside the brake drums, shoes and backing plates from the axle. I've been debating what to do with the flywheel and its housing, and have landed on leaving it on the engine, wrapping it in a garbage bag and pretending nothing happened, mostly because I'm not planning to use the engine in the short term. It's tucked well out of the way under a work bench up against a wall so shouldn't be disturbed.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5410.jpg

I'm part way through pulling the handbrake apart at the moment. There's little risk of dust coming off that though, as there's more than enough grease and oil to keep it fully contained... I'm pleased I'd already decided to splurge on an Ashcroft high ratio transfer case as the axial and radial movement at the rear output flange of the transfer case feels like it could be measured in whole millimetres. The handbrake drum is also the only drum I've pulled off so far that might possibly be reusable, so that's nice.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5430.jpg

Overall, no show stoppers, but not nearly as much progress as there should have been.

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

In my hunt for asbestos dust I've accidentally begun to strip the gearbox and transfer cases so I can clean up bell housings and the like. I was planning to get into the gearbox sooner rather than later so this is the opposite of a problem, but it has come as a surprise to me.

I've finally got around to draining the gearbox and transfer case oils. The gearbox initially came out a nasty black colour before clearing up. The sump plug cavity shows signs of brass, but no large chunks. I am planning a complete gearbox rebuild, so this isn't the end of the world, just something to note before stripping anything further.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5440.jpg

The transfer case oil looked much cleaner, but the sump plug cavity threw a lot of glitter and the odd tooth chunk. Again, I'm planning a rebuild, so not the end of the world, but not ideal.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5439.jpg

I'm also guessing the shafts shouldn't move quite this much by hand. I'm curious to know what I'll find when I crack open the casings.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=__wRLq5MCKM

When I bought the vehicle the handbrake lever was physically disconnected from the drum actuator. I had always assumed a pin had fallen out of its own accord and nobody had bothered to fix it as it was a farm bus. Having now pulled the handbrake apart, I'm suspicious it may have been intentionally disabled...

The first thing I noticed (other than all the grease and oil seen in the image in the last post) was the adjuster unit was sitting crooked after I removed the drum (this is also noticeable in the image in the previous post). Pulling the shoes off was easier than anticipated because the adjuster came out with them. Wondering why the adjuster came straight out, I consulted a workshop manual and realised the fasteners and backing plate holding the adjusters in had vanished prior to me looking at it. It turns out the only reason the adjuster was still vaguely in the correct position is one of the studs had caught and not made it all the way out of the hole. And there it stayed for a long time judging by the size of the groove worn in the stud (top right of image)!

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/handbrake-adjuster.jpg

One immediately wonders what the backing plate thought of this...

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5442.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5444.jpg

It didn't enjoy it much, by the looks of things.

Then there's the actuator. It was extremely sloppy in the hole. Eventually I managed to clean off enough grime to be able to figure out how it was attached and removed the clips.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5445.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5447.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5449.jpg

I'm guessing the groove isn't supposed to be deep enough to see the rod on one side.

It looks like I'm going to need to source practically an entire handbrake assembly as none of this looks particularly serviceable. Except maybe the drum, but there's evidence of that being out of round too. Given the state of everything else, I'd consider putting money on it having been skimmed far enough that it can't be done again.

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

I've been languishing on the project in recent times for a variety of reasons, but with the long weekend my brother in law, a fellow old 4wd enthusiast (he's a G60 Patrol collector) who was heavily involved in me buying Serenity in the first place, offered to give me a hand. With an extra set of hands, it seemed like a good time to tackle the gearbox tear down as one of us could operate a camera to document what goes where while the other spun spanners.

I had previously removed the bell housing and given it a good clean, it seems to be in reasonable shape.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5473.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5492.jpg

On to the main event.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5504.jpg

With an extra pair of hands manning the camera, we can now get action shots.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5525.jpg

The transfer case oil might not look too good, and there's definitely signs the transfer case has been used, but from a cursory inspection I'm pleasantly surprised by its overall condition. No obvious damage other than typical wear. Though with the new engine, I do plan to put in an Ashcroft high ratio gear set so it will be largely rebuilt anyway.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5528.jpg

Removing the gearbox from the transfer case.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5582.jpg

And removing the front output shaft housing from the transfer case.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5600.jpg

We tried to begin stripping down the transfer case itself, but came unstuck when we realised I hadn't replaced the circlip pliers I broke 6 years ago (sigh). Instead we've begun on the front output housing. Overall, everything is looking OK, hopefully there won't be too much to replace overall, just bearings and the like, but that remains to be seen. It perhaps wasn't as much progress as I'd wanted, but at least it was some, hopefully I can keep the momentum going.

On another note, if anybody is in any doubt, buying a set of Whitworth sockets and spanners is well worth it if working on these gearboxes. I removed the bell housing without them and bought a set in the intervening time. It's much easier to work on these when you're not approximating between a metric and AF set.

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

While I may not have been posting much, there's been a little bit of progress quietly happening.

The gearbox is still in pieces, and will be for the rest of the year. It's no longer getting a full rebuild either, just a reassemble. As I'm swapping the engine, I've decided to rebuild the transfer case with Ashcroft's high ratio kit. Reading thoroughly, it turns out that requires a 36 tooth low range output gear, and my box appears to be a Series 2/2A suffix A box with a 39 tooth gear. (I still haven't found a serial number for the gearbox, which I assume is because bits have been swapped around at some stage, there are other signs I've spotted which indicate it's been apart before.) I did look at whether I could modify it to work still, but have decided all of the changes which were brought in with later versions are worth having, so I've gone and bought a Series 3 box to rebuild instead, partly because it's going to be a bit stronger than the early 2A box, partly because it will suit the high ratio kit, and partly because I don't want to learn to drive a non-synchromesh box which I've just rebuilt. The 2A box will be reassembled and kept for when I inevitably turn the S3 box into glitter at some point in the future.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221114_213924.jpg

In an attempt to make more consistent progress, I've externalised my motivation. That is, I have given a mate, Ben, permission to hound me, daily, with what needs to be done and whether I've done it. We have weekly project management meetings, and he chases up action items throughout the rest of the week. He is relishing the role a little too much. However, the proof is in the pudding, and I've made much more progress since he's been bugging me daily.

The main goal at the moment is to have a rolling chassis before Christmas. It's coming along, but we do have a number of risk items, namely the chassis has not yet had its repair weld tests completed, and I'm not prepared to put it on wheels prior to that, and I apparently need to replace the steering relay. It sounds like it's full of sand. It may well be, it was fitted when the chassis was sandblasted. I am not looking forward to getting the old one out.

I've elected to use the mystery front axle housing, as it isn't covered in dents and scrapes, and it has substantial reinforcement sections fitted to it. It's been an invaluable source of parts, donating the differential, housing, one swivel hub, one half shaft, and two stub axles to the cause. Or most of the front axle, if you prefer!

I'm primarily prepping for paint at the moment, with most parts having been degreased and acid washed prior to coating (which I should have been doing tonight, but I've done pretty much anything I can to avoid it, including writing this post, Ben will not be pleased).

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221114_213935.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221114_213944.jpg

Old, most likely to be discarded bits on the left, parts partly prepared for use on the right.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221114_214012.jpg

I'm also working on rebuilding the half shaft universal joints and replacing bearing races ready for imminent installation.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221114_214003.jpg

My shed is a mess...

Does anybody have any suggestions for reinstalling the bearings on the half shafts? My current leading theory is a piece of plate with a DIA 36.0 mm hole welded to a chunk of pipe to use as a slide hammer.

Cheers,
Martin

[Cadas]

A cheap press work perfectly fine and ends up getting used on all sorts of stuff. I think mine was less than $200 on sale from supercheap

I’d tried hitting a few bits with hammers and while generally fine, there were casualties which end up costing time and money. The gentle pressing in of bearings on a press is very satisfying.

[turkeybrain]

Thanks Cadas. I have a press, now that you've brought my mind back to it, I reckon I can make it work, thanks for making me think it through again.

I did eventually manage to convince myself to do some painting last night. It did involve an 8:15 pm Bunnings run when I couldn't find the paintbrush I bought for the task several months back. There will be another batch of parts which need to be painted, but first I must prep them.

I'm not 100% happy with the finish, I think I've laid it on a bit thin in places (but if it's too thick it bubbles, so it could be worse), and this product doesn't like being re-coated, so it is what it is. At the end of the day, they're axles, are they really supposed to be shiny?

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221117_130033.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221117_130001.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221117_125909.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221117_125934.jpg

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

There's been poor progress during evenings this week, mostly because work has been a bit interesting. So that means I haven't finished cleaning up and painting the rest of the bits and pieces which need to be painted. I did, however, find the head space to finally pore over parts manuals to figure out which bolts I needed to buy in to build up the axles. I had hoped to buy a full restoration bolt kit, but I'm having trouble getting through to my selected supplier, and the show must go on.

Today was set aside for a job I had hoped I'd be able to ignore and never ever have to do - replace the steering relay. My previous attitude was head in the sand, she'll be right mate. However, about a month ago I put multigrips on the end of the relay and gave it a turn. With a tiny movement, any hopes I had of it being OK were dashed, it sounded like it was full of grit. I decided to buy a new one, as time is running out and I don't need to muck around with pulling one down, determining what I need to buy, waiting for bits to arrive, and reassembling it. Which brings us back to today, relay day.

I enlisted Ben's assistance, and together we embarked.

It's probably worth mentioning at this point that my chassis is on a 'rotisserie' (75 mm galvanised pipe poked through the serendipitous hole in the chassis), so we're working with the chassis upside down. The bottom of the chassis is at the top of the photos.

Pulling the bottom retainer plate off (50% of the bolts sheared off, not a good sign), it was everything I was dreading.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221126_111153.jpg

Hitting the bottom of the relay with a 4 lb mallet, we began to see nothing apparent happening at the top. But it was happening at the bottom, we were unintentionally removing the relay shaft. This wasn't a big drama (if you pretend there isn't a spring inside), the noise I previously described had me convinced there was no hope for this relay. Once we noticed this was happening, we tied a piece of foam around the bottom of the chassis to catch anything exciting, and dressed up in even more safety gear.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221126_115204.jpg

I'm pleased to report it was all pretty boring. The bottom plate broke off, but the spring didn't manage to eject anything, and was actually stuck partly compressed on the shaft even after it had been removed from the housing. Using a Dremel, we cut the spring in a few spots to fully remove any residual tension. I've read these are supposed to be lubricated with oil. I've also read grease doesn't really do much good. There wasn't any evidence that either grease or oil had ever been in the relay, it was bone dry and rusty. I had expected it to be full of blasting media, but it was just full of rust.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221126_155050.jpg


http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221126_155027.jpg

Back to the relay housing, we continued work with the 4 lb mallet. Is that progress I see?
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221126_123211.jpg

Indeed it is!
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221126_123219.jpg
With only a little more bashing it fell out!
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221126_123717.jpg

Unsurprisingly, there's some repair work to be done. Does anybody know what the inner diameter of the tube is supposed to be?
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221126_123721.jpg

All that in time for lunch, much faster than expected.

With our afternoon, we re-tackled the seized track rod end we've been working on for a week. A vice, and myself with a pipe wrench resisted rotation, while Ben threw his entire body weight behind a large set of multigrips. With much effort, finally it came free. Remarkably, the thread looks to be in great condition, so reusing that track rod is looking good.

With that out of the way, we have begun removing the old bushes from the chassis. We've been able to remove all of the centre tubes and rubber, but I have 3 outer shells to remove during the week. Oddly, there seems to be one spot where the bush had already fallen out. The remaining ones are pretty knackered, so this isn't even surprising.

Overall, it's been a great day, achieving much more than I'd expected, more easily than I'd expected. We'll call that a win.

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

The main goal at the moment is to have a rolling chassis before Christmas.

Swing and a miss...

Everything* is painted, ready for reassembly.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221209_185955.jpg

*If you ignore the brake backing plates I painted 10 years which may have gone rusty while in storage, and I'm avoiding looking at because of... reasons? Then there's the bit where I painted the steering lever which had 1/2" UNC bolts through it. Sigh.

Reassembly has begun. It has not gone smoothly. It's my own fault really. I say some silly things, and my project manager likes to remind me. This is written on the project whiteboard in the shed:

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221219_205943.jpg

So far I've successfully installed 8 studs, and 1 oil seal.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/20221219_212836.jpg

I've learned a lot this year. Like how not to install oil seals. The first went well, the second went less well. New ones are on order. Sigh.

I had organised to buy a replacement stub axle on Tuesday this week from a guy down south when I was practically driving past his front door (about 4 hours away from my place), but alas we got the 'rona, cut plans short and headed home a day early without stopping. Sigh. My father-in-law intends to pick the stub axle up in a few weeks.

My plans for this week involved landscaping the back yard. Instead, there's been a whole lot of not much going on, which does mean there will be a job debt to be paid later, the back yard has not landscaped itself.

It's not all doom and gloom though. Even though I've missed my self imposed deadline this year, I've made clear progress, something which has been lacking for a long time. The plan for next year is to build on that momentum. I'm not really sure it's possible, but I'd really love to take Serenity camping next Christmas. That's the goal, I've said it out loud (well, written it down, close enough). But it is, without a doubt, a massive stretch.

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

I'm back on my feet again, and have continued working on Serenity.

I have located the brake backing plates which I had previously sandblasted and painted. Alas, they are rusty. Not very rusty, but I'm struggling to justify installing rusty parts on my new restoration, so that needed to be fixed.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230106_032236631.jpg

After quite a few hours swinging off the back of a sandblasting cabinet over about 3 days, they are all rust-free, ready for repainting. Sandblasting was more painful than it should have been, my compressor has been getting sad and loud over the past year. It all came to a head when it started popping its overload protection while blasting. Turns out the bolt holding the pulley onto the compressor shaft had come loose, so was an easy fix. It's much quieter now, my wife was wondering why she could no longer hear it inside the house. It still wasn't initially playing nicely after tightening the nut, but letting it thoroughly cool overnight solved that and it's back up and running at full tilt, ready for further mistreatment and neglect.

I should change its oil.

Speaking of oil, the replacement oil seal arrived, and I managed to install it on Tuesday night without trashing it this time. Turns out you can't just hit them with a hammer, it's important to have something stiff which sits over the whole diameter of the seal to spread the hits and keep things straight. I won't make that mistake again! (I probably will.) I now have a spare as I bought two even though I only had one left to install, I don't trust myself.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230110_085024941.jpg

As you can also see, I've remembered to fit the swivel seal and retainer, with an eye to putting a new ball on. It was a close run thing, but I did eventually remember I was also supposed to fit a bearing to the back of the ball before I offer it up to the axle housing. I did test fit the ball before I remembered the bearing. The angle between the opposing faces on the swivel ball make them a bit of a challenge to press in bearings. There were a couple of heart-in-mouth moments as the bearing went in crooked before I got the packing angle right and it went in really easily.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230110_092921140.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230110_093029446.jpg

Installing the ball onto the axle housing was more interesting than I wanted it to be. Turns out the reinforced axle housings have a thicker flange than standard, requiring 1/8" longer bolts. Guess who didn't know that and bought the standard 1-1/4" bolts? The good news is the longer 1-3/8" bolts are used on the rear axle to hold the brake backing plate onto the rear Salisbury axle, so I've robbed Peter to pay Paul. Replacements are on order, along with a couple of 1-1/2" ones for where the stop plate is located. 5 out of 6 will do for now.

The picture below is slightly misleading. You might think I'd put anti-seize on the bolts, given the proximity of the can. Or I might have used it to grease the flange faces. But no, we've gone with moly grease on the flange faces, and Loctite 242 on the Nylock nuts. I'm pretty confident I'm going to live to regret my belt-and-braces approach to fastener retention the moment the swivel seal begins leaking oil. However, I also don't want to see these part company with the vehicle for any reason while on the move... I plan to run oil rather than one shot grease in the swivel hubs, I've settled on running Penrite 80W-90 GL-5 in the axles, gearbox, and transfer case. Penrite claim it's safe for yellow metal, and they recommend it for each of those components in the the Series 1 and Series 3, but not the 2A... I'd have considered their Mild EP, which they recommend for the 2A, if anybody sold it in Tasmania.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230110_105726770.jpg

This evening's effort has involved painting everything I previously blasted, so I can begin installing the right hand side swivel ball tomorrow night. Then it will be on to setting up the new swivel bearings, which sounds like a real hoot.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230111_105640035.jpg

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

Some sensible progress this week.

I finished assembling the second swivel ball. I did it twice because this time I forgot to fit the oil seal. I noticed before the Loctite set though, it could have been much worse.http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230112_102802578.jpg

That was only the first of several blunders. The eagle eyed amongst you may have spotted I didn't fit the Railko or tapered roller bearing races to the ball. That made for some interesting work in the press, but we got there.http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230117_083430306.jpg

Fitting the long side swivel hub.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230117_095549278.jpg

Setting the bearing pre-load is a fairly easy process, but it did take some time and a few attempts until it was sitting in the correct range. One side proceeded to tighten up overnight and had to be reset the following day. One is sitting at 14 lb, the other at 13 lb, so I'm pretty happy with that. For anybody wondering, thicker shims equates to less pre-load and therefore less torque required to turn the swivel hub.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230119_085911769.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230119_103549831.jpg

The next job is to replace the pinion seal on the Rover diff, which looks to be a relatively simple process. Replacement half shafts should be dropped off this afternoon, so I should be able to rebuild the UJ on the short side (I have previously rebuilt the long side) and install the diffs and half shafts, then begin building up the stub axle and wheel bearings.

Cheers,
Martin

[Johnno1969]

Good to hear the latest progess. Interesting to read of the swivel pre-load changing overnight. Curious.

Keep forging ahead!

John

[turkeybrain]

The changing preload has me a bit confused. Having reset it on Friday night, I checked it Monday night and it has drifted again. One side went from 14 lb to 15 lb (nothing much to worry about here), but the other side went from 13 lb to 21 lb.

I thoroughly lubricated the bearing and bush before the initial installation on Thursday night and didn't add extra oil during resetting on Friday night. I'm not sure whether this is enough of an issue to be worried about it. If it is, I don't really know how to fix it other than throwing a different set of new railko bushes at it.

Cheers,
Martin

[Johnno1969]

This might be a silly question, but if you work the one which jumped from 13 to 21lbs back and forth by hand for a while, does the reading then come down closer to that obtained originally?

[turkeybrain]

That's definitely not a silly question.

I had given it a couple of priming wiggles previously, that didn't seem to do much. I just went back out and gave it a whole heap (in excess of 20 cycles), it felt like it was loosening up a little as I did it. It dropped from low 20s to around 17-18 lb, which is an improvement, but still out of spec.

Might this be one of those things which will settle once it's mobile? I don't know.

Cheers,
Martin

[Johnno1969]

That's definitely not a silly question.

I had given it a couple of priming wiggles previously, that didn't seem to do much. I just went back out and gave it a whole heap (in excess of 20 cycles), it felt like it was loosening up a little as I did it. It dropped from low 20s to around 17-18 lb, which is an improvement, but still out of spec.

Might this be one of those things which will settle once it's mobile? I don't know.

Cheers,
Martin

It might be worth setting the pre-load again and then leaving it overnight or a few days. If it changes again, sit and wiggle it for a while (changing hands for cup of tea occasionally) and see what happens. It may take several cups of tea.

John

[turkeybrain]

That sounds like a good plan. There's definitely a temptation to set the pre-load low too. I'll have another go early next week when I get a chance.

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

After much exercising of the hub, it still sat at 23 lb.

I've pulled it apart, absolutely smothered it in oil, and put it back together. The initial reading sat at 12 lb (noting I didn't touch shims, the previous initial reading was 12 lb).

Having left it for half an hour, it's already up to 16 lb.

I tightened the bolts up in a diagonal/long/diagonal/long pattern, starting at 20 ft.lb, then 30, 40, and finishing at 50 ft.lb. It doesn't seem like the shims are settling as the bolts are not becoming loose as the preload increases.

Sigh. I'll check it again tomorrow. Does anybody know if this will cause issues?

Cheers,
Martin

[Cadas]

Perhaps consider fiction,

Friction is an issue with preload in engineering situations. High friction can lead to over torquing.

Ensure the threads and bolts are clean and lightly lubricated.

The other issue I had was the measurement device and the initial inertia when it is first used.

[turkeybrain]

Thank you for the suggestions!

I'm using new bolts (part number 237357) and have run a 7/16-BSF tap through the threads in the swivel casting prior to reassembly. I'm using Loctite C5-A copper anti-seize as a thread lubricant.

I don't have another measurement device to compare to, but it's at least the same device making the measurements each time. The extra force required to overcome initial friction is relatively minor when first assembled, but I've seen over 40 lb once it has settled with time. The numbers I'm using are what I'm reading off while in motion, rather than the ultimate force required. I'll see if I can get a video of it in action when I have a second set of hands in the shed this evening.

Cheers,
Martin

[Cadas]

The initial inertia will always be high, it’s the secondary movement which is the real measure but it sounds as though you are doing that.

An increasing preload would come from either friction, heat or possibly something in the bottom of the hole.

Thought would be too maybe torque to 75%, leave overnight and final torque the next day.

I rebuilt all of mine and had the right preload. When I first drove Sid the steering was tight, but after 20-30 miles it loosened up beautifully. There will be a certain amount of bedding in with new stuff

[turkeybrain]

Sitting at 24 lb dynamic friction this evening, a 100% increase over what I measured last night.


https://youtu.be/KHPbCp9r3TQ


When I first drove Sid the steering was tight, but after 20-30 miles it loosened up beautifully. There will be a certain amount of bedding in with new stuff

With this in mind, I think I might leave it be and hope it settles down once it has a bit of weight and a few miles under its belt.

Onward with installing the diff!

Cheers,
Martin

[Johnno1969]

Sitting at 24 lb dynamic friction this evening, a 100% increase over what I measured last night.

Well, that being the case, it sounds like there's only one rational explanation:

Aliens.

[Johnno1969]

P.S. Yep, quite likely it will settle in alright with use.

[Cadas]

Sitting at 24 lb dynamic friction this evening, a 100% increase over what I measured last night.


https://youtu.be/KHPbCp9r3TQ



With this in mind, I think I might leave it be and hope it settles down once it has a bit of weight and a few miles under its belt.

Onward with installing the diff!

Cheers,
Martin

Cold lubricant overnight. It’s going sticky.

What are you using as assembly lube

[turkeybrain]

Thank you for another interesting idea to consider.

I'm using Penrite 80W-90 mineral gear oil. It's what I plan to use in the swivels, diffs, gearbox and transfer case long term.

I've been taking measurements 24 hours apart, typically in the evening (this is not strictly true, I've taken some intermediate measures at less than 24 hours, typically around 10 am as well), so temperature differences should be minimal. The issue is only affecting one the swivels, the short side swivel has only gone up a pound or so over 2 weeks of sitting.

Ben the Project Motivator pointed out I've been thinking about the issue incorrectly. I've been questioning why pre-load is changing, but he correctly asserted I'm measuring dynamic friction, not pre-load.

Considering changing pre-load (not dynamic friction):
Increased pre-load would be caused by increased axial loading between the thrust washer in the base of the railko bush and the tapered roller bearing.
Possible sources:

Shims settling, allowing upper pin to move further in, increasing axial force

The bolts holding the pin in place do not loosen, indicating the pin is not moving


Tapered roller bearing settling

This would result in reduced pre-load, not increased pre-load


Thrust washer in the base of the tapered roller bearing increasing in thickness. Could be caused by oil absorption

The behaviour was observed when the pin was removed and re-fitted without adding oil
The behaviour was observed when the thrust washer was first exposed to oil, and observed weeks later after absorption would have finished or at least slowed




I'm struggling to come up with a plausible reason for pre-load to increase with time.

Considering changing dynamic friction (excluding changing pre-load):
There are few moving parts to cause friction in this system - the tapered roller bearing in its races, the radial face of the railko bush, and the axial face or thrust washer in the railko bush.
Possible sources:

Reduced lubrication

I have smothered the tapered roller bearing in oil once the issue was observed and it didn't make a difference
The thrust washer may be losing lubrication over time

For most resets, no extra oil was added to change volume of lubricant present, but it may have run down from the radial face above or could have spread back to a high point on the thrust washer when the pin was removed




Surface roughness

An unusual surface profile may affect dynamic friction - this could interact with the reduced lubrication points mentioned above.




It seems it's likely there is something odd with the thrust washer which I am using. Perhaps they are directional? Perhaps mine is directional? I might pull it apart and flip it over just to try that as a theory.

Nonetheless, Ben the Project Motivator has convinced me to keep moving forward, I think I am reasonably satisfied it will probably wear in OK, but I'll keep it as a watch item for when Serenity is back on the road.

While I'm here, I might as well do an update on progress.


Both half shafts have been rebuilt with new bearing distance pieces, axial roller bearing races, and bearing retaining rings. The universal joints have been replaced. The shafts are a mishmash of parts from 3 different vehicles and all-new moving bits.
The diff pinion seal has been replaced. The hardest job was getting the split pin back through the nut. It seems one of the crenellations had moved slightly, so I ended up using a different nut from Serenity's original rear diff (a diff which is only useful as a boat anchor - the axial play in the diff centre bearings can be measured in whole millimetres, and that's not even the worst of it!)
The diff housing has had a final clean out
The diff has been refitted to its housing. A new gasket has been fitted. The strengthened axle housing I'm using apparently has UNF bolts fitted which I didn't know was an option until moments before we re-fitted the diff, so the old nuts have been reused as I ordered new BSF nuts, not UNF nuts. Ah well. My new parts manual which actually covers later Series 2A models would have been handy a bit earlier.
The half shafts have been re-fitted


Next step, which is what I'm actively avoiding doing by writing this post, is to rebuild the brake backing plates, as about 12 years ago I took all of the adjuster hardware off so I could paint them. Mistakes were made. If anybody has any good photos of brake backing plate hardware (especially the front ones!) I'd be happy to receive them. Nonetheless, I'll battle on.

A note on this photo - the AF sockets fit, but the BS sockets fit much nicer. I did eventually figure that out, I made the mistake of trusting the workshop manual which suggested AF tools.
http://www.turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230121_032303581.jpg

http://www.turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230121_045727296.jpg

http://www.turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230123_111101035.jpg

http://www.turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230123_111115097.jpg

http://www.turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230201_084557496.jpg

http://www.turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230201_093544079.jpg

Cheers,
Martin

[JDNSW]

Re Threads. The Series 1 was built entirely using BSW and BSF (plus selected BA and BSP).

Series 2 replaced the BSF with UNF - for new parts compared to Series 1. Through Series 2 and 2a, UNF continued to replace BSF. Right at the end of Series 2a production, wheel studs went metric.

Series 3 continued to replace BSF with UNF, and started very slowly started to replace UNF with metric for new parts - the five bearing engine was entirely metric. But the last Series 3 still had some BSF!

And many parts are interchangeable all the way from Series 1 to Series 3, and your 2a would be exceptional if it does not have quite a few assemblies that are from older or newer models.

So check what threads and spanners you actually have when working on any part.

[turkeybrain]

Solid advice. I'm aware of several bits of my car which had obviously been replaced by a previous owner, but by the time I'm done I fear the only original parts will be the chassis and the pinion nut on the front diff... I have considered renaming Serenity, I think Theseus (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ship_of_Theseus) would fit nicely. For example, I dragged the front axle housing out of a paddock.

The biggest issue I've had is I was buying parts without the right parts catalogue. The digital version I bought from Dave's shop had the 2 and really early 2A pendant type axles with 3/8 fasteners, but none of the 7/16 fasteners and non-pendant type ball joints. I've bought a hard copy of RTC9840CC published in 1987, and it includes all of the various part changes. Checking that manual is how I realised there might be an issue with the diff fasteners, I was looking up which nuts I was supposed to use from my, ahem, 'well organised' parts store and saw two alternatives listed in the manual.

On the topic of identifying thread types, I've made up a table with various bolt sizes and thread pitches, it might be helpful to others. The cells highlighted yellow are dangerous as the TPI is shared between two thread families for a given diameter, so the difference is tooth angle (60 degrees for UN threads, 55 degrees for BS threads). It prints nicely at 260% on A4 paper (on my printer). It looks even better laminated and stuck to the wall of your shed (though I've failed at this point, it's mostly been magnetically attached to my whiteboard).

Thread Pitch Chart.xlsx (https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1BwDCBwPLI_2ARJhB9b3mItLEAiM8KMwK/edit?usp=sharing&ouid=108671527429456219602&rtpof=true&sd=true)

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

Flipping the thrust washer over in the railko bush appears to have solved my increasing friction issue. It's gone from 13 lb to 14 lb overnight, a dramatic improvement over its previous 20-24 lb efforts, and more importantly it's still in spec.

Today's progress has involved mowing the lawns, installing a frog pond, and installing new brake shoe adjusters onto the brake backing plates. I struggled to find good information about how they were supposed to go back together (I pulled these off something like 11 or 12 years ago and didn't take any photos), but this is my best guess. Please correct me if I'm wrong!

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230204_065040736.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230204_065059372.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230204_065106674.jpg

Cheers,
Martin

[turkeybrain]

I used to be indecisive, now I'm not so sure.

I had been planning to post photos of my finished front axle, all rebuilt and resplendent in its new paint job, but then I happened to it.

The idea of upgrading brakes has been at the back (and front) of my mind since I decided to swap to a 300Tdi. I seriously investigated a disc conversion, but the only one which I could be certain would be legal in Australia, given wheel spacers are banned, was the kit by Forbyn Bros. It looks a million bucks and I'm sure it's fit for purpose, and I'm thrilled it lets you run Series wheels (I want Serenity to look absolutely stock until you open the bonnet or look underneath), but it's just too expensive for me to buy mid-restoration. As such, brakes ended up on the back burner. While looking at parts manuals while trying to figure out how to assemble brake adjusters on the backing plates in the previous post, I saw the width measurement of the shoes for the 6 cylinder brakes. An extra 3/4" of width seems nice, and one also wonders why Land Rover engineers thought it was necessary to upgrade the brakes when they put a slightly more powerful engine in...

It was only a day or so later I saw Gromit advertising a set of 6 cylinder front brakes. So anyway, if anybody happens to be coming to Tassie and wants to bring a set of brakes down for me, let me know! (I do have other plans to get them collected).

I have also warned my wife that me buying 6 cylinder brakes does not preclude me from buying discs in the future if a suitable set becomes available or I somehow end up with more money than sense. My long-suffering wife thankfully approves of cars stopping post-haste, so is happy with this arrangement.

Anyway, here's what I have done.

Stub axles and brake backing plates have been fitted. The bolt locking plates supplied in the swivel kit didn't fit (bolt holes didn't line up), but thankfully I didn't know they were in there and ordered some separately which did fit. They immediately tore as I did up the bolts. The good news is I ordered WAY too many(15 - they must have been cheap), so had spares to fix this damage (by applying moly grease to the face of the lock plate where the bolt sits on it) and still have enough for another axle.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230206_090848802.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230206_102407439.jpg

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230206_102616546.jpg

I then fitted up the oil seals (the things you can do when you're not measuring pre-load every time you walk into the shed!). One of the seals had a chunk out of the face which sits on the swivel housing and was slightly bent (probably from my 'wonderful' storage over the past 12 years), so I probably should just order a new one and replace it because it's bound to leak.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230209_054736780.jpg

Then came wheel bearings, and this is about as far as I got before I decided I was wasting my time doing more. I didn't have a dial gauge (which I have now borrowed from a friend) to set the end float, and I think I've forgotten to buy replacement nuts for the end of the prop shaft, so this is as far as I got.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230210_110616184.jpg

Here it stands (pun not intended), waiting for me to get my act together.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230220_100346432.jpg

There's no point in wasting time while I make up my mind, so it's on the the rear axle. That should be an easy job, I said to myself. Murphy apparently can read minds.

So you probably don't recall in my first post in however many years, I posted this picture of a stub axle which looks to be in vaguely acceptable condition.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_5303.jpg

At the time I took the photo, I did think to myself, "that's odd, I thought they looked worse than that. Well that's good news!". It turns out my memory was accurate, and they actually look like this:
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230215_073046755.jpg

The good news is, like with my front axle, I also have a mystery rear axle from which I can harvest parts. So that will get a call up to provide stub axles. Hopefully they're in good shape (they are for imperial bearings same as the front, I know that because it's already donated M16x1.5 style wheel hubs to the cause).

With that revelation out of the way, a wise friend has told me I shouldn't use the diff without first looking inside it. It turns out it's absolutely filthy, we think it's probably the additives in the gear oil separating out based on previous experience and the fact you could see a witness mark on the pan showing where the grime floated to the top of the oil (precluding water and metal contamination) and sat. The plan is to put some diesel or brake cleaner though it, seal it up and pretend nothing happened.

(the red mark is where I wiped it with a rag, it was grey beforehand)
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230215_074650849.jpg

In better news, the teeth look fresh, I'm most pleased with that.
http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/pxl_20230215_074738641.jpg

The bad news is I also decided to change the pinion seal and update the flange to a more modern Defender style in the process. With that, I needed to replace the collapsible spacer. It is not going well. More parts are on order, they should arrive tomorrow. I just don't have the leverage to crush the spacer, and I trashed the seal investigating the issue, plus there's evidence the overloading of the pinion nut was damaging the face of the new flange and washer, so I need a new nut and washer. Having now inspected the new after-market flange, I'm not impressed with the surface finish left by the machining process on the sealing surface, so I'll probably run the original flange again as at least that doesn't have a whole pile of ridges on it. A mudslinger would be nice, but it doesn't help if the seal pre-leaks. Now I'm thinking I'll use the original flange, I could skip all of my problems with the new crush tube and reuse the old one. Guess who didn't bother to mark the bolt and flange so he could reuse the original crush washer. It was this guy!

Sigh.

http://turkeybrain.com/gallery/Serenity/img_20230218_104029.jpg

Cheers,
Martin