3 ways and ice creams

[101RRS]

I went up to Ophir just north of Orange for the weekend and took my Jayco campervan for its first run. When getting the camper set up I noticed the inbuild 3 way seemed to work much better than you would think reading all the reports - even on 12v mine seems to work well - in testing the freezer section was often over -20 degrees even on hot days.

So I thought I would test it and bought 4 Weis Macadamia and Mango bars as the sacrificial ice creams ( they are in their own little sealed packets in case they melded). I ran the fridge on 24v for the 12 hours prior to leaving and the freezer was showing -20 when I put the ice creams in.

I switched to 12v on hooking up, outside temp was 28 degrees and when I unhooked at Ophir about five hours later - I had a nice frozen Weis bar - temp on arrival was -16 but during the trip it had dropped to -10.

The next day the van was running on gas and temp got down to -28 at night (10 outside) and -20 during the day (up to 30). Another frozen Weis for dessert that night.

Got back home last night after about 7 hours running the fridge on 12v and ate the two remaining Weis bars.

So contrary to a lot of comments on 3 ways - my experience has been extremely positive with - 20 being held on 30 degree days so maybe -10 on a 40 degree day when on gas. On hot days 12v would maintain freezing but maybe not for ice cream:(.

I also had my ebay special (what not an Engel :o) 55l compressor fridge with me in case all else failed. I put a lot of the drinks in it - my 45A/h van battery was up to running it for the weekend but was getting a bit low when I had to switch to 12v on the 3 way just before hitching up to come home - voltage was down to 11.7.

Garry

[THE BOOGER]

They cant all be bad or they would go broke selling them I have an electrolux 3 way fridge works well on all three sources but 240 and gas are the best:)

[Lotz-A-Landies]

I went up to Ophir just north of Orange for the weekend and took my Jayco campervan for its first run. ...

I switched to 12v on hooking up, outside temp was 28 degrees and when I unhooked at Ophir about five hours later - I had a nice frozen Weis bar - temp on arrival was -16 but during the trip it had dropped to -10.

... GarryFirstly, being pedantic, the temp had risen from -16 to -10.

No argument, the 3 way fridges work, the main problem is that they are very subject to level. On a fridge used in a van on the highway, provided the roads are the modern flat ones not the older cambered roads the fridge will work while traveling. The Electrolux manual says when stopping for more than 20 minutes the fridge should be leveled (both ways), if the fridge is built-in this means leveling the van. A real hassel when maybe stopping for half an hour to 45 minutes for lunch.

When you have an off road van or using one in a 4WD you may be climbing a steep grade or on a severe sideways slope for more than 20 minutes and this is where the problems with the 3 ways come in. It is why compressor fridges are the ones recommended for off road vehicles and vans.

Being an older technology the 3 way are also less efficient than compressor fridges.

[101RRS]

Firstly, being pedantic, the temp had risen from -16 to -10.



Thanks Ron :o

[LWB123]

and bought 4 Weis Macadamia and Mango bars as the sacrificial ice creams ...... I had a nice frozen Weis bar ..... and ate the two remaining Weis bars.

Hello from Brisbane.

Don't know much about fridges, but I genuinely endorse your test agent. Great stuff.

But, you can do better than a Weis bar by going down the DIY route.

Years ago when Singleton was still a cow town rather than a mere mine.... the cafe opposite the old Dunolly Bridge - probably called the Bridge Cafe - made their own frozen fruit salad bars. Basically, a can of Golden Circle fruit salad topped with home made ice cream, frozen in trays and cut into blocks, wrapped in grease proof paper. If there were kids on board, my Dad and uncles used to pull up in the truck and buy a bag full on the way home from the saleyards.

Apologies to anyone who got sprayed by the cattle........

Cheers,

[Lotz-A-Landies]

...Years ago when Singleton was still a cow town rather than a mere mine.... the cafe opposite the old Dunolly Bridge - probably called the Bridge Cafe - made their own frozen fruit salad bars. Basically, a can of Golden Circle fruit salad topped with home made ice cream, frozen in trays and cut into blocks, wrapped in grease proof paper. ... Apologies to anyone who got sprayed by the cattle........

Cheers,Been there, at least when loading our own cows. Always makes me laugh when someone in a convertable car with the top down or off will drive up beside a cattle truck at the stop lights. I don't always get a laugh at the unfortunates in the car, but it's enough that it's occasional! :D

As for the Bridge Cafe, our nanny state health inspectors would probably rule the home made items unsanitary these days! :mad:

[mowog]

I have never had a problem with the 3 way fridges in my caravans. I run 12v for transit and gas for when we stop for long breaks. Our fridge mostly runs on gas except for the rare times we spend in caravan parks.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

I have never had a problem with the 3 way fridges in my caravans. I run 12v for transit and gas for when we stop for long breaks. Our fridge mostly runs on gas except for the rare times we spend in caravan parks.And so did I until it exploded.

If you don't level, it is not a case of "if" it is a case of "when".

[mowog]

And so did I until it exploded.

If you don't level, it is not a case of "if" it is a case of "when".

Well its a case of so far so good.

Not sure where the explosion comes in.... :confused:

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Well its a case of so far so good.

Not sure where the explosion comes in.... :confused:The coils develop a high spot which stops the thermal cycle flow and the refrigerant boils at that point. This creates an overpressure event and ruptures the sealed coil system. Not unlike an explosion, but not something that blows the fridge apart, only the business end of the fridge explodes/ruptures and fills the fridge and van with stinking ammonia.

[Col.Coleman]

Man, have I got a dirty mind:o

Don't know much about the 3 way fridges though, so I'm guessing you don't want to hear my story or advice.:p

This one time, at band camp..........

CC

[TerryO]

Well its a case of so far so good.

Not sure where the explosion comes in.... :confused:


A quick question Mowog if you don't mind, do you have a external reading thermometer in the fridge so that you can read it in your tug driving or when you pull up?

Same question if others are prepared to comment for any other forum members who have a 3-way in a van or camper.

cheers,
Terry

[101RRS]

Was away on the weekend in my campervan this weekend and had some issues with the 3 way.

I had the fridge on for 2 days before leaving and put cooled food in it but the temp in the main section of the fridge never got below 10 degrees - however the freezer was happily sitting on -10 degrees and if I had ice creams with me they would have been fine but meat in the main fridge section would have gone off.

I understand the cooling element for the freezer section and the main fridge is the same element it is just that the freezer is much smaller.

Any ideas how I might be able to get the temp a bit lower in the main fridge section and it is just too warm to keep food in. Doesn't matter if the fridge was on 12v, 240v or gas the result was the same.

Thanks

Garry

[Judo]

Tried shaking it? I hear a good shake every so often is needed.

As a side note, we bought a second hand 3-way for $20. Great price, but as soon as it was remotely warm in the car and we put a few things in the fridge, ours also wouldn't go below 10 degrees. While driving (so ~14V) it would start creeping down, but only very slowly and then as soon as we stopped (~12V), the temp would go up again. Seemed like we couldn't lose for $20, but it's also a little pointless if it can't keep anything cold!

[Judo]

P.S. Ours was fine on 240V.

Same result all round = common issue.... thus suggesting a good shake.

[101RRS]

Thanks Judo - turning it over etc is a good move for portable units but this is a built in unit so a bit hard to do without doing a lot of dismantling.

I did it once but not too happy about doing it again.

Cheers

garry

[DoctorJ]

Man, have I got a dirty mind:o

Don't know much about the 3 way fridges though, so I'm guessing you don't want to hear my story or advice.:p

This one time, at band camp..........

CC

I'm with you CC I had to check out the thread after reading the title lol:angel:

Cheers
Julian

[goingbush]

3 way fridges have to be dead level weather your running 12v 240 or gas, its very crucial to get them working efficiently.

The other way to improve their efficiency is put a 12v computer fan on the vent to draw air over the condenser. That will also draw out any unburned gas or co2 to avoid other problems.

easily drops the temp another 5 to 10 degrees.,

tho its bloody annoying trying to get to sleep with a computer fan running - you'd be suprisaed how loud they can sound when your in the middle of nowhere.

no idea how some people put up with generators.

[Symo]

I have a 3 way frdge in my camper. I have a two zone RF temp sensor on it so I can monitor its temperature from the car while driving.

I just did cape york in August (bloody brilliant trip BTW) and the refrigerator part maintained between 0c and 5c the whole trip, up hill and down dale. The only time it went above 5 was when we had the door open for ages to re-stock or clean something or when we re-loaded it with fresh supplies.

It ran on 12V while driving and gas when we were parked. We did about 100K per day up the cape when we drove so most of the time it was sitting VERY VERY VERY level in the camper.

4 days at Vrylya point in high 30's and it sat at 4 or 5 during the day and droped to 2 or 3 at night. We had meat in there purchased from Cairns still frozen when we got back to melbourne. The dogs loved their steak.

The camper has a small PC fan mounted behind the fridge that turns on automatically above a threshold temperature and I did notice during the days it did turn on, at nights it was low 20's so stayed off.

I agree with the other posts here - if its NOT level its not going to work. Given ours was so full the times it spent bouncing about it had enough cold gear in it that the temperature didnt move much. Somedays however i noticed as i unpacked the camper the outside of the fridge door was damp from condensation... Hmmm more insulation needed.

I love the 3 way - missus enjoys them too... :D Fridge is good also. 9Kg of gas lasts forever and the thing is silent so you can sleep whir free...

[101RRS]

Thanks for the comments. However my point is that the freezer section gets down to the right temperature but not the main fridge section. If there was level issues etc (which there wasn't) the freezer would suffer as well.

So any one have an idea why the freezer would work Ok but not the main fridge. I was thinking of taking the freezer door off and putting a computer fan in there to cool the whole fridge and just using my 25l compressor fridge as a freezer.

Cheers

Garry

[Symo]

So any one have an idea why the freezer would work Ok but not the main fridge. I was thinking of taking the freezer door off and putting a computer fan in there to cool the whole fridge and just using my 25l compressor fridge as a freezer.

Garry

If the question is realy that simple I have no idea other than poor design as obviously the cooling part is working but working better in 1 place (the freezer) than in the fridge.... thats a design issue as indicated by your remedy - take the freezer door off and let the cold spill.

The point I was hinting at was that maybe the thing was loosing temperature all over but didnt show the temperature loss as dramatically in the freezer due to thermals mass or ise buildup or what ever. Droping from - 20 to - 15 isnt so noticable in a freezer as droping from 5c to 10c in a fridge.

If the thing is working right it should work right all over....

I know my comments are silly..... its late - forgive me...:o

[101RRS]

Your comments are definitely not silly - in fact your thinking is the same as my underlying thoughts - if the cooling lines to the fridge and the freezer are the same and both compartments have their own cooling fins then both sections should work as advertised but they don't :(.

Maybe I just need a fan in the main fridge are to circulate the air. maybe that is the problem - when fully stocked the cool air from the cooling fins just cannot circulate.

Cheers

garry

[130man]

Hi Garrycol, on another forum , one of the contributors mentions cleaning the cooling fins. He doesn't say how or what with but reports a marked improvement in performance, so there may be a strategy for you to investigate. Cheers, 130man.

[Blknight.aus]

not quite....

as it starts to run low on charge the cooling ability of the refrigerant will work as far as it can and then run out of go so it will simply move through the rest of the plumbing in whatever state and temperature its in before shedding its heat and restarting the process.

sometimes with the absorbsion fridges (heres a primer on refrigeration) (http://www.polarpowerinc.com/products/refrigerator/ref-tech-overview.htm)

the fluid can all go and settle at the same level, when you fire up the heat source the convection cycle is unable to start because convection alone wont push the water/ammonia mix up to the seperator to allow the flow to start or the amonia and the water have seperated out and stratified so wont remix with just simple heating (heating with convection would eventually work BUT by the time the seperatrion occurs the ability to start the convection process is lost) thats why taking the fridge, turning it over and shaking it up a few times works.

If its lost or is loosing hydrogen pressure or has had a liquid loss these days its typically cheaper to buy a new unit than have an old one replaced.

if you're very lucky you might find that its a combination of door seals and insulation degredation thats stopped it and a new door seal and some expanda foam may get it cooling again.

[TerryO]

You can buy at Caravan accessory outlets a battery powered fan that sits in the base of the fridge that circulates the cold air making the fridge much more efficient and even in temperature, they cost about $40 and work really well.

The other trick with bloody useless three way fridges is to pack the shelves with Tupperware containers with their lids on, even if they have nothing in the containers. That way when you open the door all the cold air doesn't rush out and it doesn't take your fridge hours to recover and another bonus is you have separate sealed containers always on hand to store food in.

My next van will have a 12/240 volt fridge even if I have to cover every inch of the roof with solar panels. The three way fridge is the only thing I dislike about our current van, I have had the fridge checked numerous times and it is meant to be working correctly, had a thermostatically controlled fan fitted to the rear and that made no difference, it wasn't until we got the internal fan and the Tupperware containers that things improved and it now works pretty good ...most of the time.

Cheers,
Terry