200Tdi hubs and spindles on a 300Tdi

[rick130]

I'm assuming it's a straight bolt up and hopefully the 300Tdi vented discs and calipers all align properly.

Missing anything ?

[lux201]

I put a 10-spline center (hd axles, locker etc..) onto my 300tdi diff.

so 300tdi Diff, 10 spline center, 10 spline stub axles etc, everything bolted up just fine. (cant remember if I had to change the calipers or not, I know I definitely did when converting the rear to 10-spline but that was the entire diff swap)

next project will be to keep 10-spline center but convert CV's to 10-spline -> 24-spline hybrids and therefore go back to my old 24-spline stub axle assembly. ...no particular reason, I just prefer this configuration.

[uninformed]

Lux, when you say "stub axle" do you mean the axle shaft or the spindle?

We are looking to bolt the "stub axles" (spindles) from 200Tdi front end to the 300Tdi swivel housing. This will also require the 200Tdi hubs to suit the wider spaced wheel bearings of the stub axle (the benefit we are after)

Will the 300Tdi rotor (disc) bolt straight onto the 200Tdi hub, that is will it have the same PCD and bolt dia, will it all have the correct offset to line up with the 300Tdi caliper?

The cv would have to be changed to an AEU2522 or RRC/hybrid to gain the correct stub shaft length. An appropriate driveflange to suit. Also the needle roller will have to be replaced with the bronze bush.....Does this all sound correct?

Where is a good place to buy stub axles and hubs? New or second hand...I would prefer GENUINE. First price today for new in LR box genuine stub axles is $165 each plus freight from NSW. $88 for second hand hubs...

[lux201]

howdy, I have parts for both 10-spline and 24-spline out in the shed (rotors, stub axles etc..), tomorrow I will have a look, take measurements etc and let you know.

Cheers.

[uninformed]

ok from what I have just found out, there were some mid year 200Tdi defenders that had 10spline diffs but ran the 32 splince cv (RTC6862), before they went to 24 spline. So you can not automaticlly say a 10spline front in is the big cv (AEU2522), this would also mean that the 10/32spline combo will have the later/shorter stub axles and narrow bearing hubs etc, same as a 300tdi.

If putting a earlier stub axle and corrosponding wide bearing hub onto a later narrow bearing hub swivel housing, you will also need a longer CV, which will mean atleast going to an AEU2522, which will also mean changing the inner axle shaft to suit....

Drive flanges from early to late are different as well, not only in length but in bolt PCD and spigot dia (spigot locates into hub)

from what I can find, part numbers for the early stub axles and hubs etc are as follows:

Upto Vin: 930434 - 110 930545 - 130

FRC4319 stub axle bush
FRC4320 Stub axle
FRC2310 locking plate
SX110251M bolt (stub axle to housing)
WL110001L spring washer
FRC6139 Hub assembly
looks like this and the the later type stub axle/hub use the same wheel bearing LR# RTC3429

Bolt part# are the same from early to late, so this suggests that they are atleast the same length, dia and thread type....just hope the early and late stub axle/swivel housing have the same PCD from early to late

Hub oil seal (the one that goes on the stub axle/inside hub) looks to go from FRC8221 early and change to FTC2783 (still on the early stubs/hubs) and stays FTC2783 on the narrow bearing hubs.

Does anyone know if the RTC3511 seal is the replacent for these and work on the early stub axle/wide bearing hub?

[justinc]

ok from what I have just found out, there were some mid defenders that had 10spline diffs but ran the 32 splince cv (RTC6862), before they went to 24 spline. So you can not automaticlly say a 10spline front in is the big cv (AEU2522), this would also mean that the 10/32spline combo will have the later/shorter stub axles and narrow bearing hubs etc, same as a 300tdi.

If putting a earlier stub axle and corrosponding wide bearing hub onto a later narrow bearing hub swivel housing, you will also need a longer CV, which will mean atleast going to an AEU2522, which will also mean changing the inner axle shaft to suit....

Drive flanges from early to late are different as well, not only in length but in bolt PCD and spigot dia (spigot locates into hub)

from what I can find, part numbers for the early stub axles and hubs etc are as follows:

Upto Vin: 930434 - 110 930545 - 130

FRC4319 stub axle bush
FRC4320 Stub axle
FRC2310 locking plate
SX110251M bolt (stub axle to housing)
WL110001L spring washer

looks like this and the the later type stub axle/hub use the same wheel bearing LR# RTC3429

Hub oil seal (the one that goes on the stub axle/inside hub) looks to go from FRC8221 early and change to FTC2783 (still on the early stubs/hubs) and stays FTC2783 on the narrow bearing hubs.

Does anyone know if the RTC3511 seal is the replacent for these and work on the early stub axle/wide bearing hub?

yes, we use rtc3511 on everything, (not series) from 1972 classic rrc up to current puma.

jc

[rick130]

Hmm, looks like a useful increase in bearing separation too.

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/
(pinched from the swivels/wheel bearing thread)

[justinc]

Hmm, looks like a useful increase in bearing separation too.

http://img22.imageshack.us/img22/1654/6300c978141e456a86ccbda.jpg
(pinched from the swivels/wheel bearing thread)

Yes Rick, I wondered why in the heck they changed this design. Even the bronze bushing gave no real issues but a needle roller with muddy grease etc will....:( what an 'upgrade':confused:

JC

[rick130]

My engineer mate Mark that was ex-JRA and later an LRA consultant said exactly the same thing.

[justinc]

I fitted the Defender CV's and swivels etc etc to my Rangie and now the County, so I could have easy access to spare CV's etc, after all ,Disco and RRC with ABS use the same too, but there are precious few AEU2522 CV's out there in wreckers yards....

To date I have never broken one, and that includes using 255/85's with the Isuzu in a lot of hard low range scenarios over the years, too.

On a side note Rick, I just changed my trans oils over to 75w85 Duragear to try it out. I'll let you know if I experience any changes.


JC

[uninformed]

JC, you could run RRC cv R06665 I think, and get a custom stub so its the same length as AEU2522. This is what I run, plus a 4140 pressed on antiburst ring.

Or just get am AEU2522

[rick130]

Bearmach CV's did really well in Ashcrofts testing against their own and other aftermarket CV's and I think the pricing is reasonable.
Hopefully their consistency is good too and it should be, IIRC they're made in Taiwan.

Serg has RRC CV's with Maxi/Hy Tough stubs and drive flanges and I reckon I'll go the same route.
Mal set it up for him, and I remember Matt/Rovercare mentioning in a thread that he'd blown a few AEU2511 CV's but only bent a few 10 spline stubs.
I also like the idea that if I carry a few spare it's a lot quicker to swap a stub axle when in the bush :D (not that I do anything extreme, the 130 is my daily work truck :angel:)

I'm more likely to pop a CV now too with the new 'too cool to be true' O offset rims.
I reckon I've shortened the turning circle by 5' at least, which was the aim.

I'm no longer trying to berth the Queen Mary, merely a Naval Destroyer ;)

[uninformed]

Double post doh

[justinc]

JC, you could run RRC cv R06665 I think, and get a custom stub so its the same length as AEU2522. This is what I run, plus a 4140 pressed on antiburst ring.

Or just get am AEU2522


i ran these too, with 32's and a hot 4.7 stroker. never hurt them in stock form either. in fact i sold them on many years ago when i upgraded everything. afaik they are still going well in a 200 tdi early d1.

i'm not all that worried anymore serge, my serious offroading days are pretty much over, actually:(

jc

[uninformed]

JC, do you know if the AEU2522 and the R06665 cvs are physically the same where they mount into the stub axle? That is, if we fit these early, longer 200tdi Stub axles, will the R06665 mount in the bronze bush and work correctly give the engagement to inner axle shaft???

[uninformed]

2 long stubs on there way.........

[uninformed]

can anyone tell me the physical differences between the 2 following stub axles.

FRC3132
FRC8540

from what I have found, these are both of Sals rear ends, early defender 90/110. Both appear to be long stubs (pre 300Tdi narrow bearing). I can see that the 3132 has the slot for washer tab and the 8540 has the large flat as per latter types for lock washer.....

but are they the same length etc?

Im guessing the one with large flat would be better if all else is equal..

[rick130]

My Bearmach catalogue only shows the FRC8540 stub axle ?

This could be interesting Drum axle to disc brake con.... - Defender Forum - LR4x4 - The Land Rover Forum (http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php'showtopic=28861)


110 front hubs & stub axles can be used to convert from rear drum to rear disc brakes.

??

[uninformed]

Rick, here are both:

http://www.shop4autoparts.net/home/search-results.html



I had a FRC3132 on my bench and it is definitely a long stub with the small keyway. It is very similar (on the bearing side) to my new early 200Tdi front stubs FRC4320, possibly exactly the same measurements (need to confirm) So I see no reason to run a front stub on the rear. If you read that thread they say the front stub wont fit the rear housing..and mention grinding....not on my watch!

That brings us to hubs, I also had some other LR/RRc/Disco hubs/stubs (not sure what model/year they are off) and noted there is a noticable difference, front to rear, of the distance from WMS to disc rotor mounting surface...fronts being less (that is closer to the WMS) so throwing this into the mix means finding a disc rotor with the correct offset, then the correct caliper etc...

and since that thread was very non-conclusive, Im not putting much stock in it :p

But this one is better:

Drum brake 110 salisbury disc brake conversion - Land Rover Technical Archive - LR4x4 - The Land Rover Forum (http://forums.lr4x4.com/index.php'showtopic=11685)

seems he used his original drum long stubs FRC8540 (can tell by the large flat), early 90/110 front hubs and 110 rear discs..only thing he had to custom was a spacer for the caliper bracket...the part numbers he lists for rear calipers match LR for 110 rear disc calipers...mind you this all on a drum brake housing.

When I get all my bits and bobs from the Uk AND I get around to doing my wheel bearings, I will have a little play and try and take some measurements along the way to see whats what.

but, at this stage it seems quite doable and not to much non-bolt on LR parts.