Popped a Gen III today

[Keithy P38]

Just thought I'd share my experience today. Driving along a gravel road at 60 klicks and popped my right rear Gen III today. There were no signs of piercing but interestingly enough there is a rattle inside the now unusable bag.

I managed to change the bag in 20mins with only a flat head screwdriver and bottle jack. Lucky I kept my 3 good bags as spares hey!

Thoughts?

Keithy

[Keithy P38]

Just a side-note, I was travelling in high (so that limits my speed to under 60) however it was still your average run of the mill gravel road. I had been low range 4wding about 30 mins prior but nothing extreme.

The rest of my suspension is standard (ie no long travel shocks or anything like that).

[PaulP38a]

Well done removing that top R-clip with a screwdriver mate.

Had the same happen to me a couple of years ago, except the car was standing still and parked on my driveway so I had the convenience of the tools in my garage ;)

I have a theory why 80% of popped air-springs I see or hear of are the right rear.

The spring mount on the rear diff is angled back slightly more on the right than the left, meaning that the RR air spring angles back more when the car is raised. On the original Hard Range lift kit this was very noticeable, so we changed the design of the rear spacers to give the base of the spring a forward angle. As the car lifts and the rear diff rotates back, the base of the springs also rotate back. Any weakness in the seal of the air spring will get worse... you know the rest ;)

Cheers, Paul.

[glenhendry]

Good work carrying the spare and changing in the field Keithy. Reminds me to put a spare bag in my 4wding kit. Leaving them at home is no real use...

I am working in Moranbah all of December, and doing the Ironman in Cairns in Jun, I wonder if I cant get to Townsville sometime and catch you up for a beer.

[Keithy P38]

You have a good point Paul, i was checking out the angles once I replaced the bag.

Sounds good to me glen, let me know and I'll make sure the fridge is full.

[UK_P38]

Have you got a picture of the failed bag there Keith? You had one of you originals go bang too didn't you? Seems strange the way it failed this time and it was pretty new, your exhaust isn't running close to it or something? Should send it to Arnott and ask for some diagnosis on it... Was it the same failure as your other one? I've heard 'people' say a bag failure on a good bag shouldn't be any more common than a snapped curly...

[mtb_gary]

How old we're the bags? You did well to be able to fix in 20 mins out in the field! Where on earth do you find the space to carry 3 spare bags? With the rest of the gear and usually 4 people in the car 3 air bags would be tough to fit in!
Gary

[Keithy P38]

The bag that went pop was 8 months old, the failure was different to last time (old bag was tired and a sharp stick finished the job). I'm not sure what the guts of the Arnotts bags look like but I can gather from the rattle inside that a clamp or something has let go on me!

I store my spare bags in the spare under the rear floor, wrapped in an old towel for rattle prevention. Seeing as my 255/70 only just fits in there (when fully deflated) I don't have the styrofoam jack holder in there, I simply wrap it up in an old towel and stash it in there too.

I rekon it pays to remove the pins that secure your bags annually, clean them off and put them back in. I removed top and bottom ones with my fingers, made life much easier.

I can't upload pics by iPhone but I can email them to someone to post up?

[PaulP38a]

email them to me mate and I'll put them up on the gallery at paulp38a.com and link to them here.

if you don't already know my personal address, it is my <first_name>@<last_name>.net or use the Hard Range one...

[Hoges]

There's a "personalised LR Special tool" for removing the top R clip:eek: It's called a modified wire coat hanger:angel::wasntme: Works very well!

[Keithy P38]

Thanks Paul, email sent.

Coat hanger wire is a thing of many uses! Going into the kit as we speak!

I rang around the truck shops yesterday to see if any of them would be keen to repair it. They called it a "throw away item" and laughed... Arnotts have very kindly offered to send a replacement. That's what I call great after-sales service!

[PaulP38a]

Arnotts are great in that respect, lifetime warranty on their air springs if you were the original purchaser.

Pic of Keithy's bag below.
http://paulp38a.com/gallery/d/6246-1/KeithG3.JPG

[DT-P38]

There's a "personalised LR Special tool" for removing the top R clip:eek: It's called a modified wire coat hanger:angel::wasntme: Works very well!

I found out today that a small tent peg also makes a pretty good hook for the top clip.

Had a Gen 2 let go on me (right rear) earlier today. The rubber bag partially slipped out of the crimp band at the top end of the bag. I'm a bit ****ed off cause its done bugger all km's, still looks brand new and (similar story to Keithy) it happened on flat gravel track after a bit of low range work prior. We had it out in about 15-20 mins but didn't have spare so tried some super gel tape (to no avail). Ended up driving half way home with a block of red gum wired on top of the diff/axle under the bump stop.

Got sick of the bang, thump, bounce, float, ride effect about half way so called the RACV in to finish the journey (see photo)!

A few Q's arise... Is it possible to run a std bag on one corner in emergency? Don't have spare arnott's but could chuck in a couple of good std ones in wheel well. Also one of the dudes I was driving with reckons the bag is repairable? What sort of place could do this?

[Keithy P38]

Yeah Dave, I am getting around on a standard rr and three gen III's at the moment. No issues at all. I kept my 3 standard bags that were good so I can use them as spares in an emergency. They live in the spare wheel well permanently.

I enquired at truck shops about repairing my dud gen III but got laughed at. They simply throw the old ones away, gone are the days of repairing things!

[Keithy P38]

Double post

[FANTOM P38]

Hey Dave thats not a good look! If you find anyone that can repair let us know as I have a spare GenIII at home with exact same problem. But Arnotts will send you a replacement under theior lifetime warranty! Must come down to amount of pressure they use when crimping I would think. If ther was someone who could crimp bags on would be easily fixed.
Spares in whell well sound like good safety net though.

[Hoges]

Carrying a spare is always a good idea... however, don't forget that OEM bags vs Gen III have different spring rates... careful!

Mind you, any old air spring beats a block of wood!

[Keithy P38]

True that... I didn't notice any real difference in ride with one standard bag in place. New gen III will be going straight in when it lands though.

[justinc]

There's a "personalised LR Special tool" for removing the top R clip:eek: It's called a modified wire coat hanger:angel::wasntme: Works very well!

Yes, I use a 'modified' steel retaining wire from a *m.....e* gas shock, they are removed when taken out of the packaging.. Very strong and has multiple uses.

JC

[DT-P38]

Swapped out Gen 2 that let go for an old dunlop bag today. All running smoothly again.

Thought a few photo's of temporary red gum suspension might be in order.

[FANTOM P38]

Hey Dave,
Couldnt help but notice that locknuts on sensor extentions are not doing very much, need to get in there with spanner and lock up. Not that extentions will loosen any more as they are opposite threads each end but better safe than sorry!

:wasntme:

[DT-P38]

Yes I noticed them too. Thanks mate.

[Keithy P38]

Nice placement of the sticker mate! You can clearly see how the clamp has allowed the bellow to slip down, I - like you, wonder how you would be able to fix the bag and somehow re-clamp it.

I also wonder how mine let go from the bottom rather than the top like yours...

[DT-P38]

Nice placement of the sticker mate! You can clearly see how the clamp has allowed the bellow to slip down, I - like you, wonder how you would be able to fix the bag and somehow re-clamp it.

I also wonder how mine let go from the bottom rather than the top like yours...

Yeah. HardRange helped me out of the breakdown!

There was a fella in the auto industry (that was with us at the time) who was adamant it was repairable. I am going to follow him up at some stage for guidance on who could do it.

[jbell110]

are they spacers for a bit of lift DT-P38 with hardrange on them ??

Jeff

[mtb_gary]

Yes, the spacers are the HRA lift kit. I have the same in my P38
Gary