Extended height mode

[Rollin over]

Today we were very lucky to make it out of the Cells river area with the standard tires, the clay tracks were damp and very wet in places. The problem was at a very wet section of the track was rutted out and we got stuck in the ruts had all wheels spinning, had to backup and take a better line. So how does the extend high work? should have I took it out of drive and pushed the switch for extra height?

I must say some of track was very steep and I wonder if any other standard truck would have got out! Even when we were half way up this bloody hill the D4 was just moving so the 3.0 was revving at 4000 rpm to get us out of trouble, if we stopped it would have been all over! as you could not go back no way!

Yes before anyone tells me, we will have better tires on next time. And the best part is we have no damage just some light scratches that will remove ok.

We also found the D4 to be bloody great on gravel roads, so smooth and quiet, dust free interior.

Cheers

[camel_landy]

The car decides if it needs 'Extended' mode or not.

However, if you are in ruts, you can trick it into Extended by dropping the suspension. As it starts to bottom out, it'll then go into Extended.

If you do a search, you should find a load of info on it, including the Extended-Extended mode... ;)

HTH

M

[400HPONGAS]

Interesting ,Where is this switch for extra Height ? Only ever seen the 3 , access,standard and offroad!You have LLAMS or Goe rods ?

[101RRS]

If you do a search, you should find a load of info on it, including the Extended-Extended mode... ;)

HTH

M

Or try reading the handbook ;).

[camel_landy]

Interesting ,Where is this switch for extra Height ? Only ever seen the 3 , access,standard and offroad!You have LLAMS or Goe rods ?

RTFM... ;)

M

[WhiteD3]

Once you've bottomed out, press and hold the UP button while pressing the brake pedal. Super extended happens and stays in that mode provided you don't go above 8 kph.

To cheat, use your jack plate (which I'm sure you carry ;) ). A block of wood you can put the jack on on soft ground. Cut to suit but one side should be an inch or so shorter that the distance between ground and the chassis rail in normal mode. To force extended mode, lower the car onto the jacking plate which is held side on under the chassis rail.

[400HPONGAS]

RTFM = LMFAO

should have I took it out of drive and pushed the switch for extra height?

[WhiteD3]

RTFM = LMFAO

should have I took it out of drive and pushed the switch for extra height?

Only if you'd bottomed out.

[Celtoid]

I was under the impression that if you were already on your belly the car should have 'known' this and enabled extended height.

I don't know how the car realises that it's on it's belly...at first I thought that it could be the TC detecting no grip but that could happen in snow, ice or slippery mud, so I figure it must have weight sensors on the shocks/suspension. Is that so?

Anyway, mine has never automatically enabled extended height. I have always had to trick it or on occasions it does it after I've had it jacked up for a wheel change. I've never had to go to the extent of using the block of wood or jack method that WhiteD3 mentioned, as the times I used it I was already close to bottoming out anyway. I've then just selected access height. It won't go down immediately and there is a warning message regarding being aware of what you are lowering yourself onto. You then just press down again and it starts going down till something bottoms out. She then pops up and tells you extended mode is enabled.

I'm sure it only works if you have a mode other than normal selected on the TR system.

I say enabled for extended, cause it won't raise all the way up automatically. It's been a while since I've done it but I think there is an audible tone but there is definately a message on the screen that tells you extended is enabled and how to activate it. I think it's foot on brake and hold the suspension button up for a few seconds. She pops up a fair way too.

Cheers,

Kev.

[Graeme]

I don't know how the car realises that it's on it's belly...at first I thought that it could be the TC detecting no grip but that could happen in snow, ice or slippery mud, so I figure it must have weight sensors on the shocks/suspension. Is that so?
No weight sensors, only that the vehicle fails to lower when expected so assumes that it has grounded.

[101RRS]

No weight sensors, only that the vehicle fails to lower when expected so assumes that it has grounded.

But when out in the bush you are not lowering when you ground.

Also the book says that TC has to activate but in my experience it does not. Also in my experience when extended is activated it does not go to 275mm ground clearance but lifts 35mm above the current height setting - ie if at access height it lifts 35mm only, same if you were at onroad height when grounding. Only gets to 275mm ground clearance if you were already at offroad height.

Garry

[rmp]

Extended mode comes in when the car realises all four wheels are spinning and it's going nowhere. This may be when you're bellied out, or as has happened to me, just on a very slippery with no chance of being bellied. I was on quite a sideangle at the time so wasn't particuarly thriilled with having the centre of gravity raised ;-)

Once you're in Extended you can go into Super Extended as per the other posts. That you can control.

Do be careful with the throttle in high suspension settings as CV joints etc aren't at the their strongest.

Personally I would prefer to decide when the car goes into Extended....but now we can some measure of control with LLAMS!

<insert standard rant about lack of driver control of Land Rovers>

[discotwinturbo]

When it's at it's maximum height, be careful if you decide to hop out. Its quite a drop.

Brett....

[400HPONGAS]

So back to the original question

'so how does the extend high work? should have I took it out of drive and pushed the switch for extra height?"

So appears that most agree that is NO magic button, indeed a set of circumstances shall be met to enable extended mode , also not clearly enunciated in the manual either. Not quite sure of where he was going with should have I took it out of drive
thats another question!!

[Mungus]

Once you're in Extended you can go into Super Extended as per the other posts. That you can control.

Do be careful with the throttle in high suspension settings as CV joints etc aren't at the their strongest.



RMP,
Small alarm bells ringing. Just how much 'not at their strongest'. I understand, without too much thought, that the angles imposed by extreme limits would create higher stress, but are the CV's that affected that you will need to take it easy? I would imagine in certain situations and if needing extended height, you may also need some serious grunt under foot. Are you simply stating this as in all cases with high stresss angles on CV's, or is there a need for more caution with the LR CV's?

[CaverD3]

Only case I know of was giving it full welly on full lock when in extended height.
You can get it to go into extended heightby putting it in off road height, putting a block of wood under the chassis and lowering the hieght to normal. It will automatically put it into extended. So not about wheel spin but height sensors.

[camel_landy]

So back to the original question

'so how does the extend high work? should have I took it out of drive and pushed the switch for extra height?"

So appears that most agree that is NO magic button, indeed a set of circumstances shall be met to enable extended mode , also not clearly enunciated in the manual either. Not quite sure of where he was going with should have I took it out of drive
thats another question!!

A 'Set of circumstances' is probably the easiest way of looking at it and it is nothing to do with what gear it is in.

As for the 'Super' Extended Mode; If it goes into 'Extended Mode', just put your foot on the foot brake and then press & hold the suspension lift button for 3 seconds (until you hear another 'chime').

M

[rmp]

RMP,
Small alarm bells ringing. Just how much 'not at their strongest'. I understand, without too much thought, that the angles imposed by extreme limits would create higher stress, but are the CV's that affected that you will need to take it easy? I would imagine in certain situations and if needing extended height, you may also need some serious grunt under foot. Are you simply stating this as in all cases with high stresss angles on CV's, or is there a need for more caution with the LR CV's?

It is the case with all CVs and driveline components irrespective of manufacturer.

If you want to snap something this is how - find a hill with good traction, select low range reverse, full steering lock, angle for maximum suspension flex and then stab the throttle. Bang will result in pretty much any car.

The lower the gear, the more gentle you must be with the throttle. The greater the suspension flex and steering angle, the more gentle again. Therefore, in Extended/Super-E modes be gentle with the throttle and keep the wheels as straight as you can.

There may be circumstances where you need lots of throttle and Super-E mode. However, I have seen many a car break by drivers applying large amounts of hoof to the throttle. So I would suggest exiting the car and doing a little roadwork, maybe winching, even giving up rather than force things. It's hard to give exact rules, but any more than around say 1700rpm in Super-E mode and I'm thinking something else needs to be done.

By the way if you do snap a CV in a Disco put it into Rock Crawl so it can still move.

Unlike previous Landies, the drivelines in D3/D4/RRS is strong and not prone to breaking. The cars have other bush problems, but strength of transmission is not one of them! However, strength does not mean they are tolerant of abuse, as I said I've seen them break.

[gghaggis]

I'm pretty sure I've posted a few dozen times on this, but for the benefit of new members having trouble with the search function ...........

1. The car will enable extended mode if all 4 wheels are spinning and there is no forward motion, OR if it senses an obstruction when lowering. Extended is approx 35 ~ 40mm above whatever height you happen to be in.

2. ONLY when in extended, emergency (or super-extended) can be selected by the driver. With the vehicle stationary and motor running, hold down the brake pedal and select-and-hold the "up" position on the EAS switch until the car chimes. It will then raise a further 30mm or so (it is dependent on the individual car's calibration, amongst other things).

3. In either extended or emergency height, the car will lower back to the original height setting as soon as you exceed 8kph, travel for more than 45s continuously, restart the car or change TR setting.

If you need to raise the car to it's MAXIMUM height, without waiting for it to select extended height automatically, then follow this procedure with the car stationary, engine running, in low range and in Park:

1. Place the car in whatever TR program required (normally rock-crawl).
2. Raise the car to offroad if it has not already automatically raised (as it should when you select a TR program).
3. Use the LR jack and position it under the driver's jack location under the chassis rail. Wind up the jack until it has just taken the weight of the car (you can do this by hand).
4. Get into the car, close the driver's door and select "normal" height with the EAS switch. Don't apply the footbrake!
5. The car will attempt to lower, sense the obstruction and then raise 35mm above offroad.
6. Now apply the footbrake, and hold the EAS switch in the "up" position until the car chimes and raises a further 30mm or so.
7. Remove the jack from under the car!

Not every step is required in some situations, but if you follow all 7, you're guaranteed to get the car to raise. Note that the jack should be on firm ground, or you should have a footplate for it, to prevent it being pushed into the ground by the car (and hence it will not raise).

As rmp has pointed out, be careful with the throttle and full turning lock when at these heights. You almost NEVER need a heavy throttle when in rock-crawl, so don't be tempted to try it. The CV's are very strong, but any vehicle on full lock and at extreme wheel articulation will stress the CV.

Cheers,

Gordon

[CaverD3]

1. The car will enable extended mode if all 4 wheels are spinning and there is no forward motion, OR if it senses an obstruction when lowering. Extended is approx 35 ~ 40mm above whatever height you happen to be in.

I have had all four wheels spinning on wet grass and clay and it did not go into extended mode so I suspect it will do so only if hung up.

[gghaggis]

I have had all four wheels spinning on wet grass and clay and it did not go into extended mode so I suspect it will do so only if hung up.

You were probably still inching forward (or backward!), so it wouldn't trigger.

[CaverD3]

How would it know? If it was efffectively stationary on flat ground (which I have done) it would not pick up the inertia to tell if it was moving and the wheel speed would be irrelevent. :confused:

[gghaggis]

It cannot sense that it is "hung up" directly - there are no sensors/cameras that inform it of an obstacle in contact with the underbody. If you trigger a lowering of the vehicle and the lowering is impeded, it can sense that by noting the spring pressures and the height sensor readings. As you didn't trigger a lowering (I presume?), the car could only have raised itself by comparing the relative wheel speeds and the input data from the yaw and accelerometer sensors and concluding that you were stuck.

Cheers,

Gordon

[discotwinturbo]

All four wheels spinning on my D4 caused it to go to extended height. Vehicle had no forward movement and was on sand, but had not dug down.
Have also forced the lift the way Gordon showed me....to impress the family.
Smart bit of kit....apart from not liking steep sand dunes in high range.
Brett....

[CaverD3]

Yes, I suspect negative air pressure in the bags combined with downward movement detected by the suspension sensor.
Mine has gone into extended without being hung up but under extreme articulation.
Could go into extended mode differently in different TR settings with different perameters. :idea:

Very clever programing though and they improved it with the D4! :D

[gghaggis]

I have some video of a D3 on AT's and a D4 on road tyres, both in rock-crawl on the same obstacle - a noticeable difference viewing from outside the car, even though from the inside they both felt just as competent. I'll post it up on my YouTube channel.

Cheers,

Gordon

[Celtoid]

I'm pretty sure I've posted a few dozen times on this, but for the benefit of new members having trouble with the search function ...........

1. The car will enable extended mode if all 4 wheels are spinning and there is no forward motion, OR if it senses an obstruction when lowering. Extended is approx 35 ~ 40mm above whatever height you happen to be in.

2. ONLY when in extended, emergency (or super-extended) can be selected by the driver. With the vehicle stationary and motor running, hold down the brake pedal and select-and-hold the "up" position on the EAS switch until the car chimes. It will then raise a further 30mm or so (it is dependent on the individual car's calibration, amongst other things).

3. In either extended or emergency height, the car will lower back to the original height setting as soon as you exceed 8kph, travel for more than 45s continuously, restart the car or change TR setting.

If you need to raise the car to it's MAXIMUM height, without waiting for it to select extended height automatically, then follow this procedure with the car stationary, engine running, in low range and in Park:

1. Place the car in whatever TR program required (normally rock-crawl).
2. Raise the car to offroad if it has not already automatically raised (as it should when you select a TR program).
3. Use the LR jack and position it under the driver's jack location under the chassis rail. Wind up the jack until it has just taken the weight of the car (you can do this by hand).
4. Get into the car, close the driver's door and select "normal" height with the EAS switch. Don't apply the footbrake!
5. The car will attempt to lower, sense the obstruction and then raise 35mm above offroad.
6. Now apply the footbrake, and hold the EAS switch in the "up" position until the car chimes and raises a further 30mm or so.
7. Remove the jack from under the car!

Not every step is required in some situations, but if you follow all 7, you're guaranteed to get the car to raise. Note that the jack should be on firm ground, or you should have a footplate for it, to prevent it being pushed into the ground by the car (and hence it will not raise).

As rmp has pointed out, be careful with the throttle and full turning lock when at these heights. You almost NEVER need a heavy throttle when in rock-crawl, so don't be tempted to try it. The CV's are very strong, but any vehicle on full lock and at extreme wheel articulation will stress the CV.

Cheers,

Gordon

Thanks Gordon.

I've never measured the heights and was unaware that there were two stages to extended mode. I thought once the car bottomed out that it returned to the offroad height and then notified you that extended was 'available'.

I guess offroad on uneven ground it would be hard to tell that the D4 is up another 35 - 40mm, even if you were outside the car.

Thanks for the info.

Cheers,

Kev.

[CaverD3]

I have some video of a D3 on AT's and a D4 on road tyres, both in rock-crawl on the same obstacle - a noticeable difference viewing from outside the car, even though from the inside they both felt just as competent. I'll post it up on my YouTube channel.

Cheers,

Gordon

Thanks Gordon. :D

Link?

[camel_landy]

It is the case with all CVs and driveline components irrespective of manufacturer.

If you want to snap something this is how - find a hill with good traction, select low range reverse, full steering lock, angle for maximum suspension flex and then stab the throttle. Bang will result in pretty much any car...

...By the way if you do snap a CV in a Disco put it into Rock Crawl so it can still move. .

+1...


Unlike previous Landies, the drivelines in D3/D4/RRS is strong and not prone to breaking. The cars have other bush problems, but strength of transmission is not one of them! However, strength does not mean they are tolerant of abuse, as I said I've seen them break.

Ish... I've seen them break too.

IMO - One of the things which makes the T5 platform more tollerant is the auto gearbox. An auto means that the drivetrain, splines, etc... are more constantly loaded, so less likely to be 'shock' loaded.

Previously, most people would drive manuals. Without training, I find that most people tend to use the clutch more as an 'on/off' switch. 'Shock' loads are more likely to snap drive train components.

M

[Rollin over]

You may be right... I was sitting there spinning the wheels and found we weren't going anywhere so I tried reverse straight away and got out, it wasn't until later I remembered this option to raise car, but I had no warning as to how, so I wasn't sure how it was to work. We were in the middle of no where and no ph service so it took me by surpise that a D4 could get stuck in something that didn't look hard to drive through, must have been the stock tires lol

[gghaggis]

Thanks Gordon. :D

Link?

First one is D3

D3_wombats.avi - YouTube (http://youtu.be/ZoOSWljYRGk)

and this is a D4 at the same obstacle, same day

D4_wombats.avi - YouTube (http://youtu.be/fbXJ8ZtWMdg)

Cheers,

Gordon