DON'T LOCK AUSTRALIA UP

[MR LR]

Hi guys,

This is a new thingo started by Roothy at Aus 4WD action, trying to raise awareness to prevent the extreme green imbeciles closing down Australia and leaving us all high and dry with pavement princess 4wd's, a few people have suggested on the facebook site for bumper stickers (including me), but they are making t-shirts to try and get the word out there. Basically they want to know about any proposed track closures in local areas, because the national parks and green 'interest' groups will do as much as they can to get it closed off without the public knowing.

But we need to stop this nanny state, locking-up of our recreational areas, not just 4wding, but many kinds of outdoor recreation will be threatened by this ill-thoughtout beurocracy. So come on people lets stop this extreme green-ism.

Here's the link
Take Action | Australian 4WD Action (http://www.4wdaction.com.au/takeaction)
And the facebook page
Australian 4WD Action | Facebook (http://www.facebook.com/4wdaction)

Cheers
Will

P.S. On second thought this could end up in the soapbox, depending on people views haha

[Judo]

Can I support the cause without supporting Roothy? :angel:

[MR LR]

Hahaha, i hope so, i would do the same, i don't even buy the magazines only look at what goes on facebook, maybe we should get our own stickers made, how about we make a website link 'onelifeliveit.com.au' or something haha (then i can get some lower door stickers like the Camel trophy cars), then we can raise awareness without filling their pockets, only reason i'm interested is to keep the tracks open.

[jazzaD1]

what's wrong with roothy? he's a champ

[woody]

You only have to look at their DVD's to see why the bureaucrats and greenies want to lock up the country.

We're the poor buggers suffering because of their meat-headed environmental vandalism.

soap box here we come:angel:

woody

[lambrover]

I think if you want to support the cause you should put your money with what Roothy's got going. It's better to pool the funds and effort in one large group then many small groups. You may not like Roothy but how about you get over yourselves and look at the big picture.

[OffTrack]

The problem is extreme imbecile 4wders, and 4WDAction seems to attract them like flies to ****.

[87County]

A major part of the problem is, in my view, that track damage & vandalism caused by imbecile(s) is usually only seen well after they are gone .... the perps are immature idiots but how does one counter that ?

hmm..... the bigger the wheels ...

I did see one $WD Action video that had been apparently included with a magazine.

It featured one of their (staff?) wombats thundering through relatively pristine sandy/swampy country south of Pemberton. I think it would take years for the wet areas of that track to recover from the damage caused by the "presenter" and his mates churning/blasting & snatching their way through an largely unspoilt locality with generally forgotten tracks.

In my view it is the publishers and writers of 4WD Action itself who are to blame for that example ...

.... and now Roothy wants to take action ?

Note to 4WD Action - show us some responsible 4wd action by cleaning up the attitudes of your own staff & writers - then we'll take notice of what you publish

[stevo68]

You only have to look at their DVD's to see why the bureaucrats and greenies want to lock up the country.

We're the poor buggers suffering because of their meat-headed environmental vandalism.

soap box here we come:angel:

woodyWithout sending it to the soapbox ;) but what a load of bollox. How many DVD's have you watched and what sort of off roading do you do? I have been watching the DVD's...every single one of them...since the day they started and there is nothing in their that I would consider "meat headed vandalism".

Also there is nothing in there that I havent done in terms of offroading as an individual, as part of a club or as part of the current group I am in. As for this comment...


The problem is extreme imbecile 4wders, and 4WDAction seems to attract them like flies to ****. facts and figures please? Or again is this just an off the cuff opinion with little to no substance? The biggest nutjobs I have ever come across on any forum....has been on this forum. That does not mean that this forum is full of nut jobs. Generalised, sweeping statements like that...alll they do is give more creedance to the folk who want to mess with our freedoms.

The ridiculous thing is that regardless of forum/ magazine/ make of vehicle...we all enjoy the same bloody thing FFS.......that is getting off road, to places the average joe can' go...some like to challenge their vehicles and modify them....others like to cruise it. What ever your poison...we drive 4WD's FFS.

Statistically we probably have just as many so called "bell ends" as 4WDA/ Toyota owners/ Patrol owners etc....its more a case there is a lot more folk who drive other makes than anything else. First and foremost I am a 4WDer......then a Landy owner...as I have said before...if LR's weren't invented...Id be driving something else.

If you don't go 4WDing/ camping/ getting dirty/ get a bit of a woody tackling a rutted hill or getting through a muddy boghole, tackling the great outdoors whether desert/forest or touring unique spots.....YOU AINT A 4WDer.........blabbing on here about your landy but never going anywhere.....well what a joke. Things like this deserve our support not pre teen bitching,

Regards

Stevo

[wardy1]

I agree with Stevo. There are rednecks in every group, maybe Roothy and his staff qualify, but probably not.
I have seen one or two scenes in the DVD's that made me cringe a bit, but nothing I haven't seen done on the tracks by so called responsible 4wders.

I think it's about time we as a group got a decent, well funded lobby group going and good on Roothy for putting his hand up for it.

He gets my support:D

[stevo68]

I agree with Stevo. There are rednecks in every group, maybe Roothy and his staff qualify, but probably not.
I have seen one or two scenes in the DVD's that made me cringe a bit, but nothing I haven't seen done on the tracks by so called responsible 4wders.

I think it's about time we as a group got a decent, well funded lobby group going and good on Roothy for putting his hand up for it.

He gets my support:D Good comments......just on the bolded parts.....if you watch enough of the DVD's and meet some of them ie I have met Roothy and a couple of the staff...they are just like you and me. People who like pedicures and chardonnay don't tend to get out and camp and 4WD. Anyone could be considered a redneck dependant on ones outlook and judgements.

Regards

Stevo

[lambrover]

Most track damage that I have seen is caused by rain. I was driving some track when I was in Townsville an they were ok for most cars then after the wet and cyclones we had up there the rain had made the tracks so much harder, and that was with two weeks of rain not driving.

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[stevo68]

Most track damage that I have seen is caused by rain. I was driving some track when I was in Townsville an they were ok for most cars then after the wet and cyclones we had up there the rain had made the tracks so much harder, and that was with two weeks of rain not driving.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum RunnerNo one beats Mother Nature when it comes to destruction and damage,

Regards

Stevo

[MR LR]

Well said stevo, wardy and lamb rover, I agree in its entirety. I've watched a few 4wd action dvd's with my mates who get them but never got them myself, so can't really comment on what those guys are like. But the cause in this is something we should all be behind, no matter where you come from, your class or what kind of 4wd you have, Even if you have a brand new Evoque you should get behind it, i'm sure the beaches will be threatened haha.

[LowRanger]

A major part of the problem is, in my view, that track damage & vandalism caused by imbecile(s) is usually only seen well after they are gone .... the perps are immature idiots but how does one counter that ?

hmm..... the bigger the wheels ...



Ho Hum

Another one that blames it on bigger wheels:mad:
I for one run bigger wheels and tyres,and I can guarantee you that I cause a lot less track damage than most vehicles running around with small tyres,that are spinning and ripping tracks to pieces.
The only reason I didn't say "all" vehicles running small tyres is that some dont bother to take their 4wd off the bitumen,and these are usually the biggest whingers;)
People don't necessarily have to like Roothy,but they need to realise that he is a persona that is there to sell magazines.The point is to have a combined voice,that shows the authorities that there are a lot of people that want to have access to this this country NOW,as it is no use locking it all up,and having it,if no one will ever be able to see it!!!

[jazzaD1]

or how about damage to tracks from people going out in muddy conditions with no terrains or all terrains, IMO MT's do less damage to the tracks through less wheelspin and messing up of the track, dont get me wrong, sometimes you come across some tracks where wheelspin to clear the tread is the only thing to get you up (a few hills in the otways come to mind), but if blokes are out there struggling to go anywhere due to their tyres, they tear up the track a lot more

[Tank]

What's this crap about "extreme greenies " locking up tracks, load of bull****, every track I have seen closed is because some ****** like 4WD TV flogs the **** out of the track, which is usually a "Firetrail" to allow access to fight fires. Then State Forests or NPWS come along and lock the trail off, because they don't have the money to repair them. Example: Tuross Falls camping area, closed because of fear of litigation if a branch from a tree falls on your noggin. Hundreds of trails/tracks closed from storm damage, trees down and culverts washed away, why closed, because they don't have the money to open them. I was talking to a State Forest officer about why so many of the lower South Coast Forest trails were closed, he said because of storm damage from 18 months ago and they would not be opened again unless they had to log in the area, WHY, because of lack of funds to do so.
So if 4WD action and Roothy want to do some good, donate some money to State Frorest and NPWS for the opening of storm damaged/yahoo 4WDrivers damaged trails. I t will be years before these trails are opened if ever and nothing to do with Greenies conspiring to close every track in Australia. Two Thirds of Bendethra camping area was closed because NPWS didn't have the money to send a Front end loader into the park to push 20 tonnes of river gravel into a hole on the exit of the river on the third crossing, if I owned a loader I would have done it for them, no Greenies involved here, Regards Frank.

[jocky]

All people have to do is the responsible thing. Stop leaving rubbish everywhere and wrecking the place.
Most 4WD'ERS do the right thing.
Unfortunately all walks of life have access to tracks and national parks and dont all have the same level of respect for their surrowndings.

Putting money behind 1 lobby group is far more beneficial than several. Its like having several many super funds. Not as much money goes to the cause.

[Mick-Kelly]

Personally i love the 4WDA DVD's. I have never seen them do something i wouldn't do or drive in a way i wouldn't. I challenge every one of the whiners on here to go to the news agent. Pry open your wallet and buy the latest issue of the magazine. Watch the enclosed DVD of Fraser Island and take a long hard look at yourself. This is the sort of thing we stand to loose.
The whole 'we dont have the money to fix it' excuse coming out of every states National Parks is a load of crap and just a means to an end from our Green party dominated government to lock gates and keep people out.
I love driving this country. When i take my holidays i spend them here in Aus trying to see as much of this land as i can. I love my fishing and i love my camping. I love my fourby and i intend to keep using it for what it was designed for.

[MR LR]

This is gonna end up in the soapbox haha

[jocky]

The quickest way to stop the green machine is to vote Liberal.
Life & politics is about balance for everyone.

[PAT303]

I was on Broomes cable beach last week,the only stupid thing I and three hundred other people on the beach saw was two dumbarse's in 4wd utes spinnings thier wheels and acting like fools,on the back windscreen were big 4WD Action stickers with Bundy rum stickers either side.Say what you want but I've looked at the 4wd action site and it's full of tossers,I wonder why they've locked it out for members only????. Pat

[jocky]

I was on Broomes cable beach last week,the only stupid thing I and three hundred other people on the beach saw was two dumbarse's in 4wd utes spinnings thier wheels and acting like fools,on the back windscreen were big 4WD Action stickers with Bundy rum stickers either side.Say what you want but I've looked at the 4wd action site and it's full of tossers,I wonder why they've locked it out for members only????. Pat



NOT A GREAT ADVERTISEMENT!

[goingbush]

Hate to say it, Im sick to death of Clubs, Committees, Focus groups & politics but the only way your going to be of any help is to support a political lobby group put your money where your mouth is and join a 4WD association, they are all bitching ******* too but better than supporting some 4WD mag tossers by buying a T Shirt

Australian National Council Four (4WD) Wheel Drive Australia (http://www.anfwdc.asn.au/)

And if your one if those ******* that gets every square inch of their 4Wd covered in mud to show off in the School Pickup queue, for F's sake use your brain & wash your bloody car before anyone sees it.

If I think your a ****** imagine what the greenies think, no wonder they want to close the bush.

[mikehzz]

The biggest cause of damage to tracks anywhere is the weather. I've lost count of the number of times that I've driven along a track on saturday, camped when there has been a big storm that night, and driven back along the same track to find large sections of it gouged away by the rain. I think the term for it is soil erosion for the scientifically minded. It's obvious that no cars have driven it since us the day before. If left unchecked, the gouges get deeper with the next storm. Pretty soon the only people that can drive it are guys with 37" tyres. All dirt roads everywhere need maintaining. Traffic along them loosens the surface and allows the erosion to happen quicker...it's why they invented bitumen. I think Tank's comment about lack of money for maintenance is the most correct. Forget the green bogey man. The firies have to drive these tracks in emergencies and the less disturbed they are the more likely the gouges aren't too deep.
If we want the tracks left open then we should be prepared to do some maintenance on them. In most cases all that is needed to satisfy most 4 wheelers are a few little play areas near the tracks where they can get the cars dirty. The real jewels are the lookouts etc that they lead too. NPWS would welcome regular maintenance efforts by responsible 4wd organizations...I hope. There may be legal issues. It should earn brownie points big time.

[goingbush]

The biggest cause of damage to tracks anywhere is the weather.

I disagree, its primarily bikes and 4wders that stuff the tracks up.

Theres a track I know about that never , i mean NEVER gets maintained, I doubt the DSE even know its still there, Its just as good to drive on now as it was when I first found it 30 years ago. Nobody uses it because its not part of a network of tracks and its not worth spending half a day to get to a track that only goes a few miles.

We have other tracks that I used to like going on too but since the advent of 4WDing as a popular pastime they have been totally stuffed up by the urban cowboys that come home in a mud caked procession, theres your "soil erosion"




If we want the tracks left open then we should be prepared to do some maintenance on them. In most cases all that is needed to satisfy most 4 wheelers are a few little play areas near the tracks where they can get the cars dirty. The real jewels are the lookouts etc that they lead too. NPWS would welcome regular maintenance efforts by responsible 4wd organizations...I hope. There may be legal issues. It should earn brownie points big time.

Good Idea !!! In Victoria we have this thing called the VAFWDC , Victorian Association of Fourwheel Drive Clubs, there has been an "Adopt A Track" scheme going since the 1980's where a group of responsible 4WDers are doing just what you are promoting.

check this out, the DSE even officialy consult with the VAFWDC re track closures & maintenance.

9.3.4 in the document

Otway Forest Management Plan (http://www.dse.vic.gov.au/forests/regional-information/otway/otway-forest-management-plan/visitor-use)

[LowRanger]

Yes,the grading of tracks and other work done by the Victorian association,is probably the only good things to come out of Victoria in the last 100 years:p

They are talking about adopting similar strategies here in NSW,which I believe is a good thing,as long as they enforce the laws against those they find breaking them.

As far as erosion is concerned,no matter where it is,there will always be some sort of erosion,after all,nature shaped the surface of the earth this way.
Some areas will be more prone than others,due to the type of surface material,and to climatic conditions.No matter where you drive,and in what weather,the fact that you drive,walk,ride a bike or a horse,you are adding to the erosion factor.Having been involved in 4wds since the early 70's,I have lost count of the amount of places,we have been locked out of,because some person in an office in a city,who has never been in the area,put a red pen stroke through it and closes it off forever.These areas were classified as too worn and eroded,a long time before big tyres and high horsepower 4wds were available,so these sorts of arguments ,don't stack up.
It seems to take a natural disaster,like a large bushfire,to make authorities realise that with no vehicular access that they can't do what needs to be done in these times of crisis,and that maybe having the tracks opened and maintained,by either an authority or being adopted by a 4wd club/association may not be a bad thing.This has been taken up in Victoria and seems to be working well,and hopefully it will be adopted around the country.It is no use locking everyone out of the bush,as it will eventually be consumed by the urban sprawl,as an ever increasing population spreads far and wide.

[RVR110]

Whilst it makes for an entertaining DVD, if you think that 4WDA behave acceptably and don't needlessly damage tracks in 4WDA DVD #156 then you have different standards to me.
:)

Moving on from 4WDA, there's plenty of places I've been that you can only get to by 4WDs or bikes that have litter and toilet paper strewn around so there's no shortage of "tossers" in the 4WD & bike communities. Bad behavior (track damage, littering etc) just gives bureaucrats excuses to close tracks. Liability issues, the cost of maintaining tracks and ever present "efficiency dividends" also add momentum to track closures.

[mikehzz]

I disagree, its primarily bikes and 4wders that stuff the tracks up.



Well it's bikes and 4wd's driving on them when they shouldn't that causes maximum damage for sure.

On major roads like the Birdsville track, they close them off so that the road doesn't get damaged while it is already in a bad state after inclement weather. It isn't possible to only close off all the little fire trails on a temporary basis when the weather is bad, so they hit it with a sledge hammer, close them permanently and problem solved.

[Tank]

The best thing for Firetrails is the "Eco Drains/Erosion drains that most of the trails on the South Coast now have, I can remember when it took 9 hours to get into Bendethra from Araluen rd.. now it's less than 6 hours or less than 2 hours from Moruya.
I can remember erosion gulleys that deep on the trails that you couldn't see the bottom and I've seen these erosion gullies cause the track to slide into the valley and totally close the tracks. I haven't seen an eroded track since the eco drains were installed, these drains were paid for out of our taxes to allow access for fire vehicles firstly and then 4WD tourists secondly. 4WD tourists are necessary to keep these roads open, e.g. few years back large storms and floods hit this area and access to Bendethra and all other camping areas were locked shut. I rang NPWS Narooma and they told me they were doing their best to at least open Bendethra and Dry Creek but were hampered by lack of funds, it costs money to send crews of men to clear hundreds of trees off trails (some still haven't been cleared 2 years later) and Bulldozers. I offered to arrange some local volunteers to help, but OH&S and Insurance problems ruled that out (at short notice at least). I then rang the Moruya Chamber of Commerce and explained that Bendethra (and other) campsites would be closed till after the biggest tourist influx of the year and that at least a 1000 4WDrivers and their families would be going elsewhwere to spend their money. Within a week the trails to Bendethra and area were open with a lot of help from the Local Council, so money and resources are a necessity to keep these roads open. At the moment there a posters asking 4WDrivers not to tow camper trailers on certain trails as they are causing damage to Eco drains, which they are. If the damage continues camper trailers will be banned from these roads, remember the damage has to be repaired and it is the taxpayer who foots the bill, Regards frank.

[Disco Muppet]

Everyone who goes offroad, in a car, on a bike, etc will do some damage.
Even the best offroaders will chew up the tracks sometimes. I won't say it's unavoidable but sometimes it's difficult not to.
If you tear around the bush, breaking everything in sight and turning everything into a mudhole, then fair enough. you're a tosser.
But, if you do as minimal damage as possible, and what damage you do you repair, either by attending working bees on the tracks, picking up your rubbish, etc, then you're fine in my books.
Personally i think it's an attitude problem above everything else.
Cheers
Muppet

[lambrover]

Tank, can you please explain how a camper trailer is damaging the drains. I can't see it, if a car can drive over it and earth moving machinery can how is a trailer doing damage.

I am not trying to be smart here, just a little confused.

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[goingbush]

Tank, can you please explain how a camper trailer is damaging the drains. I can't see it, if a car can drive over it and earth moving machinery can how is a trailer doing damage.

I am not trying to be smart here, just a little confused.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner

I might be wrong, I assume he's talking about open drains rather than buried pipes, but my take on it is Its not the trailer itself that causes the damage, but when your towing a trailer the track becomes so much more difficult.

A graded road is no issue but if your trying to pull a trailer on a 4wd track you really have to work the car to make any progress over what might otherwise be relatively easy sections & the track is the worst for wear.

[vnx205]

I've seen damage camper trailers have done to the speed humps/eco drains on Bendetehra Fire Trail and on Merricumbene Fire Trail.

The towbars drag across the top of the mound that creates the drain. The groove they create is much deeper than you would expect. As well as that, there is evidence that some of them get quite a bit of wheelspin trying to drag the trailer over the hump. It also appears that parts are steep enough that the likelihood of wheelspin and track damage is much greater because of the extra effort required to drag the trailer up the slope.

I suppose an unsuitable vehicle with an extremely poor departure angle could produce the same damage. I also expect that it would be possible for a well set up tow vehicle with a very high towbar could get over without damage. However, that doesn't seem to be what some people insist on taking into Bendethera.

In theory, there should be vehicle/camper trailer combinations that could tackle the track without causing damage. I am just describing the damage actually done by the camper trailers that people have been taking in there.

[Tank]

Tank, can you please explain how a camper trailer is damaging the drains. I can't see it, if a car can drive over it and earth moving machinery can how is a trailer doing damage.

I am not trying to be smart here, just a little confused.

Sent from my iPhone using Forum Runner
Lamb, the damage mainly occurs on the tracks between the eco drains because of the steepness of a lot of tracks around here, the extra weight causes the tow vehicle to spin the wheels and get stuck, requiring another vehicle to tow them which then has 2 vehicles spinning wheels cutting up the surface.
Also some camper trailers have ridicuosly long drawbars and I have seen many get hung up on the tops of the eco drains and then drag the front part of the chassis through the top of the drain. But the extra weight and the wheelspinning to get that weight up the hill is the culprit IMO.
On one occasion I had the misfortune to be behind 4 vehicles towing campervans up Deep Ck. FT to Mericumbene FT fron Dry Ck. camping area. This climb is steep and rough and usually takes 15 to 20 minutes, w/o a camper trailer, I waited 2 hours before I left. I then headed back towards Moruya and out Wambon FT to Oulia Ck FT and proceeded up to Mericumbene FT and headed to Deep ck. FT where it meets with Mericumbene FT and thes 4 vehicles with CT's had still not got to the top of Dry Ck. FT. This was 4 hours after I had been stuck behind them at the bottom.. There was noticable damage done to the Dry Ck. FT and I thought that NPWS would chuck a hissy fit, next time I was out there the posters were up asking 4WDrivers not to take CT's on Dry Ck, Mericumbene, Mongamulla, Dampier FT's.. If you would like to come down I will take you out there and show you what I'm talking about, Regards Frank.

[woody]

The motto of most bush walkers is to take only photographs and leave only footprints. The unfortunate thing about 4WD mags is that the photos that sell subscriptions are the ones that show mud, water,rocks and sand being flung around all over the place. Now one wants to see photos or video of a 4wd driving sedately up and over an obstacle. When mud, sand, water and rocks are being displaced track damage follows, then mother nature plays her part with wind and water damage. To deliberately promote this sort of behaviour for financial gain is nothing more than vandalism.

Apart from organised events, can you get away with that sort of behaviour at a privately run 4wd park? Of course not because somebody has to pay to repair the damage. The same is true in these remote areas except that it is the public who must foot the bill, the same people who don't get upset when the tracks are closed.

With regards to these remote tracks that are a challenge to your modified rigs, spare a thought to the poor bugger that has to travel that track to do their job in a stock standard vehicle.

Don't kid yourself if you go out driving and if you can see where you have been in the rear vision mirror you have done some form of damage.

If you enjoy what you do, think about how other people perceive your chosen hobby. It's easier to give them no reason to whinge than to try and fight them in courts and change government opinion.

woody

[Davehoos]

I was asked this week about legality of driving in the forest.the map calls it myal forrest.I wasnt aware there is an issue.maybe a permit.

the work mate was with a group on road regoed motor bikes and arrived at a fence with a NP landcruiser blocking the road.they stoped thinking it closed for baiting/rally/etc but asked to leave as they had bikes.another worker told the same story at the other end of the same road.

since national parks took over operationsof state forrest locally the word meaning erection is used.
i been to meeting with an organisation im a member to be informed about logistic 5 year planning and it was obvious thatthey had one agenda."To confuse people".
the beggining of one plan junior staff was moved in to run blocking from real questions to the point one gentleman produced a map with my house and village in the center of a national park--before i informed him by showing the correct map he insisted it was virgin wilderness and not few hundred homes and farms.

The only good thing recently is that some staff has been promoted and moved on.lots of money has been waisted fixing roads that was in good order when state forrest logged these virgin forrest-the trees have been removed that had been fell to block roads and camping areas built that used to be homes--at great expence--not that they got it right-one road the drain flows up hill flooding the road--im assuming this is to fill a clay depresion with 25 meters of water to give that ive been to the outback red mud look on the honda.

I recently went to a major fire that state forrest controlled-after the NPWS left the call went out to light it up and go home.for some reason the 3 day fire was finished in a few hours after they left.

if all else cant be "erected" find an under ground orchid.

marine park---my house is on a salt water river with lots of terrorist-I recieved a letter from NP about my use of the river-river bank and local amenitie for private and buisness use.1 day before the closure of the reply-- on a public hollidy--i thought it was a trouble making form to drum up hate untill i contacted members of the commitee.

it also asked income and personal information.
At the bottom of the form was that all information was available to general public under freedom of information.
I complained to 3 people i knew--the first told me i wasnt a stake holder in the planning as my income wasnt efected by the closure of the river and destruction of of all comercial activity...so it shouldnt be on the mailing list

[newhue]

Lamb, the damage mainly occurs on the tracks between the eco drains because of the steepness of a lot of tracks around here, the extra weight causes the tow vehicle to spin the wheels and get stuck, requiring another vehicle to tow them which then has 2 vehicles spinning wheels cutting up the surface.
Also some camper trailers have ridicuosly long drawbars and I have seen many get hung up on the tops of the eco drains and then drag the front part of the chassis through the top of the drain. But the extra weight and the wheelspinning to get that weight up the hill is the culprit IMO. SNIP


Chatting to the ranger at Sundown NP here in Qld about the noticeable influx in camper trailers. He mentioned exactly what you have stated Tank, plus people try and drive it in 2wd. He also said NP's keep suggest no CT but they just keep coming. The bit of track in question takes 2 hours to reach in a 4x4, so that's a fair bit of money for a dozer before it even starts any repair work.

With all the recent gate closures it make me wonder. I really hope not, but perhaps one day Nth Sundown may be gated.

[SG1 Bones]

I would just like to say I agree with Stevo I saw Roothy at the 4wd show up here in Brisbane this year and he was talking about it up on the stage and I agreed, as did my mate, with what he had to say. Yes sometimes someone does something wrong on the tracks but should we punish the majority who are good because of the actions of the reckless minority?! ;)
When he was on stage he mentioned that one time he was off road and notice some rubbish and so he picked it up (is that so hard to do) and after finding some more found out the rubbish was left by some international tourists. So because of their carelessness in our beautiful Great South Land should we be punished?!
Also think of what they do at times on fire tracks, yes they cut down fallen trees over tracks and stuff, but what if there was a fire and the fireys had to gain access would it not be better for the track to be clear than for them to spend hours clearing it before they get there?![bighmmm]

Like previously mentioned take five minutes and look at the bigger picture.:D