Overlander 4WD of the Year Award

[Celtoid]

I'm not sure if this has been covered but I just picked up the Jan 2012 mag and DVD.




The award covered 8 vehicles...

LC200
Prado
D4
FJ Cruiser
Pajero
Patrol
Jeep Grand Cherokee
Defender
Obviously I'm one eyed being an LR owner :) but I do own other vehicle brands but it was hardly an 'apples for apples' comparison.

It went off script right at the start when they did the old "we changed tyres on all the vehicles but the D4, because it has 19"'ers". Why? And there are far better tyres than the standard Wranglers that come with the D4, even in 19".

Why not leave all standard tyres on the vehicles? The mag does acknowledge that there are 18"er wheels (non OEM) and tyres available and it is stated in both the vid and the mag that this factor affected the outcome....so no longer a level playing field. So if tyres are an issue, change the freakin wheels and tyres on the Disco. It's not a road comparo where the D4 would eat the other contenders hands down.

Then there were all the variables..the Jeep air suspension package.......and the underbody package....."which scored highly"......peeps, it's an add on!...where the standard LR products were rated really well for either being out of the way or having good bash protection or clearance as standard.....

The LC200 was an Altitude package....The LC200 Altitude steals stuff from the range topping ($130K) Sahara but is essentially a GXL which costs $10K more than the D4 SE. The standard D4 SE poohs all over the non-altitude and altitude LC in standard form with the exception of one or two gadgets. The general look and finish of the D4 was acknowledged as being 'luxurious'.

Blatant lies or a clear fact that nobody actually knew the vehilcles...?

"the auto height adjust on the D4 lowers at 40kph"........sorry folks, I own one.....gongs come on at 40 something kph, will not lower until 55kph. Also there are after market fixes that cost less than the other car's 'Add Ons'! Admittedly the gongs and the lowering can be a pain in the ass but there is a pretty big difference when in rough stuff travelling at 40kph and 55kph!

"Traction control settings were confusing on the D4"......freakin hell....one knob, 4 settings outside the normal...."never needs to be touched setting". Unlike the Jeep's 'Mud and Sand' selection.....WTF, how does that work?

They specifically drove the D4 up a hill in normal mode to get it stuck and then showed how the correct setting made it an easy task.....feature demonstration or bias?....I wasn't sure, considering how many "confused test drivers there were"....LOL!!!

"LC200 the best tow vehicle on the market"....really...? as long as they stay in 5th....which apparently they do......so well in fact that you can't get them out of it.......LOL!!!! No mention when they were banging on about the LC200's power and torque that it loses a lot through the drive train and is marginally higher by the time it gets to the wheels (albeit slower than the D4)....:) And they chew oil faster than an early model D4 eats turbochargers.....LOL!!! :o:wasntme:

Dunno, there were some good points and interesting stuff/features covered in all vehicles but it didn't seem level to me.

When the 'cooler box' in the LC200 was rated as a winning feature.....you have to wonder about the credibility.....

Just my opinion......and of course I'm seriously biased......LOL!!!!

Kev.

[Xtreme]

I haven't read the article (as I don't bother buying the mag) but from what you say has been reported, you've got to wonder about the selection criteria for the vehicles not to mention the credibility/integrity of the assessors/judges. :o

[Drover]

Just my opinion......and of course I'm seriously biased......LOL!!!!



Really…….you would never guess.

[gusthedog]

LMFAO!:D Wow an Aussie mag that's negatively biased towards Land Rovers? How dare they! And how uncommon (Gee I wish you could read sarcasm into typing!) I'm biased towards the green oval too but do see the merrits of other brands. Unbiased journalism is unfortunately absent in much of the recreational media in Australia like 4x4 mags. Also true for motorbike mags as well.

[Celtoid]

Just my opinion......and of course I'm seriously biased......LOL!!!!


Really…….you would never guess.




I know, it's shameful.....:D It all started when they pooh poohed the Deefer....

Even if you weren't a Green Oval fan, I think you'd find it hard to work out exactly what they were using as a measure, as the disparate variables were confusing. Another glaring example was the fact that the shared 2nd placed Prado was a petrol version....it's fuel eco was woeful and you'd think in this day and age, that alone would have mortally wounded it's cause.

The lack of actual vehicle knowledge by the testers just exacerbated the situation.

I just didn't get it! :confused:

[ramblingboy42]

I think when youre reading motoring journalism expect anything. The only way to resolve a test like this is to drive all of those vehicles across australia from Sydney to Perth without touching bitumen, then you would see some different results. The prado would probably use twice as much fuel as the D4, and over hundreds of km of corrugations, theres only one you'd want to be in......ask Tombie......yeah its not really that biased its just none of the vehicles on that short test were able to really show their good and inevitably there bad points.

[BMKal]

Well if you really want to know where Overlander is coming from these days, just look at the inside cover and you'll see who now owns the magazine, who is the new editor in chief etc. It will all make sense to you then. ;)

I read the same article and agree 100% with what you've said, though I'll admit that I've never driven an LC200 so not really qualified to comment on that one (other than it's a barge-arsed oversize, over priced lump of white goods).

I have currently got a new Prado 150 Series diesel (work vehicle) which is about to be replaced by either a D4 or a VW Amarok (haven't decided yet). I've test driven a new D4 pretty extensively - so feel that I can comment on their placing both vehicles equal second in the comparo. What a joke. There is simply no comparison.

I have recently told a few people where I work (Prado is the company preferred vehicle option if the company is to supply managers here with a vehicle) - go and test drive a D4. If nothing else, a short test drive in a D4 will show you what a piece of utter crap the latest Prado is. :D

Because the company's preferred choice for company supplied vehicles is a Prado - I'm going with Option "B" in my new job - which is to take a vehicle allowance and supply my own vehicle.

[gusthedog]

though I'll admit that I've never driven an LC200

My folks have a 200 series sahara and its a piece of poo. I have driven it quite a bit and prefer my $10,000 D2 to it in nearly every way. The only real advantages with it are that its new and has a warranty (which it needs) and the sat nav (which you can't adjust on the move). My D2 is so much more comfy and I can by 12 of them for the same price as it! On a recent trip up the birdsville, I got 12l/100km in my Td5 defender (now sold) towing 1.5 tonnes whilist my old man got 30-33lt/100km towing 3 tonne. At three times the fuel and 12 times the price, I'll stick with my disco 2.;)

[disco gazza]

So who won it ?
Thought about buying the mag,but as I know its part of 4wd action,I'd decided not to. :D

And where did the Defer come in the ranks..lol Hopefully not last.

The FJ Bruiser was 1st in 4x4 australia mag..:eek:

cheers
disco gazza
92 disco tdi :D

[mikehzz]

LMFAO!:D Wow an Aussie mag that's negatively biased towards Land Rovers? How dare they! And how uncommon (Gee I wish you could read sarcasm into typing!) I'm biased towards the green oval too but do see the merrits of other brands. Unbiased journalism is unfortunately absent in much of the recreational media in Australia like 4x4 mags. Also true for motorbike mags as well.

I think you have to change the font to Sarcastica :)

[d2dave]

I think when youre reading motoring journalism expect anything. The only way to resolve a test like this is to drive all of those vehicles across australia from Sydney to Perth without touching bitumen, then you would see some different results. The prado would probably use twice as much fuel as the D4, and over hundreds of km of corrugations, theres only one you'd want to be in......ask Tombie......yeah its not really that biased its just none of the vehicles on that short test were able to really show their good and inevitably there bad points.

Can you enlighten me as to which vehicle? What happened with Tombie?
Is there a thread about it?

Dave.

[Benz]

So who won it ?
Thought about buying the mag,but as I know its part of 4wd action,I'd decided not to. :D

And where did the Defer come in the ranks..lol Hopefully not last.

The FJ Bruiser was 1st in 4x4 australia mag..:eek:

cheers
disco gazza
92 disco tdi :D

Really???
out of all the 4x4's you can buy on the market today they chose that?

so glad I don't waste my money on that anymore...

[DOD DEFENDER]

G,day all i seen the mag my self. Lets just call the mag toyota 4x4 .

[Beckford]

I'm not sure if this has been covered but I just picked up the Jan 2012 mag and DVD.

I raised a post in the Defender section on 19 December. This was my thoughts;

The 2011 Puma (Defender 110) scored an "Off Road Ability" of only 2.5 stars out of 5 in this months issue of the Overlander Magazine.

It was tested unloaded..... I agree the Puma is a rough ride empty, but how many people take nothing into the outback?

And it had the best fuel economy. Long Legs did not seem to be an important issue in the outback??

I was also surprised that the Nissan Patrol did not score higher???

www.aulro.com/afvb/90-110-130-defender-county/140895-overlander-4wd-year-2011-a.html

[Beckford]

And where did the Defer come in the ranks..lol Hopefully not last.

It came last, with apparently the worst off road ability.

Apparently nothing has changed since 1948. (I had the chance to compare a series III parked next to my Defender on Wednesday / Thursday while camping. Yes they have the same styling but they are completely different 4wd's.)

And as for a test drive on a dirt road at 100km an hour.....

[Beckford]

I think when youre reading motoring journalism expect anything. The only way to resolve a test like this is to drive all of those vehicles across australia from Sydney to Perth without touching bitumen, then you would see some different results.

I would like to see the boys from the BBC Topgear carry out this test of these 4wd's.

And also, why did they not include the 3.0 Litre D4 or the Range Rover in the mix?

[Celtoid]

Sorry Guys,

I should have put in more detail for those that saved their money and didn't buy the rag.

1st Place with 4.5/5 Offroad ability score was the LC 200 4.5l TTD Altitide...which is a GXL with some snobby bits knicked from the Sahara. It also had non-standard tyres fitted.

Shared 2nd with 4.5/5 Offroad ability were the D4 SE 3.0l TTD, completely stock standard, including the Wrangler tyres & the Prado GXL 4L V6 'PETROL' (WTF??) with not standard tyres.

4th PLace with 4/5 Offroad ability was the FJ Cruiser 4L V6 petrol with non-standard tyres.

5Th Place with 3/5 Offroad ability was the NW Pajero VRX 3.2L TD with non-standard tyres.

6th Place with 3.5/5 Offroad ability was the Patrol Ti 3.0L TD with non-standard tyres.

7th Place with 3/5 Offroad ability was the Jeep Grand Cherokee Laredo 3.0L TD with non-standard tyres.

Last place with 2.5/5 Offroad ability was the Deefer 110 2.4L TD with non-standard tyres.

To me it was pretty Toyo biased but that wasn't really what bothered me. The main thing that got me about it, was the fact that I just didn't get it! I couldn't figure out what they were actually doing in the way of a comparison. The comments didn't back up the scores, their facts were blatently wrong, it was a complete mis-mash of a comparision with no obvious measurable yard-stick.

I just thought that it completely lacked consistancy and that it was seriously amaturish and unprofessional.

My thoughts anyway.

Cheers,

Kev.

[scarry]

Sorry Guys,

I should have put in more detail for those that saved their money and didn't buy the rag.


The main thing that got me about it, was the fact that I just didn't get it! I couldn't figure out what they were actually doing in the way of a comparison. The comments didn't back up the scores, their facts were blatently wrong, it was a complete mis-mash of a comparision with no obvious measurable yard-stick.

I just thought that it completely lacked consistancy and that it was seriously amaturish and unprofessional.

My thoughts anyway.

Cheers,

Kev.


EXACTLY,that's why i don't buy em anymore.One of my sons dropped a 4x4 action over here a couple of weeks ago,i picked it up for a read today, only cos i was bored,and there was a tow test between a stock diesel paj,and a CHIPPED 76 series 4.5.What a crock of s h i t .
What a real fair test that was.They obviously knew the stock 76 would get a floggin.
anyway,i tossed that mag in the bin,where it belongs:mad:
not long ago i saw another where they put a stock Puma up against a front & rear diff locked 76 series.Another cock of s h i t.

[disco 3 door]

Hi all, read article & noticed the LC200 won on its hugh power & torque figures, they forgot about the extra weight. Not sure what a D4 weighs but I would think it would weigh less, so they realy did not calculate the power to weight ratio to give a better indication. Defenately bias towards TOYOTA, & for the Defender, how can you compare a basic 4x4 against 7 LUXURY 4x4's. If the Defer was in why was the LC76 or SIMILARnot included.

[rick130]

Just had a quick read of the OL forum and one of our own was part of the test.
It gives a bit more insight into how it all works.
It appears the biggest against with the D4 is the 19" rims (again)

Those that have never encountered a Deefer before just don't know how to take them either.
I think the shock of jumping behind the wheel for the first time takes weeks to recover :lol2:

[Celtoid]

Hi all, read article & noticed the LC200 won on its hugh power & torque figures, they forgot about the extra weight. Not sure what a D4 weighs but I would think it would weigh less, so they realy did not calculate the power to weight ratio to give a better indication. Defenately bias towards TOYOTA, & for the Defender, how can you compare a basic 4x4 against 7 LUXURY 4x4's. If the Defer was in why was the LC76 or SIMILARnot included.

I don't think there is much weight difference 'cause of the unbreakable D4 chassis weighing heaps....I just made that up....:).....

Nah there isn't a lot of weight difference but I've read that the LC200 has a lot of losses through the drive train. The D4 is a smidge quicker in a standing start drag.

[Celtoid]

Just had a quick read of the OL forum and one of our own was part of the test.
It gives a bit more insight into how it all works.
It appears the biggest against with the D4 is the 19" rims (again)

Those that have never encountered a Deefer before just don't know how to take them either.
I think the shock of jumping behind the wheel for the first time takes weeks to recover :lol2:

If it was any sort of real test, you couldn't lose just on one aspect. There are lots of people on this forum who actually own these vehicles and state, whilst a smaller wheel is probably better offroad (floatation, less wheel damage, bounce), the 19"ers are no show stopper....'specially if you don't care about them getting chipped etc.

But there you go.....even our own guy didn't own a D4 (or D3) and obviously would never be able to demonstrate it's true potential, or correct the BS about the suspension, the dip stick and the "really confusing TC selections", etc! In fact the same could be said for just about all of them, did any of the drivers actually have intimate knowledge of the vehicles?....oh except the toyos.....LOL!!!

[rick130]

If it was any sort of real test, you couldn't lose just on one aspect. There are lots of people on this forum who actually own these vehicles and state, whilst a smaller wheel is probably better offroad (floatation, less wheel damage, bounce), the 19"ers are no show stopper....'specially if you don't care about them getting chipped etc.

But there you go.....even our own guy didn't own a D4 (or D3) and obviously would never be able to demonstrate it's true potential, or correct the BS about the suspension, the dip stick and the "really confusing TC selections", etc! In fact the same could be said for just about all of them, did any of the drivers actually have intimate knowledge of the vehicles?....oh except the toyos.....LOL!!!

Sheesh, read the thread on OL, I'm only pointing you to a place where you can get some insight into how some of the testers went about their decisions, and Barney had the D4 at the top, but he's only one of eight testers.

BTW, none of the brought in testers would have anything to do with the copy in the mag, that'd be done by a staff writer.

Why do people feel the need to continually have their purchases validated by an external source ?
Hell, I don't believe for a second the Defender would have the worst off road ability of the lot of them either, but I really couldn't give a toss what's written in the mag.

[Celtoid]

Sheesh, read the thread on OL, I'm only pointing you to a place where you can get some insight into how some of the testers went about their decisions, and Barney had the D4 at the top, but he's only one of eight testers.

BTW, none of the brought in testers would have anything to do with the copy in the mag, that'd be done by a staff writer.

Why do people feel the need to continually have their purchases validated by an external source ?
Hell, I don't believe for a second the Defender would have the worst off road ability of the lot of them either, but I really couldn't give a toss what's written in the mag.

I'm sorry if you thought that I was having a go.....was just trying to emphasise the lack of validity in the approach.

Most people won't get past the Mag....even if they get that far...LOL!!!....so having more info somewhere else, doesn't quite cut it for most.

I think a lot of people get the poohs if they read or hear rubbish about something they own, or something they do or the team they follow....it's tribal.

[wally]

A Pajero more capable off road than a Defender! That's hilarious. I stopped buying those ridiculous magazines twenty years ago.

[superquag]

A Pajero more capable off road than a Defender! That's hilarious. I stopped buying those ridiculous magazines twenty years ago.

As a a staunch Pajero supporter.... and Classic owner...I'd agree with you 101%. If for no other reason that the suspension travel in the RR gives a MUCH better ride and obstacle capacity.
Differant story driving point to point on good roads....:wasntme:

[wally]

As a a staunch Pajero supporter.... and Classic owner...I'd agree with you 101%. If for no other reason that the suspension travel in the RR gives a MUCH better ride and obstacle capacity.
Differant story driving point to point on good roads....:wasntme:
..And I have owned a Pajero too. Nice comfy highway car. But I had to get rid of it - it was just too boring. And it definitely was not built for the bush.