this is going to be interesting

[incisor]

a trial based on consumer guarantees ...

Harvey Norman outlets fight single trial in ACCC battle - Mobility - Technology - News - CRN Australia (http://www.crn.com.au/News/333675,harvey-norman-outlets-fight-single-trial-in-accc-battle.aspx?eid=4&edate=20130219&utm_source=20130219&utm_medium=newsletter&utm_campaign=daily_newsletter)

be very very interesting...

a lot of small businesses will be watching hard and long ....

[Judo]

I read the article, but where's the bit where Gerry says he's going broke and wants everyone to give him a break? :confused:

[incisor]

I read the article, but where's the bit where Gerry says he's going broke and wants everyone to give him a break? :confused:

last thing i am interested in is what gerry thinking..

the out come of this will determine how many small businesses in Au will opt out of retail.

i don't think many people understand what a fundamental shift this could be...

or i am having myself on...

[Judo]

You could be right, but for the moment I don't see this case changing too much. Time will tell I suppose....

[flagg]

I dunno Inc, I was stung (in my old small business) by HP with their bull**** warranties. Refusing warranties is not good for anyone - this really hurts consumer confidence. We had 7 HP laptops dying constantly and were given the run around with replacements. Ended up buying new ones from Dell 9 or 10 months after the HP purchase has the time stuffing around was costing so much.

The duplicity argument is an interesting one. I guess the ACCC is going that way to discover any parallels that could be systemic through the franchise - I dont think they would do this for independent small businesses.

[incisor]

I dunno Inc, I was stung (in my old small business) by HP with their bull**** warranties. Refusing warranties is not good for anyone - this really hurts consumer confidence. We had 7 HP laptops dying constantly and were given the run around with replacements. Ended up buying new ones from Dell 9 or 10 months after the HP purchase has the time stuffing around was costing so much.

The duplicity argument is an interesting one. I guess the ACCC is going that way to discover any parallels that could be systemic through the franchise - I dont think they would do this for independent small businesses.

hp hey, popping inverters and then capacitors i bet..

apple, toshiba and asus also had a similar run from memory.

hp have been had several times i believe...

[AndrewGJones]

they way these laptops are designed is getting ridiculous. Quad cores with the same cooling set ups that we have seen on laptops since the old centrinos came out 10 years ago.

Half of them would be overheating motherboards (graphics chips etc) as many people will just put them on a pillow or block the vents some other way, and it takes all of an hour or so of that sort of abuse to start frying the chips.

[Judo]

they way these laptops are designed is getting ridiculous. Quad cores with the same cooling set ups that we have seen on laptops since the old centrinos came out 10 years ago.

Half of them would be overheating motherboards (graphics chips etc) as many people will just put them on a pillow or block the vents some other way, and it takes all of an hour or so of that sort of abuse to start frying the chips.

That maybe true but they don't create proportionately more heat. Even though they're getting faster some have lower power usage meaning less heat. Like everything it's not just the speed of the technology that's getting better, but its the supporting components around it too.

[Eevo]

imho HN is in the wrong in regards to warranty.

not saying its their fault, HP are also useless,
but to the customer, their dealing with HN

[flagg]

hp hey, popping inverters and then capacitors i bet..

apple, toshiba and asus also had a similar run from memory.

hp have been had several times i believe...

yep, power supplies, motherboards, keyboards, they were just junk. The sad part is they weren't the cheap line either - supposedly the business end. HP used to be great for support (that is why I purchased the ones that were crap).

I had one have a display fail in 2004, I went onto the HP website and click on support, then live chat. In 30 seconds I chatted to someone, did the reboot dance and logged a ticket. Literally 5 min later I got a phone call from a guy in a HP service centre down the road. He recognised the address of my office, and knowing it was just down the road suggested I just it to him at reception. I did, and about 20 min later got a phone call from him letting me know it was fixed.

How times have changed..

[AndrewGJones]

That maybe true but they don't create proportionately more heat. Even though they're getting faster some have lower power usage meaning less heat. Like everything it's not just the speed of the technology that's getting better, but its the supporting components around it too.


true, but that performance is being put to use by the OS to a greater degree and consumers are using them as entertainment devices more than ever. My 3 sons all have asus windows 8 machines and I'm forever picking them up around the house like my parents would pick up lego all those aeons ago!

The graphics demands are through the roof now days, with blueray players, and extremely heavy 3d games available, and then there is the issue of being switched on 24/7 to monitor social media.

If consumers where 'switched on' they would buy according to their actual needs, but as the saying goes "as good increase, so do those who consume them", the extra power is definitely being used simply because it is there, rather than any sort of need.

that and they are getting thinner, fanless, and running touch screens, and then all up being sold for $500, something was always going to give.

i would not want to be HN having to deal with these machines when they probably only made $50 gross profit to start with. there are easier ways to go broke than that.

I always assumed that warranties should be dealt with by the manufacturer?

[incisor]

I always assumed that warranties should be dealt with by the manufacturer?

that is how it used to be till the accc's outgoing head huncho decided to put one last nail in small businesses coffin as he had done though out his tenure.

and many manufacturers / distributors had guidelines

typically it was, unit fails within two weeks, retailer replaces unit and sends DOA unit back

longer than that it went to the manufacturer or distributor to be dealt with at the retailers freight cost i might add on both counts.

now.....

a retailer ends up with responsibility if the manufacturer / distributor shirks theirs... and which they have been doing for donkeys years

costs to retailer go thru the roof ...

but joe blogs wants it cheaper cause he can get it way cheaper in the usa

wonder why...

interesting times ahead.

[flagg]

a retailer ends up with responsibility if the manufacturer / distributor shirks theirs... and which they have been doing for donkeys years

wow I didn't realise that. I guess the idea might have been that retailers would do their own contracts with the vender, but considering what has come out so far in the "Coles & Woolies Vs the People" it seems impossible that it would work in real life.

Its a shame that this is only coming to life with Harvey Norman, because in general people really don't have a lot of sympathy for them. Hell, I went to one of their much advertised "sales" looking for a Soda Stream. Once I got someones attention the girl who served me said "the cheap one will give you cancer" (I was speechless) and the more expensive one, including the "sale discount" was still MORE than RRP.

Are there any other industry groups Inc that you could use to shed light on the problem? Especially with the bullying highlighted in the recent cases I'm sure they would listen as it opens small business up to more bullying by vendors.