clutch master or slave, how do i pin point

[weeds]

i recently lost a bit of clutch pedal, checked the master and it was down 1/3 of fluid.......i didn't have any fluid at the time but continued on as it didn't really affect the operation of the cluch apart from the pedal not always returning all the way

i lost all my clutch pedal today....

level in the master has not changed

no visable leaks down the inside of the fire wall

can i safely assume its the slave?

my girlfriend is picking up both parts this arvo, i thought i would start with replacing the slave

thoughts?

[460cixy]

If its not loseing fluid I would say the return spring in the master or the centre valve in the master are rooted.

[weeds]

If its not loseing fluid I would say the return spring in the master or the centre valve in the master are rooted.

for the last week or so i have needed to lift the pedal up with my toes......

centre valve? i will have find what this it

[DeanoH]

The clutch slave cylinder is the likely culprit but it can be an absolute bastard to work on.

Have a good look underneath around the slave cylinder for leaking fluid. You really don't want to remove the slave cylinder if you don't really have to.

The rod that goes from the slave cylinder piston is 'held' in the clutch fork with this stupid little @!#%%^&**' ing plastic clip thing that is an absolute bastard to re-install in situ, can be done, there was a post on here a few months ago where someone made a 'special tool' to do it.

If you can grab the actuating rod with a pair of needle nose pliers, holding it tensioned towards the clutch fork whilst carefully removing the slave cylinder, the above mentined @!#%%^&**' ing plastic clip thing may not be dislodged :):):). Thus saving a heap of tears, frustration and bad language. :D

Also be careful when undoing the two bolts holding the slave cylinder in, the lower one of mine was rounded off and took a bit of trouble to remove. If it was the top one it would have been a mallet and oxy job.

Good luck.

Deano :)

[weeds]

thanks guys.....the parts are waiting for me at home

driving home without a clutch is going to be interesting......

now i am completly confused on which end to start

[DeanoH]

Double post

[DeanoH]

thanks guys.....the parts are waiting for me at home

driving home without a clutch is going to be interesting......

now i am completly confused on which end to start

Have a look for leaking fluid at master cyl and slave cyl, try putting some fluid in, undo the bleed screw on the slave cyl and see if you can pump some fluid through.

A common fault (so I'm told) is that the actuating rod (or pivot) punches through the clutch fork which would give you similiar symptoms I would have thought.

Deano :)

[460cixy]

for the last week or so i have needed to lift the pedal up with my toes......

centre valve? i will have find what this it


Centre valve is in the master. And as some one else posted about the clutch fork it may not be a hydraulic problem at all

[rainman]

Weeds, if you happen to need a fork or any clutch bits in a hurry I have the whole lot (HD fork and Valeo clutch) sitting waiting to go in and I'm probably not going to get to the job this side of Christmas so you're welcome to use them.

James.

[redrovertdi]

replace the slave and the master together, because they have worn together otherwise the new part will put pressure on the worn part and you will have to keep playing...

[weeds]

Lets hope it is not the push rod through the fork as this happened at the 60th land river gig.....

[weeds]

Weeds, if you happen to need a fork or any clutch bits in a hurry I have the whole lot (HD fork and Valeo clutch) sitting waiting to go in and I'm probably not going to get to the job this side of Christmas so you're welcome to use them.

James.

Cheers

[weeds]

replace the slave and the master together, because they have worn together otherwise the new part will put pressure on the worn part and you will have to keep playing...

Yep I have both so will replace them

[rainman]

Lets hope it is not the push rod through the fork as this happened at the 60th land river gig.....

Did you put the HD/strengthened fork in? I used to go through a fork every 60 000km or so, until I made my own HD one.

I've never had any trouble pulling off the slave cylinder. The rod usually stays on the fork and slides out of the rubber on the cylinder.

James.

[Blknight.aus]

its the fill port on the MC recirculating.

to start with it will only do it occasionally while hot and then get worse

[weeds]

Did you put the HD/strengthened fork in? I used to go through a fork every 60 000km or so, until I made my own HD one.

I've never had any trouble pulling off the slave cylinder. The rod usually stays on the fork and slides out of the rubber on the cylinder.

James.

HD forks were not available when it happened last time.

The slave is off but the rod is sitting inside the housing. Absolutely no chance of line up the rod and slave.

I am guessing the rod should be sticking out a little bit so that I can line things up, I pulled the slave off three time at Cooma and recall I could easily line things up

Pretty sure the rod has punched through the fork.....

[rainman]

It does sound like it to me.

So, pulling sicky tomorrow?

James.

[Blknight.aus]

no need if youve puched the rod through the fork simply pull it out then machine up a t piece rod by machining a section of rod the same diameter as the ball on the end of the rod to have a ball and pin configuration on one end (lets you locate it easily) and the original diameter rod on the SC side at the same length

Cross drill it and install cross pin then weld a pair of washers on each end of so they only just clear the fork, center the lot then weld it on the long end of the pushrod.

load the ball with a large blob of bluetack and install with the cross pin perpendicular to the fork arm (it may help to support it with a rest made from tie wire inserted through the bell housing drain.) then install the SC as per normal.

[weeds]

It does sound like it to me.

So, pulling sicky tomorrow?

James.

Nah......to big a job for me

MR are pretty much booked out til the new year.....they said it would be at least three weeks before they could look at it

So it's off to British off road tomorrow to hopefully have it back by next Friday.

[weeds]

no need if youve puched the rod through the fork simply pull it out then machine up a t piece rod by machining a section of rod the same diameter as the ball on the end of the rod to have a ball and pin configuration on one end (lets you locate it easily) and the original diameter rod on the SC side at the same length

Cross drill it and install cross pin then weld a pair of washers on each end of so they only just clear the fork, center the lot then weld it on the long end of the pushrod.

load the ball with a large blob of bluetack and install with the cross pin perpendicular to the fork arm (it may help to support it with a rest made from tie wire inserted through the bell housing drain.) then install the SC as per normal.

Thanks dave but I'm time poor soooooo it off the the shop. I'm sure your fix would work but I would be more comfortable touring with all new components fitted

[Blknight.aus]

That was my time poor solution, takes about an hour to machine it up in a good machine shop if you dont mind it rough.

an even rougher solution is to use a piece of inch rod and just machine up one end as a ball with a pin and the other to fit the SC.

Its a better fix than the old "drive without a clutch" routine but you're right its a "get you home" not "go on tour" fix.

if all goes well this weekend for me and you cant get it in anywhere else line up a 3 man crew for next friday arvo, I'll load the gear turn up and we'll do a 6 hour clutch change.

[weeds]

That was my time poor solution, takes about an hour to machine it up in a good machine shop if you dont mind it rough.

an even rougher solution is to use a piece of inch rod and just machine up one end as a ball with a pin and the other to fit the SC.

Its a better fix than the old "drive without a clutch" routine but you're right its a "get you home" not "go on tour" fix.

if all goes well this weekend for me and you cant get it in anywhere else line up a 3 man crew for next friday arvo, I'll load the gear turn up and we'll do a 6 hour clutch change.

Thanks dave but she is booked in at British Offroad.

[Blknight.aus]

my bad, I thought you were going to see them tomorrow to see if you could get in...

where are you headed on the trip?

[DeanoH]

Shame you don't have the time 'Weeds', Daves mod is better than the original setup.

Deano :)

[goingbush]

Do the punch through scenarios only happen on the pressed metal release forks ? When I was having a clutch issue on my Td5 I thought this was the problem but inspecting through the slave hole with a snakescope I found a nice cast lump of a throw out fork like this one
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/03/535.jpg
would it not be wise to retrofit one of these into a Tdi or do they still suffer punch thru issues?

[Blknight.aus]

nope the cast fork is the go, theres plenty of upgrades to do to the pressed one.

the cast fork occasionally falls over by busting the thrust bearing, stuffing the push rod ro cracking the plastic cum in the center and falling off of the ball.

[Chenz]

May I also suggest you change the flexible hose that runs from the master cylinder line to the slave cylinder. I had trouble with this bulging and losing pressure. It is a cheap part and while you are down there it pays to do it.

[Jode]

May I also suggest you change the flexible hose that runs from the master cylinder line to the slave cylinder. I had trouble with this bulging and losing pressure. It is a cheap part and while you are down there it pays to do it.
The workshop manual recommends changing all rubber brake components at intervals of no more than 4 years IIRC; presumably clutch rubbers wear similarly.