ECB bull bar fitted to a D4 HSE

[thomasb]

has anyone out there or anyone you know of fitted an ECB big tube bar to a D4 HSE ...............i did and im having a problem with the front parking sensors ....has anyone done this trouble free

[discotwinturbo]

has anyone out there or anyone you know of fitted an ECB big tube bar to a D4 HSE ...............i did and im having a problem with the front parking sensors ....has anyone done this trouble free

There is one on this forum with a very nice white D4 HSE....but I am pretty sure he had it fitted. His parking sensors were fine from memory.
He also has a kaymar duel wheel carrier.
Can't recall who it was though.
Brett

[roamer]

Yeah I have and have no dramas at all,
They just clip staight in.
What is your problem.


Cheers Ken

[Disco4SE]

If you have a SE and a decent bullbar, you don't need front parking sensors. Touch parking is fine.

Cheers, Craig

[thomasb]

Ken ...great a fellow traveller .............when first installed i took bar home (installed by opposite lock brookvale NSW ) they did not work ....i took it back next day they fiddeled with it it worked ......i took it home it did not work ....i unplugged the sensors ...and fiddeled with the wiring ....it worked ....took it for a short drive .....it did not work

the problem is that when i switch on the parking sensors or put in reverse (they then come on automatically ) they give off a continous tone like i'm very close to something ....even though i may be yards away

would very much appreciate how to solve this ......as ECB are fobbing me off

[trevorj]

Hiya thomas; yep I have a D4 with ECB; great bar. Mine is black, which I had enormous trouble getting the front sensors to work well with.

Turns out that in the coating, the sensor holes are filled a smidge more than they should be, and this puts lateral pressure on sensors, which they dont like. My installer had 3 goes to fix by reaming out the holes, but it takes half a day of labour to take off and reinstall and their resistance got to be bigtime. ECB claim no known issues = drivel.

Finally I gave up after also installing a RWC which totally fouled the rear ones too. Mine are now permanently all switched off; I just use the rear camera and the front bump method.... almost anyway.

One day I might get back to it and try to get them all working, but it just turned out to be too big a nightmare, with dealer and two other installers all issuing cross claims of poor workmanship.

Not sure this helps, but its where I got too!
good luck.

[thomasb]

trevor j .......................well you got it ....my bar is black .......so looks like the same issue .....has the colour got some thing to do with it .....................im in the same boat ..............ECB fob me off (sold heaps ...you are the only one to complian etc etc.....) ....dealer says loom problem they just fit it in the bar ...............Landrover says design of bar problem ....and im in the middle .......................i will look at taking ECB to legal task on this ...so you never got yours to work ..............even after reaming them out

ECB told me this can be aproblem with powdercoated bars .....where the powder is too thick .....but this does not appear to be a problem with my bar

ps what is a RWC

[stray dingo]

ps what is a RWC

rear wheel carrier

[roamer]

My bar is black, cannot see how colour has anythimg to do with it,

They did put the same ones back in the same positions I guess,that would mean that the two centre ones are black and the outer sensors would be the same colour as the car, (if they are all black, maybe what they coated them with is the problem )

Cheers Ken

[thomasb]

ken ....you are right the colour should not have anything to do with it .....but putting then in the right slots is good food for thought ......actually my D$ is baltic blue ...the only colour to have all 4 front sensors the same plain black (this is unique to that colour...most other colours like white etc have the outer 2 sensors colour coded to the vehicle

what do you mean ..."what they coated them in "........do you mean the installer .....and what would they need to coat them in during installation

my D4 is 1 year old and these sensors worked perfectly in the OEM bumper

Question ......is there a difference between the 4 front sensors (ie are they sending out a different signal )....they all look the same ......and how would i know the difference if they are all plain black as in my case

perhaps i could swap and change and see if they work .....i had not thought of that

thanks a bunch for your good observations

thomas b

[trevorj]

Hi thomas; the issue as I understand it is that its the powder coating (any colour) makes the pre-drilled holes too small (just slightly). As ECB told me, all the installer needs to do (ho, ho) is to ream them to the right diameter, then replace the OEM sensors in the right position - they are very sensitive to depth in the hole and to any lateral pressure on their housing. My installer put the colour coded ones back correctly (centre ones black, outer ones white - in my case), but couldnt get them properly positioned, at any of the attempts. Dealer advice is that they were never properly fastened to the bar, presumably there is some kind of rear fixing. I just ran out of time/energy to keep up the fight. And then it got complicated by a rear sensor being covered by the installation of wheel carrier, and the same story - after two attempts, should work, but dont. In the end, I folded and wrote it all off to experience.
With a bit more perseverance, I think the front sensor problem should have been resolvable, but the installer has to cover the half day labour each time. ECB I think have let us all down on this front (better guidance to installers is needed).

[Mick-Kelly]

Dear lord, how did we manage to get on without parking sensors. I cant believe this is even a topic (facepalm). Quick to the ombudsman.

[roamer]

what do you mean ..."what they coated them in "........do you mean the installer .....and what would they need to coat them in during installation


thomas b



Coated the sensor face to make it black.....but thats not your problem.
I'm thinking that the sensors could be different, but maybe not, :confused:
One of the tech's will know, ask your dealer


And Mick-Kelly,
You sound like the same sorta guy,
who couldn't see the need for a starter motor,
when a crank handle worked just fine. :angel:



Cheers Ken

[BobD]

My ECB bar is fine as my car is an SE. Can't say the same about my Kaymar rear bar and Mitch Hitch, however. The previous owner gave up on the rear sensors and they were disabled when I bought the car (and still are).

I miss the rear sensors in particular as they worked very well on my previous VW Multivan. I never really used the front ones, however. They were just a nuisance when they went off as I went past a tree or a car while reversing when I already knew exactly where the front of the car was.

Bob

[thomasb]

thanks ken ...ill relook at the holes

..................and mick kelly ....are you an arbitor of what can be a topic here ...

.i just happen to think if you pay for a car with this capeability and a bar supplier says you can keep that capeability with their product and takes your money (quite a lot of it actually )then that should be so ...............i happen to like the idea of electronic sensors for a large vechicle that sees its fair share of city business driving as well as off road ..............perhaps if you dont have anything useful to contribute it might be better if you ignore this topic

ta

Thomas b

[thomasb]

thanks trevor .......ill re look at the holes ....

[trevorj]

Thomas - heres pic of my setup. I suspect (but really just a guess) that the sensor is too deep in the hole, and its 'seeing' the bar itself. It would be worth checking the depth on yours compared to the depth on an OEM installation.
Totally agree on the principle - I paid for it so it should work. Might not be why I bought the vehicle, but.....

[roamer]

That'll be your problem,mine are flush with the bar
Cheers Ken

[thomasb]

its never "your problem " unless it is your problem ..............if the sensors are to a specification ........and (with landrover im sure they are to a very tight one ) ....then the bar should also be to a specification ...presumably based on the original R and D one from ECB ....and the basis of their marketing claims ...............so there should not be a variation ................ie ...if the sensors from land rover are to consistant specification then the bar should be to a similar specification that was originaly designed to be compatable with those sensors .............if there are variations in the thickness of the bar then that could be a problem .........and thats not "your problem"
thats a problem for the people who take your money but dont deliver on their promise

sorry if this topic offends some ......but as trevor says sometimes its the principal that needs to be kept in site

[thomasb]

ken ....i might have mis read your "your problem " ....comment ...so aplologies ....

.....yes trevors problem is some thing i have been also thinking for a while ....that the sensors are reading the bar ..................either too deeply set ....or they are reading the "stuck out bits" where the uprights come out

any way keep helping us with your thoughts ......i would like to think there is a resolution somewhere in this and ill keep persuing it

kind regards

thomas b

[Orkneytdv6]

Maybe try putting a washer behind it, to test if the depth is the problem. That should narrow the odds.

[sniegy]

Hi all,
Just a question to the owners that have the sensors fitted to the ECB bar & are not working.
Are your sensors fitted to the bar with the factory fittings ie: the rear locking mechanism & rubber o ring?
Albeit slightly different we had an ARB client that come in just after having his brand new bar fitted & his park control module was going nuts !
We checked over his vehicle to find that the wiring harness had been destroyed, caught in many places while they tried to fit the bar. We took photos & sent them along with him where he had the bar fitted & the client was told that in no way ARB could have done that!
Back to us & we had to remove the bar with ARB's permission & rectify his wiring issue to start with. Once that was done we refitted the bar & retest the issue & again faults due to some components not fitted.
We gave the customer a set of sensor holders & o rings to fit as they were not fitted & the sensor kept picking up the bar as the sensors sit flush against the front surface of the bar. The rear holder locking mech's were glued to the rear of the bar & all is well.

I agree with the member that if you pay for something (& it's not a small amount of money either) & it is not working then the installer should make it work as described.


HTH.

Cheers

Sent from my iPad using Forum Runner

[SBD4]

....I agree with the member that if you pay for something (& it's not a small amount of money either) & it is not working then the installer should make it work as described.

X2

I'm sure the fellas have absolutely no difficulty parking their discos without the sensors.

They paid money for a feature on their original vehicle config and now it doesn't work when it was advertised by the bar manufacturer that it would. I for one would not just accept that it no longer worked.

A thought, are the sensors required to be oriented correctly? Do they have a "right side up"?

Edit: Also, are they any lower to the ground than they would be when fitted to the OEM bumper or, angled towards the ground? If so that might cause them to be picking up signals from the ground surface.

[thomasb]

sniegy...............i know nothing of holders and O rings ....the sensors sit in a little V shaped metal holders in the ECB bar ...(and were held in place by cable ties put there by the installer )......again it looks like just a design problem where the sensors are picking up either the bar or the ground ..................thanks for your commemts of support re getting what was promised ............yes i can park with out the sensors ............but i like them in Pitt St or China Town ........I paid more for the higher spec to double as a town car ....and the retention of this functionality was promised by ECB when they took my money

[trevorj]

ditto for mine, except there is no cable tie; they just kind of hang a slot in a small bracket at right angle off the bar....very loose and wobbly.... no o-rings or any form of fixing. No wonder they kept giving false detections. definitely design issue for ECB.
This is a pic (of sorts ...squeezy iphone shot...) of the sensor in the bar; the bracket is in bottom left. very poor form.

[thomasb]

trevorj ...i swapped around the middle two sensors in my bar .....(and given the way they fit into the holders this means i also turned them upsidedown ..or rightside up ...that is if there is an upside and a down side i dont know ....) .......anyway they worked perfecty for 3 days ....then after a cold wet night they went back to a constant beeping agin .....i left then alone and when they dried out or the weather dried out they resumed working again ....and worked perfectly for 2 days ....untill it rained again .................so could the issue be water in the connections .....and how could i find out where the water is getting in and causing the problem and fix it .....any ideas ......anyone ......?????.......................it looks like in the right conditions they will work ....but appears rain and wet set them off ........this would not be an issue in the OEM bumper as they are well set in their own permanent holders and well sheilded from the elements ......................this looks like a poor design in the bar from ECB

[trevorj]

thomas- mine were much worse in the rain, which I put down to (wild guess) drops of water sitting in the recess in front of the sensors. Of course, only happens rarely here - perth -lol
still, not happy camper on this front either. so, wet or dry, had to switch them off, permanently.

[SBD4]

Thomas/Trevor, I'm not sure this would be of any help - you could have a look at the instructions ARB provide for mounting their bar. They have photos and instructions on how the sensors are mounted into their bar. It might provide some insight into how you can mod yours to sort out the issue.

The sensor install starts at step 30. The part number list is at the beginning for grommets etc.

http://arb.com.au/media/products/3432200-16-25-362/ARB_3432200_fitting.pdf

It's a long shot but you never know...

[Discostewpot]

trevorj ...i swapped around the middle two sensors in my bar .....(and given the way they fit into the holders this means i also turned them upsidedown ..or rightside up ...that is if there is an upside and a down side i dont know ....) .......anyway they worked perfecty for 3 days ....then after a cold wet night they went back to a constant beeping agin .....i left then alone and when they dried out or the weather dried out they resumed working again ....and worked perfectly for 2 days ....untill it rained again .................so could the issue be water in the connections .....and how could i find out where the water is getting in and causing the problem and fix it .....any ideas ......anyone ......?????.......................it looks like in the right conditions they will work ....but appears rain and wet set them off ........this would not be an issue in the OEM bumper as they are well set in their own permanent holders and well sheilded from the elements ......................this looks like a poor design in the bar from ECB

Thomas

I think I have the answer to your problem if you havent already found a resolution. I had an OL bar fitted to my car with front parking sensors refitted. They were going off like crazy all the time, after some investigation I found that the silicon sleeve that the sensors sit in were flush with the actual sensor and bar. These sleeves need to be sitting past the sensor. I just got some tweezers and pulled the sleeve out to where it needed to be and problem fixed. They now function as they should do, even when it rains. Oh and two of my sensors were painted black to match the colour of the bar.

[thomasb]

Discostewpot ....thank you for this suggestion ........im sure i'll eventually get a fix on this (no thanks to ECB ...they prefer to ignore my problem at the moment )

There are no silicon sleves??in the ECB bar ....i have the original landrover sensors just sitting in the holes provided in the ECB bar .....the original LR sensors have little rubber ring things around the front of them (very thin little washer type things things that fits on the front of the sensors and then fit into the holes ...............did your OL bar come with silicon selves ...perhaps i could look at getting these where would i get them

BTW ...i just spent 3 days in Barrington Tops and went over some pretty ratteley trails and some very muddy tracks .....my sensors worked perfectly for the 3 day ....not a problem ...then on way back to Sydney yesterday ...lots on rain on the freeways ...and .....beeeep off they go again

also SBD4 thanks for the info on the fitting of the ARB bar to D4 ...i have not been able to open this yet ....even visited the ARB site and found the same file but cannot open it there either ...says some thing about run time ???...i will get my daughter to show me what im doing wrong

Ok thanks all ...........seems like there is a fix some where out there and have to say love those sensors even out in the bush ...wonderful at picking up stumps hidden in the undergrowth !!!

[Mike_S]

Wish I'd had the front sensors working on my RRS last weekend in Toolangi forest, would've saved me smacking both sides of the front end on buried tree stumps / trunks :(

Mind you, it wouldn't have stopped the tree stump into the n/s rear arch. Not content with taking the paint off the front bumper it had to go for the rear as well to make sure :mad:

Might have to look into having a D3/4 front bar modified for the front end, may well save me few $$$'s in the long run if my driving doesn't improve :(

As for the sensors themselves, they're held in differently on mine and they're much easier to angle. It's in a metal sleeve clipped into the bumper without any kind of rubber seal, they just pop out. I assume they've changed the design.

[thomasb]

sean .......i could not open this document but i called ARB and they kindly sent a copy to me by email .....useful to see how the sensors are fitted in the ARB bar .....they have little grommets in the holes to hold the sensors snug ..the whole fitting for the sensors in the ARB bar looks better and more robust than what ECB offer

the fitting instructions have the following instruction ..........................................

31. Once holes are drilled, de-burred and painted fit rubber grommets. Place a small amount of CRC or similar to inside edge..............

Question .............what is CRC ??

[SBD4]

Thomas it's a similar product to WD40- here's a link:

CRC 5-56 | Multi purpose lubricant | Convenient 360 (http://www.crcind.com.au/multi-purpose-lubricant)

[thomasb]

and so the story goes .....my sensors have dried out after their drenching on the freeway back to sydney ..............and now they are working again ...................so it looks like we have isolated the problem to water in the system .........????

question .............any suggestions on how to water proof them ......CRC??? ...any other sugestions ...........???

[thomasb]

An update on my ECB bar and parking sensors .............after hours of fiddeling .....(the park sensors are very sensitive to pressure I've learned )...they work perfectly ...........except when it rains ......then they go off permanently ......so ...i got some silicon rubber tape and taped up the sensors and around the entry of the cables point .......then sprayed liberally with CRC .....................but to no avail ......a good rain in sydney as recently .....and off they go again ...............SO .......I'm getting water in my cabeling loom some where ......but then the ECB bar has so many holes and gaps that is not surprising ......anyone with an Auto electrical background who might care to offer any suggestions what i might do next

[Tombie]

Any news / resuylt on this?

I'd suggest Consumer affairs - Unsuitable for application would be what I'd be targetting ECB with...

[thomasb]

Tombie Thanks for your intrest .....The situation is same as was some months ago ......................the sensors work fine ....(even after a good oodnadatta track shaking ......) but when it rains and water gets in they go off permanently ......and once the bar drys out they work fine again ...............................I intend to remove them one of these days and put silicone around where the wires go into them and see if this will fix the problem

I think the unprotected nature of how the sensors fit into the ECB bar versus in the origiinal LR bumper (where they sit in a well protected plastic " tubes" molded to the inside of the bumper )where water may not get in

ECB are brisbane based and appear have no technical support in any of the other cities of Australia ....and so rely on their dealers ......who in my case were less than capeable .........unless you think fitting and wiggeling cable ties is technical........................

I ended up removing and refitting the sensors myself ....and having to fit small 90 degree angles (bought from bunnings ) to hold the sensors in properly .......As I said I have them working .........and perhaps silicon (or any other suggestions welcome ) will fix my water ingress problem

BOTTOM LINE = In my opinion ECB have not properly designed this bar to adequately fit these sensitive sensors and protect them from water that find its way easily in behind the bar every time it rains

regards

Thomasb

[Tombie]

Thanks for the update...

Perhaps try some "liquid electrical tape" on the backs of the sensors to seal them up...

[thomasb]

what pary is "liquid electrical tape " .........and where do i get it ...

..i tried WD40 and it sent them crazey ....apparently WD40 conducts electricity ....better than water .......i had to take them out and flush them with electrical (alcohol) cleaner .....and let them dry ....then they worked again .........so perhaps this "liquid elrctrical tape" is the answer ....where can i get it

[rufusking]

Jaycar stock it.

Jaycar Electronics - Search Results for liquid electrical tape (http://search.jaycar.com.au/search?w=liquid%20electrical%20tape)

[Tombie]

eBay as well.....

[AnD3rew]

Dear lord, how did we manage to get on without parking sensors. I cant believe this is even a topic (facepalm). Quick to the ombudsman.

I don't have front sensors and don't really see the need for them, but I have to say I do miss my rear sensors since I installed a wheel carrier and Mitch hitch. With the rear wheel in place you lose even more rear visibility and with no camera it is quite hairy reversing sometimes, I'd really lie to get them back.

Does anyone have a RWC and Mitch hitch and have managed to keep the sensors working? I have been considering having a play and seeing what I can do.

[Guppy]

I don't have front sensors and don't really see the need for them, but I have to say I do miss my rear sensors since I installed a wheel carrier and Mitch hitch. With the rear wheel in place you lose even more rear visibility and with no camera it is quite hairy reversing sometimes, I'd really lie to get them back.

Does anyone have a RWC and Mitch hitch and have managed to keep the sensors working? I have been considering having a play and seeing what I can do.

Hi Andrew,

I have the Kaymar with a single carrier and a Mitch hitch. My rear sensors work most of the time ( the very hot days didn't seem to agree with them).
The guys at Kaymar gave me a different secure shaft which raised the wheel slightly. It also worked out I needed the useless aluminium curved plate as this seemed to deflect the sensor signal allowing it to work. ( I originally had it off and the sensor was going off)

Hope this helps

Gup