Holden Red Conversion

[Series3 GT]

Hi all, I'm looking at doing the conversion to the Holden red motor, I was going to do a Ford 250 but I went and priced a motor and it was $500 just for a motor with high kays. I can get a 186 for $100 and a conversion plate for $60 and I'll try and get the mount thrown in the deal, the 2.25 is getting a bit slow and would cost me more to rebuild then it would to convert. The vehicle is an unregistered farm ute that gets used for farm work, bush basher 4WD and hunting vehicle. I'm wondering is it worth it or not. A lot of people will say it's not worth it but I want a bit more power. I'd prefer a 202 but I can't find one very easily. My plans for the motor would be new plugs, new leads, points, dizzy cap, twin barrel carbie and possibly extractors in the future. I'd like to use the Land Rover clutch and flywheel cause the flywheel is that bit heavier for a bit more torque down low. Any advice would be great.

[Homestar]

It's not that hard to do, but there are a few things to take into consideration. If you are going to get rego on it at any stage, then do your homework first. If it is only ever going to be used on the farm, then no probs and get cracking:D.

With a 4 cylinder, you will need to cut a section out of the front crossmember to get it to fit, and weld in a bit of angle iron to replace the cut out bit. If you need to get it registered, then you will also need to strengthen the crossmember with some box section on the front.

The engine driven fan may give you clearance issues, but I just stuck a thermo fan in front of the rad to fix that.

Everything else is fairly straight forward. Don't forget to check the alignment of the engine to the gearbox properly or you could chew your box out in no time. There is a sticky thread on this at the top of this forum - http://www.aulro.com/afvb/holden-powered-series-land-rovers/133415-before-fitting-holden-engine-check-aligment-first.html

Cheers - Gav.

[Series3 GT]

Well I think I'll set about buying the things I'll need and get going, I've only got a very small budget to work with but I should get away for under $180 or maybe $200. But thats very cheap in conversion terms. If I can use the Landy flywheel it'll be even better I'd say just that bit more torque lower in the rev range. Is this conversion pretty easy to take on within a week or does it require a bit more.

[Homestar]

I did mine during a ground up resto of a IIa many years ago, so it was more than a week...:D

You should be able to bung it in without issues in that time. Just remember that everything will need modding - wiring, hoses, throttle, etc and these can take time, but there is nothing hard about it all.

Keep us posted and post some pics along the way to help others out.:)

Cheers - Gav.

[Series3 GT]

When I do eventually do it, there will be many pics and updates. It's too much to take on right now cause of the 100" but when I've got most of that sorted it's on the to do list.

[Series3 GT]

I've found a way of saving a bit of money, I've got a line up on a 202 that I can have for free, but she needs some work. No.1 cylinder had a lot of oil fouling on the spark plug so theres work to be done to it. The bloke who owns it said he wants to do a clean up and thats in the way. It was running when it was pulled out of the car but a bit rough. He said if I want it he might source a rebuild kit for me so thats even better.

[Series3 GT]

I'm still considering the Holden Red conversion but the 202 will probably cost too much to repair, I'm wondering which would suit best a 186 or 202. As I've said the vehicle is an unregistered bush basher and I use it for general farm work, playing around off road and hunting (chasing foxes so a bit of grunt is required) so which engine would suit and does anyone in WA (Albany Area) have the conversion kit they're willing to part with?

[Homestar]

If you end up with a choice between a 186 and a 202, go for the 186 - it is better suited to the series vehicle, and IMO was a better and smoother engine than the 202.

[Debacle]

I've had both and much preferred the 186. 186 was in a series 2 and 202 was in a series 3. Found that the 186 was better in low range off road, but the 202 was a bit better getting up to speed on the highway(had it up to 130 once, quite scary, never did it again).

Also had a 186 in a HQ many years ago and found it to be a good, free revving motor, but they don't like really high constant revs.

[Series3 GT]

Thanks for the opinions, the 186 should be a bit better on fuel and should rev better than the 202 cause of the shorter stroke but that's in theory. The trade off is the 202 has more grunt and torque which would be nice to have for carrying loads and catching up to speedy foxes. So a 186 with extractors and maybe a upgrade carbie and cam could out perform a 202 easy?

[clubagreenie]

The 186 is hands down the better choice. When you cut out the front crossmember just slice down the sides and About half way forward and down to the level of the base of the radiator. Take the piece you cut out and flip over and weld back in.

The sides of the support panel needs to be cut down, cut off the rearmost edge and keep. Slice off the same amount you move it forward and reweld the rear piece on.

[klonk]

Have you found an adapter yet, might be able to help you with a conversion plate and bits, unfortunatly it was a 6 cyl landy so the gearbox has different bolt pattern to a 4 cyl but you can swap the bell housings,it has a tired 161 holden fitted, ran alright but a little smokey and abit of a rough setup.
Its not mine but will make a phone call and send a PM.

Cheers Steve

[Series3 GT]

Thanks for the offer on the adapter, I haven't found one yet but I have got another option of the wreckers apparently they have a couple, It would be a challenge finding (unless it's still got the bell housing the one you've got) the 6 cyl bell housing and then fitting it, If it was a 4 cyl I'd only need to fit the adapter plate to the motor.

[Homestar]

Quick question for you Series3 GT - do you have an original 6 cylinder motor from the series 3 or is it a 4?

Just having a thought about removing my Holden 173 and putting the original 6 back in. If you had one, I could do you a swap for a good running holden red and conversion kit...

Just a thought...:)

[Bigbjorn]

The principal reason LR people have trouble with their Holden conversions is that they are usually doing it on the cheap. Appalled by the cost of reconditioning their Rover, they get a used Holden and put it in with the minimum of prior attention. They are replacing a worn out engine with a well used engine. Do it properly. A full rebuild, a more suitable cam grind, high volume oil pump, the correct sump and baffles for the job. Attend to the carburettor with a float bowl packer, pressure regulator, return line. You are taking an engine designed for low to medium speed family car use into an application it was not meant for. Things need to be changed to suit it for the application.

[klonk]

Yes I have a bellhousing to suit it but someone has fitted a landrover starter to it and knocked a hole in the edge of it to allow for the longer starter shaft, like I said it is a rough set up, if you don't have any luck elsewhere it will be here.

Cheers Steve

[Series3 GT]

Bacicat- It's a 4cyl sorry, thanks for the offer though.

Brian Hjelm- I'm planning on doing a light rebuild just doing the rings and maybe a new cam and play with the sump and carby. It is only a farm ute with a tired 2.25 petrol and I'm just after a cheap reliable motor with a bit more power.

Klonk- Thanks again for the offer and if I don't find a adapter plate close by I'll let you know.

[aussipro]

Hi all

Started this project 9 months ago with my son and had to stop, but now on again. The adapter plate I obtained was incorrect and not wanting to make the same mistake again. I would like to call on some advice and it would be much appreciated.
To marry the 202 to the S3 box (bearing in mind that it is a seized landi 6 cylinder coming out ) does the adapter plate and engine mounts need to be a certain type or are they all compatible. eg; 202/186 onto S2/S3 boxes.

I can get hold of a 186 adapter and mount off a S2 but not sure if it would fit onto the 202 and S3 box.:angel:
hope this makes sense.

Cheers
Bruce.

[Homestar]

The 186 and 202 blocks are identical as far as the engine mounts go - as they are for all the red 6's so the engine mounts you have will fit the 202 fine.

Not 100% sure on any differences between the series II and series III gearboxes, but I would thing the adaptor or this should be the same for both.

[clubagreenie]

Will be fine.

186 & 202 are same pattern. The boxes are also the same, but not sure about the rover 6 pattern matching the 4cyl pattern to bolt the adaptor to it. You should be able to swap to a 4cyl bell housing if needed.

[aussipro]

Hi Guys
Thanks for the info and will look into, much appreciated

regards Bruce.

[wrinklearthur]

A full rebuild, a more suitable cam grind, high volume oil pump, the correct sump and baffles for the job. Attend to the carburettor with a float bowl packer, pressure regulator, return line.

High volume oil pump, I may have one of those but how can I be sure it is high volume by looking at it?
.

[Homestar]

High volume oil pump, I may have one of those but how can I be sure it is high volume by looking at it?
.

It is physically deeper than a standard unit and uses longer bolts to hold it on. If you have a standard one as well, you will soon notice the difference. Or post a pic, should be able to tell from that.

[mick88]

If you end up with a choice between a 186 and a 202, go for the 186 - it is better suited to the series vehicle, and IMO was a better and smoother engine than the 202.

Would a 202 with it's longer stroke be a better choice with 3.54 diffs or an overdrive (or both) as the engine revs would be lower and the 202 should have more torque?


Cheers, Mick.

[Homestar]

In that scenario, then probably yes, the 202 would be a better option. If it were to have standard diff ratios, then the 186 is a freer revving engine and would suit better.

[Bigbjorn]

In that scenario, then probably yes, the 202 would be a better option. If it were to have standard diff ratios, then the 186 is a freer revving engine and would suit better.

Ummmm, 202's in GTR Toranas were revving freely to over 7000rpm in race engines and for 500 miles at Bathurst.

[Homestar]

Ummmm, 202's in GTR Toranas were revving freely to over 7000rpm in race engines and for 500 miles at Bathurst.

I understand that and didn't say that a 202 won't rev, but a 186 has less revolving mass and spins up quicker - a freer revving engine, not a higher revving engine.:)

[Series3 GT]

Looking at getting a 186 to replace the dodgy 202 I got for free cause it's gonna cost me too much to repair but it would still run just needs some money and time. The 186 seems to get a better wrap from everyone in a Landy than the 202 just cause the 186 is a more freely revving motor. Cause I wanna chase foxes and tear around the farm the easier revving motor would suit better and I should be able to extract enough grunt out of it to get the big beast up to speed quick, my rear tyres aren't gonna like me but they won't have a choice being on gravel with a bit extra power:D Just need someone whose willing to trade a rough 202 for a reasonable 186, shouldn't be too hard

[Homestar]

I've got a 173 you can have cheap, - but you'll have to take the rest of the series III it's attached to as well...

[Series3 GT]

Thanks for the offer, not really looking for a 173 or a whole series 3 to go with, I've put the 202 up for swaps to see if any of the speedway boys will pick it up and maybe have a 186 to trade.

[Series3 GT]

The 2.25 petrol isn't going to well at the moment, she's blowing big clouds of blue on start up and the oil is getting low (wonder where it's going:angel:) and there's oil being pushed out the breather. It isn't as smooth as it used to be and has less power than before (if that's possible:D) and it gets hot quick. The clutch is slipping and its just getting old. Time to organize the motor to replace it, I've found a wrecker that'll sell me a 186 for $100, another wrecker has the conversion plate and I'll need to see if he's got the engine mounts and source a spigot bush and do a light rebuild before I drop it in (rings, valve stem seals, few gaskets and couple other bits) should have the old IIA moving a good bit quicker when finished.