Code of Conduct for MPs. Why not?

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Have been reading the news today and in the light of the Craig Thompson and Peter Slipper affairs. MPs reluctant to support code of conduct - ABC News (Australian Broadcasting Corporation) (http://www.abc.net.au/news/2012-05-14/mps-reluctant-to-support-code-of-conduct/4009436).

It seems that neither of the major parties are willing to support legislation that will codify their conduct inside and outside Parliament.

The Ministry of Health requires me to have a code of conduct, as do most departments in the public service. So if it's good for the goose then it should be good for the gander and members of parliament, the senate and state legislatures should also have a legally required code of conduct. To which they can be legally held accountable.

[CraigE]

That just shows how many are con artists and abuse the system.
In nearly every other field of employment we are bound by codes of conduct. Why should these people be any different.
Time a few of them lost their jobs and/or went to jail.
:mad:

[Drover]

Political Code of Conduct = Political suicide
…..and that’s why it will never happen.:mad:

[vnx205]

Is there a danger that if such a thing existed, they would spend all their time in the house debating whether some member of the party across the chamber had breeched the code of conduct?

It might become another distraction from their job of running the country.

Although lately they seem to be spending a lot of time on the issue of their colleagues' behaviour anyway. :)

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Is there a danger that if such a thing existed, they would spend all their time in the house debating whether some member of the party across the chamber had breeched the code of conduct?

...<snip> :)Not sure about their distracting from the business of mucking up the country, but if they had a Code of conduct, it should be clear when they have to stand down instead of playing musical chairs while keeping an illegitimate government in power.

[Mick-Kelly]

Not sure about their distracting from the business of mucking up the country, but if they had a Code of conduct, it should be clear when they have to stand down instead of playing musical chairs while keeping an illegitimate government in power.
Couldnt have said it better myself. The ALP are just shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic.

[ramblingboy42]

whats that I can smell? ah yes, its just the soapbox being pushed into position.....

[JDNSW]

Is there a danger that if such a thing existed, they would spend all their time in the house debating whether some member of the party across the chamber had breeched the code of conduct?

It might become another distraction from their job of running the country.

Although lately they seem to be spending a lot of time on the issue of their colleagues' behaviour anyway. :)

At the risk of usurping Ron's prerogatives, can I ask what pants have to do with codes of conduct? (I do seem to remember quite some time ago a prominent Australian politician losing his in a foreign city.)

But I was of the impression that the (proposed) code of conduct probably referred more to issues such as fiddling expense accounts or accepting cash or skiing holidays in exchange for legislation. Be too much to ask, I suppose, that it be applied to those members caught 'branch stacking' or doing deals in secret in return for support in the house.

John

[Lotz-A-Landies]

whats that I can smell? ah yes, its just the soapbox being pushed into position.....Not at all. I can be retrenched because of the fiscal requirements of the government, he can be unelected at the fickle requirements of the electorate so neither of us has secure employment.

I am under a code of conduct and it is frequently held above our heads as is professional misconduct. Why should my ultimate boss be exempted from the same conditions.

BTW: I did not vote for the current opposition at the last election, but I did vote believing in Juliar's promise of no carbon tax.

[ATH]

If those we elect to parliament don't know right from wrong at their age, what hope have we of their ability to run the country properly?
It's a disgrace that the whole of the parliamentary system and the image of the country itself, should be sullied by the actions of these selfish, arrogant incompetents, on both sides of the house, in the upper and lower chambers.
And we've got no hope of it ever getting any better and no so called "code of conduct" will change that.
Stop wasting time and get on with trying to keep the country from being mired in the same pile of **** that's going to affect the world soon because of the actions of a tin pot country like Greece and a few other members of the EU.
Plus the bankers of course.
AlanH.

[Sleepy]

What would a code of conduct achieve ? Bit like peeing in a wetsuit, makes you feel warm inside but no one really notices.

The ALLEGED offences of Slipper and Thompson are covered by current laws....Fraud, Harassment etc. If found guilty then they should be charged appropriately.

Although, thinking as I type, it would be appropriate to have a rule about wearing Budgie smugglers.;)

[Blknight.aus]

I have a simple code of conduct for them

I'll stand within earshot with a bloody great gun, Alex can watch the proceedings, When he says "Daddy, they're being silly" or "they're being naughty" Or "he called him a bad word" I'll shoot one.

Should have a dictatorship in by next week I reckon.

[bob10]

Just looked up " expedient" in my Macquarie budget dictionary, [ I know, a man of few words],:

1. tending to promote some proposed or desired object.

2. conducive to advantage or interest, as opposed to right.

3 a means to an end.

Political expediency is what keeps Thompson in Parliament, and what put Slipper in the Speakers Chair. Both sides of the house would do the same to cling to power. A code of conduct might make Joe public feel warm & fuzzy, but somehow I don't think it would change much.

But then again, it depends on what book you read out of . In my Routledges NEW Sixpenny Dictionary [ with 238 illustrations! ] published in 1892,
expe'dient, : Proper ; fit; convenient ; suitable ; . A means to an end ; a shift.
Big Red must have the same book. She should look up " con'science : Moral sense of right and wrong." Bob

[Lotz-A-Landies]

...<snip>
Big Red must have the same book. She should look up " con'science : Moral sense of right and wrong." BobBob

You're nearly right Juliar has made a science out of being a con artist.

She was being expedient when she lied about being a Lesbian to get elected into student politics and now the lie is she's anti gay/lesbian rights because she's playing to the base elements in our society to stay elected.

[DiscoMick]

We already have a code of conduct, called the law. Neither Slipper nor Thompson have been convicted of anything. If they are, and the penalty is more than a year in prison, they will be thrown out of parliament.

A code of conduct has great potential to be abused to silence your political opponents by accusing them of some crime, which doesn't have to be actually proven to falsely discredit someone. An example was the trumped up sodomy charges in Malaysia, used to silence the opposition leader.

Be very wary about being seduced in the currrent 'trial by media'. Its a very dangerous and slippery downhill slope towards silencing public opinion.

[tonic]

Couldnt have said it better myself. The ALP are just shuffling deck chairs on the Titanic.

Yes, what a joke, the world economy is not so good and we are falling into it slowly and all we seem to be doing is watching a comedy show. If what I heard last night is true, the next bit of news is that Mrs Shorten has moved home to mums becuase Bill has put a bun in his PA's oven. More distraction, what's next. Code of conduct will just give them more to argue about and give the media more to play with while hiding what they are really doing with our laws and economy.

[DiscoMick]

Didn't Shorten and his wife appear together at the weekend to deny that rumour? And, even if it was true, so what? How does that affect his role in government? The media treats government like a soap opera.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

I think you're mostly missing the point of a code of conduct. At present the only way an MP stops sitting in the house is if he convicted of a criminal offence.

As we've seen in this Craig Thomson affair is that the Government has managed to string the investigation out for three years, now the crimes associatiated with breaches of electorial law have had their statute of limitations pass, so crimes that may have removed Thompson from Parliament are now no more than a talking points in pubs and forums.

We should be able to expect more of the people who represent us.

A code of conduct would specify what conduct of MPs are unacceptable, and it would specify the actions that are to be taken including when an MP can continue to sit and when they can not continue to sit in Parliament when alleged breaches of the Code occur.

It will save a lot of the debate and distraction instead of increasing it.

[DiscoMick]

I doubt if the government wanted the investigation strung out for 3 years. Short and quick would have suited them better. Thompson himself complained his life had been frozen for 3 years when it should have only taken 6 months.
I just think its dangerous to have any code which can be used to evict elected representatives who have not been convicted of committing any crime. It means the people in their electorate lose their voice in parliament, which is undemocratic.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Police and health workers can be stood down even when they haven't been convicted of a criminal offence and even if the grievance is not a criminal offence.

Why should our bosses be held to a lower standard?

[tonic]

Didn't Shorten and his wife appear together at the weekend to deny that rumour? And, even if it was true, so what? How does that affect his role in government? The media treats government like a soap opera.

Keep watching the news and we will see, I understand we are talking about criminal activity mainly, but where would it stop. Senior police for instance can be stood down for some types if adultery.

[vnx205]

References to Bill Shorten's alleged dalliance raise questions about the prospect of a code of conduct.

Is the behaviour of a politician in the bedroom or even in his mistress's bedroom to be scrutinised to see if it breaches the code of conduct? How does it affect his performance in parliament?

As there is even some doubt about the veracity of the rumour, it also raises the question of what is the most unparliamentary behaviour; impregnating your PA or using a rumour about someone's personal life (which may turn out to be unfounded) to destroy someone's political career.

It could be argued that spreading rumours for political gain is more the sort of behaviour that parliament should be concerned with rather than marital infidelity.

I would have expected that if any of the tabloid journalists thought that the story had legs that it would have featured more prominently in the gutter press by now. Maybe they don't think it is true.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

We already have a code of conduct, called the law. Neither Slipper nor Thompson have been convicted of anything. If they are, and the penalty is more than a year in prison, they will be thrown out of parliament.

A code of conduct has great potential to be abused to silence your political opponents by accusing them of some crime, which doesn't have to be actually proven to falsely discredit someone. An example was the trumped up sodomy charges in Malaysia, used to silence the opposition leader.

Be very wary about being seduced in the currrent 'trial by media'. Its a very dangerous and slippery downhill slope towards silencing public opinion.So what you're saying is that so long as our members of Parliament are not convicted criminals, is O.K. for them to have low morals and indulge in the lowest of acts so long as a criminal conviction does not occur when they are in office.

I would have thought we should have a right to expect a much higher standard of those who would dictate to us.

In the game of politics, all parties run the risk of tit-for-tat, if one side makes unfounded allegations against the other there is just as much chance of the reverse being true.

A code of conduct, can quite easily say its O.K to commit adultry but don't use tax payer funds to do it. If you do expect to be stood down while it's investigated, to your party's detriment.

Perhaps it will cause al parties to scrutinise the background and morality of those they pre-select and offer to the electorate.

Addit: On Craig Thomson AEC today reported http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-news/electoral-commission-in-new-thomson-probe-20120516-1yqbs.html

" The analysis notes that the combined $196, 000 worth of salaries of Crisalee Stevens and Matthew Burke - who were employed at the HSU to help directly with Mr Thomson's bid for Parliament - had been properly disclosed in HSU third party expenditure returns for 2006/07 and 2007/08.

This afternoon Mr Thomson tweeted a short response to the electoral commission findings.

"AEC report clearly shows FWA got it wrong on electoral expenses. Wonder how widely that gets reported!"

Even in spite of the disclosures, I wonder if the members of the HSU knew they were funding the political aspirations of their National President to the tune of $196,000? None of the 5 HSU members in this office, knew that was where their HSU union dues were being spent.

[DiscoMick]

As a member I wouldn't be happy but if it was properly disclosed then the whole executive is to blame not just Thompson.

[George130]

They area employed by the people so should have a code of conduct. Simple in my eyes. If my minister can get away with it then so can I when employed in his department. That should scare them.

[Sleepy]

As a member I wouldn't be happy but if it was properly disclosed then the whole executive is to blame not just Thompson.

Probably a thread drift, but you're spot on DM. Surely the process that was (or wasn't) in place must be a concern.
How is it that someone could, allegedly, clock up such expenses without a system of audit and review?
If I spend over $100 on the work account I must have receipts and any expenses must be justifiable. All expenses are reviewed monthly by accountants with sharp pencils (and no sense of humour;))

Nonetheless, IMHO, these (and any) alleged criminals must be first found guilty before we determine any penalty.

[DT-P38]

Absolutely they should be held to a much higher standard than the rest of us.

Think about it people ... They are our leaders and what is that old line?

"Lead by example"

If they don't clean up it will enable us to move further from our "fair dinkum" roots. And IMHO on average we are already too far off that mark.

[Davehoos]

Absolutely they should be held to a much higher standard than the rest of us.
Think about it people ... They are our leaders and what is that old line?
"Lead by example"


I do agree with this comment.

I dont like the smell off the 2 caracters recently refered to but in the same way i dont like many other TV news time waisters in the middle pecking order that dont improve my-our lives.buzzing around the failed leader promoting their future.[not refer to labour members only].

I vote for my local rep.that is our system.
I didnt vote for those fools up the coast that caused this mess but someone did...or the idiots that live in victoria.

LOTS OF PEOPLE VOTED FOR slipper/thompson [and others] and it can be assumed as they are not rioting or collecting petitionss that they feel they are the best people for the job and represent the local feeling..as sad as that is.

Our system stops citizens that have been bankrupt or criminals etc from being in parliment.Is that fair to stop people that also may have something to add or conect with their local public

recently a very public outcry was heard about a P&C selling chocolate penises.the organiser has been "run out of dodge".
did they sel'does that represent the culture of the local area?
my mum wants to know how much they are.