Running 265/75 r16s on 16x7 dynamic steels

[Ged]

I've had the 2" lift and about to get a ARB deluxe winch bar fitted. I'm running the 18" alloys around town and want to invest in offroad set of rims and tyres. I have my eye on the 16x7 dynamic steel rims (+30mm offset) and BFG 265/75 r16 Mud Terrain KM2. I've read ALL the threads I can find on this combination and still not clear if I will experience rubbing at full lock (with or without articulation). Does anyone run the same set up and if so, whats your experience? I'm also interested in whether the sidewall bagging on 7" rims is excessive?

[MR LR]

That combination should be sweet :)

265 is the widest you can go on 7" rims AFAIK

Cheers
Will

[twr7cx]

If your going to buy the wheels, why not get wider ones - I'd have recommended 8" wide. Les Richmond Automotive sell a fair variety.

[Ged]

Good question. Issue with 8"rims is that combined with 30mm offset and 265 tires is that the tires protrude beyond wheel arches. I'd have to fit a flare kit which is an extra bit of work and $.

[Ged]

Forgot to add that the procomp wheels that the LRA sell have +6mm or +12mm offset which actually increases the track width 48mm and 36mm respectively beyond what the dynamic +30mm offset. So my understanding is that this makes the tires protrude even further, definitely requiring flare work.

[buddha D2]

Andrew down at HiLine4WD in Traralgon should be able to help out Dynamic rims too.....he ran the 8x16 on his D2 and had to put the flares on.....I reckon the 7's would be good if not wanting to go that way

[CJT]

Dynamic do 16x8 rims and I would definetely go that way.

Also, a 16x8 +30mm offset will be the same overall tyre / track width as a 16x7 +30mm with the same tyre.

Offset is measured from the wheel centre, meaning the centre of your tyres tread is going to be in the same location on a 7 or 8 inch wide rim.

[Ged]

CJT, I'm in your camp regarding the 8". Problem is a 8" rim with a

[Ged]

Damn the small size of iPhone screens - premature Send. I was saying CJT that I'd prefer 8" over 7" but the extra distance between the centerline of the rim and the edge of the tire causes the tire to protrude beyond the flares. I really don't want to do additional work on the flares.

[chuck]

I ran that size tyre on my D2 for all the time I had it, no problems.

This was on 7" oem rims.

Slight rubbing on full lock which can be fixed by adusting the steering stops slightly.

The tyres on 7" rims bag out better thus keeping your body away from walls.

You will probably find oem 7 x 16 rimson ebay or similar for the price you will pay for the Dynamics - the oems are lighter and very strong.

Cheers

Chuck

[CJT]

As I mentioned, if a 16x7 with a 265 does not sit past your guards than a 16x8 with a 265 will not sit out past your guards. :)


You need to ignore the extra width of the rim, an 8" rim is roughly 200mm wide, your tyre is 265mm wide, the tyre centre does not move on a different width rim, only the offset can change that.

[Ged]

Cheers chuck. I seriously considered the OEM alloys. I heard a few reports though that fixing them when damaged in remote locations was a lot more difficult than steel.

[MR LR]

Cheers chuck. I seriously considered the OEM alloys. I heard a few reports though that fixing them when damaged in remote locations was a lot more difficult than steel.
I don't know what you'd be doing to damage them though...

[Ged]

Chris, your logic is persuasive. Have you run the 265/75 r16 on a dynamic 16x8 with +30mm offset on a D2 with 2" lift and ARB bullbar? The reason I ask is that the local tyre dealer has fitted plenty of modified D2s in referral from our local landy specialist. They reckon that the 8" protrude (with tires I have referred to) but the 7" don't. Based on your logic that doesn't make sense. Me thinks I need to chat to them tomorrow armed with your insights. Cheers mate. I'll let you know how it goes.

[Ged]

I don't know what you'd be doing to damage them though...

I don't know either Mr LR jnr but I intend to find out!! :D

[MR LR]

I don't know either Mr LR jnr but I intend to find out!! :D
If you're flogging a Landie that hard something else is gonna give...

Its up to you, but i have 100% cofidence in Land Rover alloys and my cars don't exactly get treated that lightly...

Cheers
Will

[Ged]

Thanks for your perspective Will. I appreciate you taking the time to share it. Cheers

[CJT]

Chris, your logic is persuasive. Have you run the 265/75 r16 on a dynamic 16x8 with +30mm offset on a D2 with 2" lift and ARB bullbar? The reason I ask is that the local tyre dealer has fitted plenty of modified D2s in referral from our local landy specialist. They reckon that the 8" protrude (with tires I have referred to) but the 7" don't. Based on your logic that doesn't make sense. Me thinks I need to chat to them tomorrow armed with your insights. Cheers mate. I'll let you know how it goes.

Ged,

I have not run that exact tyre size.

I used to run 245/75 R16 on 16x7 +30 dynamics with 2"lift and ARB bullbar and wished I had of gone to a 16x8 to allow the fitment of 285/75 tyres.

I have since gone to 18x9 +32 alloys with 33x12.5 R18 muddies when the rims eventually arrive.

I would definetley talk to the tyre place and ask them to explain why the tyre would sit further out on a 8" rim compared to a 7" rim, also mention that the centre of the rim and tyre is always the same so why the difference.

Also, regarding steel vs alloy rims. Steel rims have a lower load rating but can be bent back to a reasonable shape in the bush, alloy rims have a higher load rating and will take a bigger hit before they do sustain damage.

My factory 18x8 alloys with the standard 255/55 tyres took some pretty big hits from tree roots when deflated to 16psi and came out unscathed.

[Ged]

As I mentioned, if a 16x7 with a 265 does not sit past your guards than a 16x8 with a 265 will not sit out past your guards. :)


You need to ignore the extra width of the rim, an 8" rim is roughly 200mm wide, your tyre is 265mm wide, the tyre centre does not move on a different width rim, only the offset can change that.

and that Chris appears to be the issue. According to the distributor of the rims that I am dealing with, the Dynamic 8" that is suitable for a D2 has less positive/more negative offset than the 7", hence it sits out wider. :)

[CJT]

and that Chris appears to be the issue. According to the distributor of the rims that I am dealing with, the Dynamic 8" that is suitable for a D2 has less positive/more negative offset than the 7", hence it sits out wider. :)

I see, did they give you the offset?

[CJT]

I found the information you recieved did not make sense, so I called Dynamic Tyres myself.

The answer is;

16x7 & 16x8 are both +30mm offset for the D2, wheel and tyre centre will be in the same location.

16x8 is only available in black with the round holes.

So, as mentioned they will fit as the tyre location will not change.

If you want to check for yourself the details are below;

Dynamic Tyres
30 Laser Drive, Rowville, VIC
Ph: 1300 655 870

[Ged]

Chris, I rang Dynamic and they confirmed your info. Was the tyre dealer just plain ignorant or is being selective with his information so that he can shift something he has stock of...or some other reason. Anyway, thanks again for digging into it, really helpful advice for a less experienced D2 owner. Ged

[LowRanger]

Personally I would be running the 16"x7" rims if you want to run 255's,particularly if you want to drop your tyre pressures off road.With the smaller width rim,you will be less likely to unseat a bead.I know a few people that run 255's on 8" rims,and they are always paranoid about unseating a bead when aired down.
For a reference,I only run 8" rims on my 35's(315's) and run them down to 10Psi without problems.
If you were going to use the vehicle as a shopping trolley then it wont really matter.

[Ged]

Heres an update. Fitted the dynamic 16x8 rims with 30mm offset into some 265 75r BFG KM2's. Cost $95 for rims, $350 for rubber. Doesn't protrude beyond flares or rub under road conditions. Heading off road this Sunday so will test and advise.

[clubagreenie]

You don't get rubbing on the radius arms at lock? I have 265's on factory 16x7 alloys and rub on both lock with no articulation.

[splinter]

Heres an update. Fitted the dynamic 16x8 rims with 30mm offset into some 265 75r BFG KM2's. Cost $95 for rims, $350 for rubber. Doesn't protrude beyond flares or rub under road conditions. Heading off road this Sunday so will test and advise.

Does this mean that you ended up fitting flares, I thought in an earlier post you stated that you didn't want to fit them?

[CJT]

Does this mean that you ended up fitting flares, I thought in an earlier post you stated that you didn't want to fit them?

I think he is referring to the factory D2 flares / guards.

[LowRanger]

If that is the case,then I can't believe that with -30 offset rims,that they don't protrude.

[Ged]

Hi doubters, incredulous responders, interested bystanders, and other commentators, let me reply:

1. Clubagreenie, I said that there is no rub under normal "on road" conditions. Have not tested under full articulation but will do so on the weekend. I could come back reporting some issues but I'll let you know.

2. Splinter, no, I have not fitted aftermarket flares. CJT, you are correct I am referring to the D2 factory fitted guards/flares

3. Lowranger, surprising but correct that that under Vicroads regulations that the tyres are legal and do not protrude. I quote "As per VSB14 Section LS, tyres up to 50mm larger in diameter than that specified by the vehicle manufacturer may be fitted provided: The entire tyre cross section is covered by the vehicles bodywork in plan view with the front wheels in the straight ahead position". I can state categorically that if you look from directly above, you cannot see any part of the tyre. I've attached photos, two of which are photos taken from directly above of the FRH and RRH guards. That being said, there's only a few millimetres in it. I even had my landrover specialist look at it. He is a licenced roadworthy tester and his opinion was: "legal".

4. Finally I will say that it appears that the brand of tyre that you fit can make a difference. Not all 265's MTs are exactly 265mm across from outside edge to the other. Go measure a few yourself and you'll see what I mean. As there is only a few mm in it, I could easily have bought another 265 profile MT and found that the edge of the tire was visible from plan view.

Happy to share anything else you want to know or dig into.

[splinter]

Thanks for the update Ged, does anyone know if those black factory flares fitted on some discos make the body wider than the discos that don't come with them?

[CJT]

If that is the case,then I can't believe that with -30 offset rims,that they don't protrude.

They will be +30 offset for a D2

[boofdtl]

They will be +30 offset for a D2


-25 is for D1

[that_kid]

Thanks for the update Ged, does anyone know if those black factory flares fitted on some discos make the body wider than the discos that don't come with them?


the difference is negligible at best. I took mine off before I put the 75mm flares on and its basically the width of the plastic, so about 1.5mm


I estimate you will bother with changing between road tires and MT's about 4 times before you get over it....

Unless theyre a bias ply tire, just run them full time

[Krayzie Keegs]

I wish I had seen this post I had just gone thought all this myself just a week earlyer and could have saved to some time.

I in the end whent with the Micky T BAJA MTZ 285x75 on the dymanic 16x8 from Les Richmond, so the tire is that bit wider but only just (on the right angle) can be seen to sick out, and dont rub anywhere but the sill finish at front when turn which i just removed for sliders but a small trim with the grinder would fix

[Slunnie]

-25 is for D1
D1 isn't -25 from the factory, thats LandCruiser offset, but that offset is commonly enough fitted to D1's with flares.

On another note, with all of this talk about the aftermarket Disco2 rims having an offset of +30, that is also in comparison to the OEM rims which are +57, so those wheels centreline will be sitting wider than factory by 17mm per side.

From what I've seen and what I've tested, a 2" lift usually but not always works just with 265/75-16 on OEM rims (+57) but does not work without rubbing the body with 285/75-16 on OEM rims (+57). The 285/75-16 is mathematically 10mm wider to the outside (and also inside) of a 265, where the +30 rims will place a 265/75-16 tyre 17mm further to the outside of a 265/75-16 on OEM rims - so, you might get rubbing on the inner body work, but the reduction in tyre size may also prevent it. I hope your testing is positive news.

Also, somebody commented on the 8" rim being about 200mm wide, please note that this is the internal bead measurement on the rim, not the outside width.

I've been giving OEM alloy wheels a hammering for a lot of years and they are strong. I have not dented or broken any. But, I would highly recommend the OEM rims because they have the best bead retaining rings in them that I've ever seen, and these are normally 1000x better (maybe even more!) than any that I have seen on aftermarket rims. The only tyre I've seen pulled of a Disco2 or P38 rim has been the BFG AT tyre, nothing else.

[Ged]

Hi all. A short report on the off road test of the new tyre/rim combo up Walhalla way last weekend. Experienced plenty of full lock opportunities but probably never fully extended/compressed the suspension fully on all four corners so I cannot state it was a comprehensive test. Nonetheless no rubbing or fouling observed. I'll update again after future trips.

[TD50WA]

For what it is worth, I run 265/75/16 mtz's on factory 7" rims. I have standard suspension which has sagged at the front and I only get some minor rubbing on full lock because I haven't adjusted the stops yet. I have been off road flexed out etc and no rubbing. I also agree with slunnie in that I run 10psi in the sand and have never rolled a tyre yet....drive accordingly of course. The factory rims are pretty damn good. If you want a wider stance, use factory with adaptors, note I said adaptors and not spacers. The adaptors are the ones that have the centre spigot mount as well, not spacers that just go under the studs. Yes I know they are illegal in oz, but they are used in Europe and have good reputations from those that have them. Zu rims are probably the next best option although they are pricey, but you get an extremely strong quality rim for that money.
Just another point, 265/75's are not legal on a d2 as they are a 32" tyre and factory is a 29" tyre. That is 3" difference or 75 mm. The max the govt allows without examination is 50 mm. Please correct me if I am wrong?

Cheers all
Kev

[TD50WA]

Just further, those rims at +30 are also illegal as the standard offset is +57, so that is a difference of 27, the max is 25mm. Yep, only 2mm out but technically....
The Zu rims are +38 I think, so are a tried and tested offset.
I think we all stretch the limits as to what we can legally do though, and it's only a problem if you get caught:D, or is it?

Cheers again.:D

Kev

[bob10]

Just another point, 265/75's are not legal on a d2 as they are a 32" tyre and factory is a 29" tyre. That is 3" difference or 75 mm. The max the govt allows without examination is 50 mm. Please correct me if I am wrong?

Cheers all
Kev
You are correct. Been talking to my local tyre person regarding buying Bridgestone D694 LT tyres, he tells me legally I can go 15 mm above the size stated on the drivers door transfer, anything above that makes insurance null & void. He looked up on the computer , 265 is too much for my 1999 D2. Bob

[Ged]

[QUOTE=bigkevg;1759747]
Just another point, 265/75's are not legal on a d2 as they are a 32" tyre and factory is a 29" tyre. That is 3" difference or 75 mm. The max the govt allows without examination is 50 mm. Please correct me if I am wrong?

It appears that way Kev. It is interesting to note that there is however a potential contradiction in the Vic regs. Here it is:

One clause in the regs allows you to increase overall tyre diameter by a max of 50mm. If you compare a D2 OEM wheel with a 265/75 16, you have a difference in the overall diameter of the wheel of 65.78mm. It appears clear that this would be illegal under this clause.

There is however another clause in the regs relating to raising 4WD ride heights that allows a different interpretation. They allow an increase in ride height of a 4Wd by maximum 75mm. 50mm of that lift can be suspension lift, thereby allowing 25mm for lift owing to tyre size increase. Ride height is measured at a fixed point of the vehicle chassis or body work. A common reference point is the top of a wheel arch of an unladen vehicle. If you take a 265/75 r16 wheel and tire combo and put it on a vehicle with a 50mm suspension lift, the overall ride height, as measured at the wheel arch does not equal 50mm+(65.78mm/2). Thats because the distance from the centre of the wheel to the outside of the tire is less at the point where the tyre contacts the ground. In other words, vehicle weight compresses the tire, reducing the distance between the top of the wheel arch and the ground to less than it would be if the vehicle tire were not bearing weight. So whilst on paper a 256/75 r16 would increase the ride height by 32.89mm, once you actually put it on the vehicle and allow vehicle weight to compress the tire, the lift is substantially less.

I am not saying this argument would hold water if tested in a court of law but it appears to exist nonetheless. :( Is anyone aware of this alternate interpretation?

[TD50WA]

Good theory, but the law works on specifics. There are general, overall type rules, and there are more specific rules. The specific rules will be applied in preference to the overall rule.
In other words, you may not exceed the overall height gain allowed, but the specific rule about tyre sizes will be applied anyway.
As per my car, my height is on standard albeit sagged springs, but I am still technically illegal because the tyres I am running exceed the maximum allowed without examination and approval.
This is the info I have received from my dot anyway.:p

Cheers
Kev