Disco 3.9 V8 and Auto box into 110 Defender

[jakeslouw]

I've searched and searched and I can't get a hit on this subject.

I can source a 3.9 V8 in reasonable nick, with ZF auto box, out of a Disco 1.
The 14CUX and all injection stuff as well as visco fan and all serpentine belt & ancillaries will be part of the deal.

What issues will I be looking at if I drop the 3.5 and LT85 out of my 110 and drop in the 3.9?

- g/box cross-members?
- prop shaft lengths?
- ECU connection to old style harness?

What else?

[Slunnie]

It should all bolt up the same as far as I know. It does for the LT95, R380 and the ZF and I would expect the same for the LT85.

The loom, I'm pretty sure there are 3 wires that come out of it that you wire. You may need to do a search on here or Outerlimits4x4 forum from a poster call RUFF to find that info.

I think your biggest issue will be making the radiator and heater hoses work with a county radiator and likewise the fan shroud is different to the County one too - the 3.9 fan and coolant hoses are in different locations to the twin carby V8. Likewise fitting the airbox and plumbing to make it work - this obviously is also different.

I also fabbed a centre console with the gear selector etc - that was into a series II though.

[jakeslouw]

"I think your biggest issue will be making the radiator and heater hoses work with a county radiator and likewise the fan shroud is different to the County one too - the 3.9 fan and coolant hoses are in different locations to the twin carby V8. Likewise fitting the airbox and plumbing to make it work - this obviously is also different."

Hmmm thanks for that. The cross-member was worrying me.

Heater has been disconnected (not much point when we never go much below 0 deg C over here, and have a V8 up front as a heater........)

I'll discuss the shroud with the Disco's owner. Maybe he'll part with that as well, as he's installing a Lexus 1HZ 4.0 V8.
The rad has to come out for a pressure check and possible recore / rod anyway. So probably a good time to move inlets and outlets.

Space behind the plenum chamber for the airbox: yes that will have to be investigated. The heater, as mentioned, is redundant, so I can remove it and maybe shift the airbox towards the passenger side and blank off any holes in the bulkhead.

Plumbing for the airbox: not a biggy, I'll just go down to the local supplier of cooling and heating ducting and see what will do the job. Otherwise I'll get some nice bling stainless-steel round tube bends and straights and plumb something up with silicon joins.

ECU: yes, I've managed to download some 14CUX EFI conversion guides, so with the help of a good auto electrician it will probably all work.

I might even go after-market ECU at some stage, and run paired sequential and closed-loop O2 sensors.

[jakeslouw]

But does anybody have a bright idea for the transmission tunnel?

We can't get NAS spec tunnels here, and I can't afford to try an import something.

Should I make up a steel frame with some ally checker-plate?

Or just get some thicker checker plate and bend and rivet something together?

[Slunnie]

I fabbed a tunnel, but despite being a bit bigger than the LT95 which the Countys ran, I thought they still fitted???

[jakeslouw]

Our V8 Counties had LT85s later on.

So after I've removed the LT85 and rubber boot and lever, will the ZF's lever fit the hole or will I just need to do some cutting and drilling? What about the t-case lever? Does that line up as well?

[Slunnie]

I'm not sure. I've only done Series 2 to 3.5V8/Lt95 and then to 3.9EFI/ZF/LT230, not not exactly what you're doing. I also made my own tunnel. I'm not sure, but a friend who put a ZF/LT230 into a Stage 1 I don't recall having to make a new tunnel, but I think he did have to somehow cut in the tunnel to fit the shifter box. I don't recall the transfer lever. I'm not sure.

[bee utey]

Our V8 Counties had LT85s later on.

So after I've removed the LT85 and rubber boot and lever, will the ZF's lever fit the hole or will I just need to do some cutting and drilling? What about the t-case lever? Does that line up as well?

The ZF shifter is cable operated so you can within limits mount it where you like, or even make an extension for the box end. I imagine the transfer lever off the LT85 could be used instead of the Disco one if needed.

[jbell110]

I did a 4.6 & zf in my 130 it all bolts in, the disco cross member bolts in for the auto. biggest expense was the custom radiator using the disco side tanks
keeping the auto & oil cooler lines,it was done with an extra thick core.
the auto shifter fits easy. I used the disco centre consel & positioned the
shifter to suit. mine was a td5 so the wiring suked but we got there..

Jeff

[jakeslouw]

Well this idea has crashed and burned as the deal for the 3.9 fell through. I think the current owner wants to hold on to the original engine and box just in case.

I'm now also looking at a Lexus 4.0 non-VVT V8 (1UZ-FE) and auto box: I can get a matched set of a bench-tested engine & box for under $1,000, and the Spitronics ECU and TCU combo with a Lexus harness pack will cost me $500-odd.

I can't even buy a used hi-mileage Rover 3.9 V8 engine for that price.

So what do the tappet-heads out there all say?

- Lexus 4.0 @ 190kW and 353Nm, $1,500
or
- Isuzu 4JB1T @ 85kW and 235Nm, $2,250

Both will need an adapter of some kind and engine mounts.

WHAT SAY YOU?? :D

[Slunnie]

Shame you're in South Africa. I'm about to pull a 3.9 V8 and automatic transmission from a discovery when I get some time.

Edit: actually I think it's a 3.5 ESI.

[jakeslouw]

Shame you're in South Africa. I'm about to pull a 3.9 V8 and automatic transmission from a discovery when I get some time.

Edit: actually I think it's a 3.5 ESI.

Yeah well I'm tired of watching my hard earned cash disappear out of the old 3.5's exhaust pipes with little to show for it power wise.

My other vehicles are a 4.7HO Jeep GC and a 3.6 Pentastar Wrangler, so as long I get 190kW for my 5km/L I'm happy as.

It's a Lexus V8 or else I'm going to the smoky side and I'm putting in an Isuzu 2.8 or 3.1 TD.

[jakeslouw]

...........and just for the nay sayers and Luddites:

the current 3.5 is an 8.15 CR and has some issues:

- water pump shot
- cam follower noise
- loss of power (POWER? WHAT POWER?)

Just a mild do-over in South Africa with a hone, rings, 3.9 cam, cam chain & sprockets, gasket set, etc etc will cost me $2,000 and no guarantee that the monkey with the honing stones actually knows what he is doing.
And I'll still have 100kW of mind blowing custard-skin pulling power.........

[justinc]

1uzfe is a fantastic engine, even with some adapters etc it will still be worth it. these engines in stock bottom end can handle 300kw easily.

and they are fuel efficient.

and they are light.

and they are easy to work on and very reliable.

I had an LS400 and now an LS430 with the 3UZFE 4.3VVT engine. What a gem. 9.7l/100km on the highway and if you need it over 440Nm on tap....Still silky quiet and smooth at 198,000km


JC

[jakeslouw]

1uzfe is a fantastic engine, even with some adapters etc it will still be worth it. these engines in stock bottom end can handle 300kw easily.

and they are fuel efficient.

and they are light.

and they are easy to work on and very reliable.




JC

Exactly. They make 280Nm at 1000 rpm and over 350Nm at around 4,500 rpm. That's more torque at 1000rpm than my current engine get at PEAK.

And I can get another for just in case for $600.

I can run them in various ways: batch injection per bank, paired injection, or even full sequential if I want to.
I can do the ignition of a single coil and a crank sensor, or I can play with the cam sensors and run multi-coil.

I can even run closed loop or open loop on the Lambda sensors. I can run knock or not.

But the downside:

- alternator sits very low
- crank sensor sits low
- starter motor is in the V and doesn't like water

[justinc]

IIRC Starter on the 2UZ is in the V, 1UZ on the side? Anyway, jap electrics are pretty reliable. I went through 2 alternators on my 1UZ, both due to power steering pump dripping onto them. A common complaint with these models and who says toyotas don't leak oil!:D

I'd say these are minor concerns for the sort of plusses in fitting an engine of this quality.

JC

Edit: Oops, yes starter IS in the VEE! Good thing it never gave me any trouble in almost 300,000km, thats why I wasn't sure where it was :)

[jakeslouw]

IIRC Starter on the 2UZ is in the V, 1UZ on the side? Anyway, jap electrics are pretty reliable. I went through 2 alternators on my 1UZ, both due to power steering pump dripping onto them. A common complaint with these models and who says toyotas don't leak oil!:D

I'd say these are minor concerns for the sort of plusses in fitting an engine of this quality.

JC

Edit: Oops, yes starter IS in the VEE! Good thing it never gave me any trouble in almost 300,000km, thats why I wasn't sure where it was :)

Yes definitely in the V.

And I've read the same about the PS pump.......which a little ally drip plate should solve with almost no cost.

The 1UZ engine is very popular here due to the price and availability: anything and everything is getting them shoved under the bonnet, and the 3rd party ECU market is booming.

www.spitronics.co.za (http://www.spitronics.co.za)