Tie Rod Ends

[hot rover]

I have been reading some threads on the forum regarding tie rod ends. I am a little confused over the whole issue. I recieved some new ones for my 2a and they came with full threads on them. I questioned the supplier about this and he said that they are all the same and will work in any vehicle. Do I need the shouldered ones as it has fitted or will the fully theaded ones do the job.
Cheers Rod

[chazza]

Unless the steering tubes are threaded all the way to the end, you will need the shouldered ones, or a mixture of both depending what is on the car,

Cheers Charlie

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Rod

As Chazza says, the SIIa should have a very slightly raised shoulder before the end of the rod, this mates with a tie rod/drag link which have the thread machined out for the first 1/2" or so under the clamp. SIII usually have fully threaded tie rods and drag links where there is thread under the clamp, although this is not to say that your vehicle hasn't been swapped around to SIII rods at some time. So it is worth checking for the presence of full threads inside the rods.

Some suppliers have superseded the correct SIIa shouldered ones for the later SIII full threaded (incorrect) ones.

It does make a difference because of the clamping pressure between the tube and the lack of shoulder.

All Four X 4 in Kotara (Newcastle) NSW All Four x 4 Spares - Home (http://www.allfourx4.com.au/) will supply the correct ones mail order on request.

Diana

[JDNSW]

As Diana says. Clamping with the unthreaded section onto thread (or vice versa) is insecure, as there is not enough surface area - the crests of the threads in contact will soon wear off, especially on rough roads, thus removing the clamping effect, allowing the tube to unscrew. Unless spotted in time this could easily lead to steering failure. You can, of course, replace the tubes with Series 3 ones - they are the same length (although the drag link steering damper setup varies). This interchangeability is why you need to check what is actually used on your vehicle rather than rely on what should have been fitted.

For the record, the thread and nut type on the taper connection is irrelevant.

John

[hot rover]

Thanks for that. MR still maintain that the fully threaded ones will work. I sent them a photo showing that mine have a sholder on them. I am sick and tired of suppliers not giving me what I ask and pay for.
Cheers Rod

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Hi Rod

When I say suppliers, I mean manufacturers have superseded the the S1/SII/SIIa tie rods into the same part as the SIII. So it may not be MR's fault but the fault of the supply chain they use.

Diana

[Warb]

Whilst everything that has been said is completely true, and fitting the wrong joints is obviously to be avoided, just out of interest surely as the joints unscewed there would be progressively more tow-out or rotation of the "straight ahead" position of the steering wheel before steering failure happened? Wouldn't (shouldn't?) the driver notice this long before any catastrophic failure?

[B.S.F.]

In my case the tube from the steering box to the steering relay had a wrong TRE fitted.I drove my car more or less daily for ten years before I realised I had a problem.Had I not attended to it straight away ,I probably wouldn't be writing this.

Do not be tempted to fit an incorrect TRE !!!
W.

[Lotz-A-Landies]

Whilst everything that has been said is completely true, and fitting the wrong joints is obviously to be avoided, just out of interest surely as the joints unscewed there would be progressively more tow-out or rotation of the "straight ahead" position of the steering wheel before steering failure happened? Wouldn't (shouldn't?) the driver notice this long before any catastrophic failure?Hi Warb

It is not necessarily the fact the TRE unscrews, but if they did you would be correct.

In the SI/SII/SIIa there is a shorter amount of thread inside the tube. Over the last 40 to 65 years this has likely worn a little by corrosion and replacement issues. When there is insufficient clamping on the TRE there is a little movement with every turn of the steering, coupled with shock loadings this wears the threads on both the TRE and rod. Without noticing any symptoms if is possible (and has happened) that on heavy cornering the loads on the worn threads can lead to a catastrophic failure where the TRE exits the rod almost instantaneously resulting in a loss of steering and crash of the vehicle.

Diana

[JDNSW]

And remember that Series Landrovers have six of these tierod ends, and only the ones on the track rod would alert you to a problem by changing toe-in. The others would just change the straight ahead position of the wheel. And, on a corrugated road, once the clamping has stopped working, it could quite easily unscrew in only seconds.

John

[Warb]

OK, the threads tearing out after significant wear I can accept. Rapid unscrewing seems less likely, because it would require both ends to be sufficiently loose and even then I'd anticipate it to be slow enough that the massive increase in tow-out would be noticeable. But then I guess we've all seen people driving whilst seemingly oblivious to a flat tyre or other obvious major fault....!