Will Santa fix my Rangie if I'm a good boy?

[poleonpom]

Well, I seriously doubt it, so I'd like to draw in the collective wisdom in this site.
Recently the car was stalling when hot and restarting when cold - changed the crank position sensor and all good - until today. The car will not start at all, just turns over - same symptom as before, just the engine is not hot. Unfortunately I do not yet have a Faultmate, so I can't check it out. Could the replacement CPS be faulty? Perhaps some other dirty sensor?

[kimandy]

Good luck...

If by chance Santa does come and fix it, send him around to my place when he's finished please.

[poleonpom]

Thanks, if he turns up, I'll show him your post - good luck

[mike 90 RR]

Could the replacement CPS be faulty? Perhaps some other dirty sensor?

1 way is ...if you kept the old CPS .... reinstall it and see if it fires up ...

Cheers
Mike

[LOVEMYRANGIE]

Mikey!!! Where you been!!??
Merry Xmas mate!

I'm going for fuel pump or spark module.




Using Capitals, the difference between helping your Uncle Jack off a horse or helping your uncle jack off a horse...

[mike 90 RR]

Mikey!!! Where you been!!??
Merry Xmas mate!

I've shut down for Chrissy ... I'm been gearing up for a house reno ... 3 months off :D (no .. not requiring deodorant ;))

Merry Christmas to you 2 mate ... :thumbsup:





I'm going for fuel pump or spark module.


... Your a mean Santa .... :twisted:

CPS replaces the module .....

[poleonpom]

Ho, ho, (crank, whirrrrr) OH!

[LOVEMYRANGIE]

I've shut down for Chrissy ... I'm been gearing up for a house reno ... 3 months off :D (no .. not requiring deodorant ;))

Merry Christmas to you 2 mate ... :thumbsup:





... Your a mean Santa .... :twisted:

CPS replaces the module .....

Ahhhh.... P38 forum!! Damn you Tapatalk!!
Thought I was in the Classic section! Misread the header.

CPS is a hall sensor, you can kind of physically check it with a multimeter and magnet but a cro (oscilliscope) with it cranked insitu will generally give you an idea of its condition.
I wouldn't think its the problem tho as CPS will usually result in misfires rather than complete shutdown.
Shutting down when hot is usually a sign of open circuit in the pump.
Check the Malpassi regulator while you have it out too.

Andrew


Using Capitals, the difference between helping your Uncle Jack off a horse or helping your uncle jack off a horse...

[poleonpom]

The more I think about it, the more I think it has to do with the fuel pump. The car has done 165k which is the lifespan of the pump, the exact same thing happened on my RRC. I'm going to check the fuel pressure tomorrow, can anyone tell me where the fuel valve is licated pls?

[mike 90 RR]

t I'm going to check the fuel pressure tomorrow, can anyone tell me where the fuel valve is licated pls?

I'm taking a punt based on the D1 + fuel rail ..... LH side of fuel rail has a (Tyre) Valve? ....

Remove valve with a tyre valve tool
Slip a length of 6mm? hose over valve body and hang the other end into a bucket
Turn key on and check the fuel flow


Possible alternatives .......
Remove the fuel pump and go to Repco and see if a VN commodore fits ... or a bosch universal fuel pump kit

Don't know if the above info is correct for a p38 ... but at least it will be a start point



Basic check of Spark system .....
Find a spare spark plug (anything will do)
Remove a spark lead
Install to spare spark plug and lay it (earth it) on the side of the motor / manifold
Have someone wind the motor over
Does it sparks up? .... if yes .... CPS is OK


Cheers
Mike

[poleonpom]

Thanks guys,

checked the fuel pressure using a tyre gauge = 0, then took off the valve and nothing!

The fuel gauge has been intermittent, so I may as well cut an access hatch and check out that as well as the pump - hasn't been a compelling enough reason until now! - I guess this gives me an excuse to buy a Dremel! :angel:

I also have a load of jobs lined up on the RR, so I may as well use the time wisely and get going.....

Like the tip about looking at other fuel pumps

[PhilipA]

Possible alternatives .......
Remove the fuel pump and go to Repco and see if a VN commodore fits ... or a bosch universal fuel pump kit

Don't know if the above info is correct for a p38 ... but at least it will be a start point


Yep I am pretty sure that The VR fuel pump will fit in the assembly. You may have to change connectors.
However if your fuel gauge has become intermittent, I guess you should first check the earths.
If it isn't the earths, then you maybe should buy a new assembly as it would be a PITA to have to get into the tank again to replace the assemly later as AFAIK you cannot get gauge parts separately

Regards Philip A

[poleonpom]

Thanks Phillip,
Am I right in thinking 5.0 litre VR fuel pump?

[mike 90 RR]

Thanks Phillip,
Am I right in thinking 5.0 litre VR fuel pump?

V6 .... Have your pump on the counter and ask for the VN & VR .. compare

[poleonpom]

Ok, I'm in and will post photos of the 'operation'. Next step is to go to the motor factors and compare pumps - Santa brought me a Dremel, so this isn't so bad!

[poleonpom]

Ok, the deed is done and I have adapted a VN Commodore fuel pump and fitted it into the Range Rover. The Range Rover started first turn of the key :)

After reading all your great posts, I thought about whether I should drop the tank or cut a hatch to access the fuel pump. I decided that the hatch option was easier for me. I found a really great article on how to cut a hatch with easy-to-follow instructions and measurements on LandyZone - a lot easier than it first seems: Tank Fuel Pump Template P38 - Land Rover Zone (http://www.landyzone.co.uk/lz/f10/tank-fuel-pump-template-p38-109368.html)

The area was easy to mark out and cut into:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/207.jpg

I carefully used my Dremel (thanks Santa!) to cut out the hatchway, this was really easy and the metal folded up without much effort to reveal the fuel pump, you have to give the area a solid clean to make sure no dirt gets into the tank:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/208.jpg


Getting the pump out wasn't difficult, but a bit messy, watch out for petrol pouring out of the cylinder:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/209.jpg

I then went off to see Bill at Autobarn (Altona) who flogged me a VN Commodore fuel pump. On looking them up in the book, they are the same as the VR model pump and an almost identical match for the Rangie pump:

this shot shows the bottom of the two pumps:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/210.jpg

and here's the top, slightly different:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/211.jpg

I had to cut the contact guard a little to solder the wires directly to the pick up, there were no marking on the case for + and - for the new pump, so I followed the layout of the old pump. The diameter of the new pump is also less than the RR pump, this means the outlet tube of the new pump is loose. I made a collar out of pvc pipe that jammed over pump outlet pipe and the RR take-up pipe. Here's the original:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/212.jpg

and here's the CommoRange:

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/213.jpg

Put it all back together, tightened everything up and crouched as I turned the key!!!!!!! and she started. Big grin and a good drive around the local area, stopping off to soap her down on the way back.

Job done!:eek:

Thanks for all your help and guidance through this, I hope to get to know some of you better over the next coming months.

[wayneg]

Thanks for the write up, was the pump unit hard to remove once visible, looks like you could easily loose a chunk of finger whilst getting it out. Also what year is your car, anyone know what pump goes into a later car with the The STC4345 unit if different. I have read the unit has an additional plug for emission info but cant see if that would make the pump different
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2011/12/203.jpg

[poleonpom]

Mine's a '96 and the pump assembley is easy on the fingers.

[poleonpom]

I tried to find other photos of your unit to see if it is similar to mine but couldn't find one showing the bottom end. The actual pump is about 15cms long and sits right at the bottom of the assembley.

[996TURBO]

Thanks for the write up, was the pump unit hard to remove once visible, looks like you could easily loose a chunk of finger whilst getting it out.
I can't imagine how you managed to remove the pump from such a small aperture...

Bravo:)

[poleonpom]

I should have explained it better. The bottom of the pump housing is held by tabs and easily drops (see last photo). The pump is held in place by two screws on bracket - nice and easy ;)