Glow Plugs - L series Diesel

[101RRS]

As it is getting colder my diesel Freelander is getting harder to start in the morning. Can take up to 30 secs to start and then pollutes the environment for a while with grey smoke from the unburnt fuel.

Obvious culprit is the glow plugs - I know about one not being easy to to change because if its position but are the others just screw out and the new one screw in or do they stick and break off like the TD4s.

Likewise is it possible to test them in situ?

I have a few new ones somewhere and if they are just screw out screw in I will replace.

Cheers

Garry

[woko]

Easy test is to disconnect the wiring from the plug and use a piece of wire from the + of the battery and tap the end of the plug, if it sparks they are usually alright.

Never had any issues removing them, but there is always a 1st.

Also had a few that are difficult to start even with good glow plug (mine being one of them). with these I advanced the injector pump 1/4 of a tooth, this cures the problem.

[101RRS]

Thanks for that - it does seem harder to start since I did the belts so maybe even though the belt is on the right spot on the pulleys it might have moved on the adjuster. Hmmm not quite up on moving it so I will have to do some reading.

I assume that you do not lock the pump and you loosen the idler pulley a bit and the loosen off the adjuster bolts on the rear pulley holding the actual pully in place with a 3/8 drive in the square hole.

To advance the pump do you move it counter clockwise (top of the belt to the front) or clockwise (top of the belt to the rear). I assume that with everything connected and only loosened you cannot adjust things too far.

Cheers

Garry

[isuzurover]

DI diesels shouldn't need the glow plugs even in a canberra winter. you should look elsewhere.

[woko]

Easiest way to advance timing is to put a timing mark on the injector pump and cam shaft, loosen the bolts on the cam shaft pulley while holding the injector pump. Move the injector pump counter clockwise 1/4 tooth (make sure cam shaft hasn't moved) and tighten bolts on cam shaft pulley. Don't loosen the tensioner pulley. This way you will only need to remove the FIP belt cover only.
If you can do a cam belt on one of these it will be a breeze for you.

Disagree with DI not needing glow plugs. With older DI yes but most modern diesels need them. Good example take a TD4 with no fuel burning heater to the snow, you will have troubles starting even with glow plugs.

[101RRS]

Thanks Woko - not sure I would be game to do that - likely to stuff it up :(. I might get a local diesel service to do it for me.

Cheers

Garry

[wrinklearthur]

Hi Garry

There is a lack of information about on these L motors. So if you don't mind me hanging onto the coat-tails of this thread, I would like to keep the thread going with some other faults pertaining to the 'L' motor.

The problem is again with the Freelander belonging to Graham ( He was the one stuck in Warwick, Q'ld for 5 weeks with this Freelander and its head problems ).

To recap a little, the Freelander when Graham purchased it, looked to be a very clean and tidy unit. He did the usual motor checks for leaks, coolant colour and for clean oil. The purchase took place somewhere north of Brisbane and Graham started off to drive home, the rear welsh plug bust through corrosion letting the coolant go, just north of Warwick, which in turn lead to the damaged head being replaced along with the turbo.

How the current problem relates to that part of its history is unclear, but it did come about after that chain of events.

The problem is in my judgement, is with the turbo's boost pressure as the waste gate setting hasn't been checked since the turbo was replaced.
What is the correct or recommended boost pressure allowed for this motor?

The motor does run nicely at idle and won't show any faults until it is revved up, either at stand still or driving and then the power output the engine produces is then cut back.
Is this effect the so called limp home mode?

I can get back with some more specific details of the symptoms if asked what to look for, but in the meantime the car is drivable, although it's down on power.
Should we be looking for a device to read or reset the car's computer?
.

[101RRS]

Hi Garry

There is a lack of information about on these L motors. So if you don't mind me hanging onto the coat-tails of this thread, I would like to keep the thread going with some other faults pertaining to the 'L' motor.

What is the correct or recommended boost pressure allowed for this motor?

The motor does run nicely at idle and won't show any faults until it is revved up, either at stand still or driving and then the power output the engine produces is then cut back.
Is this effect the so called limp home mode?

Should we be looking for a device to read or reset the car's computer?
.

The L series is well covered in the RAVE Manual and the Freelander Haynes workshop manual.

I cannot see where turbo boost is listed.

Check the air fliter - if clogged it will strangle the engine at 3000rpm. Having said that the symptoms do indicate limp mode but normally the check engine light would be on. Limp mode happens when the ECU detects a fault (usually a sensor failure). The ECU is programmed with a range of default values for the sensors so that when an error is detected the majority of sensors are ignored(not sure which ones) and the ECU uses its own programmed values which allow the engine to run but not at its maximum performance (hence limp mode). Driving the car (I did it from Melbourne to Canberra) it is a slug - slow acceleration and a top speed of about 110 kph but the check engine light should be on (if it not on you are not in limp mode).

You should get codes cleared and then start and run the engine and see what codes come back.

Check that air filter first though.

Garry

[woko]

Recommended boost pressure is 14psi.

It wont get full boost pressure at stand still free revving the engine. the boost may not be right, but I think you have another problem.

It sounds like the needle lift sensor is faulting due to fuel starvation.

How long since the fuel filter was changed?

Has the screen in the fuel supply banjo bolt been checked and cleaned?

[camel_landy]

I would have to disagree with the comment about 'L' Series diesels not needing glow-plugs in cold weather. Mine had a glow-plug failure and was an absolute bitch to start unless I had run up the Webasto heater before hand.

3x of the plugs are easy to change...

...however, sods law states that it's the plug obscured by the injector pump that has failed!!

M

[101RRS]

I would have to disagree with the comment about 'L' Series diesels not needing glow-plugs in cold weather. Mine had a glow-plug failure and was an absolute bitch to start unless I had run up the Webasto heater before hand.

3x of the plugs are easy to change...

...however, sods law states that it's the plug obscured by the injector pump that has failed!!

M

As I have 3 new plugs I am going to replace them assuming no issues. Not doing the fourth as my logic is with three good plugs and maybe a dud fourth the engine should still fire OK on the good three - it only needs to fire once to get temps up.

Now what a stupid idea to put the fourth glow plug behind the injector pump - we constantly see this sort of nonsense in landrover products. Great ideas let down by its execution.

I will do the plugs first (bought a long reach 10mm socket yesterday) and if starting is still difficult I will try the fine tuning of the injector pump - I am surprised this process is not listed in the workshop manuals - landrover obviously thought that the accuracy of one tooth was good enough - however having the adjustment available on the camshaft end of the injection pump belt end implies that fine adjustment was always intended.

Garry

[101RRS]

I went and replaced the three accessible glow plugs today. All came out relatively easily - noting that the fourth glow plug cannot be removed without removing the injection pump :confused: so that is staying put. To get the first glow plug out you have to remove the top radiator hose because it is in the way.

Here is a pic of the removed glow plugs - the two at the right only have a light carbon covering but the one on the left was covered in engine oil - maybe a dead valve seal.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e334/gazzz21/Forum%20Posts%20Album/P4150010.jpg

On putting the new glow plugs in and turning on the ignition the first thing I noticed was that the glow plug light was on much longer than previously - now 15 secs where before was only 5 secs. On turning the engine over there was an initial fire but the engine did not start for a few more turns then ran fine - this time there was no unburnt fuel smoke on start.

So has started quicker without smoke but the outside temp was 22 degrees so not a definitive test but I would say I did have a glow plug issue.

I will see what happens in the morning when temp is about 3 degrees. On cold mornings I normal go through two glow plug cycles (summer just start) so if there is still is an issue I guess I will try fine tuning the pump.

Cheers

Garry

[101RRS]

Went out and started the car this morning - not as cold as expected but did take some cranking to start but no smoke:) - so issue was/is a combination of glow plugs and injector pump fine tuning.

I took the injector pump belt cover off and found the sproket to be in the fully retarded position. The slots are about 15mm long so I moved the sprocket to the mid position which has advanced about half a tooth so now is in a neutral position. The engine started straight away but even the engine was cold, outside temp was about 23 degrees.

So again I will try early in the morning when temps will be much colder.

For those who have a FL1 L series here is a pic of the general layout of the injector pump belt - the injector pump sprocket on the left and the camshaft sprocket on the right. The four adjuster bolts can be seen on the camshaft sprocket. Loosening these bolts allows the sproket to turn a little while the actual camshaft to which the sprocket is bolted does not move.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

I didn't take a pic before adjusting the belt but the adjuster slots in this pic of the camshaft sprocket are covered by the bolt heads as the adjustment is now in the neutral position. You can see the bolt head marks on the sprocket that gives an indication of the adjustment range available.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

Garry

[101RRS]

Went out this morning to start the car - after one glow plug sequence it fired first go and with no smoke :).

Thanks to Woko for his timing advice - worked really well. However I would have thought that there might have been a more scientific way of fine tuning the injection pump. To advance the timing until the engine fires OK when cold seems just a little crude.

Nevertheless the car starts really well now - thanks to everyone for your input.

Cheers

Garry

[woko]

There is a more scientic way to check timing. you can check the plunger lift in the injector pump. you need a make a tool to fit into the plug in the middle of the injector lines so a dial indicator can measure the lift of the plunger. The lift setting is 0.8mm when on TDC. I have measured a few with starting issues and the lift has been 0.2 +-0.1 and 1/4 of a tooth advance lifted it to the required 0.8