QLD National Parks Permits - Cape York

[applemac]

Now to stay on any camping ground on Qld National Parks we have to “CONVENIENTLY PRE-BOOK “ . It’s part of the “SMART QUEENSLAND” idea to keep us out of national parks as much as possible, but who does the National Parks belong to ????

While I was tripping around on the Cape York, everyone I met was disgusted by this system. Camp Grounds fully booked but hardly anyone in them, because people overbooked sites not knowing which day they would be turning up. (It’s impossible to predict exactly when you’re going to be at a particularly place).
At Iron Range NP (Chilli Beach) a guy tried to make a booking over the phone, only to be asked where the NP was (the person on the other side of the phone couldn't find it), they didn’t know of such NP. This guy handed the phone to the ranger that was in front of him while this was going on.

With virtually no phone reception across most of the Cape, no self registration at the Campgrounds, Rangers not taking bookings and the all system of Touch Screens out of action, it's a fine example of incompetent bureaucrats in a main office not having the slightest regard for the tax payer that pays their wages and to whom the National Parks belong to.

I spoke to a ranger there that confirmed my suspicion that keeping people out of National Parks is one of the main reasons this new system was introduced. I have to say it’s the only thing they’ve been good at.
Right now, people are booking more days then they need to make sure they secure a place in each campground, so the Government is getting a good revenue from fully booked campgrounds even at a time when there isn’t enough people around.

While this is happening everyone is getting frustrated by not being able to book a site on the spot on a virtually empty campground.

People that are strongly supportive of this system are the Moreton Telegraph Station. They are the official booking agent for the NP on the Cape (so they proudly told me). These guys are happy of course, it’s a sure way of getting extra business.
These where the only people I met that where strongly defending it......

Queensland is now the most unfriendly State to Travel within Australia, I was told by several people (Grey Nomads).

On top of it all, they are certainly succeeding to stuff up the Tourism in Queensland.

[joeT]

It takes me back to a T.V add, also think that was targeting QLD that was scraped awhile back.
Went as:

Where the bl@&dly h$ll are you...

Answer: At home still trying to work out how to find and book a "good" camping
spot.
Which I also personally found highly frustrating when trying to book
for Fraser island. Never had been there before so how am I to know...
"This is the right spot".

Joe

[Davo]

When I lived in Canada years ago I was horrified to learn that in order to book a campsite at a big provincial park I would need a credit card. I seem to remember that it was so they would get their money even if I didn't turn up. I didn't have a credit card at the time, so I gave up. It was a big shock, coming from Perth where you'd just drive far enough out of the city and find a spot for the night.

I never did go camping over there!

[crump]

(Buderim—LNP) (Minister for National Parks, Recreation, Sport and Racing)
(9.56 am): Queensland is the lucky state. We have a diverse range of natural beauty, valuable
resources and viable land at our back doorstep, but many Queenslanders have either barely glimpsed
their own backyard or, worse, never seen it at all.
The message from the previous government to Queenslanders, tourists and businesses has
been that it is all locked away—you are not allowed to go there. Under this government the message is
loud and clear: our state is magnificent, we want you to see it, we want it to be used for the benefit of all
Queenslanders. A sizeable portion of our state comprises Queensland government estate and it
belongs to all Queenslanders. There are over 12 million hectares of terrestrial estate and 72,000 square
kilometres of marine park waiting to be realised.
Access to public land can mean many different things to an array of different people and groups.
Moving forward in this government we will work with those at the coalface to define access to
Queensland government estate. We will deliver it in a manner consistent with the promises made by this
government to grow our four-pillar economy. To support the definition, as the government we will
honestly assess the definition and the attributes of the current tenure classifications espoused by the
Nature Conservation Act and the manner in which they are utilised. We need to ensure that land that is
part of the government estate is classified appropriately so that we are not locking away useable land
just because the default option is the easiest one.
We need to ensure that we are managing land in a way that interacts positively with modern
realities. There is no doubt that there are many areas of Queensland that have high conservation
values, and some of them are already recognised as great icons in this state. We will continue to respect
and preserve the spaces to conserve our state’s natural beauty for future generations. We will do this by
ensuring the higher protection tenure classifications afforded under the Nature Conservation Act and
World Heritage protection are used appropriately.
Public land is for public use. Queenslanders are entitled to use the land and they are entitled to
derive a benefit from it. As a government, we need to ensure that we can be flexible with public land. We
need to strike a balance of the objectives of different stakeholders and give paramount consideration to
the benefits to be reaped for all Queenslanders.
Inaction, mismanagement and exclusionary attitudes taken by the previous government towards
government estates allowed its potential to wither away. We will not sit idly while our state suffers as a
result. We will take action. The possibilities and potential of our public land at this time are a wealth yet
to be realised, but they will be realised under this Newman government.

[roverrescue]

just as another side to the story.
Lakefield Rinyirri opened last weekend - We ducked over to chase barry.
Ive been camping in the park every year for 9 years and up til saturday had only ever seen a ranger at one of the bases (use to be three, now only kalpower).
I was pretty negative about the system, and the big issue is going to be people " site banking"as you talk about BUT for the first time ever i got a visit from the rangers we were camped 30 odd kays from kalp.

Was great to see them out and about keeping the peace. I yarned with a ranger on tuesday who said the system is working well in lakefield with good compliance and few problems.nobody likes change- maybe there are benefits?

If you have a site booked drive long and hard into the night
You know exactly where to go to roll a swag out rather than checking 12 full sites first?

Give it a season then judge it?

Steve

[applemac]

(Buderim—LNP) (Minister for National Parks, Recreation, Sport and Racing)
(9.56 am): Queensland is the lucky state. We have a diverse range of natural beauty, valuable
resources and viable land at our back doorstep, but many Queenslanders have either barely glimpsed
their own backyard or, worse, never seen it at all.
The message from the previous government to Queenslanders, tourists and businesses has
been that it is all locked away—you are not allowed to go there. Under this government the message is
loud and clear: our state is magnificent, we want you to see it, we want it to be used for the benefit of all
Queenslanders. A sizeable portion of our state comprises Queensland government estate and it
belongs to all Queenslanders. There are over 12 million hectares of terrestrial estate and 72,000 square
kilometres of marine park waiting to be realised.
Access to public land can mean many different things to an array of different people and groups.
Moving forward in this government we will work with those at the coalface to define access to
Queensland government estate. We will deliver it in a manner consistent with the promises made by this
government to grow our four-pillar economy. To support the definition, as the government we will
honestly assess the definition and the attributes of the current tenure classifications espoused by the
Nature Conservation Act and the manner in which they are utilised. We need to ensure that land that is
part of the government estate is classified appropriately so that we are not locking away useable land
just because the default option is the easiest one.
We need to ensure that we are managing land in a way that interacts positively with modern
realities. There is no doubt that there are many areas of Queensland that have high conservation
values, and some of them are already recognised as great icons in this state. We will continue to respect
and preserve the spaces to conserve our state’s natural beauty for future generations. We will do this by
ensuring the higher protection tenure classifications afforded under the Nature Conservation Act and
World Heritage protection are used appropriately.
Public land is for public use. Queenslanders are entitled to use the land and they are entitled to
derive a benefit from it. As a government, we need to ensure that we can be flexible with public land. We
need to strike a balance of the objectives of different stakeholders and give paramount consideration to
the benefits to be reaped for all Queenslanders.
Inaction, mismanagement and exclusionary attitudes taken by the previous government towards
government estates allowed its potential to wither away. We will not sit idly while our state suffers as a
result. We will take action. The possibilities and potential of our public land at this time are a wealth yet
to be realised, but they will be realised under this Newman government.

I don't want to get into politics or take sides in the political arena but I'm looking forward to see something done for the sake of all Australians and the benefit of the tourism industry, which is a very important part of our Country.
I work in the tourism industry and have heard over and over from overseas visitors how disappointed they are for not seeing enough wildlife or experiencing true offroading. They are sold the idea of a trip to Australia with similar expectations to going to Africa. Australia has that charisma and we should keep it that way. Tourism lasts forever, mining doesn't. If we loose our wilderness and the access to it, we've got very little to show for. I'll never forget how disappointed i felt when I visited Kakadu National Park as I was driving through a Highway, it didn't feel right, I wasn't in the wild.
Also if we want people in general and our children to learn to respect the environment, it's important to give them access to it so it can be enjoyed in it's true form.
If the Newman Government has the guts to stick to it's premisses and make our land available to all (in an Environmental responsible manor), i will be the first one to applaud.

[debruiser]

I have acidently booked the wrong campsite before on this system. I had been to a campsite with a friend (who booked for us the 1st time) and want to take the wife there later on, so I booked what I thought was the right place, only to find out it wasn't where I thought it was (only a few kms down the way in the same park) so we just stayed wherever we wanted - there was buggerall people around and we figured we had payed for a spot... might as well use one we liked... I know that is technically the wrong attitude to have but I'm sure that most of the other people there didn't even book or pay for their site!

[newhue]

Now to stay on any camping ground on Qld National Parks we have to “CONVENIENTLY PRE-BOOK “ . It’s part of the “SMART QUEENSLAND” idea to keep us out of national parks as much as possible, but who does the National Parks belong to ????

While I was tripping around on the Cape York, everyone I met was disgusted by this system. Camp Grounds fully booked but hardly anyone in them, because people overbooked sites not knowing which day they would be turning up. (It’s impossible to predict exactly when you’re going to be at a particularly place).
At Iron Range NP (Chilli Beach) a guy tried to make a booking over the phone, only to be asked where the NP was (the person on the other side of the phone couldn't find it), they didn’t know of such NP. This guy handed the phone to the ranger that was in front of him while this was going on.

With virtually no phone reception across most of the Cape, no self registration at the Campgrounds, Rangers not taking bookings and the all system of Touch Screens out of action, it's a fine example of incompetent bureaucrats in a main office not having the slightest regard for the tax payer that pays their wages and to whom the National Parks belong to.

I spoke to a ranger there that confirmed my suspicion that keeping people out of National Parks is one of the main reasons this new system was introduced. I have to say it’s the only thing they’ve been good at.
Right now, people are booking more days then they need to make sure they secure a place in each campground, so the Government is getting a good revenue from fully booked campgrounds even at a time when there isn’t enough people around.

While this is happening everyone is getting frustrated by not being able to book a site on the spot on a virtually empty campground.

People that are strongly supportive of this system are the Moreton Telegraph Station. They are the official booking agent for the NP on the Cape (so they proudly told me). These guys are happy of course, it’s a sure way of getting extra business.
These where the only people I met that where strongly defending it......

Queensland is now the most unfriendly State to Travel within Australia, I was told by several people (Grey Nomads).

On top of it all, they are certainly succeeding to stuff up the Tourism in Queensland.

Why don't you cut and past that to as many politicians and news papers as possible. Given you have been there you have weight. It does seem our parks have suddenly taken a sharp turn after the Greens got involved making deals with Labour.

We are looking at a trip next year to the Cape. If the "at the door" facilities aren't working by then I'll just poach me thinks. I feel that even if the ranger gives me a fine, my argument against it by the time we finally make court is valid. How are the people meant to honour a system if the system is buggered.

[mikehzz]

The parks are totally run by the state government. All your woes should be directed there. There are only 6 parks run by the Commonwealth and none are in Queensland.

[Michael2]

.... If the "at the door" facilities aren't working by then I'll just poach me thinks. I feel that even if the ranger gives me a fine, my argument against it by the time we finally make court is valid....

Then, when you go to court, subpoena the premier of the state and ask them to comment on the published policy vs practice.

or maybe if you try a stunt like that, there'll be so many court delays that it will never make it to court.

[nugge t]

Sadly it has been going this way for last few years and the system seriously sucks.

National Parks do not "manage" the parks, the just look to keep people out. Less people = less work for same pay.

The irony is that these people expect people on holidays to have such a tight itinerary that they can prebook weeks in advance when they couldn't organise a chook raffle.

The 12 hour notification period of cancellation is also a joke, especially in remote areas where there is no phone/internet reception.

The extension of a proven flawed system to Cape York is just further evidence of the level of competence of NPWS IMHO....gggrrrrrrrrrrrr

[mikehzz]

How National Parks are managed was covered quite well in the thread about the Stockton protest. One of the 4wd Association delegates had his say and it was basically what I had heard from another delegate that I had heard. I know that thread was concerned with NSW parks so I would be interested to know if the same process is in place in Queensland. If it isn't then it should be. Interested stakeholders need to be represented and influence the policy not just beaurecrats whose life is easier if the place is locked up.

[newhue]

I've lost count of rain affected camping weekends, so with parks hopeless refund policy they expect me to keep burning the camp fees. So we balance the books by just not paying next time.

I was at a meeting for NP's Great Walks some years ago. A ranger told me over dinner that the $5.45 camp fee which was less then, was no more than the cost of counting visitor numbers for statistics. This in turn helped with management. Trouble is there figures are so inaccurate its no wonder management is similar.

Surely a Cape Pass would work better. First in best dressed. Numbers are a best guess which is no more than now. Works in the desert, works in Tasmania, just not in QLD apparently.

[applemac]

"Surely a Cape Pass would work better. First in best dressed. Numbers are a best guess which is no more than now. Works in the desert, works in Tasmania, just not in QLD apparently.[/QUOTE]

I totaly agree with the idea of a camp pass, as you say, it works in the Desert.
It's the same over there, you don't know when you get to a spot or how long you're going to stay there.

[newhue]

I was told last year approx 4300 people cross the Simpson each year. And to my thinking there are fewer routes across the Simpson than the Cape. And at a rough guess you'd get two deserts into the Cape.
But good old red neck Queensland introduce some book in advance system in an area with little phone coverage, hence little internet as well. Then install a pay at the door system that's not commissioned properly, in an area that has large amounts of rain. My guess it will be an ongoing waste of money.

I have tried several times over the years writing to Qld Parks regarding annual passes. All I get is an acknowledgement of letter, but no response or comment.