V8 Bruce Davis chip upgrade

[disco2_dan]

Well I bit the bullet and booked my v8 00 discovery in to get chipped next Thursday 8am! I'm hoping this will live up to my expectations, I will be more then happy if I get a little more power threw the full rev range and if I get an extra 70-100km per tank! I will let you all know how it goes!

[Landy Smurf]

One of my friends parents got one from there and said it made a bit of an improvement

[CJT]

What sort of money are they asking for that?

Just wondering as when I had been looking into options for mine, I came to the conclusion that the best was to fit a Haltech Interceptor and tune with that, price was around $1300 from memory including the tune.

[disco2_dan]

What sort of money are they asking for that?

Just wondering as when I had been looking into options for mine, I came to the conclusion that the best was to fit a Haltech Interceptor and tune with that, price was around $1300 from memory including the tune.

Yeah I looked at that option too but they couldn't garentee any better results then the Davis chip, both stated 13kw from memory, but talking to the old cocky up at katoomba Scott's auto one and he was told the sand thing but when he got his car back he actually got a 25 or 27kw increase (can't remember what one it was he said bug one of the 2) and the Davis chip is only $600 fitted so I thought well for 600 I will be happy with 13kw and an extra 100km per tank!!

[ozscott]

Mine has had a crow tow cam and port matching done...so its probably begging for a better tune to take advantage. Does anyone know how SGI goes with the chip?

Cheers

[disco2_dan]

What's sgi?

[Disco Muppet]

What's sgi?

Sequential LPG Injection.

[ozscott]

Sorry mate - yes. I hate acronyms but the need for quick posts outways that!

Cheers

PS. SYL

[walker]

Well I bit the bullet and booked my v8 00 discovery in to get chipped next Thursday 8am! I'm hoping this will live up to my expectations, I will be more then happy if I get a little more power threw the full rev range and if I get an extra 70-100km per tank! I will let you all know how it goes!

Dan, when you go in there, could you ask him about remapping for a 4.6 in a D2? I have a 4.6 bottom end with all 4.0 top end but as far as I know the ECU has never been remapped to take advantage of this.

I know there is a guy in the uk who is doing it but I would prefer someone in Aus.

[disco2_dan]

Dan, when you go in there, could you ask him about remapping for a 4.6 in a D2? I have a 4.6 bottom end with all 4.0 top end but as far as I know the ECU has never been remapped to take advantage of this.

I know there is a guy in the uk who is doing it but I would prefer someone in Aus.

Yeah mate no problemo, I will show him the post so I don't forget exactly what u got and what you want, I'm pretty sure he will have a solution for you

[Pedro_The_Swift]

he actually got a 25 or 27kw increase

am quite happy to believe this if its the same dyno both times:D

[disco2_dan]

I believe it was the same dunk both times as was my understanding (now I may be wrong here) it was done by Davis before and after it was chipped both on the day it was chipped....

[rusty05]

Would be interesting to see how you find it.

I did mine around 2 years, was told I would get an extra 100km per tank as well. (this was the clincher in doing it)
Approx 10-15kw increase I recall the quote, it was also $600.

you can tell the difference when driving in mid rev range.
But no improvement with km/tank

It actaully went backwards by approx 1%.

Keen to see your results!

[disco2_dan]

Would be interesting to see how you find it.

I did mine around 2 years, was told I would get an extra 100km per tank as well. (this was the clincher in doing it)
Approx 10-15kw increase I recall the quote, it was also $600.

you can tell the difference when driving in mid rev range.
But no improvement with km/tank

It actaully went backwards by approx 1%.

Keen to see your results!


Well the extra km per tank is the main reason I'm doing it aswell!! The extra power was just the Icing on the cake...
Was this the Davis chip you got??
I spose even if I don't get the extra km per tank the little more power will be helpful going up the mountains and towing the boat around

[Hoges]

Well I bit the bullet and booked my v8 00 discovery in to get chipped next Thursday 8am! I'm hoping this will live up to my expectations, I will be more then happy if I get a little more power threw the full rev range and if I get an extra 70-100km per tank! I will let you all know how it goes!

From the MY date am assuming your is a Thor upgrade engine with Bosch motronic engine management? If so, good luck with it... I'm surprised they have a chip unless it's a "piggy back" type since for all intents and purposes the motronic system as fitted to the 4.0 and 4.6 V8s from 1999 -2002 is virtually tweak proof...deliberately designed that way by BMW engineers...

I see Davis Performance offers a flash retune for 2002-2004 V8 Discos but nothing for 1999 -2001 ...

Is yours a GEMS motor?

[Scouse]

From the MY date am assuming your is a Thor upgrade engine with Bosch motronic engine management? If so, good luck with it... I'm surprised they have a chip unless it's a "piggy back" type since for all intents and purposes the motronic system as fitted to the 4.0 and 4.6 V8s from 1999 -2002 is virtually tweak proof...deliberately designed that way by BMW engineers...

I see Davis Performance offers a flash retune for 2002-2004 V8 Discos but nothing for 1999 -2001 ...

Is yours a GEMS motor?All V8 D2s are Thor.

[disco2_dan]

From the MY date am assuming your is a Thor upgrade engine with Bosch motronic engine management? If so, good luck with it... I'm surprised they have a chip unless it's a "piggy back" type since for all intents and purposes the motronic system as fitted to the 4.0 and 4.6 V8s from 1999 -2002 is virtually tweak proof...deliberately designed that way by BMW engineers...

I see Davis Performance offers a flash retune for 2002-2004 V8 Discos but nothing for 1999 -2001 ...

Is yours a GEMS motor?

Yes it's the Thor motor and its dead stock not any type of upgrade what so ever, I also can't find anything on his site about it but when I rang him and spoke to Bruce he said its a chip and it takes 1-1.5 hours to install and I was very clear that it was a 00 build date and it was a Thor motor....

[biggin]

...................
you can tell the difference when driving in mid rev range.
But no improvement with km/tank

It actaully went backwards by approx 1%.
....................

This is about what I would expect from a $600 chip.
Has anyone actually done better?

[disco2_dan]

This is about what I would expect from a $600 chip.
Has anyone actually done better?

Well I know the old cocky got a 25kw increase and 80-130km extra per tank

[biggin]

Thanks Dan, but I was looking for first hand results.

I somehow doubt the old cocky had this sort of an improvement solely by installing a chip.
It seems too good to be true.

And you know what that means.;)

[Hoges]

Both of these references are worth reading so you can ask proper questions of Davis Performance to determine what you might be getting for your $600...

Motronic 5.2 Reprogramming (http://www.318ti.org/notebook/motronic_reprogramming/index.html)


and

www.p38arover.com/rover/p38a/Engine.../BOSCH_521_Systems.pdf

plus

web.nanocom.it/.../BOSCH%20MOTRONIC%20V8%20P38%20and...

the ECU is easily turned into a "brick" and can only be changed 14 times! So if you want to experiment with different maps... tough luck.

I've often wondered if a modified GEMS solution using Thor sensors might not have been a better option for remapping... but I don't have the smarts to do this :(

[disco2_dan]

Well I did see the dyno results if that helps

[disco2_dan]

Both of these references are worth reading so you can ask proper questions of Davis Performance to determine what you might be getting for your $600...

Motronic 5.2 Reprogramming (http://www.318ti.org/notebook/motronic_reprogramming/index.html)


and

www.p38arover.com/rover/p38a/Engine.../BOSCH_521_Systems.pdf

plus

web.nanocom.it/.../BOSCH%20MOTRONIC%20V8%20P38%20and...

the ECU is easily turned into a "brick" and can only be changed 14 times! So if you want to experiment with different maps... tough luck.

I've often wondered if a modified GEMS solution using Thor sensors might not have been a better option for remapping... but I don't have the smarts to do this :(
The p38 link didn't work, and the first one is for the Thor motor?

[rusty05]

Well the extra km per tank is the main reason I'm doing it aswell!! The extra power was just the Icing on the cake...
Was this the Davis chip you got??
I spose even if I don't get the extra km per tank the little more power will be helpful going up the mountains and towing the boat around


Yep the Davis one.

D2a as mentioned can be reflashed, so its still your ecu that they remap.

[Hoges]

The Bosch Motronic 5.2 EMS was used in BMW 3 series, as well as by Ferrari and Land Rover. Land Rover introduced it with the Bosch upgrade known as the Thor motor. Previously used Lucas SAGEM system. BMW engineers seemed to have gone out of their way to make the Motronic 5.2 system highly proprietary as explained in the first reference.

I am very surprised that BD Performance are reflashing the EPROM of the Thor Motronic EMS through the OBDII port and charging $600 for the privilege...

I might be sceptical :eek::wasntme: but I'd really like to see the results


EDIT: check out this -applies also to D2 Thor V8 http://www.aulro.com/afvb/p38a-range-rover/134470-p38-after-market-chip.html though things may have moved on from here...but I doubt it

[Collins]

The information on the Davis website is rather confusing as the years 1999 - 2004 cover the entire D2 production period :
[I]Extract from Davis Performance web site
'Petrol Engines V8i

2002 - 2004 Flashable (programmable) chip through the diagnostic port
Erase the management program and re-program.
1999 - 2004 Series 11
Has a non programmable ECU replace chip'[I]

I have spoken to Bruce a couple of times about this & have been assured that it is worthwhile and should see an appreciable increase in performance. Other forum members have said that they have noticed gains after rechipping/reflashing.

[disco2_dan]

not sure if this is relevent hoges but this was a gems re-chip i think

How to chip your Gems Rover V8 ECU - YouTube

[smally4.6]

G/day Disco2 Dan
How did it all go , are you happy with the chip upgrade:)
Cheers smally

[disco2_dan]

G/day Disco2 Dan
How did it all go , are you happy with the chip upgrade:)
Cheers smally

Lol I forgot it was today I thought it was tomorrow, he rang this arvo and asked what happened I said nothing wasn't I booked in tomorrow he said no it was today I was like sooooo sorry he said no worries come in tomorrow at 8am...

[justinc]

Had a D1 3.9 ECU chipped By Bruce Today, I'll get it back tomorrow via express post. Good service and a good product for these. Gives a great strong idle, excellent midrange and economy remains unchanged or better. (Not for the first few tanks though as the extra poke is experienced:cool: Must also have a little more advance dialed in, 12degBTDC, and a functioning vac advance unit. Also helps a little to increase the MAF output from .9 to 1V up to 1.2V.


JC

[disco2_dan]

Good to hear JC I'm glad to hear input from you as I know your a guru :) I will be posting as soon as I get back my initial thoughts and feelings, fuel wise I will put up after a couple weeks and 4-5 tanks, I'm really excited and hoping the results will be good, also hoping he does a before and after dyno for me so I can post up the results for every one too see!!

[disco2_dan]

Well I'm at Davis ATM and Bruce took my truck for a drive and come back and said she is running like a pig!!! Dam and there I was thinking it was running great!! Turns out the oxygen sensors were disconnected!!! And the air flow meter was only running at 70%!! Very impressed with Bruce and the service so far! So getting new airflow meter and hopefully the oxygen sensors are ok then his going to chip it so I'm hoping its going to be going awesome when his done!

[disco2_dan]

Oh and he said its been running in limp mode!!!

[Pedro_The_Swift]

these live feeds are very exciting!:D

[Yorkie]

yes, how is the coffee quality?, any biscuits?
:)

[disco2_dan]

Yes yorkie The spare parts guy makes a good coffee! also when asked about suspension was very knowledgable and friendly! Over all I'm very very impressed so far! The car should be ready soon so i can't wait to see how it goes!!!
Butterflies much!! Lol

[Tombie]

Worst thing... You wont know how much difference the Chip makes!

Because if it was running so 'bad' before its going to feel much better anyway :)

[Psimpson7]

exactly... you may well see 25kw.. its just that 23 of them had gone missing.

[Hoges]

Impressed .. sort of! :angel: can you find out exactly what has been done... did he simply reprogram the existing chips through the OBDII plug or did it require the ECU to be removed and a new chip with a different fuel map to be substituted on the main circuit board ?

Am wondering if the P38 Rangie has a different version of the Motronic system from the later model D2s. If this is the case then there may be some hope for frustrated P38 folk!!:eek:

Can you ask him if he can he perform the same reprogramming on the Thor ECU in a 4.6 P38?

cheers

[Tombie]

P38 is Pull ECU and change chip

[Hoges]

P38 is Pull ECU and change chip

Does this imply that the late model (2002-2004) D2 with the reputed "same" engine as the P38 in fact has a different EFI ECU which allows tinkering?

If so what might prevent an ECU from a late model D2 being swapped into a P38 and then remapped to get rid of the flat spots... thoughts?

[biggin]

Worst thing... You wont know how much difference the Chip makes!

Because if it was running so 'bad' before its going to feel much better anyway :)
x2
I thought for once we were going to get some firsthand comment on how good the chip is. Guess not!:(
And more importantly, if it's worth it.

[walker]

Does anyone know if anyone on Melbourne does this type of thing. I have heard plenty of good things about Bruce David but I would prefer to take the car in to someone in Melbourne.

[disco2_dan]

Well finialy got home, yes I agree it's a shame the way the cookie crumbled with the oxygen senses and air flow meter :( but on the plus side HOLY HELL!! It honestly feels like a different car! I put my foot down and she gets up and goes like an SS or XR8... There is a huge difference but like you guys said its hard to assess the difference that the chip made :( overall I'm still happy there is a huge difference in the sound of the exhaust note and like I said put your foot down and it's at redline incredibly fast... I will be filling the fuel tank up Tuesday so I will post up the economy difference, Bruce was saying that with how the car was running it should have been sucking petrol like its running out of fashion, when I told him my fuel economy he was shocked... Would anyone know why someone would unplug the oxygen sensors? Oh and he can reflash the 4.6 I'm pretty sure for about the $600 mark

[smally4.6]

x2
I thought for once we were going to get some firsthand comment on how good the chip is. Guess not!:(
And more importantly, if it's worth it.

I have had the ecu upgrade for quite a while now....
Its worth the $ and the performance is noticeable .. I'm running 235/85 tyres.....
Towing a 1.7 ton caravan is a lot easier with the extra torque...
Fuel wise I would say its slightly better...
I have recently towed our van to Brisbane and was very pleased with it:D
Well worth the coin......
Cheers smally

[Andrew D]

If a scientist was conducting this experiment, he just through the test tube in the bin and turned the bunsen burner off. (& cracked a beer).

I would be interested to see a chap with a D2 who is currently achieving 16 - 17 litres per 100 in city travel have the chip installed. Then give us the run down. I would love even more to see V8 driver stick it to the Td5. Not that V8s are not already doing that.

By the way Dan, I'm still happy you have your rig running like it should.

Regards
Andrew

[Disco Muppet]

I would be interested to see a chap with a D2 who is currently achieving 16 - 17 litres per 100 in city travel have the chip installed. Then give us the run down. I would love even more to see V8 driver stick it to the Td5.

Good luck :angel:

Dan, glad you're pleased with your results :)
I'd be happy just to have mine drivable, I hate driving my toyota :mad:

[Hoges]

Well finialy got home, ........... when I told him my fuel economy he was shocked... Would anyone know why someone would unplug the oxygen sensors? Oh and he can reflash the 4.6 I'm pretty sure for about the $600 mark

Disconnecting the O2 sensors allows the engine to run "open loop" i.e. to a predetermined fuel map. Perhaps they thought they'd get better performance than having a dynamically adjustable setup which is what happens with properly operating O2 sensors i.e. a "closed loop" situation.
Some vehicles run open loop until the engine reaches correct operating temp. ...at which stage the O2 sensors are switched on and the vehicle goes "closed loop"

[ozscott]

0pen loop defaults to a rich tune...goes hard but I gets poor economy.

Cheers

[Andrew D]

I only have the front O2 sensors. The rears have been blanked and I still achieve the 16 -17 litre per 100 for city travel.

No point chipping my car with regards to your comments Hoges?

Regards
Andrew

[ozscott]

Andrew I understood that all oz discos only had upstream o2's unlike NAS that have both.

Cheers

[disco2_dan]

Andrew I understood that all oz discos only had upstream o2's unlike NAS that have both.

Cheers

From what Bruce said there are 2, 1 I think is up in the engine bay end and the other I believe is under the car somewhere, where ever they are he had to let it cool down for an hour before he could get to them or he said he would burn the hell out of his hands.....from his expression I'm guessing he learnt that lesson the hard way lol

[disco2_dan]

Thanks hoges that prob explains it! Would that be why it was in limp mode then?

[ozscott]

Interesting..mine only has 2 in total.

Cheers

[clubagreenie]

AU spec only requires 2 O2 sensors, both are located (at least on the D2) on the down pipes, pre cat. The other 2 in US spec models are located post cat.

[Hoges]

AU spec only requires 2 O2 sensors, both are located (at least on the D2) on the down pipes, pre cat. The other 2 in US spec models are located post cat.

x2
The NAS vehicles AFAIK also have extra kit bolted on such as EGR and SAI (secondary air injection). Having the extra set of O2 sensors downstream of the cats monitors the cats' performance/ efficiency, data from which no doubt feeds back and regulates the EGR/SAI...

[Hoges]

Thanks hoges that prob explains it! Would that be why it was in limp mode then?

I really don't know re. the "limp mode" for the EFI. Can understand why it may have felt sluggish prior to taking it in for the rechip given that the MAF was deficient and the O2 sensors disconnected. Possibly BD meant that when the system detects these problems it may have been programmed to use a restricted data set from the full fuel mapping database as a compromise performance profile pending faults being cleared.

Somewhere I read that disconnecting the O2 sensors and/or a faulty MAF will trigger the MIL light on NAS spec vehicles, but not on non-NAS variants. So, it's no surprise that without physically checking them, you were not to know that the O2 sensors were 'off the air'.

Re fuel range: It really does depend on load /distance and traffic density. My P38 drinks fuel at around 20+ l/100km on short, heavy traffic trips (which is why I generally won't drive it unless I'm doing about 50km ...) yet for Bris-Toowoomba return (250km all up) this figure drops to 11.5-12 L/100km (at the pump). Mind you, the wife's ASTRA 1.8 automatic only gets 12.5 L/100km around the inner city (Bris) but 6.1 -6.4 L/100km on the Toowoomba run...

[clubagreenie]

When the MAF fails the system may flip into open loop mode and if the MAF completely dumps sending a signal then it'll stop fuel (no air coming in according to MAF) but then the O2 sensors see unburnt O2 and say add fuel.

Had this issue a while back and lead to a rebuild of the auto as the symptoms were just like a slipping auto.

[disco2_dan]

Well filled the tank up the other night and went to ourimba today to see relo's and well it a different car, no probs accellorating up any hills in 5th gear at hwy speeds plus did about 20-30km off road prob 10km of which was low range and I'm pretty sure it's on par with before, about 12.5L per hundred, but won't be 100% sure till I fill up again I'm upto about 300km and its in the same spot as usual only difference is the amount of power, now I know the O2 sensors and airflow meter will account for quite a percent too but taking that into account I'm still happy with the difference..... I would like to be able to go for A run with someone who has got a stock one just to guesstimate how much difference there actually is, I would think as an absolute shot in the dark but compared to what it was and is now its about 40% difference... Now I'm prob going to get shredded for saying that but hey it's just my "feeling" the difference....

[walker]

It is a V8 isn't it? 12.5 l/100???

[Tombie]

First - Really glad you're happy with the result...

But 40%.. No way.... :)

Not from a chip on a Rover Petrol V8... Closer to 15% maximum.

Again, as long as you're happy.. The driving experience has improved for you and you are enjoying driving it now - that's all that counts.

Have you owned it quite a while? If so, like shocks you probably havent noticed it getting to the state it was before the chip. Its such a gradual decay in performance.

The mapping would have given a bit more in the mid range though, so you would be getting more torque right in the 'driving band' of the rev range.

[disco2_dan]

First - Really glad you're happy with the result...

But 40%.. No way.... :)

Not from a chip on a Rover Petrol V8... Closer to 15% maximum.

Again, as long as you're happy.. The driving experience has improved for you and you are enjoying driving it now - that's all that counts.

Have you owned it quite a while? If so, like shocks you probably havent noticed it getting to the state it was before the chip. Its such a gradual decay in performance.

The mapping would have given a bit more in the mid range though, so you would be getting more torque right in the 'driving band' of the rev range.

Sorry I ment the 40% including the airflow meter and both O2 sensors and chip, I've had the car prob 7 months now and it's been the same since I bought it, I was actually happy with the way it went that's why I never suspected anything was wrong... 12.5L per hundred consistently unloaded, car trailer with a car on car weighed 1.4 ton and trailer was 1050kg plus all the other stuff in the car and did 14.5L per hundred Penrith to Stuart town cruising just over the speed limit the whole way so economy was no indication either not to mention I was still whooping young blokes on their p's in little squirts lol so really was shocked and a little confused when he jumped in it gave it a boot full up the road and come back saying its was running like a **** box!!! Hahahaha but who am I to be offended by what he said ( I really was quite offended and shocked but hey he would know right!!) so any way each time he took it for a burn up the road I could hear the difference in the note of the exhaust and the way the motor reved, like I said it was shocking the difference from driving there and driving home......

[walker]

Is this the fuel economy thst everyone is getting? I don't get anywhere near this. I do have a lift, bar etc but I will get about 18-19 around town just doing short trips and 16 on highway.

[brenno]

12.5L per hundred consistently unloaded, car trailer with a car on car weighed 1.4 ton and trailer was 1050kg plus all the other stuff in the car and did 14.5L per hundred Penrith to Stuart

Shhhhhh... You'll have the Td5 crew all looking to swap over to the (far superior) V8.

Glad you're happy with the results.

I'm not surprised that you think it's a 40% gain factoring in the MAF and o2 sensor issues.

It can't have been running too well before the chip and fix up. You wouldn't have known though, as you've had nothing to compare it to.

[brenno]

Is this the fuel economy thst everyone is getting? I don't get anywhere near this. I do have a lift, bar etc but I will get about 18-19 around town just doing short trips and 16 on highway.

I'm getting around 16L - 17L per 100 or thereabouts. Most of my driving is short trips, and I only work 6.5km's from home.

That's with lift, 33's, arb bar, etc... And, I'm on standard diff gearing at the moment too.

[ozscott]

The best round town economy I got from brand new was a repeatable 14l per 100k. Mines a manual which got better economy than the autos. I have now had head porting and a crow tow cam and new valve seats and timing gear and tappets and excellent compression. Mines a HC and I still dont get anything like 12l per 100k...to do that I would have to ttavel everywhere on the highway at 85kph...then again I have 31inch at2 tyres roof rack tjm front bar tow and recovery gear onboard alongwith lpg

Cheers

[Eevo]

just a thought on economy

4l engine = 16l/100km which is 4L fuel per 1L engine
2.5l engine = 10/100km which is 4L fuel per 1L engine.

in terms of volumetric efficiency, they are the same.

[walker]

You need to put a smiley face or wink to show you are being funny or sarcastic!:D

[Eevo]

You need to put a smiley face or wink to show you are being funny or sarcastic!:D

but i wasn't being funny or sarcastic :(

[Disco Muppet]

Shhhhhh... You'll have the (far superior) Td5 crew all looking to swap over to the V8.


Fixed :p
Anyway, not a chance!
Pah! 12.5L!
Mine gets better than that....
In the last week of driving I've gotten an astonishing 0l/100km!.......
......Because it's in the carport, broken :( :mad:
Glad your happy with your results dan :ohyes:
Now all you need to do is convert it to a 4.6 and you'll have a even cooler petrol bill :D
Nicely done mate.
Cheers
Muppet

[disco2_dan]

Nah if I was going to do anything like that muppet I would get one of those 5L 400hp motors from the uk lol oh we thought ours were bad on economy.... Helped my mate pick up a 4runner from Newcastle the other night, hwy driving it did 20L per 100 it's got a 96 senator 215i motor in it

[Yorkie]

Any tickets yet? ;)

[brenno]

......Because it's in the carport, it's always broken :( :mad:

Fixed ;)

[disco2_dan]

Any tickets yet? ;)

Nah no tickets Liam lol I do speed a lot but its usually only 10kmh over the limit so 99% of the time the cops don't even give me a look!!

[Disco Muppet]

Fixed ;)

hmm....one breakdown in 235k kms, I'll take my chances :angel:

[brenno]

hmm....one breakdown in 235k kms, I'll take my chances :angel:

Really??

Uh oh... 235k is about the time when they really start giving you headaches. :wasntme:


I must say, I do enjoy our Td5 vs (the completely superior) V8 tete-a-tete Mr Muppet. :thumbsup:

[Disco Muppet]

Really??

Uh oh... 235k is about the time when they really start giving you headaches. :wasntme:


I must say, I do enjoy our Td5 vs (the completely superior) V8 tete-a-tete. :thumbsup:

Oh likewise. :twisted:
Hmmm, I seem to recall V8s get a little iffy at 200k + as well.....
Do you put things in smaller fonts as it's what the little voice in your head that, deep down you know is lying, keeps telling you? (not meant as a barbed comment, just consider it my return to your serve :) ) :p

[brenno]

Oh likewise. :twisted:
Hmmm, I seem to recall V8s get a little iffy at 200k + as well.....
Do you put things in smaller fonts as it's what the little voice in your head that, deep down you know is lying, keeps telling you? (not meant as a barbed comment, just consider it my return to your serve :) ) :p

Touche.

No need to explain your comments mate... It takes a lot to offend me. ;)

Re. the small font. It probably happened accidentally whilst I was moving my completely operational, exceptionally powerful, and running like a dream V8, from out in the street into the driveway. :p

Can't leave it out... I don't want some envious Td5 owner breaking in a taking it for a joyride to feel what a rumbling V8 goes like. :angel:

By the way, I do hope you get yours back on the road soon mate.

[Disco Muppet]

I grew up on a V8 D2, I'm intimately familiar with them ;)
If I was able to drive one legally, maybe I'd have one.
Then again maybe not.
A V8 county though? Tempting... :twisted:
Thanks mate, looking at it tomorrow and if all's well it should be a 2 hour job top.
If not then hey, I get that top end rebuild I always wanted :eek: :twisted: :mad:

[brenno]

Thanks mate, looking at it tomorrow and if all's well it should be a 2 hour job top.
If not then hey, I get that top end rebuild I always wanted :eek: :twisted: :mad:

Let's hope it's easy, and not expensive.

[disco2_dan]

Ok guys just gone threw my first tank of fuel, now it's just clicked over 534km and the fuel lights come on so that means it usually has 15L left, so it's slightly less then normal which was for the last 3 tanks before the upgrade was 587km when the light came on.... But factoring in my right foots been a little heavier then normal due to "testing out" the new power curve and the fact I did a little off roading at ourimba last weekend, I think that's a pretty acceptable figure and I think I can work on it a little bit....

[SPROVER]

That's awesome.You have to be happy with those figures.

[Freightdog]

DISCO


I grew up on a V8 D2, I'm intimately familiar with them ;)
If I was able to drive one legally, maybe I'd have one.
Then again maybe not.
A V8 county though? Tempting... :twisted:

I reckon the only one on this forum that thinks you will NOT get a V8 disco when you are old enough is YOU!:)

[Disco Muppet]

DISCO



I reckon the only one on this forum that thinks you will NOT get a V8 disco when you are old enough is YOU!:)

I'd be right too :D

[disco2_dan]

I'd be right too :D

Lol keep telling yourself that.... One day you won't believe it hehehehe

[Signal1]

Is this the fuel economy thst everyone is getting? I don't get anywhere near this. I do have a lift, bar etc but I will get about 18-19 around town just doing short trips and 16 on highway.

My 4.6 D2 with just on 50K on the motor averages 17L/100 if driven sedately otherwise 20L/100. Between Wednesday night and Monday night running around with the Show, I went through three tanks of premium :eek: :(:dbcry:

I watch these threads with interest. I would really like to tweak it but seems like somewhat of a black art

[Hoges]

Ok guys just gone threw my first tank of fuel, now it's just clicked over 534km and the fuel lights come on so that means it usually has 15L left, so it's slightly less then normal which was for the last 3 tanks before the upgrade was 587km when the light came on.... But factoring in my right foots been a little heavier then normal due to "testing out" the new power curve and the fact I did a little off roading at ourimba last weekend, I think that's a pretty acceptable figure and I think I can work on it a little bit....

Based on a 95L nominal tank capacity, that gives you 534 km for approx 80L = 15L/100km vs 13.6 l/100km previously... quite reasonable! Be interested to see figures for a "controlled" trial!:D

[disco2_dan]

Well a bit of one will be tomorrow, I'm towing a car trailer tomorrow from blacktown to moruya empty, then loading up the 82 single cab hilux with a 253 v8 tub tray, then heading home.... So will be interesting comparison from the last time I towed the car out Stuart town before the chip and oxygen sensors were hooked up, oh plus me the missus and 2 mates lol I'm hoping about 17L/100 give or take.....

[Disco EMU]

I'm towing a car trailer tomorrow from blacktown to moruya

Moruya? That's my old hometown!

[disco2_dan]

Moruya? That's my old hometown!

Any one you want me to egg? Lol

[Disco Muppet]

Any one you want me to egg? Lol

First tojo driver you see :angel: :wasntme:

[Pedro_The_Swift]

My 4.6 D2 with just on 50K on the motor averages 17L/100 if driven sedately otherwise 20L/100. Between Wednesday night and Monday night running around with the Show, I went through three tanks of premium :eek: :(:dbcry:

I watch these threads with interest. I would really like to tweak it but seems like somewhat of a black art

I need a 4.6 fuel map anyway so I will be going here--
Tornado Chips (http://www.rangerovers.net/rrupgrades/engine/tornado/index.html)

[walker]

My 4.6 D2 with just on 50K on the motor averages 17L/100 if driven sedately otherwise 20L/100. Between Wednesday night and Monday night running around with the Show, I went through three tanks of premium :eek: :(:dbcry:

I watch these threads with interest. I would really like to tweak it but seems like somewhat of a black art

Glad it's not just me Pete. We really need to find someone to remap our 4.6's to improve mid range power and economy.

[Pedro_The_Swift]

this thing is just so quick off the mark now,,,
but when you add in the long pedal throw and the fuel map hole I can see how a new map makes sense.

would really be interesting to swap 4L and 4.6L ECU's and see what difference there is,,

[elshano]

Hmm those Tornado chips sound the business. One on fleabay for about 650 landed.
Rover V8 Tornado ECU Chip V8 EFI 3 9 4 2 V8's Morgan TVR Kitcar Dax MG MGB RV8 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rover-V8-Tornado-ECU-Chip-V8-EFi-3-9-4-2-V8s-Morgan-TVR-Kitcar-Dax-MG-MGB-RV8-/151007727734?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item2328c31076)

No mention of 4.0 Thor though?

[Disco Muppet]

Hmm those Tornado chips sound the business. One on fleabay for about 650 landed.
Rover V8 Tornado ECU Chip V8 EFI 3 9 4 2 V8's Morgan TVR Kitcar Dax MG MGB RV8 | eBay (http://www.ebay.com/itm/Rover-V8-Tornado-ECU-Chip-V8-EFi-3-9-4-2-V8s-Morgan-TVR-Kitcar-Dax-MG-MGB-RV8-/151007727734?pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item2328c31076)

No mention of 4.0 Thor though?

AFAIK the 3.9 and the 4.0 are the same, just advertising ****.

[OffTrack]

The advert is for a Lucas 14cux chip. The Lucas ECU's were used on Disco 1's. The D2 V8 uses a Bosch Motronic ECU.

[elshano]

There you go, I knew it couldn't be that simple!

[disco2_dan]

First tojo driver you see :angel: :wasntme:

Lol DEAL!! First stop tomorrow to pick up one of the boys.... His a hilux driver lol

[disco2_dan]

So far 459km off 61L of fuel, that was all the way there towing a 600kg empty car trailer and a little bit back with the hilux on the back, so that's not bad going I think....

[Hoges]

So far 459km off 61L of fuel, that was all the way there towing a 600kg empty car trailer and a little bit back with the hilux on the back, so that's not bad going I think....

13.3L/100km... very good indeed!

[disco2_dan]

Ok now the total trip was 795km and total fuel was 121L so that's 15.2L/100 which I'm more then happy with really

[mrapocalypse]

That's what you'd get from a Jap Diesel in a Niss or Toyo.

Happy Dayz.

[smally4.6]

I have had the ecu upgrade for quite a while now....
Its worth the $ and the performance is noticeable .. I'm running 235/85 tyres.....
Towing a 1.7 ton caravan is a lot easier with the extra torque...
Fuel wise I would say its slightly better...
I have recently towed our van to Brisbane and was very pleased with it:D
Well worth the coin......
Cheers smally

Been raining here in tas for the last 2 days, had time to go through my trip log to gold coast towing our caravan late last year.
These fuel figures are mainly all towing .......
The best fuel economy was 17.7 ltrs /100k mainly freeway driving sitting on speed 85k/95klms ....
The worst I recorded was driving over the mountains and the figures were 23ltrs/100k
I did have 3 weeks at the gold coast so these fuel figures were excluded from the calculation.
I traveled approximately 8138k minus 2500klms at the gold coast.
The average fuel consumption was 18.82 ltrs per 100k....:D
Over all Im very happy with these figures.....
For the $ paid for the ecu upgrade the performance may not be as much as others.....
But the increase is noticeable.... ...especially low to mid range torque....
Any one thinking about this ecu/chip upgrade its worth it.....
Cheers smally

[walker]

Smally, is that a 4.6 D2 that you had the upgrade ECU? And was it the Graeme Davis chip?

Did you just mail your ECU to Sydney and not drive the vehicle for a while? How long did it take?

[smally4.6]

Smally, is that a 4.6 D2 that you had the upgrade ECU? And was it the Graeme Davis chip?

Did you just mail your ECU to Sydney and not drive the vehicle for a while? How long did it take?

Gday Walker

My d2 is a 4.0 (my d1 had a 4.6 i should change my name:D ).
I took my disco to Justin Cooper and he sent the ecu to Bruce Davis.
It took 4 working days:(......
Couldn't wait to get it back......
Cheers smally

[walker]

Yes Bruce Davis, not Graeme. :bangin::bangin:

4 days is pretty good. Will have to think about it.

[disco2_dan]

well according to the scantool i got today the highest HP reading so far has been 220HP now i know this wont be 100% trust worthy but if anyone else has a scan tool for their v8 could you tell me what yours reads please
thanks dan

[Eevo]

dyno

[ozscott]

The scantool is inaccurate. Mine has shown crazy kw after some head and cam work.

Cheers

[Tombie]

What tyre size are you running Dan?

[disco2_dan]

What tyre size are you running Dan?

235/70/16
Cooper at3's

[disco2_dan]

The scantool is inaccurate. Mine has shown crazy kw after some head and cam work.

Cheers

What kind of head work did you get? And what cam work?

I was thinking about doing similar and wondering what kind of results you got and if you would do anything different?

[ozscott]

Hi Dan - port matching of intake and exhaust with a Crow Cam (2 up from stock) and new followers and timing gear. I have a fairly freeflowing muffler (its not loud cause of the stock resonator) and it came up well. Its very punch mid range and when revved through to injection cut off is still pulling hard. Its a 4.0 manual with 208,000k on the clock but the bottom end was still very nice so no touchy. I had Sequential LPG (BRC Impco) installed with very short runners using a wedge plate under the plenum and the result is significant grunt on LPG - probably better than petrol and certainly more torque than on petrol (98).

Cheers mate

PS. I am running 245/75/16's in General Grabber AT2, so its high geared for a manual but still tows my nearly 2 tonn Vagabond well off the line - albeit I wouldnt want bigger tyres with the 5 speed.

[uzz32soarer]

Hi guys, I'm generally a lurker rather than a poster but I've been researching ECU upgrade chips for my 1995 P38 and came upon this thread.

Here's some info on my car:

Car was delivered as a 4.0SE and I purchased the car at 160k kms. Car had been converted to dual fuel running LPG prior to my purchase. Exhaust had been replaced with a larger diameter pipe system and cats had been removed.

Engine split a liner and did head gaskets at around 230k kms, and was replaced with a 4.0 engine from a Discovery Series II. Two years later this engine also did a head gasket, and again, liner was split. Had a new engine built using a factory high comp 4.6 block from the UK which was built using my heads and 4.0 top end gear. BCEM was told that the car now had a 4.6 litre and it went like a cut snake. I had step sleeve liners fitted and the whole 9 yards, Cost $8000 AUD but it’s a good car and I figured that if I spend the money it should end up bullet proof.

One year later it did a head gasket and again, the heads were skimmed and checked.

Another year passes and it did a head gasket again! Heads were removed and it was found that one of the step sleeve liners was cracked, maybe from bad installation, no real idea.

Engine was pulled down completely and the main bearings had hammered themselves to pieces. The engine was about to fail, at 12 000 kms! CC’ing of the chambers showed comp ratio in excess of 13:1. Seems that nobody had considered that my heads had been skimmed at least four times and then when fitted to a high comp engine, I ended up with super high comps which just smashed the main bearings.

The engine has now been fully rebuilt, using my heads but with standard 4.6 pistons, stepped sleeve liners and a new camshaft grind designed with LPG running and towing in mind. When it came home I was very disappointed in the performance. The car felt sluggish and was using massive amounts of fuel to the tune of 30+ liters per 100 kms! After continuously harassing the mechanics shop they decided to pull it down and found that it was 5 degrees retarded on cam timing, yet the markers on the brand new factory timing gears was point to point perfect. There was 15 thou of lift stretch in the chain, after just 3000 kms.

They set about getting a local engineering shop to create an adjustable cam gear to suit a rollmaster double row timing chain that allowed the correct slots for the cam angle sensor to read and fitted this unit to the car. They actually found that they had to advance by 2 degrees to get the cam specs correct as per the grind sheet details but now it runs properly and has dropped to 15 liters per 100 kms fuel consumption on petrol. So now finally we have the ability to purchase a quality double row adjustable timing chain set for a GEMS engine.

Now that we seem to have one the round, my thoughts went to removing the factory dead spots and getting some livelihood out of the engine with a performance chip.

In short here’s what we have:

• 1995 Range Rover P38
• 4.6 liter high comp engine
• Mild cam to suit LPG and towing applications. I can supply cam spec sheet to you if helpful.
• 2.5” free flowing exhaust with no CAT converters.
• No O2 sensors fitted to my model.
• Knock sensors fitted.
• Standard size wheels and tires.
• LPG fitted.

I will soon be changing the LPG system to a direct injected style which will open up the air intake tube as the air won’t have to suck the gas in through a mixer. At that time the entire air intake system will revert back to stock.

I've written to Bruce Davis and also to Mark Adams and am awaiting a reply back to see what is available. I'll keep you informed.

[uzz32soarer]

My primary reason for the long winded post above was to let you guys know about the fitting of the camshaft recently.

We sent my old cam out to Wade and had it reground to a mild spec suitable for towing and LPG. A little more lift across the board and more exhaust duration to get rid of the gasses.

The camshaft came back and the engine builder chose to fit brand new genuine Land Rover chain and gears. The camshaft was not dialed in as no adjustment was possible anyway, but was set up 'dot to dot' as per factory specification.

When the adjustable timing gear set was manufactured it was found that to set up a dial gauge and get the camshaft to the ground measurements of lift, the car needed to be advanced 2 degrees from TDC and a full 7 degrees from where the factory gear set was installed.

You can only imagine the difference what 7 degrees of advance made to the car and to drop from high 20's to a best cruise fuel consumption of 11.8 is amazing.

Another point worthy of note was how much the factory single row chain stretched over just 3000kms. 15 thou of camshaft lift!!

I searched the World for weeks and wrote dozens of emails, but nobody had an adjustable timing set for a GEMS engine, and now here we are with a product developed locally to give us the quality of a rollmaster double row timing chain, -6, -4, -2, 0, +2, +4, +6 degrees of adjustment and is made to work perfectly with the GEMS cam angle sensor system.

The gear/chain set is available in Ringwood, Melbourne by a respected Range Rover / Land Rover repair facility. A world first product, developed in our own back yard.

[smally4.6]

Disco2_Dan
How's the disco going since the chip install
Any more fuel figures.....
cheers smally

[Pedro_The_Swift]

BCEM was told that the car now had a 4.6 litre .

I'm sorry?
you did what to who??
:eek::eek::eek::eek:

[clubagreenie]

X2. I looked at a BCU, ECU and the settings sheets from BBS and couldn't see a point that designates the engine cap.

pedo, sorry I haven't got back to your PM. $$$ took a hammering on tax and when I decided to paint the house a heap of dry rot in windows behind bog was found. So ECUs are sitting in transit and waiting funds before work starts as I don't want MA doing stuff when I can't afford it. I'll let you know on my progress.