1997 P38A HSE V8 good foundation for tough truck?

[Steve223]

Hello gen'ts,

I'm new to this section of AULRO, still looking for a "tough truck" I can build (or better get build) and came across a 1997 Land Rover Range Rover P38A HSE with 12k and zero modifications. Would this be a good foundation?

I read in one of the last 4wd action of a guy who put a TD5 engine in there and apparently he did it in a day?

Can I get give this a good lift and put 33' tires on?

Thanks a lot

Steve

[Keithy P38]

Have never heard of a td5 P38! Maybe in a classic Rangie though!

You can lift the P38 on airbags and put 33's on no worries, it won't be a comp truck by any stretch but will be damn capable as a road registered toy! Will go pretty much anywhere your tyres and diffs will lead you! Mine does better on zero lift and 30" tyres than mates 100 series on 33's and pootroll on 33's... The only thing the P38 doesn't have over them is the ability to swim (or drown gracefully).

Would be good to see one with heaps of custom barwork and twin lockers doing the hard tracks like myself!

Cheers
Keithy

[Steve223]

Hello Keith,

Thanks for your input, the guy actually swapped the TD5 from a Disco, Hm would need to do better then my D3 which is doing quite well, can you get front and rear locks for it?

thanks

Steve

[Keithy P38]

It will do better than a D3. More capable in terms of the end result - a D3 might still get you up that hill or over the washouts but the P38 will do it easier (better wheel travel and live axle suspension).

You can get lockers for them no worries. I run an Ashcroft rear locker in mine, you buy them from the UK for about $950 to your door. They are stronger and engage 3 times as far as ARB lockers (the pins that engage when you flick the switch), and they also don't leak air like ARB lockers.

Cheers
Keithy

[Steve223]

What kind of fuel economy do you get out of your V8?

[Keithy P38]

Depends on the driving! Around town I don't do much of, average about 14.5 to 15l/100km, most of what I do is highway or low range driving. Ill sit on 12l/100km fully loaded on the highway and average about 16l/100km if you throw a fair bit of low range driving into the mix.

Keeping in mind mine is a '99 HSE. Not sure what a gems 4.6 would be like.

Cheers
Keithy

[mtb_gary]

Steve
The Rangie is a bit like it's owner....it loves a drink:twobeers:. With a '96 4.6 GEMS I can get around 13.5 l/100 k on the highway with standard size wheels and tyres and 2 people on board. However, once the average speed gets over 100 and I am sitting on 110+ fuel consumption goes up to 15l/100 k. On a 5,700 k trip last year that had the car fully loaded with camping gear, extra fuel, water, beer and wine as well food etc and roof rack loaded on the roof we averaged 17.2l/100 k. For that trip i was running Cooper S/T 225/75/16's which I have since sold in favour of the Maxxis Big Horn 265/75/16's. The driving was mainly bitumen (Perth to Karijini National Park) with plenty of sand and dirt tracks along the way. My highway tyres are Pirelli Scorpion Zero 255/60/18's. for towing 2 tonne of boat add an additional 1.5 l/100 k.
Gary

[Steve223]

hi Gary, that’s not to much higher then my D3 TDV6 full kited and loaded

what do you think 10k a good price for a car with only 100k?

1997 HSE, V8 one owner, full service history and only 100k for 10k

cheers

steve

[Keithy P38]

That's a good price. With only 100k you must ask if there is a motive behind the sale.

Call State Roads (inspection company - privately owned not government) and have them inspect it before you lay down the coin. They do a comprehensive check, take photos and call you to verbally explain what they thought of the vehicle.

www.stateroads.com.au

Cheers
Keithy

[Steve223]

Thanks Keith need to keep that in mind,

Spoke to Davies Performance today and ask what I need to spent to trick it up
He suggested buying a TD5 defender as I would lose less money if I ever sell again.

He mentioned would not get bull bar or rear bar for P38 unless custom made.

I just like the RR and I'm 192 cm high think it would be much more comfortable

[Keithy P38]

It's more comfortable any day of the week! When you consider the purchase price and what you get for your money, you can't go past a P38! Plus the V8 rover motors sound great with a nice little exhaust system!

And you can now get a bull bar for them. Still no rear bars though.

[Steve223]

what is involved to lift car on airbags I think LLAMS does not work on P38?

just would like to gauge what money I would have to spent to make it outperform the D3 do you have an idea what the following would cost or where to buy so I can do the math

DP mentioned bushes would wear out quickly if car is further lifted?

[Keithy P38]

Hardrange (now closing for business early march if a buyer is not found) are the only people I know of who do a lift for the P38. Basically the kit is 2" spacers under the airbags, extended brake lines, extended height sensors, extended bump stops and Arnotts Gen III airbags. They were selling the kit for around $1800 from memory. The bags cost $1000 delivered if you buy them yourself, the rest you could make up if you knew a boilermaker and had a friend at pirtek! The kit also had longer shocks and double cardan uni joints from memory.

I'm running Gen III bags in mine (longer than factory bags by 3.5"), the computer can be calibrated to give lift with the Gen III's (as I have done), and they ride better. You will also need longer shocks if you lift it physically (using lift blocks). Since I've only "computer lifted" mine I've left the factory shocks on board. Mind you, I'm only an extra 1" to 1.5" over a factory P38's highest setting, plus the extra 1" I've gained out of larger tyres as well.

[Steve223]

Hm no more lift or spares then for the lift once they are gone?

[Keithy P38]

I doubt you'll need spares, but yeah nobody else makes them.

The main thing you would need for the lift would be the sensor extensions. Even then you can make them yourself, everything else in the lift kit can be made locally.

[benji]

33s won't fit on with air suspension, which is a shame. But it's not hard to put a coil lift under them and extend the bumpstops - then you can.

With the fuel economy - unless your having fun:twisted: you'll use less fuel than most tojo 6cyl diesels.

I get 12.4lt/100km on hwy, and 14.4 around town. A roof rack absolutely kills economy!!! But sometimes they're necessary.

I've seen a 2.7V6 Dsl in a p38. THere was a writeup in Landrover Enthusiast mag about 12 months ago - definately wasn't done in a day though.

[Keithy P38]

Paul + 3 other people on this forum run 33's with bags still under the bum! The old 33's come in many fashions, and I believe it to be the 255/85's that offer the least trouble.

Still had to trim a little though.

[Steve223]

Thanks a lot guys will make an offer to the guy for the HSE will see whether he accepts (pending pre purchase inspection)

[Keithy P38]

Good work mate!

Have you got another one in mind just in case it falls through?

Keep in mind with your inspection that its a rover, so small oil leaks are common but big ones are an owner who does not maintain his seals! And the roof lining is probably sagged!

Key things to look out for are the HEVAC "chequebook" symbol (could mean blend motors are gone or worse), the air suspension may have seen better days or could be completely overhauled, and sunroof and air con drains sometimes leak - a sign that the drains need unblocking, generally nothing worse.

Got a link so we can have a glance at it?

[DT-P38]

Make an offer to Paul and buy the Hard Rangie.

[PaulP38a]

Make an offer to Paul and buy the Hard Rangie.

Yeah, thanks Dave... was thinking the same. Most of the work is already done :)

Keithy - my EAS is perfect as you would expect, and augmented with EAS Emergency Bypass and on-board air for tyres and cleaning. The HEVAC behaves nicely most of the time (and I am including the Nanocom Evo when I sell the Hard Rangie for re-calibrating the blend motors if/when it plays up). No oil leaks recently since I changed the sump gasket (yes, it does have oil!).
Roof lining is perfect. Already has 4.1 diffs to match the 33" tyres and a rear air locker (disconnected air line as the solenoid leaks!)

Problems/issues: mine is a 4.0 pov pack not a 4.6 HSE, the driver's seat has a tear in it, it is not "pretty" (a few scratches and minor dents) and I don't wash it very often, the ball joint boots are cracked, steering wheel is off-centre (rotation), speedo is out 15% (use the 7" touch screen head-unit/GPS instead/ until you do the maths in your head, or buy the $200 re-calibration box).

Regardless of what happens to Hard Range, whether I sell it or close it down, the ability to lift a P38 with EAS another 50mm in order to fit 33" tyres and capability to improve off-road clearance under diffs will continue in some form...

If someone buys Hard Range, the HRA Lift Kit is a "hero product" as Dave says, and the new owner will be a fool to not continue with it.

If I close HRA down, I will happily share the insights we have gained over the years (our IP) with the P38 community, as it will no longer be a commercial interest.

My advice to Steve is to get a 99+ model if you can. Overall, they are a better package than the pre-99 models as they have 4W TC and a more efficient Engine Management System. My 99 4.0 has at least as much grunt as my previous 95 4.6.

My final thought about the P38 - if you drive it, you will want it. If you are not totally smitten with the P38 when you drive it, then run away... there is a major issue with that particular car, or with you ;)

Cheers, Paul.

[Steve223]

Make an offer to Paul and buy the Hard Rangie.

Lol yea if I had more clue about the whole mechanical site that would be tempting but I guess they selling because it does not generate the revenue they want. As important as it is to do what you love you still need to earn a crust otherwise the fun goes quickly....

http://www.carsales.com.au/private/details/land-rover-range-rover-1997-14331478

[Steve223]

Good work mate!

Have you got another one in mind just in case it falls through?

Keep in mind with your inspection that its a rover, so small oil leaks are common but big ones are an owner who does not maintain his seals! And the roof lining is probably sagged!

Key things to look out for are the HEVAC "chequebook" symbol (could mean blend motors are gone or worse), the air suspension may have seen better days or could be completely overhauled, and sunroof and air con drains sometimes leak - a sign that the drains need unblocking, generally nothing worse.

Got a link so we can have a glance at it?

The car supposedly is like new just used by rich family as the occasional drive, though roof lining starts to sag otherwise apparently in 1a condition

[Aussie]

I think their meaning purchase Paul's P38 not his business

[Keithy P38]

It appears straight and tidy from the photos! The interior has been looked after - a sign its had an owner that really looks after it. Looks good!

Or as mentioned above, Paul's Hard Range P38 is for sale with lift kit, 33's and rear locker and diff gearing all ready to rock at $11k!

Good luck mate!

[mtb_gary]

Steve
Looks good! With a lot of sitting around not moving check the rubbers (tyres, boots, hoses etc for perishing signs) as well as water in the oil from condensation. With such a straight clean looking original car at one level it seems a pity to want to modify.
Gary

[Steve223]

Steve
Looks good! With a lot of sitting around not moving check the rubbers (tyres, boots, hoses etc for perishing signs) as well as water in the oil from condensation. With such a straight clean looking original car at one level it seems a pity to want to modify.
Gary

thanks will, yes agree Nearly a pity to start modifying the car But if I buy it has to be the play can't have three cars just for driving on the street. car is Just listed so I will wait a couple of days and make an offer With the modifications I still would need to make I would not offer more than 8k So not sure whether he would go for that

[Keithy P38]

There's only one way to find out!

Here are 3 that I would be looking at... Very good condition and value for money.


http://carsales.mobi/cars/details/?R=13876708

http://carsales.mobi/cars/details/?R=14334651

http://carsales.mobi/cars/details/?R=14087459

[benji]

[QUOTE=Keithy P38;1860263]Paul + 3 other people on this forum run 33's with bags still under the bum! The old 33's come in many fashions, and I believe it to be the 255/85's that offer the least trouble.

Sorry; yes it can be done, but AFAIK not without the HRA lift kit (which I didn't think was going to be available); or at least thats what I thought....

[Keithy P38]

You are right, with standard bags/heights you won't fit 33's without scrubbing.

Little mis-communication but no harm done!

I think if you were prepared to have stuff fabricated yourself you could make the lift kit up, would be time consuming but could still be done.

[DT-P38]

I think their meaning purchase Paul's P38 not his business

Yep that's what I meant. All the work is done on The Hard Rangie. If the pov pack is an issue, swap out a second hand HSE interior from a cheap wreck... There is a dude in Melbourne wrecking a couple of P38's a month with VERY reasonable parts prices.

[Steve223]

Yep that's what I meant. All the work is done on The Hard Rangie. If the pov pack is an issue, swap out a second hand HSE interior from a cheap wreck... There is a dude in Melbourne wrecking a couple of P38's a month with VERY reasonable parts prices.

is the car mentioned somewhere listed for sale? their web site does not list the car

[Keithy P38]

It's listed here on "The Marketplace". Paul has also commented in this very thread. Look for PaulP38a.

[Steve223]

Strange tapatalk omitted Paul's post saw it now though, could not find car in marketplace though.

[PaulP38a]

The Hard Rangie P38 is sold guys, sorry. The Marketplace ad has expired and been pruned out by the look of it. I didn't want to advertise it on the usual carsales, ebay sites to avoid the tyre-kickers and scammers.

Came to an arrangement with an enthusiastic couple here in Canberra yesterday (we have been talking for a couple of weeks) and the car should be changing hands in 1-2 weeks after I get the rrp38a plates and a few other bits swapped over.

Steve - my previous suggestion of going for a 99+ model stands. You will appreciate the better engine management and 4W TC.

Cheers, Paul.

[Steve223]

The Hard Rangie P38 is sold guys, sorry. The Marketplace ad has expired and been pruned out by the look of it. I didn't want to advertise it on the usual carsales, ebay sites to avoid the tyre-kickers and scammers.

Came to an arrangement with an enthusiastic couple here in Canberra yesterday (we have been talking for a couple of weeks) and the car should be changing hands in 1-2 weeks after I get the rrp38a plates and a few other bits swapped over.

Steve - my previous suggestion of going for a 99+ model stands. You will appreciate the better engine management and 4W TC.

Cheers, Paul.

Thanks for the advise Paul, I guess I will keep looking I'm not in a hurry