One person's view of the floods & other natural disasters in Australia

[Lionelgee]

Hello All,

Firstly, let me set the scene: I live in Bundaberg and yesterday afternoon I was able, for the first time since the flooding, to drive to my local supermarket. En route to the supermarket I drove through the lower parts of my suburb, East Bundaberg; which until a number of days ago had sections covered by flood water. This supermarket is the closest shop that is open located to “ground zero” of the floods in the CBD area of Bundaberg. On my way to the supermarket I saw streets lined with people’s flood damaged possessions, which were placed in front of their homes.

To set the context or perspective - prior to leaving home I had heard on the TV, a news section which led with the phrase – “the cost of the Bundaberg floods will run into millions of dollars”. My background is in communications and cultural studies and from this perspective I tend to see things a little differently. There is a sub-section of cultural studies that looks at artefacts from different periods of history and the cultural practices that were considered appropriate at the time associated with that artefact. The same artefact can tell us something about the identity of the owner. The location of where the artefact was found may also indicate the socio-economic status of the artefact’s owner. The artefact may also reflect something of the personality of the owner as well.

For instance, take some examples of one group of items that I saw sitting in front of a people’s flood affected homes. There were two different types of bed heads that I briefly saw as I travelled past them in my car at 60 kilometres an hour. These bed heads indicated to me some of the decisions made behind each individual purchase that two neighbours had made, at some point in their lives. One owner chose to buy a naturally stained timber bed frame; and they must have liked lathe turned decorations. Alternatively, a neighbour liked a more contemporary approach and chose a MDF sleek profiled bed frame. Now let us introduce another aspect to the purchase of the bed frame - if a person has been on an extended trip they know the sense of comfort and release attached to coming home and dropping into their own bed that night. The one item – the bed, represents something we chose because we made a conscious decision to select that specific item from a particular store. It might have been a bed that they had to save for and the owner may have had to do without other things for a while, as they saved for the bed that they wanted the most. The bed may have been bought locally; or it could be anchored to the location of where they were living when they were first married and living interstate, or even overseas. So from the one item each of us may have an attachment in time and place; also a possible sense of comfort, familiarity and security. All of these aspects taken from one item combine to form aspects of our identity.

The location of where I saw the items is also telling. The items were located in front of people’s homes and the items were discarded; moved from private property to public land – the council footpath. The items are no longer a part of the owner’s life even before they are collected off the footpath. Until then the items act as a stark reminder of what has been lost from their owner’s life. These items are also now sitting outside of the building their owner may once have called “home”. It is a place where their owners felt safe and secure. The fact that these very structures have been stripped bare and their inhabitants no longer feel safe or secure is also monumental within itself. When the former owners of these discarded artefacts buy replacement items their new purchases may also serve as a constant and stark reminder of the situation that caused the need to replace their old bed.

Yet during my brief drive past this scene of devastation I saw hundreds of items placed upon the footpath of each flood affected home. Each item reflects the loss of identity and stability of each owner. Items which are now waiting for the council to remove them so the monuments of loss can be taken away from sight; but not from memory.

I wonder how many marriages will break down in flood affected, or fire ravaged areas of Australia; or the world because people are so devastated and their losses have been so great? Yet the first thing we hear on television or the radio is how many millions of dollars has been lost. Somehow I cannot help to think that placing an almost automatic dollar value on losses from natural disasters presents such a very limited perspective of people having the very fabric of their life torn from away from them.

My thoughts and heartfelt feelings go out to the people affected by this and the many other natural disasters that happen within our district and within our world. Especially, for those who can no longer rest next to the ones they love, while they lay secure within their own beds tonight.

I need to express my apologies to the economists amongst our membership. Please consider that my musings only reflect my individual representations within only one discipline of academic studies.

Well that is my two bob’s worth anyway – ooops :wasntme:


Kind Regards
Lionel

[S3ute]

I need to express my apologies to the economists amongst our membership. Please consider that my musings only reflect my individual representations within only one discipline of academic studies.

Well that is my two bob’s worth anyway – ooops :wasntme:


Kind Regards
Lionel

Lionel,

There may be the odd reader that puts your treatise down to some academic w__k_erism, but happily not I. I reckon you have raised a genuinely interesting point in what I take to be the central tenet - too easily substituting dollar values for human values.

In my own line of work, more by necessity, I travel among economists from time to time and in another context they seem to have the same bemusing urge to monetarise complex natural or human phenomenon.

Take conservation of the natural environment for example - the argument goes that if we don't place dollar values on landscape attributes like lookout vistas of considerable scenic beauty, wildlife habitat, general wildnerness etc the less-informed politicians and planners will discount them relative to tangible earners like farms, pipelines or sub-divisions. So, the economists have spent the last few decades coming up with clever ways to try to put monetary values on things that we rarely go out of our way to actually put monetary values on - mostly we just personally value those things and leave it at that.

Now suppose, by way of an example, that we could clear a 1000ha forest for new farms that might earn say $1 million a year, but in the process lose a nice stream to fishing, 500ha of extremely rare numbat habitat, a pleasant view that 500 people stopped to look at each weekend and so on. Suppose further that the economists have a crack at valuing the alternative and come up with something like that this might be worth $1.1 million a year if people reckon they would be willing to pay that much to stop it or have that added to next years' tax bill. Sounds rational because it seems like we are clearly being asked to choose between $1 million gain and $1.1 million loss. However, it always seems to me - silly perhaps - that this is a nonsense because beyond the rubbery figures (how many decimal places do you want) the thing we would be actually giving up is not $0.1 million (net) but rather a nice stream with fishing opportunity for the anglers, some rare habitat for numbat fanciers and what used to be a nice view - plus hopefully a few forest roads for the 4X4 folks. This is the real choice and aggegating it into money just blurs its real dimensions.

So, I am with you all the way on the need to look at the emotions behind the figures.

Apologies to anyone who think this was having a cheap go at land clearing, because I owned a farm and one of my limited and fading skills was pasture development. I could have made the farms worth $2 million a year.

Cheers,

[Lionelgee]

Lionel,

There may be the odd reader that puts your treatise down to some academic w__k_erism, but happily not I. I reckon you have raised a genuinely interesting point in what I take to be the central tenet - too easily substituting dollar values for human values.

In my own line of work, more by necessity, I travel among economists from time to time and in another context they seem to have the same bemusing urge to monetarise complex natural or human phenomenon.

Take conservation of the natural environment for example - the argument goes that if we don't place dollar values on landscape attributes like lookout vistas of considerable scenic beauty, wildlife habitat, general wildnerness etc the less-informed politicians and planners will discount them relative to tangible earners like farms, pipelines or sub-divisions. So, the economists have spent the last few decades coming up with clever ways to try to put monetary values on things that we rarely go out of our way to actually put monetary values on - mostly we just personally value those things and leave it at that.

Now suppose, by way of an example, that we could clear a 1000ha forest for new farms that might earn say $1 million a year, but in the process lose a nice stream to fishing, 500ha of extremely rare numbat habitat, a pleasant view that 500 people stopped to look at each weekend and so on. Suppose further that the economists have a crack at valuing the alternative and come up with something like that this might be worth $1.1 million a year if people reckon they would be willing to pay that much to stop it or have that added to next years' tax bill. Sounds rational because it seems like we are clearly being asked to choose between $1 million gain and $1.1 million loss. However, it always seems to me - silly perhaps - that this is a nonsense because beyond the rubbery figures (how many decimal places do you want) the thing we would be actually giving up is not $0.1 million (net) but rather a nice stream with fishing opportunity for the anglers, some rare habitat for numbat fanciers and what used to be a nice view - plus hopefully a few forest roads for the 4X4 folks. This is the real choice and aggegating it into money just blurs its real dimensions.

So, I am with you all the way on the need to look at the emotions behind the figures.

Apologies to anyone who think this was having a cheap go at land clearing, because I owned a farm and one of my limited and fading skills was pasture development. I could have made the farms worth $2 million a year.

Cheers,

Hello S3Ute,

Thank you for your support, I appreciate it. I also fully agree with you and also the views of some economists. My first foray into tertiary studies was Farm Management Horticulture Strand at Queensland Agricultural College. In my former vocation as a Parks and Gardens supervisor I frequently had to place economic values on such things as street trees. For example the last shire council I worked at had an avenue of Leopard trees that lined each side of the main entrance road into town. One of the trees I inspected had major damage to its main structural roots. The state of the tree meant that a strong wind could have blown it across the road - which was also part of an interstate highway which passes through town. So I had to develop the costs of the tree's removal and demonstrate in writing to the council why we should outlay the cost of buying an advanced tree; transport it from the capital city of the state where the tree nursery was located and dig a very big hole in the ground with specialist soil mix to let it grow. The other option was to buy a seedling in tube stock and cross fingers it would survive and one day fill the void left by mature tree.

I was also fortunate to interview local fishers when the government decided to impose green zones for the Great Barrier Reef. While they did mention loss of income and rising prices for imported sea food the fishers also mentioned the social losses involved in some of them who were 3rd generation fishers. It is not so much an emotional stance - it is more one of the social consequences and loss of local identity which the economist fail to factor into their dollars and cents estimate. I know from my former role in disability advocacy that once people start pressing the "emotional value" button then their cause is lost. Interestingly, another term that refers to the social consequences is also known as "social capital" Yep the economists are trying aren't they or maybe it is us social - quality of life types trying to appease the economists by using a term they think carries some gravity :twisted:.

Kind Regards
Lionel

[Lionelgee]

Now suppose, by way of an example, that we could clear a 1000ha forest for new farms that might earn say $1 million a year, but in the process lose a nice stream to fishing, 500ha of extremely rare numbat habitat, a pleasant view that 500 people stopped to look at each weekend and so on. Suppose further that the economists have a crack at valuing the alternative and come up with something like that this might be worth $1.1 million a year if people reckon they would be willing to pay that much to stop it or have that added to next years' tax bill. Sounds rational because it seems like we are clearly being asked to choose between $1 million gain and $1.1 million loss. However, it always seems to me - silly perhaps - that this is a nonsense because beyond the rubbery figures (how many decimal places do you want) the thing we would be actually giving up is not $0.1 million (net) but rather a nice stream with fishing opportunity for the anglers, some rare habitat for numbat fanciers and what used to be a nice view - plus hopefully a few forest roads for the 4X4 folks. This is the real choice and aggegating it into money just blurs its real dimensions.

G'day Again S3Ute,

It is really ironic that you mentioned forests because my wife Leeann were talking about this just this morning. It was to do with the Land Care movement and their needed to provide the economic values for the project as part of the submission for funding. Leeann raised the question - "how do you state the economic value of something like a tree?" Having studied Arboriculture - the study of the growth and management of trees - while I was at Queensland Agriculture (QAC) this was a perspective I could provide.

I also remembered trawling through the QAC library I happened upon a book from around 1920 and it happened to include a comparison between the yield of dairy cows where one mob had access to the shelter and shade provided by mature trees. The other group had no access to shade and were left out in the open. So at the end of the trial the authors could state that the group of cows which had access the shade and shelter of trees produced in terms of the era so many gallons of milk compared to the shelter deprived herd. So each tree could be valued per year for the productive life of each cow. What disturbed me was that this research was performed in the 1920s and just sat on the dusty shelf of the library. Go figure!

BTW the trial was done on the same property, same soil type, same food/pasture/dietary additives same natural climate; same herd, same farmer ... same ... same... the only factor which was different was one paddock had trees while the other paddock did not.

Kind Regards
Lionel

[trog]

Takes me back to uni days. Once spent a sociology tutorial wandering a few areas on chuck out days comparing rubbish to census income declarations. It was a bit of an eye opener.

[Ausfree]

Lionelgee, please do not apoligize as my heart goes out to any body who goes through natural disasters and as you know I have family who live in the Bundaberg area and have been directly affected by the floods there. I have been monitoring the situation very closely and the destruction that has happened is absolutely mindboggling. I went through the Newcastle Earthquake in 1989 and I still remember the destruction and disruption this caused to the city.

To S3ute, the Hunter Valley coalmining and destruction of this beautiful valley is testamount to what you are saying. You have to visit this valley to see the devastation that is going on. When a westerly wind blows the dust can be seen going over our house and we are miles away. Coal dust has even been reported at Tea Gardens on the coast of Port Stephens which is probobably (at a guess) 150 k's from the nearest open cut mine.

My heart goes out to anybody in the Bundaberg area and any other (Grafton, ) area effected by the floods.

[Lionelgee]

G'day S3Ute,

After a number of years of studying; which was done as a result of misadventure - I had to leave my trade Landscaper Parks & Gardens due to my eyes; I am still coming to terms with the concept that I am indeed an academic wa-ker. One of my brothers who is a fitter machinist called me an "academic" recently and I admit that the term made my skin crawl a bit. :mad: I am beginning to accept that I am indeed verging on the realms of having to accept the term as applying to myself - an academic that is :eek:. Possibly I am an accidental academic ;)

Kind Regards
Lionel

[Tombie]

An excellent read, and excellent follow up posts as well...

I like what you observed and your thoughts around it all...

I think to add a bit more to these sort of things one must look at any potential that these are not first occurrences for some people.
Many have weathered similar events before.

In this regard, some come to value life and family over possessions.

I have been through a few events which changed views.

I have been victim to a house break-in, a home invasion and a house robbery (all in Adelaide metro)
I have had 2 vehicles stolen and written off (Adelaide Metro)

What this has taught me is not to get to attached to possessions but rather to just enjoy them whilst I have them.
And to have damn good insurance cover on everything!

A possession is just that, a memory is far more powerful and soothing.

I guess also, being in my job (DIDO) I sleep away from 'my bed' for nearly 60% of my year. There is no comfort taken in being in 'my' bed - the comfort for me is holding my wife...

I am sure I have struggled to get my feelings across in this post, I hope can understand what I am trying to say.

[Tombie]

G'day S3Ute,

After a number of years of studying; which was done as a result of misadventure - I had to leave my trade Landscaper Parks & Gardens due to my eyes; I am still coming to terms with the concept that I am indeed an academic wa-ker. One of my brothers who is a fitter machinist called me an "academic" recently and I admit that the term made my skin crawl a bit. :mad: I am beginning to accept that I am indeed verging on the realms of having to accept the term as applying to myself - an Academic that is :eek:. Possibly I am an Accidental Academic ;)

Kind Regards
Lionel


Perhaps you could try an AA meeting.... Academics Anonymous :angel:

[Lionelgee]

An excellent read, and excellent follow up posts as well...

I like what you observed and your thoughts around it all...

I think to add a bit more to these sort of things one must look at any potential that these are not first occurrences for some people.
Many have weathered similar events before.

In this regard, some come to value life and family over possessions.

I have been through a few events which changed views.

I have been victim to a house break-in, a home invasion and a house robbery (all in Adelaide metro)
I have had 2 vehicles stolen and written off (Adelaide Metro)

What this has taught me is not to get to attached to possessions but rather to just enjoy them whilst I have them.
And to have damn good insurance cover on everything!

A possession is just that, a memory is far more powerful and soothing.

I guess also, being in my job (DIDO) I sleep away from 'my bed' for nearly 60% of my year. There is no comfort taken in being in 'my' bed - the comfort for me is holding my wife...

I am sure I have struggled to get my feelings across in this post, I hope can understand what I am trying to say.

G'day Tombie,

You expressed yourself very well. Do not apologise.

There has been research conducted about the affects that Fly-In Fly Out and Drive-In Drive-out has on both the worker's health themselves and on the family.

Griffith University did the research only late last year - I will find the link and post it up if you have not come across it.

You are dead right about how possessions only form one part of our identity. Another aspect of our identity is the work we do. If people are retrenched unexpectedly they feel an acute sense of loss and plummeting feelings of self worth. There are a couple of books which have snappy titles too - such as retire and die. Because even planned for retirement can remove a sense of personal value and usefulness from people. Our geographic location - where we live and travel also anchors aspects of our identity. So too does liking Land Rover products. :angel: This places us in a distinct sub cultural troupe that is even broken down to different tribes of what type of Land Rovers we like. I for one like Series 3 Land Rovers and ex-military Land Rovers.

Our attachment to consumerism and identity through making purchases can be a real problem for some people. I am reading a novel where a person wakes up in hospital after getting a head injury and they can remember nothing about themselves. It turns out I bought this book years before I had any formal interest in academia - before I became a member of AA.

Thank you for posting up your thoughts Tombie :)

Kind Regards
Lionel

[Lionelgee]

G'day Tombie,

Here are some links that might be of interest -

Despite wealth for toil, FIFO workers find themselves sick and tired (http://theconversation.edu.au/despite-wealth-for-toil-fifo-workers-find-themselves-sick-and-tired-8540)

http://www.mining.com/shift-work-miners-ill-exhausted-and-depressed-report-70420

Shift, drive, fly: work and wellbeing in regional coal mining communities - Griffith University (http://www.griffith.edu.au/business-government/centre-work-organisation-wellbeing/news-events/previous-news-and-events/2012/shift,-drive,-fly-work-and-wellbeing-in-regional-coal-mining-communities) - for the links for the full report click on this link and then look for three links to the main report documents on the page http://www.griffith.edu.au/business-government/centre-work-organisation-wellbeing/research/regulation-institutions/projects/the-relationship-between-working-arrangements-and-wellbeing-in-regional-coal-mining-communities

Here is a link to research carried out in Western Australian mines back in 2009. http://www.uwa.edu.au/__data/assets/pdf_file/0003/405426/FIFO_Report.pdf warning the document has 105 pages so it could take a while to retrieve internet wise.

Before seeing the light and studying horticulture I worked as an Electrical TA with a company of contractors based out at Woodlawn mine located just outside of Goulburn. BTW I had over 20 jobs in the three years after leaving school before I found my vocation - well my first one :D and studied horticulture at Queensland Agricultural College.

Kind Regards
Lionel

[Lionelgee]

Hello All,

I got interested in the identity and employment through my PhD when I interviewed people with Asperger's Syndrome very few of them were working. The National Autistic Society of the United Kingdom suggests that only 15% of people with a diagnosis of Asperger's Syndrome are employed (accessed 2nd of Feb 2013 from http://www.autism.org.uk/living-with-autism/employment.aspx).

No IsuzuRover I do not know what methodology and sample size the National Autistic Society used :). I am still waiting for the Department of Human Services to respond to my request about the Australian statistics on the employment rate in Australia of people on the Autism spectrum. They have not contacted me back and it has been some months now.

Anyway, there are research documents that suggest that people form a strong sense of their identity from work. Because only 15% of adults with Asperger's have full time employment in the UK it denies the opportunity for people to develop a sense of competence and self worth -also factors in research that have been associated with being employed. Trying to get figures of the rate of ASD in Australia is not easy - for various reasons. However the Center of Disease Control in the USA cites the following information

Data and Statistics, Autism Spectrum Disorders - Centers for ... (http://cs.dogpile.com/ClickHandler.ashx'du=http%3a%2f%2fwww.cdc.gov%2fnc bddd%2fautism%2fdata.html&ru=http%3a%2f%2fwww.cdc.gov%2fncbddd%2fautism%2fda ta.html&ld=20130202&ap=1&app=1&c=info.dogpl&s=dogpile&coi=239138&cop=main-title&euip=58.164.158.223&npp=1&p=0&pp=0&pvaid=e21a17c47b5d44ddaf60fdba4a6fc0fa&sid=794727687.3235705044851.1359787444&vid=794727687.3235705044851.1312329226.1240&fcoi=417&fcop=topnav&fpid=2&ep=4&mid=9&hash=6BCC4AE7BFAC66369215611F74EBCA6A)
www.cdc.gov/ncbddd/autism/data.html (http://cs.dogpile.com/ClickHandler.ashx'du=http%3a%2f%2fwww.cdc.gov%2fnc bddd%2fautism%2fdata.html&ru=http%3a%2f%2fwww.cdc.gov%2fncbddd%2fautism%2fda ta.html&ld=20130202&ap=1&app=1&c=info.dogpl&s=dogpile&coi=239138&cop=main-title&euip=58.164.158.223&npp=1&p=0&pp=0&pvaid=e21a17c47b5d44ddaf60fdba4a6fc0fa&sid=794727687.3235705044851.1359787444&vid=794727687.3235705044851.1312329226.1240&fcoi=417&fcop=topnav&fpid=2&ep=4&mid=9&hash=6BCC4AE7BFAC66369215611F74EBCA6A) Found on: Google, Yahoo! Search

Mar 29, 2012 ... About 1 in 88 children has been identified with an autism spectrum More detail from - http://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2012/p0329_autism_disorder.html. So if the Australian rates a similar to the rates in the USA what is the population of Australia and 1 in 88 comes down to ..... subtract from that the people who are under or over the normal working age in Australia and you come up with a figure of ......

It also means that any time you are at an event with 88 people at the venue then one of these people may have some type of an Autism Spectrum Disorder. Some of these people may have a poor employment history, be socially awkward and do too much research about how people form a sense of identity; they may also like restoring Series 3 Land Rovers; and they might post too many documents up on AULRO. One of the one in 88 could even be me!!!

The percentage of these people who have Asperger's Syndrome - a condition which will be taken out of the DSM V and you get an indication of how difficult it is to get the exact numbers of people - however the amount is statistically significant.

Having employment also makes people contributors to society in that people who are employed pay taxes - so the economic loss; let alone the social capital loss is very significant.

Kind Regards
Lionel

[Blknight.aus]

So far, Ive been lucky, Between cyclone fire and flood Ive been missed every time yet have either been within range of or own property in the are of one of or all of those events. (I suffer more from idiot political fall out than actual damage)

Heres what worries me.

I've helped out where I can, when I can at every event I've had access to and it never ceases to amaze me at how grateful the affected people are
for what little that gets offered them.

My concern...

Whose going to protect the vulnerable from the greedy?

Here's an example

During the latest flood out, I got stuck at chinchilla and the less than scrupulous owner of the bed and breakfast bumped the prices on a lot of things or told people he only had the premium suites left, filled them and then began selling on the smaller cheaper rooms charging the same prices for those rooms as the premium rooms. Put signs out for a sausage sizzle then charged $5 for a softie and a snag in bread with onion. Dinner was now additional and the breakfast wasnt going to be a cooked one any more. I only stayed because I was willing to bare the cost, it was still cheaper than turning and burning the diesel to go the long way around, but what if I'd had no choice?

[schuy1]

I seriously think his actions would come under the profiteering act, unless he can prove that those supplies he started charging extra for were actually costing him more to obtain as a result of the flooding. I would be noting his actions in a letter to the office of fair trading and let them sort it. I have heard of similar in Bundaberg of people being charged $11 for a coffee! ( or attempting to b charged :D ) the matter is with OFair trading now I believe. Aside from the legal side of it I would suggest to him that it would not buy a new premises if he continued in that manner! :D

[Lionelgee]

I seriously think his actions would come under the profiteering act, unless he can prove that those supplies he started charging extra for were actually costing him more to obtain as a result of the flooding. I would be noting his actions in a letter to the office of fair trading and let them sort it. I have heard of similar in Bundaberg of people being charged $11 for a coffee! ( or attempting to b charged :D ) the matter is with OFair trading now I believe. Aside from the legal side of it I would suggest to him that it would not buy a new premises if he continued in that manner! :D

There were also rumours of some stores raising the price of milk and bread in Bundaberg, during the floods.:mad:. They might have put it down to the formula of supply and demand.

Kind Regards
Lionel

[Blknight.aus]

I think his act is well rehearsed, his booking sheet was always in full view and it was booked solid except for the premium rooms. Always seemed to have a convenient "cancellation" when he needed one. He made a lot of noise about wanting early payments for the next night because he was fully booked with a tour group coming out from brisbane that night (which would be tuesday, the day after australia day) He went very very quiet when he was asked how he expected them to get in and he had better call them and cancel then refund their booking.


In all aspects his dogma got promptly flattened with a large serving of Karma. (and other than pointing out the blindingly obvious I played no part in any of it)

May the same fate befall all those who attempt similar against those in need with no choice.

[S3ute]

To S3ute, the Hunter Valley coalmining and destruction of this beautiful valley is testamount to what you are saying. You have to visit this valley to see the devastation that is going on. When a westerly wind blows the dust can be seen going over our house and we are miles away. Coal dust has even been reported at Tea Gardens on the coast of Port Stephens which is probably (at a guess) 150 k's from the nearest open cut mine.


Hello again from Brisbane and thanks.

I do know what you are describing with some genuine familiarity I regret to say.

While the massive coal developments in the Hunter from about the late 1970s has inevitably brought prosperity to the region and probably personally to a few AULRO members who live and work there, it was a very different thing for my own family.

Family settement of grazing land in and around Singleton and later Muswellbrook commenced around 1870, but had pretty much left with limited trace by the end of the 1990s, largely as a result of the coal and power development.

Expansion of the State coal mines near Hebden in the 1960s took a couple of properties, but these were offset by local land purchases in other parts of the region. Lake St Clair was built to supply water into the mines and associated electrical development and inconveniently for us happens to sit atop my late grandfather's property (St Clair) and the properties of several uncles and cousins. The resulting diaspora to the Peel, Namoi, North Coast and elsewhere, effectively broke a longstanding network of family contacts. The rapid expansion of the mines between Singleton and Muswellbrook knocked another couple of properties out of the system and these could only be offset by shifting much further to the west around Narrabri.

For myself, my parents owned a couple of farms in the hills just to the east of Muswellbrook in the valley just over the hills from Liddell power station and at night you could hear the plant quite clearly. The dust etc was also getting pretty ordinary as was the constant threat of having another transmission line come through the valley and eventually having to put up with a pylon on the flat below the homestead - having seen two lines go up in the adjacent valleys over the years, we were likely to be next. There were no coal reserves under either farm, but one sat over a very rich limestone deposit for which the state issued prospecting licenses in the early 2000s. That was enough and, after my Dad passed away, I could see no future in it and sold out. In doing that, I was one of the last of the family to go.....

Miss the landscape that I knew in the 1960s and 70s, but not necessarily what is there now.

Cheers,

[S3ute]

=Lionelgee

Mar 29, 2012 ... About 1 in 88 chil[/I]dren has been identified with an autism spectrum *

It also means that any time you are at an event with 88 people at the venue then one of these people may have some type of an Autism Spectrum Disorder. Some of these people may have a poor employment history, be socially awkward and do too much research about how people form a sense of identity; they may also like restoring Series 3 Land Rovers; and they might post too many documents up on AULRO. [B][I]One of the one in 88 could even be me!!!

Kind Regards
Lionel

Lionel,

Hello again from Brisbane.

I note from another thread (news please) your mention that no-one seems to have noticed your post herein on Aspergers.

Not so. I didn't need to put 88 people into a room the find a case - a very close friend's late son Ben had it. So, while this exceptionally nice kid lived among us we got to know it well. His passion, unfortunately, was cricket rather than Land Rovers, but I don't hold that against him.

Cheers,

[Disco44]

So far, Ive been lucky, Between cyclone fire and flood Ive been missed every time yet have either been within range of or own property in the are of one of or all of those events. (I suffer more from idiot political fall out than actual damage)

Heres what worries me.

I've helped out where I can, when I can at every event I've had access to and it never ceases to amaze me at how grateful the affected people are
for what little that gets offered them.

My concern...

Whose going to protect the vulnerable from the greedy?

Here's an example

During the latest flood out, I got stuck at chinchilla and the less than scrupulous owner of the bed and breakfast bumped the prices on a lot of things or told people he only had the premium suites left, filled them and then began selling on the smaller cheaper rooms charging the same prices for those rooms as the premium rooms. Put signs out for a sausage sizzle then charged $5 for a softie and a snag in bread with onion. Dinner was now additional and the breakfast wasnt going to be a cooked one any more. I only stayed because I was willing to bare the cost, it was still cheaper than turning and burning the diesel to go the long way around, but what if I'd had no choice?

Dave rip off merchants like that should be cut with a rat tail file.

John.https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/1259.jpg

[Ausfree]

I seriously think his actions would come under the profiteering act, unless he can prove that those supplies he started charging extra for were actually costing him more to obtain as a result of the flooding. I would be noting his actions in a letter to the office of fair trading and let them sort it. I have heard of similar in Bundaberg of people being charged $11 for a coffee! ( or attempting to b charged :D ) the matter is with OFair trading now I believe. Aside from the legal side of it I would suggest to him that it would not buy a new premises if he continued in that manner! :D

Yep, a shop near where my daughter lives in Bundaberg was charging $8 for a loaf of bread that they had baked on the premises. I might add there are some angry people who have vowed to never go back to that shop. They could'nt go anywhere else as they were cut off by floodwaters.:mad: