Defender coils, advice please.

[landy]

Hi all. I'm looking for some advice from the defender mob. I have fitted at the moment a set of mil spec HD LR coils as fitted to the military 110's. They give me a good lift but are really soft but give great articulation. I've set the car up more towards touring rather than heavy off road use and I've had to fit 1" spacers under the rear spring saddles to keep the rear level. I have a set of drawers,fridge slide/80L fridge in the rear plus normal touring gear and carry a spare and 2x jerries on the roof rack.We also tow a camper trailer. On the front is a terra firmer tube bar and 10,000 lb winch.
I'm looking at replacing the coils with a set of 500kg rear and 150kg front OME's with 2" lift to cope with the weight at the rear.
Has anyone fitted this combo and what is the driving manner of the car like. The car is my daily driver and I expect it will make the ride a bit harsh. Is this a combo you can live with day to day?
Cheers

Nino

[Blknight.aus]

change your driving style if you want to keep the suppleness of the military suspension set (of which theres 3 varients 1 for general and a couple for the speccy rigs)

I reccomend the Suspension stuff gear, Ive fitted probably 20 sets of their stuff and not had a serious customer complaint... heres some of my complaints

1. the bush kits are generic, sometimes they fit perfectly other times its a touch questionable but typically you can re-use the spacers from your old shocks to sort it. Its not a problem for me I have spares on hand

2. sometimes they provide a poly bush (which I dont like) sometimes they provide rubber, Me I prefer the rubber, if my customer doesnt care then what they provide is fine, some customers like poly, some like rubber, I just make sure to ask if I can have the appropriate set sent as part of ordering ( I do mine over the phone)

3. one set turned up with no labels on the springs. not a big deal 10 minutes on the phone and 5 more with the verniers and a measuring tape had it sorted.

4. my delivery guy always packs em on the bottom cause they're usually the heaviest box he gets, when I'm first on the run he'll either ask me to help or to "just have a listen tell me if that sounds right"

about the best thing you can do is go get a front axle weight and a rear axle weight then tell the suspsenion place those numbers as part of what youre trying to setup.

[inside]

I have a set of 2 inch lifted springs that I took out of my 110 to replace with the standard military springs. The military springs are very subtle I agree but they will sag when you load them up as you have found. The ones I took out are much heavier duty than the military ones and were quite uncomfortable with no load but when loaded up were quite good. Like all things 4WD I guess they are a compromise. They are the blue colour so that makes them Dobinsons from memory.

As you're in Brisbane let me know if you want to borrow them for a while. At least you can get a feel for what heavy duty springs are like. For me they don't work but in your situation they may be fine.

[isuzutoo-eh]

Sorry to go off-tangent, does anyone have any specs for these military springs? They might be useful for Isuzu Counties...

[landy]

Cheers Inside, PM being sent.

Nino

[inside]

Sorry to go off-tangent, does anyone have any specs for these military springs? They might be useful for Isuzu Counties...
Here are the specs.

Front. Spring, Helical, Compression, Steel, 415mm LG, 16.5MM Bar Dia, 8.37 Coils LR Part AYG4176

Rear. Spring, Helical, Compression, Steel, 135mm ID, 19.3MM Wire Dia, 415MM Free LG, 8 Coils. LR Part AYG7167

There is no difference between left and right in the front as with some springs.

[Red90]

Are these the same springs fitted to civilian Isuzu engine 110s or is there a different part number?

[ThorneGator]

Nino,

I haven't used this exact setup, but my tourer/ daily driver vehicle is setup almost exactly as yours minus the trailer-towing (but with addition of rack and RTT (110kgs)), and I just recently replaced my springs, etc. After reading many posts on here, I called Les Richmond Automotive and talked to their "shop-guru" about Defender suspension/ springs. Just a Blknight.aus mentioned, the guys at Les Richmond also asked for a front and rear axle weight.....that would be best option and ensure a good chance at getting the setup right the first time.

Barring that, feel free to use what I put in mine to work from.
In the front, I went with Les Richmond purple-yellows (220lbs/15.5"). It was explained to me that the 180kgs would give a softer ride and greater articulation, but might bottom out when I wanted the extra help along downhill sections when the front axle would be handling extra load. I am more than happy with ride and stance.
In back, I went with Orange-Green (320lbs/16.8"). I already had a set of helper airbags in back, and kept those for the transition from daily driver to fully loaded.

Objective measurements (after installation):
Front: 900(PS) & 905mm(DS)(ground to bottom of wheel arch)/ 97mm(axle to bumpstop)
Rear: 925mm (ground to bottom of wheel arch)/ 130mm (axle to bumpstop)- airbags empty(3psi), full rear drawer, spare tyre, fridge, 30kgs of misc gear.
It was explained to me that an ideal bumpstop measurements would be 100mmF/130mmR regarding shock travel up & down.

The ride (subjective) is smooth, almost like a floating feeling on city streets; I personally like the ride a little more firm. On easy-moderate tracks (tracks & river crossings) it has a similar feel but with a subtle, backbone that doesn't leave me worrying about bumpstops. I have not used these springs on more difficult tracks yet, so no comment.

[Vern]

Lra springs are in lb/in not kg. [emoji6]

[DiscoMick]

You might find it helpful to search the Britpart online catalogue and see the ratings of their various spring options. HD Defender 110 front springs are the same as standard 130 front springs BTW.
Everyone has their own preferences.
I've researched this quite a lot and at this stage have left the standard 110 springs in place, but have rear Airbag Man airbags. I run them at 10 normally but at 15 when towing our camper trailer.
My line of thinking is that Defender are not meant to be sports cars, they are meant to give a comfortable ride over bad roads. I don't want a firm suspension which will jar on bad roads.
I find the airbags limit body roll without making the vehicle ride harshly.
But it's each to his own. Hope that is helpful.

[Bearman]

Are these the same springs fitted to civilian Isuzu engine 110s or is there a different part number?

Military ones are different - 2" lift over civilian ones.

[Red90]

So what is civilian? Seeing as they have 1.5” taller bunpstops and a heavy engine they can’t be regular 110 springs. There would be no front bump stop clearance.

[ThorneGator]

Lra springs are in lb/in not kg. [emoji6]

Thank you, Damien....learn something new everyday!

[Red90]

Military ones are different - 2" lift over civilian ones.

So what is civilian? Seeing as they have 1.5” taller bumpstops and a heavy engine they can’t be regular 110 springs. There would be no front bump stop clearance.

[Red90]

Front. Spring, Helical, Compression, Steel, 415mm LG, 16.5MM Bar Dia, 8.37 Coils LR Part AYG4176

I'm trying to figure out what springs I have on my truck and they might be these. They have 16.5mm bar and around 8.37 coils. Mine do not have ground ends. Do these have ground ends?

[simmo]

the springs fitted to my defender in 2000 when i bought it were the heavy duty ones, "gut busters". I changed them soon after getting the car to OME front and rear 50 mm lift medium duty springs. they were fine, and offered quite a good ride, even when light. while the car sank a little at the back with heavy loads it was still good offroad. I's say with some air bag helpers they would fine for most conditions. I'm still using the OME at the front, but have changed to full airbags on the rear. I still have the rear OME in the shed.
cheers simmo

[Red90]

This is what I found on my truck. http://red90.ca/rovers/springs/Red90s%20Isuzu%20Front/Spring%20Testing.htm

The specs seem to match the Perentie springs. I changed to OEM HD springs (NRC9488), which lowered the truck around 15 mm.

[DiscoMick]

I'm actually curious about whether airbags which work so well in the rear coils could also be fitted to the front.
I've quizzed all sorts of gurus about this over the years and never had a satisfactory answer about why this isn't done.
I would quite like to be able to just pump in 10-15 psi in the front airbags to compensate for the extra weight of the bullbar and winch, as I do at the rear, while retaining the soft standard springs. Sounds like a win-win to me.

[TheGrumpy]

Shock is inside coil isn’t it?

[weeds]

I'm actually curious about whether airbags which work so well in the rear coils could also be fitted to the front.
I've quizzed all sorts of gurus about this over the years and never had a satisfactory answer about why this isn't done.
I would quite like to be able to just pump in 10-15 psi in the front airbags to compensate for the extra weight of the bullbar and winch, as I do at the rear, while retaining the soft standard springs. Sounds like a win-win to me.

You’d have to relocate the shock......

I’ve found the 130 ‘110HD’ front springs to be spot on with bar and winch.

[DiscoMick]

You’d have to relocate the shock......

I’ve found the 130 ‘110HD’ front springs to be spot on with bar and winch.Can you compare how they perform compared with the standard springs please?

[weeds]

Can you compare how they perform compared with the standard springs please?

I’ve never had standard springs.....

I had 2” King’s on this dirty old tdi and they were too stiff

The 130 front in the TD5 hard top are a softer ride and have raised the bumpstops to a nice height.

[Red90]

I'm actually curious about whether airbags which work so well in the rear coils could also be fitted to the front.
I've quizzed all sorts of gurus about this over the years and never had a satisfactory answer about why this isn't done.
I would quite like to be able to just pump in 10-15 psi in the front airbags to compensate for the extra weight of the bullbar and winch, as I do at the rear, while retaining the soft standard springs. Sounds like a win-win to me.

What do you think you are gaining? This does not "retain the soft standard springs". The air bags add spring rate. As much or more than you would get from heavier springs. If you want a lift with the same spring rate, get spacers for the spring supports.

The only reason for airbags is so that you can adjust as the load changes. The front does not change.

[DiscoMick]

Airbags might bring it back to standard height. But I won't bother.