Beach Driving

[tomar5e]

The missus and I are heading to Eighty Mile Beach for 5 days and are looking forward to getting the D4 on the sand. My previous D2 had issues with traction control and sand and found ourselves stuck a couple of times on what I thought would be a breeze for it. Obviously the D4 is streaks ahead of the D2 but what i was wondering is there any D4 specific things i should take note on with the D4 on sand?
And what is the minimum tyre pressure that is safe to go down to with the standard 255/55/r19's?

[CSBrisie]

Sand mode, DSC off and 18-20 psi; lower to 16 if necessary; probably could go to as low as 12 in an emergency (stuck) in a straight line - ie sharp turns increases likelihood of tyre coming off rim; use Rock Crawl if you get stuck

[101RRS]

And don't forget to turn DSC back off if you change any TR setting.

[discotwinturbo]

Where is the soft sand on eighty mile beach ?

Wallal downs.....two wheel drive. And two wheel drive in a few other places. Have been there a number of times, but quite possible I missed the soft stuff if I went at a different time of the year. Have even towed our camper along one stretch for about 10kms.

As mentioned earlier, 16 is a good pressure with 19's provided it is soft enough to warrant it.

I have been down to 12 at calcup, but had dsc off and low range to get over the last dune due to the electronics deciding I was pushing her too hard.

Brett...

[gghaggis]

The missus and I are heading to Eighty Mile Beach for 5 days and are looking forward to getting the D4 on the sand. My previous D2 had issues with traction control and sand and found ourselves stuck a couple of times on what I thought would be a breeze for it. Obviously the D4 is streaks ahead of the D2 but what i was wondering is there any D4 specific things i should take note on with the D4 on sand?
And what is the minimum tyre pressure that is safe to go down to with the standard 255/55/r19's?

You can always buy the book ;)

GOE Offroad Booklet (http://www.greenovalexperience.com/booklet.html)

Cheers,

Gordon

[Redback]

And don't forget to turn DSC back off if you change any TR setting.

I was told at a LR driver training day that sand mode is the only mode you turn the DSC off, all the rest you leave the DSC on, as it helps with articulation in mud ruts and rock crawl and skids when in snow and grass modes.

Baz.

[Tombie]

The missus and I are heading to Eighty Mile Beach for 5 days and are looking forward to getting the D4 on the sand. My previous D2 had issues with traction control and sand and found ourselves stuck a couple of times on what I thought would be a breeze for it. Obviously the D4 is streaks ahead of the D2 but what i was wondering is there any D4 specific things i should take note on with the D4 on sand?
And what is the minimum tyre pressure that is safe to go down to with the standard 255/55/r19's?

Just FYI, if you had trouble with TC and Sand.. Your pressures were wrong :cool:

[tomar5e]

Where is the soft sand on eighty mile beach ?

Wallal downs.....two wheel drive. And two wheel drive in a few other places. Have been there a number of times, but quite possible I missed the soft stuff if I went at a different time of the year. Have even towed our camper along one stretch for about 10kms.

Brett...

With 140k,s of beach I'm sure there's 4wd worthy sand somewhere there... and plus, discos don't have 2wd ;)

Thanks for the tips everyone and am keen to see how we go :thumbup:



Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 2

[101RRS]

I was told at a LR driver training day that sand mode is the only mode you turn the DSC off, all the rest you leave the DSC on, as it helps with articulation in mud ruts and rock crawl and skids when in snow and grass modes.

Baz.

Hmm - DSC seems to be a bit of black magic so I would not disagree but then would not agree based on my own experiences.

One week after getting my car ended up here and was surprised that I could not get out.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/
I was crossed up and traction control was not kicking in - trying different TR settings - traction control was not kicking in because engine revs would not go above 2500rpm so couldn't get a wheel to spin fast enough - I later found out that DSC was cutting engine power at 2500rpm. If I had DSC off I would most likely have driven out. Instead I had to get the Freelander to pull me out - after I was out the Freelander had no issues driving through with less ground clearance as its traction control worked once revs got up a bit.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

I have found DSC works well on most conditions (detects deflating tyres pretty well) and I would leave it on in most conditions offroad and only turn it off for difficult conditions. It may stop a roll over if swerving on the beach to miss something.

Garry

[NavyDiver]

Garry
"One week after getting my car ended up here and was surprised that I could not get out."

Height and Tires mate- it is entirely possible to get stuck on wet grass. DSC is only one reason you could not extract yourself once stuck. Road or even AT tires in deep mud especially if you have your tummy sitting on the deck taking a lot of weight and traction off your tires. Avon River descent in WA had a farmer on a tractor making a killing towing hundreds of cars and even some 4wds he allowed to park for free in his nice grassy paddock at $50 per tow :D:D:D
"I had to get the Freelander to pull me out - after I was out the Freelander had no issues driving through with less ground clearance as its traction control worked once revs got up a bit."

SSSSSSSSSShhhhhhhhhh mate my swimbo likes Freelanders and I like my D3 :D



Back on topic

Sand driving is lower tire pressure and momentum especially if in soft sand. Do not dig a hole when starting off and do not stop in really soft stuff. DSC off, tires down and ride height at as high as you can go before you start playing.




ExpeditionOz 4WD Skills - Sand Driving - YouTube

I like the momentum part in mud as well

[Celtoid]

Hmm - DSC seems to be a bit of black magic so I would not disagree but then would not agree based on my own experiences.

One week after getting my car ended up here and was surprised that I could not get out.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/
I was crossed up and traction control was not kicking in - trying different TR settings - traction control was not kicking in because engine revs would not go above 2500rpm so couldn't get a wheel to spin fast enough - I later found out that DSC was cutting engine power at 2500rpm. If I had DSC off I would most likely have driven out. Instead I had to get the Freelander to pull me out - after I was out the Freelander had no issues driving through with less ground clearance as its traction control worked once revs got up a bit.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/

I have found DSC works well on most conditions (detects deflating tyres pretty well) and I would leave it on in most conditions offroad and only turn it off for difficult conditions. It may stop a roll over if swerving on the beach to miss something.

Garry

I believe TC is ineffective at zero speed....

I'm sure I read that on this forum.

I've also read here about guys failing to get up slippery hills that have turns....assumed to be the DSC cutting in an killing their momentum.

Kev.

[101RRS]

I believe TC is ineffective at zero speed....

Kev.

But when in gear with wheels spinning the car thinks it is moving. Dsc can stop the engine getting enough revs to activate TC.

As far as the original post goes - TR in sand, tyres down, DSC on until sticky stuff then off.

Garry

[Celtoid]

But when in gear with wheels spinning the car thinks it is moving. Dsc can stop the engine getting enough revs to activate TC.

As far as the original post goes - TR in sand, tyres down, DSC on until sticky stuff then off.

Garry

I'd have to defer to more learned colleagues, so this is just a question, not a statement....wouldn't the lack of friction....transferred/translating into load on the wheels, drive train, engine, etc be noticed by the car's tricky stuff and register as non-movement (Isn't this one of the triggers for Extended Height)? Which you'd hope would trigger an effective TC response...but due to lack of actual FWD motion, can't?! Hasn't this been identified as one of the major advantages of the rear eDiff...it reacts when the TC is slow or can't?


And refering to your 'response to the original post goes'...wouldn't the DSC react to the wobbles you get driving in soft sand (not real sticky stuff...just general beach driving) and potentially bog you?

That was my take on what I've read anyway....

Geez I wish I hadn't missed GGHaggis's Brisbane GOE event......:(

Cheers,

Kev.

BTW, I'd much prefer leaving safety equipment like the DSC on, for the reasons you mentioned....but if it has the potential to keep getting you bogged....rock and a hard place I guess...

[TerryO]

One week after getting my car ended up here and was surprised that I could not get out.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e334/gazzz21/15122010001.jpg
I had to get the Freelander to pull me out - after I was out the Freelander had no issues driving through with less ground clearance as its traction control worked once revs got up a bit.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e334/gazzz21/IMG_0069.jpg


Garry

Hey Garry, ...:D

Hmm! ....you had to get towed out by a Freelander! ...that is not something I would be admitting to. :angel:

Oh well to late now the secret is out and we have the photo to prove it for all eternity ...;)

Cheers,
Terry

[101RRS]

Yep - my Freelander - has done plenty of offroad work so I know what it is capable of. Build better than any RRS or D3 as well.

Most people who knock them have never owned one.

As I said - the bog hole that stopped the RRS (admittedly at the time I was not up on its idiosyncrasies) did not stop the Freelander. It doesn't have DSC that cuts engine power to a level lower than is needed to activate TC.

garry

[PeterOZ]

had sialr when my D3 was new, took it on beach at straddy and promptly bogged it to the chassis :eek:

did not know much about DSC etc, did have it in sand mode and though the e.diff would kick in and Id be able to get out. wrong, e.diff did not kick in, no idea why, maybe a DSC thing?

Forgot to lower tyre pressure so mistake number 1.

Had to get towed by an old bomb cruiser, highly embarrassing what!!! :p:o

[ozscott]

Just FYI, if you had trouble with TC and Sand.. Your pressures were wrong :cool:

x2...cant seriously get into trouble with a D2 on sand even stock without CDL if the tyre pressures are right.

Cheers

[Peter]

D2 (Diesel, 7 seater) - I owned one for many years and took it fully loaded to Bathurst Bay, Fraser, Moreton, etc, etc. Every time it looked like getting stuck we remembered the words of a wise old bloke at Moreton who saw the Disco over packed inside and out and towing a boat and struggling to proceed. He said "15psi in the truck tyres and 12psi in the trailer". We did as we were told as it was 9pm at night. All seven of us then got back in and like magic it floated out of its ruts and drove off like it was on tar.

This 4WD was the turning point in my wife's off road driving. Basically, she has no fear and will take on anything... since this Land Rover.

D3 (Diesel, 7 seater) - wow so much more power and weight and tech.

My first encounter in sand took my faith away. Now I wouldn't change it for the any other truck, unless there is someone out there with a D4 SE who wants a clean swap ;).

What changes my mind??

Tyres - yes they make a huge difference I had Pirelli Zeros and they were worn and good. Changed them soon after I owned the car to Kumhos which were new and bad. I now have Pirelli ATRs and yes they cost more and yes they make a huge difference.

DSC - You need to turn it off. Now everyone thinks this is obvious but you need to push it and hold it till the light comes on not just the beep. As a newbie I had the knowledge but not the experience. On sand you need the DSC off no argument. If you leave it "on" you will struggle or worse get stuck as the poor computer tries to manage conflict.

Suspension Height Rods - the car is setup for great road use and is about 25cm too low for deep sand. The speed sensitive lowering must have been designed for Brittish beaches and not the long deep trenches of our sand islands.

This causes the whole underbelly to grind against the middle of the track. Think about it... Drag a stick through the sand know tray a sheet of ply. I suggest this is akin to dragging a floating axle or the underside of the D3.

Now with proper tyres, appropriate DSC treatment and GOE height rods the D3 not only is awesome in the sand, it makes my mates 100 series look a bit average as the D3 tech does work. Compared to the 100s I seem to stop in sand quicker, accelerate faster and travel in greater comfort.

Yes my wife loves the D3 and my mates have nicknamed it the "Sand Rover" as it seems to do things with less effort than the Tojos and Pajeros.

[Celtoid]

But when in gear with wheels spinning the car thinks it is moving. Dsc can stop the engine getting enough revs to activate TC.

As far as the original post goes - TR in sand, tyres down, DSC on until sticky stuff then off.

Garry

Given all the other posts, we haven't quite got this nutted down....sand DSC on or OFF?

TC working with 'knowledge' that it's moving or not? Extended mode works on what?

Cheers Kev.

[Peter]

Kev,

For sand driving.

Drop pressure to 20psi at most
DSC off.
TC set to sand.
Soft stuff - Raise the suspension. Keep below 50kmh and it stays up.
Hard sand - drop to normal height and go as fast as the beach limit and conditions allow.

Bonus - get a set of suspension rods.

Have fun.

Cheers PK

[DiscoWeb]

Given all the other posts, we haven't quite got this nutted down....sand DSC on or OFF?

TC working with 'knowledge' that it's moving or not? Extended mode works on what?

Cheers Kev.

For what it is worth, everyone I have spoken to including on driver training days run by LR to advance sand days run by the Range Rover Club say in all off road environs to turn the DSC off.

Has worked for me on sand and all other surfaces, but really the true expert is GGhaggis, what say he !!!

As always my opinion is offered with nothing other than limited personal experience and the anonymity of a keyboard to back it up !!!

Regards,

George

[gghaggis]

For what it is worth, everyone I have spoken to including on driver training days run by LR to advance sand days run by the Range Rover Club say in all off road environs to turn the DSC off.


Not ALL off-road conditions, but any where you anticipate doing more than jogging pace should have the DSC off. In slow rock-crawl conditions, turning off the DSC also reduces (slightly) the effectiveness of the traction control.

Cheers,

Gordon

[101RRS]

Not ALL off-road conditions, but any where you anticipate doing more than jogging pace should have the DSC off. In slow rock-crawl conditions, turning off the DSC also reduces (slightly) the effectiveness of the traction control.

Cheers,

Gordon

So in genuine Rock Crawl situations where you are driving slowly and generally using low end torque and not your higher RPM power (DSC when on seems to restrict my max revs to about 2700 RPM) you would advocate leaving DSC on? I have noticed in some Youtube vids that some cars seem to have good TC response where others it is poor - this may explain that observation. Thanks for the pointers. Garry