Non-OEM D3 shocks

[Graeme]

After having fitted non-OEM (Britpart) D3 shock/spring assemblies to my D4 1000 kms ago, I'm certain that the shocks have far less slow speed damping than the genuine LR MY09 D3 shocks I fitted 2 years ago. The vehicle wallows at 100 kph, especially the front, which I did not occur with the genuine D3 shocks. I don't know if I'm coming down with some dreaded lurgy but I could barely stay awake driving this afternoon even after having stopped for a walk.

I cannot recommend these as replacements for genuine D3 shocks.

[rick130]

You fitted Britpart dampers ? :(
Your deity only knows where they may have been made.

If you are going to use aftermarket dampers, use Koni, Bilstein, Delphi/De carbon or The Ultimate Suspension from here in NSW.

[AnD3rew]

Never heard a good word said about Britpart.

[Mike_S]

Nicknamed s***part by my independent LR specialist in the UK.

[Graeme]

They were purchased from Famous Four in the UK with no indication of the brand, not that I had any knowledge of any bad Britpart reputation. I noticed the partly ground away Land Rover logo on the bottom of the fronts (I had already fitted the rears) and wondered if they were refurbished used ones or grabbed from a pile of ready to be used LR genuines. I got an inkling of a problem when I took my van for a short run and the front of the D4 bounced quite badly but thought (hoped) it might have been caused by no load in the rear of the D4.

I understand that these shocks are the same as what can be purchased through various Oz outlets, hence the warning that they might not be particularly suitable. The shock body, the springs, the bottom bush with LR brand and part number and the paint marks on the top nut appeared identical to the D3 Delphi shocks/springs when compared side by side before fitment although obviously the valving could not be compared. I anticipated that the valving might be different but not this different.

[Graeme]

If you are going to use aftermarket dampers, use Koni, Bilstein, Delphi/De carbon or The Ultimate Suspension from here in NSW.AFAIK currently Bilstein and Konis are withdrawn from sale whilst they work out why they blow front seals and no other brand of shock is available. These are described as OEM on the web-site which would therefore be Delphi.

[TerryO]

Hi Graeme,

I have had a set of these replacement Delphi shocks fitted for about two months now and I can tell you they are way better than the set of blown Koni's they replaced. In total I have done about 3,000 k's on them.

Are they a bit soft on dampening? yes a bit but even with a front bar and winch fitted, plus rock sliders and rear wheel carrier they seem to handle reasonably well.

I have also done over 1,000 k's mainly in the Vic and NSW high country towing our van over Christmas and I was very happy with them. They are not perfect but they have been much better so far than I expected.

cheers,
Terry

[Geedublya]

Bilsteins seem to work OK on the rear, mine have 50K on them now without an issue. Fronts were not lasting 10K.
Replacement Delphis on the front are genuine Landrover and have 30K now. They don't have the control off the Bilsteins in either compression or rebound but are acceptable.

[rick130]

Pretty sure The Ultimate Suspension have a rebuildable/revalveable twin tube damper available for the D3, and as they used to use de Carbon (Delphi) as their house damper can probably revalve them still too.

[rick130]

AFAIK currently Bilstein and Konis are withdrawn from sale whilst they work out why they blow front seals and no other brand of shock is available. These are described as OEM on the web-site which would therefore be Delphi.


Hi Graeme,

I have had a set of these replacement Delphi shocks fitted for about two months now and I can tell you they are way better than the set of blown Koni's they replaced. In total I have done about 3,000 k's on them.

[snip]

cheers,
Terry

What could be so weird about the D3 suspension to cause seal failure ?
Does it use a very high motion ratio ?
Is it possible for a bending motion to be introduced into the shaft ?

Some of the racecars I've worked on had high rocker ratios and shaft extensions on the dampers which combined with a Bilsteins puny 14mm shaft and coilover springs (plus nil droop) exerted sideways forces on the top cap bearing/seal.
It wasn't pretty and resulted in very high amounts of stiction too.

I'll have a crawl under a friends D3 this morning and have a look-see at the setup.
We tend to park together in our own special little Land Rover carpark under some trees when going for morning coffee.

[TerryO]

Pretty sure The Ultimate Suspension have a rebuildable/revalveable twin tube damper available for the D3, and as they used to use de Carbon (Delphi) as their house damper can probably revalve them still too.


Hi Rick,

Are the Ultimate Suspenion shocks replacements for the air bag shocks or for the coilers?

I have had two sets of Koni's, the first set lasted 5,000 km but improved the handling of the D3 so much that it made it more like a slot car than a 2.7 ton 4x4 and the ride was still exceptional over bumps etc.

When changed for the second set of Koni's every shock had blown its seals and leaked all of its oil into the airbag.

Koni had changed the dampening in the FSD shocks by the time I got the second set, obviously they had experienced some issues and were trying to find a remedy. The ride in the second set was at best ordinary and it never handled as well as the first set.

When I took it back the second time they offered to replace them with the Delphi aftermarket shocks because they had stopped selling Koni's or D3/4's, so I accepted the very reasonably (cheap) priced Delphi replacement shock option and they are pretty much ok so far.

Why the aftermarket shocks die so quickly on a D3/4 no one seams to know, I wondered if it was through overheating inside the bag, I know my Koni shocks seamed to deteriate very quickly after I towed our 2.5 ton van.

cheers,
Terry

[rick130]

Hi Rick,

Are the Ultimate Suspenion shocks replacements for the air bag shocks or for the coilers?


I'm guessing coilers ?



[snip]
Why the aftermarket shocks die so quickly on a D3/4 no one seams to know, I wondered if it was through overheating inside the bag, I know my Koni shocks seamed to deteriate very quickly after I towed our 2.5 ton van.

cheers,
Terry

Quite possibly.

All a damper does is convert kinetic energy into heat.
That heat has to be dissipated somehow.

[Graeme]

The front shocks only have 25mm stroke from fully extended to starting to compress the bump-stops. The bump-stops (helpers) are, from memory, about 50mm long and if compressed to around 30mm would provide a total of about 55mm stroke. The bare shock has about 90mm stroke but that includes the bump-stop and half the top bush thickness. The rears have more than 100mm stroke (I forgot the actual measurments) without considering the bump-stops. The shafts are approx 18mm dia using a tape measure.

[Graeme]

Hi Graeme,

I have had a set of these replacement Delphi shocks fitted for about two months now and I can tell you they are way better than the set of blown Koni's they replaced. In total I have done about 3,000 k's on them.

Are they a bit soft on dampening? yes a bit but even with a front bar and winch fitted, plus rock sliders and rear wheel carrier they seem to handle reasonably well.

I have also done over 1,000 k's mainly in the Vic and NSW high country towing our van over Christmas and I was very happy with them. They are not perfect but they have been much better so far than I expected.

cheers,
Terry
Don't misunderstand, these shocks perform as shocks compared with the worn-out earlier D3s and the failed D4s, its just that as well as I can remember the MY09 D3 shocks had much better control around 100 kph on secondary roads and also without the mild lurch mid-corner. Without new MY09 to directly compare with I can't be absolutely sure but I hope for something better next time.

[TerryO]

I'm guessing coilers ?


As in coil springs that the early five seater D3 S model's had fitted rather than the airsprung SE / HSE's.

cheers,
Terry

[rick130]

As in coil springs that the early D3 S model's were rather than the airsprung SE / HSE's.

cheers,
Terry

I don't know Terry, they do list dampers for the D3.

In the past they used de Carbon but actually make their own dampers now.

As for the high motion or leverage ratio, I can see that causing problems.
You need large forces generated quickly to control the wheel and chassis.

Ideally you need as large a piston as possible (eg 46mm) to reduce the internal forces needed, and a larger piston is more sensitive to shaft displacement and generates those forces faster, allowing more control with small shaft movements.
If Bilstein and Koni are having problems with their 46mm piston dampers....:confused:

[PhilipA]

As for the high motion or leverage ratio, I can see that causing
problems.
You need large forces generated quickly to control the wheel and
chassis.


LC200s have the same problem with a high leverage ratio as the shock is quite a way inboard.
I met 2 owners at Drysdale Station who were there for a week waiting for new aftermarket front shocks after blowing the seals on the Mitchell falls road. They wouldn't tell me the brands.
Thats independent suspension for you!LOL . It doesn't seem to happen as much on the old solid axles. That's "progress"
Regards Philip A

[d3viate]

As in coil springs that the early D3 S model's were rather than the airsprung SE / HSE's.

cheers,
Terry
I don't know Terry, they do list dampers for the D3.

Go further into the link and they only list for coils

[discotwinturbo]

Never heard a good word said about Britpart.

Britpart gave me a free calendar....that's a good word ;-)

Brett.....