HID headlight upgrade

[boofdtl]

Last night i put the first of many HID headlight upgrade kits in a D2 its a 35w and 6000k mate gone are the days of the yellow of littler better lights this upgrade is very nice for got to get pics they was heaps of work on this one last night got a D1 to do next week will get pics....

Its a plug in unit very well set up and the cost for the uint is $199 i throught thats good for what you get when you see the light at night.....

[seano87]

I just pity what everyone else sees coming the opposite way.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus using Tapatalk 2

[lewy]

have to agree that HID lighting is a great improvment on normal? lighting i have cheap chinese HID drivies.However the comments about about blinding oncoming traffic are correct if they are not adjusted correctly,Talking to old mate the highway patrol copper the other day they have defected about 30 cars in the last 4 weeks for showing anything but white light to the front which hid tend to do after about 4000k is exceded.Justified is my opinion.

[boofdtl]

Adjustment is the key i did have to lower them about 1/4 to 1/2 a turn in saying that they are more on the road the high beam side was way to high anyway....

[Slunnie]

have to agree that HID lighting is a great improvment on normal? lighting i have cheap chinese HID drivies.However the comments about about blinding oncoming traffic are correct if they are not adjusted correctly,Talking to old mate the highway patrol copper the other day they have defected about 30 cars in the last 4 weeks for showing anything but white light to the front which hid tend to do after about 4000k is exceded.Justified is my opinion.

Is there an ADR, rule or guideline that relates headlight colour temperature that anybody can provide a link for?

[boofdtl]

Is there an ADR, rule or guideline that relates headlight colour temperature that anybody can provide a link for?


There is i am trying to find it and post it up..

[lewy]

division 2 81[a] of the MOTOR VEHICLES (STANDARDS) REGULATIONS - AUSTRALIAN VEHICLE STANDARDS RULES.this link is from the nt website
MOTOR VEHICLES (STANDARDS) REGULATIONS - AUSTRALIAN VEHICLE STANDARDS RULES (http://notes.nt.gov.au/dcm/legislat/legislat.nsf/linkreference/MOTOR%20VEHICLES%20%28STANDARDS%29%20REGULATIONS%2 0-%20AUSTRALIAN%20VEHICLE%20STANDARDS%20RULES?opendo cument)

81 Performance of headlights
(1) When on, a headlight, or additional headlight, fitted to a vehicle must:
(a) show only white light; and
(b) project its main beam of light ahead of the vehicle.
(2) Headlights must be fitted to a vehicle so their light does not reflect off the vehicle into the driver’s eyes.
hope this helps

[Slunnie]

Thanks for this Lewy.

I'm assuming from the ADR in that context that the headlights need to be white as opposed to blue, red, green etc rather than a specific warmth of white light. I ask this because if the police are booking cold whites then so many headlights would also be outside of range being warm whites. I wasn't sure if there was a specific value or range such as 2500-4000k specified.

[lewy]

you would think that to rely on one persons eyesight over anothers would be a hard ask, ie what appears white to me may be blue to another perhaps the police are carrying some sort of meter.also at rego time there is a board with certain marks to check the height and alignment of your lights this will have some sort of formula attached to it, dont know if this is used to measure glare etc.The "just commodores" forum used to have a regular contributer to the forum from the highway patrol members could ask questions in a "without Predjudice" way of him\her if anyone is a member.

[boofdtl]

Thanks for finding that so how do think it is as i have a 3inch lift and std lights and they go right through to the driver in front do you think that it would be the same.

[Tombie]

Thanks for finding that so how do think it is as i have a 3inch lift and std lights and they go right through to the driver in front do you think that it would be the same.

There is an ADR for that too ;)

Specific maximum height for lights above roadway.

1400mm max / 500mm min - to centre of the headlight.

[Slunnie]

Thanks for finding that so how do think it is as i have a 3inch lift and std lights and they go right through to the driver in front do you think that it would be the same.
That isn't covered in the above ADR.

The NSW guidelines that I have seen have a maximum headlight height of 1200mm from the road.

Interestingly, for trucks at least and I'm not sure if this transfers to 4WD's, but there is no specification on power output of the bulbs or the type of bulb but the headlight must project forward at least 25m on low beam and 50m on high beam and they must be a white light (no specifications on how white). The parker lights must be no greater than 7watts however.

Vehicle standards information sheets (http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/registration/downloads/vsi/vsi_dl1.html)

This may not help 4WDs though.

After a brief scan I couldn't see anything from DOTARS in the NCOP.

[Tombie]

Australian Design Rule 13/00 – Installation of Lighting and Light Signalling Devices on other than L-Group Vehicles

6.2.9. Other requirements

The requirements of paragraph 5.5.2. shall not apply to dipped-beam headlamps. Dipped-beam headlamps shall not swivel according to the angle of lock of steering. Dipped-beam headlamps with gas-discharge light sources shall only be permitted in conjunction with the installation of headlamp cleaning device(s) according to Regulation No. 45. In addition, with respect to vertical inclination, the provision of paragraph 6.2.6.2.2. shall not be applied when these headlamps are installed.
Paragraph 5.5.2 basically says that if a fitting won't work just by fitting a globe, it's not considered a light. (Ie optional driving lights that aren't fitted aren't lights etc).

And regarding 6.2.6.2.2...


Quote
6.2.6.2.2. However, devices which are adjusted manually, either continuously or non- continuously, shall be permitted, provided they have a stop positon at which the lamps can be returned to the initial inclination defined in paragraph 6.2.6.1.1. by means of the usual adjusting screws or similar means.
These manually adjustable devices must be operable from the driver's seat.
Continually adjustable devices must have reference makes indicating the loading conditions that require adjustment of the dipped-beam.
The number of positions on devices which are not continuously adjustable must be such as to ensure compliance with the range of values prescribed in paragraph 6.2.6.1.2. in all the loading conditions defined in Annex 5.
For these devices also, the loading conditions of Annex 5 that require adjustment of the dipped-beam shall be clearly marked near the control of the device (see Annex https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2012/05/889.jpg.

So according to 6.2.9, the part of clause 6.2.6.2.2 that states manual adjustment is permitted, is NOT permitted in the case of HID fitment, ie, manual adjustment isn't allowed. So that means you need to comply with the previous clause, which is shown below:


Quote
6.2.6.2.1. In the case where a headlamp levelling device is necessary to satisfy the requirements of paragraphs 6.2.6.1.1. and 6.2.6.1.2., the device shall be automatic.
Therefore, automatic self levelling is required. (the two paragraphs mentioned refer to the actual specifications for beam angle etc).


But what about ADR 45?, well that refers mainly to signal lamps, but it does outline the colour variations permitted for lighting. I haven't converted the numbers to easy to understand form, but basically, white has to be white, not blue, yellow or purple. Ie 10,000K HID's are illegal.

Quote
Australian Design Rule 45/01 – Lighting and Light Signalling Devices not Covered by ECE Regulations

45.2. GENERAL SPECIFICATIONS

45.2.1. Lamps shall be so designed and constructed that in normal use, despite the vibrations to which they may then be subjected, they continue to function satisfactorily and retain the characteristics prescribed by this Rule.

45.2.2. The colour of the light emitted shall be within the limits of the co-ordinates prescribed in Clause 45.2.2.1 for the colour in question.

45.2.2.1. Colours of Lamps- Trichromatic Co-ordinates

Photometric blah blah stuff.... Just keep it white (ie under 6500K).



Then we get to the gas discharge specific ADR's.....



Quote
Australian Design Rule 75/00 - Headlamp Cleaners

6 GENERAL SPECIFICATIONS

6.1 The headlamp cleaner shall be designed and constructed to clean those parts of the light-emitting surface of the headlamp which distribute the passing beam and the driving beam so that at least the cleaning effect specified in paragraph 7 below is achieved.

6.2 The headlamp cleaner shall be furthermore so designed that:

6.2.1 When parts of the headlamp cleaner in the rest position(s) are on the headlamps' illuminating surface, the photometric values of the headlamps, .... blah blah, not more than a 5% reduction in light output.....

6.2.1.1 Paragraph 6.2.1. is not applicable when the headlamp and the parts of the headlamp cleaner referred to in paragraph 6.2.1. form a complete assembly during the approval of the headland;

6.2.2 During operation, except in the rest position, the mechanical parts shall not cover more than:

6.2.2.1 20 % of the illuminating surface of a passing lamp,

6.2.2.2 10 % of the illuminating surface of a driving lamp with no high beam.

6.2.3 It is able to operate at all temperatures between -10 degrees C and +35 degrees C and to operate satisfactorily at speeds between 0 and 130 km/h (or the maximum speed of the vehicle if it is below 130 km/h); .......... the cleaner shall remain undamaged if exposed to a temperature of -35 degrees C and of +80 degrees C respectively for a period of one hour;

6.2.4 In normal use, in spite of the vibration to which it may be subjected, its satisfactory operation continues to be ensured;

6.2.5 It will not be functionally damaged due to water, ice or snow accumulating on it during normal operation of the vehicle, even if the cleaning liquid is frozen; a temporary failure due to freezing or deposit of snow shall not be considered as damage, provided that the device can be made to work again by simple means;

6.2.6 Elements which may come into contact with the cleaning fluid must be resistant against a mixture consisting of 50 % methyl alcohol, ethyl alcohol or isopropyl alcohol and 50 % water;

6.2.7 Its parts do not hinder the adjustment of the headlamps or the inserting or changing of filament lamps; if necessary, the cleaner or parts of it may be detachable, if they can be removed with simple tools.

6.3 Parts of the headlamp cleaner which, in the rest position(s) and/or during operation, form part of the external surface of the vehicle, shall meet the following requirements:
6.3.x. goes on to basically state that there are to be no no sharp or pointy parts, like bonnet scoops but scaled down..... Have a read for the details.

Quote
6.5 In case of approval of a vehicle the following requirements shall also be met:

6.5.1 Cleaning of all passing (high beam) headlamps shall be compulsory. If there are more than two driving headlamps, the cleaning of one pair of these headlamps shall be sufficient;

6.5.2 If the cleaner has a fluid container this may be combined with the fluid container for the windscreen washers and the rear window washer.......


ADR 77 states the following items of interest:

Quote
Australian Design Rule 77/00 - Gas Discharge Headlamps


6.1.1 Headlamps shall be so made that with suitable gas-discharge light source they give adequate illuminance without dazzle when emitting the passing beam, and good illumination when emitting the driving beam.

6.1.6 The trichromatic coordinates of the light of the beams emitted by headlamps using gas- discharge light sources must be in the following boundaries:

limit towards:
blue: x > 0.310
yellow: x < 0.500
green: y < 0.150 + 0.640x
green: y < 0.440
purple: y > 0.050 + 0.750x
red: y > 0.382

6.2.1 The passing beam must produce a sufficiently sharp "cut-off" to permit a satisfactory adjustment with it's aid. The "cut-off" must be a horizontal straight line on the side opposite to the direction of traffic for which the headlamp is intended: on the other side .....(it can't be too high or low)...... A cut-off extending above a combination of these lines shall in no circumstances be permitted.

6.2.2.1 .....in the case of headlamps designed to meet the requirements of left-hand traffic, the "cut-off" on the right-half of the screen is horizontal.....
So dazzle and light spill above the horizontal (slightly higher on the passenger side) is a no go.

(If anyone can convert those trichromatic coordinates to a more 'real world' figure, I love you long time....)

Quote
6.2.5 Only one gas-discharge light source is permitted for each passing beam headlamp.
So no doubling up of HID globes in your headlights. Levelling is taken care of in ADR 13 above. ('aint the labrynth of ADR's wonderful??)



And ADR 78 basically goes into the specifics of globe design, specifics on the arc discharge (shape, photometrics etc) but I wouldn't worry too much about that, as long as you dont have blue or purple HID's.

[lewy]

im thinking that this discussion has been had before not only on this forum but many other auto related forums,Slunny will tell me if i am wrong but i think his original post said more or less'prove it in legal terms that they are illegal" The fact that your standard lights being white but they are possibly aimed to high may be in breach of that "formula"that i have already posted about.which i will now try and find.also i believe that lights coming from behing are as bigger danger as those coming from the front as you can usually adjust the mirror away from your face.:D

[Tombie]

That isn't covered in the above ADR.

The NSW guidelines that I have seen have a maximum headlight height of 1200mm from the road.

Interestingly, for trucks at least and I'm not sure if this transfers to 4WD's, but there is no specification on power output of the bulbs or the type of bulb but the headlight must project forward at least 25m on low beam and 50m on high beam and they must be a white light (no specifications on how white). The parker lights must be no greater than 7watts however.

Vehicle standards information sheets (http://www.rta.nsw.gov.au/registration/downloads/vsi/vsi_dl1.html)

This may not help 4WDs though.

After a brief scan I couldn't see anything from DOTARS in the NCOP.

Actually there is - ADR 13...

Aftermarket halogen to HID conversions are available however their use on a road registered vehicle will generally result in contravention of the relevant ADRs.



Typical ‘conversions’ comprise ballasts, wiring and HID globes that plug straight into the existing lamp.


Halogen lamps and their globes must comply with ADRs 46 and 51, while HID lamps and their globes must comply with a different set of requirements within ADRs 77 and 78. Interchanging globe types (such as putting HID globes into a lamp designed for a halogen globe) prevents continued compliance of the lamp/globe assembly.


In addition, ADR 13 requires that all vehicles fitted with headlamps (including HID) producing over 2,000 lumens (a measure of light output) have a self-levelling system and headlight washers.



Simple retro conversions don’t provide these features and are therefore illegal for road use and are likely to be excessively glary to other road users.
If the vehicle manufacturer offered optional HID lights for a particular model then retrofitting the complete system including lamps, globes and the features required by ADR 13 to that model should be acceptable. But ‘grafting’ a full system between models or makes would impose performance certification requirements in the new application and is unlikely to be viable.

[Tombie]

As for "what colour white"...ADR 78/00 covers that one...



3. TECHNICAL REQUIREMENTS

3.9. Colour

3.9.1. The colour of the light emitted shall be white or yellow, as prescribed on the relevant data sheet.

3.9.2. In case of white light, the calorimetric characteristics, expressed in CIE chromaticity coordinates, shall lie within the limits given on the relevant data sheet which are to be within the area formed by the following limits:

Towards blue...............................x > 0.310

Towards yellow............................x < 0.500

Towards green.............................y < 0.150 + 0.640x

Towards green.............................y < 0.440

Towards purple............................y > 0.050 + 0.750x

Towards red.................................y > 0.382


3.9.4. The colour shall be measured according to the conditions specified in annex 4, paragraph 10.

This basically means the bulb colour should be 4100 K, with a tolerance of between 3500 K and 5000 K.

[Slunnie]

Skuilnaam, a huge thank you to you! Thanks for finding all of this data, digesting and presenting it. I'll sit down and digest it tonight better than a skim which I have to do right now, but it looks like you've hit the nail right on the head. Thanks so much again.

[Slunnie]

im thinking that this discussion has been had before not only on this forum but many other auto related forums,Slunny will tell me if i am wrong but i think his original post said more or less'prove it in legal terms that they are illegal" The fact that your standard lights being white but they are possibly aimed to high may be in breach of that "formula"that i have already posted about.which i will now try and find.also i believe that lights coming from behing are as bigger danger as those coming from the front as you can usually adjust the mirror away from your face.:D

Yes and no, it wasn't a questioning of what you'd presented - you presented what you had witnessed and there can be not a lot of real debate about that.

What I was more interested in is a couple of things:

Firstly to clarify what is fact per the guidelines and ADR's so that we can work with the proper information and so within an accurate framework. I've got a pretty good grasp on some areas of modifications and I know the rules pretty well (obviously not lights though :D ) and I see a lot of information thrown up on forums that is just blatently incorrect. So now I prefer to work from the source for vehicle modifications.

The HID discussion had come out in another thread which was really interesting I thought. The end result was the forum decided to fit HID according to the ADRs etc as a straight bulb swap was not legal - no problem, but from all of this information and what Skuilnaam has just presented today, we can look for options to do HID in a manner that is legal, and so the implication may be that HID can be fitted to vehicles like SLS equipped Disco2's if an HID specific headlamp assembly is manufactured by an aftermarket supplier, or options for xxxx landys with standard round headlight assemblies may be....... etc.

The guts of it however related to the warmth of the globe and what the actual definition of what is legal... or more to the point what actually is white light by the ADR's definition on headlight colour, and despite what is practised by the police, what is allowed and not allowed as testable by the courts. The implications for this at the time of asking wasn't necessarily HID specific although it is obviously applicable, but on the shelf there are a number of headlights available which include temperatures that are out of the specified colour range (and wattage). I thought that it was the Xenon headlights that had a notable reputation for being a blue light and likewise it would be interesting to know if older globes or lower voltage/watt globe are at the other end of the scale and infact too warm.

This is what was actually rattling around in my mind rather than a "prove it".

[lewy]

thanks slunnie,I should learn not to try and put words in people's mouth,As i said i personally find HID's excellent when i am behind them.It is getting to the stage up here were it is getting dangerous with all the bright lights coming at you that I would welcome a crackdown on these modified lights or at least a friendly warning from the powers that they are watching.Or it could be my 56 years old banjo playing eyes.:D

[boofdtl]

Thanks for posting all the info up guys makes my job easy its a good read as well thanks again..

Boof