TD42 into Defender 130? Anyone done it?

[Sitec]

Hello all!

Ok, sat in my shed is a Turboed TD42 Nissan Diesel and Patrol gearbox.. My thoughts r to replace the Td5 with it as it'll take the heat and abuse a lot better!! Anyone ever done it? Drove a Patrol with a tweaked Td the other day and hell it went well! Thoughts please, cheers. Simon.

[Slunnie]

Does the tape say it fits? I would have thought a 6 would be too long.

[rick130]

Is your TD5 tweaked ?
I would've thought more scope, more easily with the TD5 ?

I like the TD42T, we have one here in a GU but they're a lump of a thing and asthmatic as hell stock, but are hard to kill.


You'd need to at least fit a 1.2:1 high range too, they don't rev as well as a TD5.

[Sitec]

Nah, not that I know of... Trouble is it's getting heavier by the day.... 285 tyres, roof rack, roo bar, air tank, camp body and under tray.. Tirfor that lives in the back... Just thinking that it's a lot to ask of an already overloaded 2.5 with 240000kms on the clock. Not only that, I'm tryin to get away from the wiring/ecu's that u can't fix when in the middle of a creek 500 km away from civilisation.. The TD's are great for bolting huge turbos onto, adding intercoolers and exhausts like dustbins, having the boost running at 14psi + and still being reliable... Oh for a mechanical 5 litre Td5! They do sound nice even if they are too small!! As for length... It'll fit!! I'll make it fit! There's a lot of room between the bulkhead and back of the engine. Planning to use the Patrol 5 speed and make my conversion plate between that and the LT230. I hear ya re gearing it up... Been looking for a 1.192:1 ratio (V8 90) but it seems they are as rare as chooks teeth over here! Think the old auto Rangie 1.003:1 wud b too high!.... Fast tho!!!!!

[klonk]

I saw one last weekend in a defender, engine and gearbox, as Slunnie said Toooo long to fit, the gear levers were between the seats due to the long bellhousing on the box. made you wonder why they did it, it wouldnt have been very nice to drive. Dont know how it went, the owner wasnt preasent

Cheers Steve

[rick130]

LRA used to fit the GQ 'box to Landies so an adapter plate/input shaft must be available somewhere to fit it up to the LT230.

The gear lever is too far rearward in the GU, so I can see it needing to be bent forward as klonk said to get somewhere near the right spot in a Defender.

It's a heavy lump of a thing and long, that's why everyone prefers the 4BD1T.

Even more potential power/torque (I've heard it's stronger internally, the Challenge blokes spend a lot of $ beefing the TD42T up to take the boost, etc) just not as smooth as a straight six.

I've been thinking of a GQ box behind a 4BD1T but I don't like the ratio spread, it's a bit wider than the R380. Good for low/low work but I like the jumps between gears closer, and I reckon the R380 ratios would really suit an engine with a more limited rev range.
I reckon The GQ box shifted better than the GU 'box too.

[Slunnie]

Been looking for a 1.192:1 ratio (V8 90) but it seems they are as rare as chooks teeth over here! Think the old auto Rangie 1.003:1 wud b too high!.... Fast tho!!!!!

Discovery is 1.2:1. You'd be pretty lucky to find one that isn't that ratio.

[justinc]

I have often thought a 12HT or 12HDT FTE with the corresponding autobox from the 60 and 80/100 series respectively would be a fantastic fit to a 110. A very strong, reliable, smooth and torquey turbo diesel 6 would be a fantastic powerplant. If that guy in the UK can fit the 6BD1T to his Defender, then a toyota 6 will be no problem:D. I don't have a problem with the Td42, but the Toyota 12HT etc are just a little bit better/ refined IMO.
You might also notice that the trans stick in the 5 speed 80 series box may even be a better fit / position than the Nissan one.

JC

[gusthedog]

I have often thought a 12HT or 12HDT FTE with the corresponding autobox from the 60 and 80/100 series respectively would be a fantastic fit to a 110. A very strong, reliable, smooth and torquey turbo diesel 6 would be a fantastic powerplant. If that guy in the UK can fit the 6BD1T to his Defender, then a toyota 6 will be no problem:D. I don't have a problem with the Td42, but the Toyota 12HT etc are just a little bit better/ refined IMO.
You might also notice that the trans stick in the 5 speed 80 series box may even be a better fit / position than the Nissan one.

JC

Or you could just leave the 12HT or 12HDT in whatever toyota it is in and drive it :wasntme:

[Dougal]

There is an Rrc around with a 1hz. It filled the engine bay and required relocated radiators etc. A lot of work for an average engine. The 1hdfte is an excellent engine of the same size. But 6 cyls is a fuel consumption penalty. Far better than a td42.

Plenty of excellent Isuzu and Toyota 4 cyl diesels to pick from.

[VladTepes]

IMHO the best place for a GQ engine is in a GQ Patrol - don't get me wrong though - I am a big fan of GQ Patrols and nearly almost sort of kind of maybe thought about buying one recently but went with a Tdi Disco instead....

[djam1]

Don't want to be rude or derogatory but I find them a tad gutless even the turbo ones

[justinc]

Don't want to be rude or derogatory but I find them a tad gutless even the turbo ones

...Certainly now, after your latest bolt on...:cool:

JC :D

[88classic]

doesnt diesel engine blocks need to be made of steel cos of their high compression ratios and so on..
cars are buit for weight distribution so adding to much weight would create more problems??> Im not sure ..but running a bigger alloy motor is a great choice especially when they run water tight coil packs etc...
and the amount of torgue you can get is upthere ..along with the sound and power of a chev....
WHY Would'nt YA.....

[Bush65]

In the USA you can buy billet aluminium (or should I say aluminum) blocks and heads for the Duramax V8 diesel, these are for very high cylinder pressures and performance. IIRC you can also buy billet aluminium blocks for the straight 6 Cummins.

IIRC, the stock Mazda Skyactiv diesel has an aluminium block. These 2 and 2.2 litre engines have been taken up to some phenomenal power for racing.

So it can be done in aluminium with diesels - just a matter of trade-offs.

[robbotd5]

You blokes are unbelievable!!!! Just modify the TD5 to suit your needs. And stop committing sacrilege. My little 5 can show up a lot of so called bullet proof toyonismo motors. Their expressions are priceless as I overtake them with my 9.1m van in tow. And yes, it is done safely!!! Apart from me not being able to see properly from the smokescreen these lumps create. Stay true to the fold gents. The TD5 mafia will fight for the cause!!
Regards
Robbo

[rick130]

In the USA you can buy billet aluminium (or should I say aluminum) blocks and heads for the Duramax V8 diesel, these are for very high cylinder pressures and performance. IIRC you can also buy billet aluminium blocks for the straight 6 Cummins.

IIRC, the stock Mazda Skyactiv diesel has an aluminium block. These 2 and 2.2 litre engines have been taken up to some phenomenal power for racing.

So it can be done in aluminium with diesels - just a matter of trade-offs.

FWIW, pretty sure the Audi TD that was the first diesel to win the Le Mans 24hr's a few years back used a (lightweight) iron block.

[rick130]

You blokes are unbelievable!!!! Just modify the TD5 to suit your needs. And stop committing sacrilege. My little 5 can show up a lot of so called bullet proof toyonismo motors. Their expressions are priceless as I overtake them with my 9.1m van in tow. And yes, it is done safely!!! Apart from me not being able to see properly from the smokescreen these lumps create. Stay true to the fold gents. The TD5 mafia will fight for the cause!!
Regards
Robbo


Psst, half the blokes posting in this thread don't use Land Rover engines in their respective Land Rovers ;)

[robbotd5]

Psst, half the blokes posting in this thread don't use Land Rover engines in their respective Land Rovers ;)

Yeah I know....so!!!!!! Not having a serious go or anything...
Regards
Robbo

[sheerluck]

Psst, half the blokes posting in this thread don't use Land Rover engines in their respective Land Rovers ;)

Does such a thing exist any more? After all, the Pumas are Ford, the D3/4 are PSA, not sure where the Freebie or FFRR come from though.

[Dougal]

Does such a thing exist any more? After all, the Pumas are Ford, the D3/4 are PSA, not sure where the Freebie or FFRR come from though.

It's all PSA.

[Sitec]

Pffffttt. Puma lump in a Defender.... That's worse than a TD42..... It came out of a van!!!! :D. Hey ho, I hear ya with the New alli blocks but that isn't going to pay the mortgage.. However my $1500 GQ (rest of it sold now for $1200) with its turboed (now $300 engine and box) is good for 200bhp (YouTube Td42 mods etc) or more if I really want to go silly. With a $2000 pump upgrade, huge intercooler and a 3" exhaust it costs me under $3000, and I can spanner it myself at home or in the bush. Ya can't locate an error code in the Flinders!... It would really make my 3 tonne 130 boogy! What's a good Td5 with ECU worth? Gotta b about 3k+. I then have a cast, sweet sounding 6 pot with bags of power and torque that'll move mountains and run at 120kph all day in 40deg. Find me a Td5 in a 130 that'll do that and survive... Ya I hear u about pullin the Td5 out, but when it's done 250000 km, the head's been off as it 'slipped' due to those plastic dowels etc etc, is it worth chipping it to within an inch of its life and then always wandering if it's going to 'hold' as u bury the throttle up that sandy hill carrying all my camping gear 600kms from home.....? Mmmmm, still to be decided. Back to the jury! The floor is again yours! :cool:

[rick130]

OK OK, you've convinced me, pull the POS TD5 and put in the TD42T.

The TD42is one of my favourite old school diesels, as I said above, we have one here in SWMBO's Patrol, so here's my recommendation.

Pull the POS TD5, PM me and I'll help dispose of it :angel:

Install the TD42T :D


Problem solved ! :cool:

[Dougal]

Pffffttt. Puma lump in a Defender.... That's worse than a TD42..... It came out of a van!!!! :D. Hey ho, I hear ya with the New alli blocks but that isn't going to pay the mortgage.. However my $1500 GQ (rest of it sold now for $1200) with its turboed (now $300 engine and box) is good for 200bhp (YouTube Td42 mods etc) or more if I really want to go silly. With a $2000 pump upgrade, huge intercooler and a 3" exhaust it costs me under $3000, and I can spanner it myself at home or in the bush. Ya can't locate an error code in the Flinders!... It would really make my 3 tonne 130 boogy! What's a good Td5 with ECU worth? Gotta b about 3k+. I then have a cast, sweet sounding 6 pot with bags of power and torque that'll move mountains and run at 120kph all day in 40deg. Find me a Td5 in a 130 that'll do that and survive... Ya I hear u about pullin the Td5 out, but when it's done 250000 km, the head's been off as it 'slipped' due to those plastic dowels etc etc, is it worth chipping it to within an inch of its life and then always wandering if it's going to 'hold' as u bury the throttle up that sandy hill carrying all my camping gear 600kms from home.....? Mmmmm, still to be decided. Back to the jury! The floor is again yours! :cool:

You forgot to mention the 12-16 litres/100km.:angel: IDI and 6 cyl's are both fuel consumption penalties. Combine them and it gets a bit woeful.

[rick130]

You forgot to mention the 12-16 litres/100km.:angel: IDI and 6 cyl's are both fuel consumption penalties. Combine them and it gets a bit woeful.

Quiet Dougal, I'm trying to help him get rid of his unloved TD5 ;)

[bretty15]

i have been looking at the same idea taking out a very under powered 300tdi puting in 12ht or 1hdt then maybe do 100 with a trailer on just not sure if adapter available or if i put complete box and tranfer in where to fit hand brake ??? plus i think feul would be better cruiser get obout 10 /11 l/100 my 300tdi getting12/13 l/100 emty 15 l/100 towing my 12ft van at 85 /90 kmph flat 95 if i turn of aircon

[Dougal]

i have been looking at the same idea taking out a very under powered 300tdi puting in 12ht or 1hdt then maybe do 100 with a trailer on just not sure if adapter available or if i put complete box and tranfer in where to fit hand brake ??? plus i think feul would be better cruiser get obout 10 /11 l/100 my 300tdi getting12/13 l/100 emty 15 l/100 towing my 12ft van at 85 /90 kmph flat 95 if i turn of aircon

If your 300tdi is using 12-13 litres/100 empty, then you have some big issues to find. These problems might be the same ones stopping you doing 100km/h.

Cruisers only get 10 l/100km when driven like your grandad. But where will you put the extra 2 cylinders?

[bretty15]

have a few mates with cruisers thay get 9-10 emty 11-12 towing camper loaded at 100+ plus low down torque is alot better dont need to burn clutch taking of on a incline in hi range with trailer on few time had to drop into low to get rolling..the old mans disco was the same

[loanrangie]

have a few mates with cruisers thay get 9-10 emty 11-12 towing camper loaded at 100+ plus low down torque is alot better dont need to burn clutch taking of on a incline in hi range with trailer on few time had to drop into low to get rolling..the old mans disco was the same

I call BS, the TDI is about the most fuel efficient 4cyl diesel engine fitted to any 4wd vehicle .

[ramblingboy42]

really off topic but I'm surrounded by cruisers and no one gets anywhere 10-11 km/100 it's more like 15-18....people tell porkies about their vehicles capabilities for some reason. A guy I work near regularly was given a cruiser temporarily and was astonished at its fuel consumption....he doesnt have to pay but said he wouldnt own one for that reason alone.

[Dougal]

have a few mates with cruisers thay get 9-10 emty 11-12 towing camper loaded at 100+ plus low down torque is alot better dont need to burn clutch taking of on a incline in hi range with trailer on few time had to drop into low to get rolling..the old mans disco was the same

I know quite well a grandfather with a 1HD-FTE 100 series (The 1HD-FTE is the most efficient toyota 6 cyl engine ever). It has never reached 10 litres/100km and it's been trying for 200,000km. Even when driven well under the speed limit.

Your mates figures are BS. Take a look on Spritmonitor.de or fuelly and find any results which match.

[Sitec]

Yup, Td5 in a 130 is the same... 10lt/100km, it can happen..... empty at 85kph with the wind behind me... But really.... Nah, it's more like 12/14 per 100km if I'm honest. Think we all 'tweak' the figures a little to justify the ownership of these 'fuel effecient' British vehicles.... Buying this Patrol for the donor engine and driving it.. so easy, gets to 110kph so easily, is quiet, comfortable, cool.. Even after 300000 km. They do make a good vehicle, it has to be said. :(

[jerryd]

I got sent this pic from the 2012 Sydney Expo,I was told it was either nissan powered or it sat on nissan running gear. Must belong to someone on here I would have thought.

[disco2_dan]

Well I got 2 mates both with 80 series cruisers, ones the 4.5 petrol and ones the 4.2? I think, its turbo diesel any way, the petrol when driven slowly VERY slowly returns about 17L per hundred or normally driven 20L per hundred, and the one with the turbo diesel gets about 14L per hundred with a light load or towing his van about 16L per hundred, my v8 disco just towed 2.5T from Penrith to Stuart town and returned 14.5L per hundred which I was more then happy with considering I was sitting 10-15km over the speed limit the whole way and was giving it stick up all the hills.....

[rick130]

I got sent this pic from the 2012 Sydney Expo,I was told it was either nissan powered or it sat on nissan running gear. Must belong to someone on here I would have thought.

That's a GQ/GU front diff, radius arms and freewheeling hubs. It also has a very long nose, so maybe a TD42T shoehorned in too ?

[Dougal]

But why would you bother with a TD42 or toyota 6 when an Isuzu 4BD1T fits in, does 10km/l on a flat trip at 100km/h and puts out figures like this when fed 20psi from a $200 turbo?

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/02/139.jpg

400Nm from 1000-3,500rpm.
500Nm from 1500-2500rpm.
550Nm at 2000rpm.
140kw from 2,500 to 3,500rpm.

Add an intercooler, tweak to 24psi boost you need to step up in turbo size and you get this:
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2013/09/381.jpg

Stock injection pump is still not tapped out. It can do ~140cc/1000shots.
Discussion here: http://www.aulro.com/afvb/isuzu-landy-enthusiasts-section/169564-4bd1t-turbo-sizing-performance-prediction.html

[BigJon]

But why would you bother with a TD42 or toyota 6 when an Isuzu 4BD1T fits in, does 10km/l on a flat trip at 100km/h and puts out figures like this when fed 20psi from a $200 turbo?



Maybe because the 1HD-FTE is a much smoother engine that won't kill gearboxes with the torque pulses that the Isuzu suffers from.

[Dougal]

Maybe because the 1HD-FTE is a much smoother engine that won't kill gearboxes with the torque pulses that the Isuzu suffers from.

This is true. But I can buy a lot of very strong gearboxes for the price of a 1HD-FTE.
No-one has managed to kill an Isuzu gearbox behind a 4BD1T yet. It's just that landrover stuff that has a best-before date.

BTW, 1HD-FTE's can put out some extremely impressive numbers when fed the appropriate boost and fuel.

[flagg]

I got sent this pic from the 2012 Sydney Expo,I was told it was either nissan powered or it sat on nissan running gear. Must belong to someone on here I would have thought.

It's a GQ with a Series III body. They had a rusted out GQ with good chassis and running gear, and a mechanically dead Series III. There are a few pics on around the forum snuck in here and there.

My hat goes off to them, they did a fantastic job - every part of the.. thing.. was done by them without cutting corners. They even lengthened the doors and made their own interior that would rival any new car.

[Sitec]

Because I have a TD42 engine in 'stock' and I hate the clatter of fours! I am rethinking the original plan of using the Patrol gearbox though. It's sooooo long! Doubting the LR box will take the torque tho..... Mmmm!

[Dougal]

Because I have a TD42 engine in 'stock' and I hate the clatter of fours! I am rethinking the original plan of using the Patrol gearbox though. It's sooooo long! Doubting the LR box will take the torque tho..... Mmmm!

Even if the engine is free, the cost of the mods to make it fit will just add to the 50% extra fuel consumption. The TD42's may be tough, but they are not in any way efficient. The low efficiency means they need a lot of boost and fuel to make respectable power.

The truck 4BD1T's are very sweet motors. The original landrover 4BD1's were industrial spec, looser piston fit, generally noisier and don't have the sound covers either. Don't judge one by the other.

[uninformed]

Im just going to add that, LR people tell porkies about the fuel consumption and power as well IMO.

I have a 2.8tgv in one of the lightest 110 tray backs. When new, when run in, when rebuilt it would only return at best 12/100. When towing my 1.8t dual axle trailer it maxes out at about 115 on flat ground, no head wind.

Funny how I read of guys towing 2+t vans and being able to do 110 up an incline and get 11/km out of tdis etc.... :D

[rick130]

Im just going to add that, LR people tell porkies about the fuel consumption and power as well IMO.

I have a 2.8tgv in one of the lightest 110 tray backs. When new, when run in, when rebuilt it would only return at best 12/100. When towing my 1.8t dual axle trailer it maxes out at about 115 on flat ground, no head wind.

Funny how I read of guys towing 2+t vans and being able to do 110 up an incline and get 11/km out of tdis etc.... :D

And most Deefer odo's are around 7-8% out which throws the milage out.

I nail 11.5-11.8l/100km almost all the time fully loaded, so what are you doing ? :p

[Dougal]

The 93 RRC with a 300tdi was claimed:
8.6 litres/100km on the Urban cycle (which was probably different 20 years ago)
6.9 litres/100km at steady 56mph.
9.7 litres/100km at steady 75mph.

[jakeslouw]

Just bumping this thread: so nobody seems to have fitted a TD42 into a Defender?

I'm busy looking at this option because the TD42 is cheap over here as low kilo imports.

And I think a 25psi 4.2 in a 130 would make my toes curl.

I'd love any info anybody has on the possibility of this conversion being possible. Including whether I should consider R380/LT230 versus Nissan Patrol 5-speed/T100 or whatever.

Length and width don't seem to be an issue, but that TD42 is a TALL bugger isn't it?

[loanrangie]

Surely there are better options available locally ? the isuzu would be my first choice, have a look at the 3.6 4be to R380 D1 conversion.

[jakeslouw]

Surely there are better options available locally ? the isuzu would be my first choice, have a look at the 3.6 4be to R380 D1 conversion.

A low mileage TD42-T is only AUD$5500 over here.

And I can pick up a Cabstar box for it for around USD$500

But I'd consider the Isuzu options. We get 4BD1s, 4JG2s and 4JB1s over here, as well as the newer 4JJ1 etc. The 4BE1 probably not.

We have a local fabricator that makes up adapters, he has a Nissan RD28 kit as well.

I'd like a 6-pot for the rev range and the smoother power pulses.

[rick130]

I really like the old TD42T but they are a heavy lump! (But probably lighter than a 6BT or 6BD1T)

There are so many TD42's here in Oz but everyone uses the 4BD1T and puts up with the vibes!! [emoji23]

What about the Toyota 1HFZ? (Is that the right number? Or is it 1HFTE?)
The twin cam, 4 valve straight six out of the last of the 79 series.
It's one hell of a good engine.

[strangy]

1HDTE.
Amazing engine.
Son converted into his 80 series with 5 speed Auto.
IIR 1200 for the plug and play loom.
It’s lovely combo, smooth and power to spare.

IMO apart from comp vehicles, if either engine was seriously desired, I’d just get the vehicle it came in.
Aside from the typical LS conversions, anything non standard to LR is big outlay and no return.