Numerous failures, but could it be an ECU error?

[drivesafe]

Just before Christmas, I could no longer manually select gears.

After a bit of snooping, one of the LR forums suggested that it may not be a problem with the transmission but that it might be a faulty temperature sensor.

After reading this I remembered that on a number of occasions when the RR had been sitting all night, and my wife had backed it up out driveway, about 20 metres, by the time hse had reached the top, I could hear the thematic fan was running.

There has been no warnings related to either the temperature or the transmission but the the problem persist, all be it intermittently.

Now the suspension is locked in travel height and there are a number of warnings, “MAXIMUM SPEED 50 KMS” comes up and on one occasion, the message “SPECIAL PROGRAMS OFF” came up while driving.

But I also have another problem ( or two? ).

I use to be able to bring up the hidden screen but this can no longer be accessed and when I tried to reset the defect codes, as per catch-22s write up, I can get the screen to display “CHECK CONTROL OK” but I can not access anything else.

Is it possible that there are no actual faults and the problem lays with the ECU?

Again, any clews?

[PAT303]

Check the battery voltage?,did you recently replace the alternator?,did the errors start before or after that job?. Pat

[drivesafe]

Hi Pat and I think the battery is OK and I get 14+v at start up so thats not a problem.

BUT, as you posted, everything has only happened since the alternator was replace so maybe a reset is due.

While the alternator was replace at least 6 months be for the transmission started it’s little games, I have not been able to get into the hidden screen since the alternator was replaced and I did not put two and two together.

Thanks for the suggestion.

[harlie]

DS, I was getting the “MAXIMUM SPEED 50 KMS” message when my battery was on the way out. Alt was fine, I think it was because the V dropped too far during engine start, and this 'fault' is one that doesn't try to reset itself untill the car is turned off/on. New Battery, not seen the message since, may not be you issue, my EAS wasn't in a "not enabled" state though - just a thought.

[Graeme]

Is it possible that there are no actual faults and the problem lays with the ECU?Its likely that a simple fault such as low voltage at a critical time has triggered a fault condition in 1 ecu that has triggered flow-on faults in associated ecus. The gear train and suspension are closely tied by TR so a fault in any component is likely to generate faults in other systems. This doesn't help find the cause though!

[drivesafe]

Thanks harlie and an interesting suggestion because my battery was discharged down to 7v in a few minutes when the alternator went and I honestly gave it little hope of being able to be recharged, it but it came good.

Thing is, maybe it just gave me a bit of time and is now at the end of it’s usefulness and your suggestion maybe the cause ( it is the original battery ).

Thanks Graeme and this is an area I have not worked in but it looks like it’s time to start.

The plot thickens with my RR.

To day, after days of suspension fault warnings of different types, suddenly the fault messages ceased.

Until I tried to lower the RR and back they came, so I will see how many days before they stop again.

[harlie]

Until I tried to lower the RR and back they came, so I will see how many days before they stop again.

Yeah, remember in the digital world of 1s & 0s the voltage doesn’t have to be down much for a 1 to be received by the next ECU as a 0, and then it's all gone to pot. The sensors and switches are anologue but comunication between ECUs is digital and very sensitive to voltage. Try a battery, at $200ish, it would have to be the cheapest thing to start with too - not to mention being original it's time is nearly up (from memory you have a '07?).

[drivesafe]

Surprise, surprise.

I have been keeping an eye on my cranking battery since the alternator crashed.

At the time I was surprised the battery actually recovered from the 7v rapid discharge.

Since then I have measured the voltage on a regular basis, taking the measurements at least 12 hours after the last drive.

The measurements have always been 12.35v or higher but this morning, after 48 hour since the last drive, I got a reading of just 11.84v.

The battery is stuffed and to confirm this, I tried recharging it and after just 1 hour, using a 16 amp charger, the battery charger was indicating the battery was fully charged.

NO WAY.

So a new battery on Tuesday and will see what goes from there.

I’ll see if this resolves the problems BUT, do I still need to have all the fault codes cleared and will this happen automatically?

[harlie]

If you still have the suspension not active message and the lights are out on the suspension control, unfortunately you will need the faults cleared.

It's a stupid system that 'thinks' there is a problem (can be as simple as a dropped or misinterpreted packet) and doesn't retry...

[33chinacars]

Time to buy an IIDTool or simular if you haven't got one already. Thats to clear faults.

Gary

[drivesafe]

Time to buy an IIDTool or simular if you haven't got one already. Thats to clear faults.

Gary

Hi Gary and while I am tempted to get something to clear the faults, the more I think about it the more I think this vehicle has had a problem from the day it rolled off the production line.

I have had problems with the sound and nav system from the day I bought this thing and they were never properly fixed, no matter how many times I put it in to be serviced and/or to get the problems addressed.

Every time one problem was fixed ( if they could fix it ) a new problem surfaced.

The alternator failure is another sore point as this vehicle is not fitted with a dual battery system and I only run 4 x 55w driving lights and even these are only fitted if I’m doing a long trip, which is vary rare and because the sound system is so useless, the first thing I do in most time when I get it to drive, is to turn the screen off, so no current load from the sound system.

And as I hate air conditioning ( in any vehicle ), it’s only on if the wife is with me.

So power usage in my case is well bellow average so why did the alternator last such a short time.

As above, the more I think back, the more weird problems I can remember, both before but more so, after the alternator failed.

About 6 months back, the Park Brake failed and would not release.

I NEVER drive to release my Park Brake, I have always released it with the switch before driving. On this occasion when it would not release using the switch, when I went to back out of a parking spot, it came off with a thud.

Two or three days later, it came good and has not missed a beat since.

The Global Opening is not working at this time and hell only knows what else is not working.

The air conditioning is another mystery operation.

As above, my wife has the air conditioner on when ever she is in the vehicle and when on, I turn on the seat air conditioning.

The passenger seat works every time. Mine might work and then won’t work.

For example, we can go to get the mail, my seat doesn’t work. I get out and get the mail, get in and the seat is now working, get out to fuel up, get back in and it’s not working again. Stop to do some shopping, get back in and it’s working again and again, the passenger seat never misses a beat.

I have to be honest and say that while the RR was under warranty, Land Rover were totally useless at addressing the problems with the sound/nav system, and I now think I should have laid the boot into them to fix the problems while it was under warranty and maybe I wouldn’t have all the problems I now have.

[33chinacars]

Sorry to hear of all your troubles Tim. Have no idea how to fix any of them. Sounds like a Friday afternoon special finish with a long weekend hangover. I would be pizzed off with it too

Gary

[harlie]

Unfortunately this sounds like the dealer through and through. They really have no idea what they are working with, in saying that, with the complexities of vehicles now days, work shops really need someone like an electronic engineer with all his toys (to be able to analyse CAN signals ect) on staff or on call at least. The dealerships can only “diagnose” a problem if one of the ECUs log a fault and report a code for them; if there’s no code they are truly stumped.

Back when my D2 was purchased, it had a strange engine surging issue at highway speeds that would come and go. No faults and luckily for me the workshop manager at the dealer took my word there was a problem and kept looking, I would leave the car with them for weeks on end, they could get it to do it occasionally but no ideas. Searching of the internet back then returned three other cases (all OS) described exactly as mine was doing. I printed these write ups out, took them in – they all reported a new engine ECU as the fix. Dealer told me that if the engine ECU has a problem the Trans ECU will report it – they could not comprehend the possibility of an ECU being faulty thus not passing any fault details about itself! Over the next 18 months they replaced every sensor, harness and connector under the bonnet, and during this time if I had found another vehicle that suited our needs it would have been sold. I eventually exploded in the dealership one Saturday in a very unprofessional rant that essentially emptied the building of customers. That afternoon a new engine ECU was fitted under protest of the experts in the workshop. We still have the car and it has not missed a beat since. My point is that quite often they really don’t understand what they are looking at.

[Homestar]

Geez Harlie, that would have done me in for sure...

I can't see why they didn't take a punt on replacing the ECU earlier - when I was working for a large diesel engine manufacturer, replacing the ECU was almost first thing on the list if a truck came in with an issue that didn't throw a fault code - if it didn't fix it, you swapped them back and kept looking, and put the new one back on the shelf - nothing lost. Sounds like the dealer was a total tosser...

[ariddell]

They're not cheap but it's one of those times when having a VCM or T4/T5 would come in very handy. Would allow you to make sure all the software versions for the various modules have been updated correctly and not missed by the dealer.

There was a fairly major looking software update for the audio system available that comes up in the main screen of SDD when a VCM is hooked up, not sure exactly what it does as it told me my car had already been done when i tried to run it. The LR diagnostic software also allows you to view the activity on the various busses to see the sort of communication drop outs described by others. I half suspect a lot of the dealers have no idea how to use their own tools for anything beyond the most common tasks.

The seat fans can crack inside, the drivers seat cooler on our 08 was similarly temperamental but was throwing an overheat code that could be seen in SDD. Turns out the little plastic air conduit between the fan and the vent inside the seat had cracked so it would work intermittently.

Shame you're not down here in Vic or I would have been happy to hook up to my VCM kit and see what it says for you, but may be worth finding someone other than your dealer with one up there.

[drivesafe]

Hi ariddell and thanks for the offer. If only I was closer.

Thanks for all the info folks.

I haven’t driven the RR for nearly a week but today, before taking it out for a spin to the post office, I measured the battery voltage and it was 12.53 which is not bad.

Still, going to replace it when time permits.

Now where would be the best place to get the fault codes cleared? Not sure I want a dealer to do it.