Who is running a PEL500110 thermostat in their D2

[walker]

I know there has been talk about this before but I just wanted to see who is running the PEL500110 thermostat.

I bought one just before Christmas and installed it only to find my running temp went up to 105. I assumed it was a did thermostat and so put the old one back in. I just had the did one replaced and put it in today, only to find the running temp at 102. There must be something I am doing wrong!!!! The can't be both faulty but since they are an 82 thermostat I was expecting lower temps.

Any ideas or suggestions.

[schuy1]

most peculiar! What is the old orig thermostat temp? It should be the same 1 would think. Installing the right way round? :D (Silly question I know) Cold be a dud batch maybe but not likely. Is the rest of the system in good order? like hoses, radiator etc? Maybe the bypass hose?

Cheers Scott

[walker]

The old original thermostat should be an 88Deg thermostat, while the one I put in is a 82deg thermostat. It should be giving me cooler running temps.

It is the right way round. I cant guarantee everything else is in good order, but the point is with the original thermostat it runs at 95 while with the new stat which should run cooler it runs at 102.

I am getting my temp measurements from scanguage. Not sure which sensor scanguage gets the water temp from.

I was hoping there was someone else out there that had installed this same thermostat. I guess I will have to go back to the original.

[schuy1]

So the scangauge will be using temp input from the motor temp sender as the standard gauge uses. If the original thermo is an 88 and the new is 82 with the standard running a lower temp there is probly nothing wrong with your cooling system. With that reasoning the new 1 has to be either not opening at its rated temp or is not opening properly. The latter is my bet otherwise the temp would be a lot higher. 7 degrees is a fair bit of difference. I have not looked at 1 but is there a way of testing in a pot of hot water? Sorrry I am not able to offer more idea :(

Cheers Scott

[Trippy]

Did you sort this out walker? I am about to order a new thermostat and am not sure if I should get this one or the normal one.

[walker]

I sorted it out by putting the original thermostat back in. I did get the first one replaced for free but the 2nd one was exactly the same. I can't explain it. Either it was a bad batch or this is not the right thermostat for the D2 V8

[Trippy]

Bummer! Is there anyone else out there who has used this successfully? I am about to put in an order for a bunch of parts from Rimmer Bros.

[michaelp]

I am still happy with the PEM101020 -With Hard Spring (Designed for a V8 and used as a stopgap with K4 engines) that i put in at least 6 months ago.
The only difference is the spring tension (I think).

[kelvo]

I sorted it out by putting the original thermostat back in. I did get the first one replaced for free but the 2nd one was exactly the same. I can't explain it. Either it was a bad batch or this is not the right thermostat for the D2 V8
I've been looking at replacing my thermostat and looked at getting the 'cooler running' PEL500110 but it seems that due to the lighter bypass spring at higher engine revs it is causing too much water to actually bypass the rad. Causing higher running temps. If you are doing alot of low engine speed work then it may allow cooler running.

PEM101020 might be a better option as it is an 82°C stat, but with a heavy bypass spring so should be better at higher engine speeds/water flow rates

But as I don't like being a guinea pig I'm just going to replace mine with the original PEM10990, as preventative maintenance.

Kelvin.

PS Mine is a TD5, not a V8 but part numbers are still the same for both engines.

PPS I can not be 100% sure that what I have said is actually correct :angel:

[roverv8]

I know there has been talk about this before but I just wanted to see who is running the PEL500110 thermostat.

I bought one just before Christmas and installed it only to find my running temp went up to 105. I assumed it was a did thermostat and so put the old one back in. I just had the did one replaced and put it in today, only to find the running temp at 102. There must be something I am doing wrong!!!! The can't be both faulty but since they are an 82 thermostat I was expecting lower temps.

Any ideas or suggestions.

Same happened to me with PEL500110, it ran hotter on the hwy & I had fairly new radiator , put the old one back & im back to normal running temps, low 90's.
Can only guess the lighter spring by-passes to much coolant at higher RPM's

[fourteen8]

I installed 82 degree thermostat a couple months ago and happy with it. It stays at 84 most of the time instead of 89. The max it gets so far is 86-87 degree.

Well mine is td5.

[bidds]

Were the new thermostats Genuine LR parts?

I'm interested as I'm probably going to change mine out soon (td5) as preventative maintenance.

On my 90 Rangie I bought a few new sensors that were aftermarket, fuel temp, coolant temp, etc and every one was useless - ended up replacing with the original sensors and they're still there five years on with no problems.

[clubagreenie]

PEM100990 - Cream is 88° With hard Spring (Designed for Diesel and V8 applications)

PEM101020 - Black or Cream is 82° With Hard Spring (Designed for a V8 and used as a stopgap with K4 engines)

PEL500110 - Grey is 82° With Light Spring (K4 engines)

You need the PEL500110 The hard spring prevents flow through the radiator at low speeds and so in our ambient temps runs hotter. I have it in mine (V8) and sits on 87.7 at idle in full sun on 35+degree days. On the freeway drops to 84.

You can't really install them the wrong way as there's 2 outlets on top and on underneath.

I changed mine pre radiator change and it only dropped a little, after the new rad, coolant (Penrite purple) and water wetter dropped to very stable temps that I'm happy with. There's no effect on cold starts and increased fuel consumption with cooler running as the cold start system shuts down at 55 degrees.

The 100990 is the std Aust spec thermostat. 101020 is gulf spec and the 500110 is actually from the freelander.

[fourteen8]

Were the new thermostats Genuine LR parts?

I'm interested as I'm probably going to change mine out soon (td5) as preventative maintenance.

On my 90 Rangie I bought a few new sensors that were aftermarket, fuel temp, coolant temp, etc and every one was useless - ended up replacing with the original sensors and they're still there five years on with no problems.

Yes I changed with Genuine LR thermostat.

[roverv8]

The hard spring prevents flow through the radiator at low speeds and so in our ambient temps runs hotter.I think the opposite
the softer by-pass spring causes more coolant to by-pass from the radiator,back to the top Rad hose instead of forcing through the thermostat & into the block.
equals less flow to block & hotter running on the HWY.
check out the flow chart on RAVE
The by-pass valve flows back to the top rad hose & in the top of the rad,
;)

[Eevo]

now im confused. given that the engine spends more of its time at low speeds and high revs are usually for a short time only, would i want a hard or light spring?

[clubagreenie]

Then why is the softer spring the unit for hotter climates? Everything I've read (and it's a substantial amount) details the spring as allowing flow to circulate to the heater area at idle and allow the system to warm up quicker.

From RAVE:

By-Pass Flow Valve
The by-pass flow valve is held closed by a light spring. It operates to further aid heater warm up. When the main valve is closed and the engine speed is at idle, the coolant pump does not produce sufficient flow and pressure to open the valve. In this condition the valve prevents coolant circulating through the by-pass circuit and forces the coolant through the heater matrix only. This produces a higher flow of coolant through the heater matrix to improve passenger comfort in cold conditions.

When the engine speed increases above idle the coolant pump produces a greater flow and pressure than the heater circuit can take. The pressure acts on the flow valve and overcomes the valve spring pressure, opening the valve and limiting the pressure in the heater circuit. The valve modulates to provide maximum coolant flow through the heater matrix yet allowing excess coolant to flow into the by-pass circuit to provide the engines cooling needs at higher engine rev/min.

[roverv8]

The spring is a pressure relief if you like, so if you go changing spring rate it will change the by-pass rate,RAVE shows by-pass flows back to the top rad hose, not through the engine.
I can only tell you mine ran hotter, and according to the post, thats what started thread.
I also had a radiator less 6 months old, I wasted about $70 bux on that thermostat, its sitting back in its box.

[justfishing]

Hello,
Just got my engine back together and put in a PEL500110 runs really hot will put the normal one back tomorrow as engine is hot. Took a while to bleed I installed a new water pump as well the temp does drop at tick over but anything over 1500 rpm she just gets hotter.
Ian

[clubagreenie]

RAVE shows by-pass flows back to the top rad hose, not through the engine.

Exactly, bypasses from circulating through the engine heater to passing into the radiator and cooling it. Everything I types there is directly from RAVE descriptionof the operation. At idle, stays in engine/heater. Once moving/increased revs it bypasses into the radiator. With the softer spring bypasses at lower revs.

[roverv8]

I think the opposite
the softer by-pass spring causes more coolant to by-pass from the radiator,back to the top Rad hose instead of forcing through the thermostat & into the block.
equals less flow to block & hotter running on the HWY.
check out the flow chart on RAVE
The by-pass valve flows back to the top rad hose & in the top of the rad,
;)

If this is incorrect , please enlighten us, why my & others 82deg thermostat light spring runs hotter that the 88deg thermostat heavy spring at higher RPM's.

Is there a big batch of bad PEL500110 thermostat's?
I'd love to get my TD5 running cooler in summer, thats why I bought it.

[clubagreenie]

I'm not up for trying to analyse the flow diagram in RAVE, but the text I copied in a few posts ago is directly from RAVE. 28/10, 2003hrs.

I have a spare t'stat and looking at it and my setup, 2000 V8.

Flow from short hose between alternator & a/c pump then tee piece which branches to top rad connection (inlet) or drops to t'stat OF THE BYPASS SPING BRANCH. This line is the top straight connection on the t'stat. The branch on an angle is the only one marked "to pump" and goes to pump inlet (underside of pump). Straight down goes to lower rad connection (outlet)through the thermostat controlled plate (which is in the bottom branch).

Now I'm not calling anyone anything but IF it was installed with the pump branch to the top hose (180degree rotation out) then the pump inlet flow from the radiator outlet would be forcing the bypass plate closed, take the easiest route which is back to the top hose (but has the pump flow through the engine against it (but the pump can't suck enough to provide flow)).

Sorry if it's a bit haphazard but typing on phone jn carpark, bonnet up in direct sunlight. If anyone in western Sydney wants to get together to compare and test stuff I'm always free to meet up. Be nice to get to the bottom of things andnot drag things through the mud because we're missing something obvious.

[justfishing]

Hello,
Put a normal 88 degree back in what a hassle that was and now runs at 90 - 93 no problems. Was looking at a 82 degree hard spring but happy with what is in there now. with the light spring it would go up to 105 and at that point it was turn the car off and refit the old thermostat.
Ian

[Freightdog]

I have one in mine, no idea if it is hard or soft spring. However it runs about 6 deg cooler than the original. Coolant is at 84 deg when cruising, up to a max of 90 when I have to stop at lights etc. It is a V8, would have mentioned it earlier, but I thought everyone drove 8's :-)

[clubagreenie]

Now 0325 and been staring at the fow charts for both TD5 & V8 for hours. There is a difference between the two and there may be some differences between detailed operation & the diagram. But if I go raiding for a spare t'stat now I'll get locked out.

[roverv8]

Well ive discovered my problem,
having a good look at the inside of thermostat (PEL500110) I bought,
I can see on the rim of the thermostat itself (inside)
V2936 - 92deg C - 1203

are these PEL500110 in fact a 92deg C thermostat??

From what I read on here these are supposed to be 82deg C which is why I bought & fitted

Can Anyone else confirm the temp rating by checking theirs??

Can't see on RAVE what the op temps are supposed to be for K series freelander, but Ive seen several posts on the internet about freelanders boiling

[clubagreenie]

I have no listing nor in any research have I found a reference to a 92deg t'stat. My 2 spares are both marked at 88.

The reference list I have posted is from researched info plus checks of operation I've made myself.

PEM100990 - Cream is 88° With hard Spring (Designed for Diesel and V8 applications)

PEM101020 - Black or Cream is 82° With Hard Spring (Designed for a V8 and used as a stopgap with K4 engines)

PEL500110 - Grey is 82° With Light Spring (K4 engines)

[justfishing]

Well ive discovered my problem,
having a good look at the inside of thermostat (PEL500110) I bought,
I can see on the rim of the thermostat itself (inside)
V2936 - 92deg C - 1203

are these PEL500110 in fact a 92deg C thermostat??

From what I read on here these are supposed to be 82deg C which is why I bought & fitted

Can Anyone else confirm the temp rating by checking theirs??

Can't see on RAVE what the op temps are supposed to be for K series freelander, but Ive seen several posts on the internet about freelanders boiling

X2 Same as mine just had look now 92 deg C. How can they sell them as a 82 deg C ?????? I fitted the stranded hard spring much better today brought a new radiator went and warmed up the car didn't go above 93 deg C even sitting idling for a while at the lights.
Ian

[bob10]

Just checked RAVE, it says the thermostat for the TD5 starts to open at 82 degrees, fully open at 96 degrees. Fuel cooler opens at 82 degrees. Is the number on the thermostat the starting or fully open value? Bob

[gwest47]

I note on another post on Technical matters that a member received a PEL500110 that on very careful inspection of the writing on the metal rim around the thermostat indicated that it was rated at 92C, not the 82C he expected.
I checked a PRT that I have for my MGF (PCH001190) which is meant to open at 87C and after resorting to a magnifying glass found that all it had inside was WAXSTAT 11 9. Not very helpful at all. I checked it by pouring near-boiling water into the inlet and measuring the temperature at which it opened and started dripping water out the bottom. It appeared to be opening in the very high 80s.

[Seryi]

Installed Britpart's PEL500110 on D2 v8 with swapped 4.6 instead 4.0 With old OEM t-stat temperature gap was 96-106C, now it's 91-96. Replaced it bacause el. fan was always running bacause of high temperature. The first fun part of this history is that on the package of the new t-stat was written "not for sale outside UK and EU", and it was bought in Russia. The second, is that in the package was "MotoRad" t-stat. But it works fine, i'm satisfied. Thank's AULRO community!

[ozscott]

I have been running a PEL500110. Normal running in town and on the highway is a very stead 85-87. Only occasionally in heavy traffic will I get to 90. Doing some very steep off road load range stuff and reving the engine hard to get up a mountain I achieved mid to high 90's on a wam day (28 degrees). I am very pleased with it. I have yet to tow my boat (2 tonns) but I think it is the right thermostat choice for much lower running temps.

Cheers

[ozscott]

Running a pel500110 in my 4.6 high compression motor. It is returning typically 84-87 on hot days in sunny Qld. Towing a 2 tonn dual axel trailer boat on a hot day a few weeks ago returned 90-91 degrees when labouring up hills in overdrive (5th). I have had the thermostat for 8,000k and am very happy with it. Offroad on steep climbs in low range is is typically around 90-91 degrees. The hottest it has been was 93 in very stop start traffic on a high 30's day.

Cheers

PS. I wonder if some of you who have bought pel500110's might have been given the wrong part...?

[D2lee]

I got the 82c Pem101820 with the hard spring, which dropped the temperature as expected. If you check the coolant flow diagram you can see that the hard spring will force more coolant around the radiator, where as the soft spring will be more easily overcome and allow more coolant to bypass the radiator.

I've since replumbed the system with an inline Thermostat.

[ozscott]

Lee what are your coolant temps now and what were they with the hard spring set up stock.

Cheers

[D2lee]

hi, with the hard spring 82c stat, temps dropped to about 90C.


With the re-plumbing, inline stat and electric fans, it's 75-80c, which are Des Hamills guidelines for these engines.
I've tried in 40c temps, elec fans are ok (and infact much better at idle where the (new) viscous doesn't seem to shift enough air and temps slowly rise. I'm yet to try off-road, maybe this weekend if I have time. Same fans are used on a huge 5.4l 300hp V8 in the Falcon with same size radiator, so hopefully the rover V8 shouldn't create much more heat than that!

[peter51]

Hi D2lee - Confirm your D2 is the V8 and where did you purchase the thermostat - locally or on line?
Peter

[D2lee]

hi, yes it's 4.0 V8.

I got an inline 'stat housing from ebay and fitted into the top hose. Takes a standard Tridon stat from supercheap (although they don't stock all the temp range).

Took out the old stat housing and connected the bottom hose directly to the pump inlet (with an inline joint)

Blocked off the hose from the pump outlet to the bypass valve.

Now, this potentially creates an issue with too much pressure through the heater matrix when the radiator stat is still closed, so drilled 2 holes in the new stat to allow some pressure relief. (engine warm up take approx. the same time as with the old system and viscous fan).

now all coolant either goes through the radiator or the heater matrix, instead of (at least) 10% bypassing the rad all the time.

Also allows you to choose any stat 71c-90c+

Current stat range 71c - starts to open and ~82c fully open.

Falcon electric fans are electronically controller by a programmable thermostat, with manual override direct to two relays (for redundancy).

Set them to come on around 78c, when the stat is nearly fully open (or a couple of degrees less when off roading).

Normal operating temp, typical 25-30c day, around 70-78c.

Offroading max temp (did some serious stuff at the weekend) 82c.

Fuel economy over 1 week typical commute -50% freeway, 50% stop/start highway (same as previous weeks), 15.5l/100km, no change from running at 96c with viscous fan.


Also have alarms for;
low coolant level
engine temp via obd
engine temp via separate sensor
trans oil leakage sensors at both crimp joints near the cooler.

[Battler]

is this the inline stat you got from eBay D2lee?

Inline Thermostat Housing With 1 1 2" Inlet Outlet | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Inline-Thermostat-Housing-With-1-1-2-Inlet-Outlet-/321930758078?hash=item4af49187be:g:IDcAAOSwkNZUjnb R)

[peter51]

Thanks for the info D2Lee. That is very useful info, especially about the extra pressure buildup.
I may consider your mod as my P38 typically runs 96-98 when idling at lights on hot humid days in Brisbane - otherwise it stays around 88-90. All cooling system is new. Ive already been through one cracked block on my previous 4 litre P38
Beside reading water temp I also monitor coolant pressure gauge and low coolant.
Coolant pressure stays at 0.6 bar or top hose can be squeezed to about 2cm when hot.
How are you sensing fluid leaks at the transmission hoses?
Peter

[D2lee]

is this the inline stat you got from eBay D2lee?

Inline Thermostat Housing With 1 1 2" Inlet Outlet | eBay (http://www.ebay.com.au/itm/Inline-Thermostat-Housing-With-1-1-2-Inlet-Outlet-/321930758078?hash=item4af49187be:g:IDcAAOSwkNZUjnb R)

that's the one, bit expensive, but not much else available.

[ozscott]

Is it running a bit cool for engine wear? Some say close to 100 c to get rid of moisture in the oil out and there are other considerations such as the proper operating temp for oil to best protect. I have considered a cooler set up but I would be surprised if a 4.6 is with its thicker walls is stressed at 84-87 typical water temps.

Cheers

[D2lee]

it's one of those things that will never be proven. There is so much variation in build quality, that it's effectively "the luck of the draw".
Having read everything I can find on the subject, I'm trying to avoid being one of the ~80% with cracked blocks/slipped liners. The engine was not design in 1950/60 to run at 90-100C. LR weakened it by boring it out, weakened the mixture and increased the temps purely to reduce certain emissions at certain revs. After this cracked blocks/slipped lines was of epidemic proportions on both 4.0 and 4.6 engines.
There are "expert" opinions, that even though the 4.6 blocks were chosen for their slightly thicker walls, (assuming the guy checked the entire wall thickness on all 8 cylinders correctly on 1000's of blocks per week), that with the extra torque, they stay at a lower rev range under load, where the mixture is it's weakest, hence combustion temps are higher, contributing to the failure.


Anyway, it's all down to the individual, what they want to do and how lucky they feel.

[ozscott]

Yep who would know. My 82 degree thermostat copped a work out today. 38 degrees outside and 67 degree intake temp. I gave it a hard time then idled it for a while and allowed temp to top out at 94. Later on heavy traffic at 39 degrees outside the https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/02/939.jpgcoolant reached 95. AC going flat out at all times.

I reckon these temps are still sound. With the 4.0 running a stock stat it was 104-105 in the same conditions.

Cheers

[Battler]

I must have a high temp thermostat. My temps are between a lowest of 90c and mostly runs at 93-95c. Does go up to 102 quite often in hot weather and then drops back. Gets as high as 110c when idling sometimes in the heat.

So I think I will be doing D2Lee's mod and try to get the temps to a max of 90c by experimenting with different Tridon thermostats.

Cheers

[Pedro_The_Swift]

Does the intake temp vary greatly?

[ozscott]

So today when running up and down hills in 31 degree heat she sat on 84-87. That is my normal range when in the move around the burbs in the early 30 degree days. I reckon that is spot on temp for these engines. Given that Dexcool still does its job without boiling to at least 120.degrees the odd spike up to 94/95 idling with AC on on a really hot day close to 40 degrees is harmless in my view.

Cheers

[rusty05]

I changed mine over to the PEL500110 on D2 v8 temperature range was originally around 95-99C, after swap it's 92-96.

Before that I swapped the original for standard, it went upto 98-102.
so then I went for the lower temp item. still thought it would have gone lower, as I can see some of the others are getting lower temps on this therm.

So there is variation in them for sure.

[Pedro_The_Swift]

very happy with mine (yes I said it,,)
car telling me 40 outside Torque telling me 88deg at 100kph,
idleing for 6-7 minutes (left car on and aircon on for passenger Guiness) and it showed 90, 30secs later back to 88.

add late 30's and ocean humidity and its a good day to be at the Alex Surf Club!!!:cool::beer:

[clubagreenie]

The advantage of the freelander thermostst is not only the lower temp (how did they achieve low emissions in the freelander with the cooler temps?) but also the softer bypass spring, allowing more flow to the radiator at idle.

[Eevo]

Does the intake temp vary greatly?


depends on the driving your doing.

100 on the highway, the intake temp is about 5degrees above outside air temp.
if your in bumper to bumper traffic, it can be 60-70 degrees.

[assafde]

Reading the information from RAVE regarding the coolant system:
========================
Thermostat - Main valve
---------------------------
The thermostat is used to maintain the coolant at the optimum temperature for efficient combustion and to aid engine
warm-up. The thermostat is closed at temperatures below approximately 82C (179F). When the coolant temperature reaches approximately 82C the thermostat starts to open and is fully open at approximately 96C
(204F). In this condition the full flow of coolant is directed through the radiator.
The thermostat is exposed to 90% hot coolant from the engine on one side and 10% cold coolant returning from the radiator bottom hose on the other side.
Hot coolant from the engine passes from the by-pass pipe through four sensing holes in the flow valve into a tube surrounding 90% of the thermostat sensitive area. Cold coolant returning from the radiator, cooled by the ambient air, conducts through 10% of the thermostat sensitive area.
In cold ambient temperatures, the engine temperature is raised approximately 10C (50F) to compensate for the heat loss of 10% exposure to the cold coolant returning from the radiator bottom hose.

By-pass flow valve
---------------------
The by-pass flow valve is held closed by a light spring. It operates to further aid heater warm-up. When the main valve is closed and the engine speed is below 1500 rev/min, the coolant pump does not produce sufficient flow and pressure to open the valve. In this condition the valve prevents coolant circulating through the by-pass circuit and forces the coolant through the heater matrix only. This provides a higher flow of warm coolant through the heater matrix to improve passenger comfort in cold conditions.
When the engine speed increases above 1500 rev/min the coolant pump produces a greater flow and pressure than
the heater circuit can take. The pressure acts on the flow valve and overcomes the valve spring pressure, opening
the valve and limiting the pressure in the heater circuit. The valve modulates to provide maximum coolant flow through
the heater matrix and yet allowing excess coolant to flow into the by-pass circuit to provide the engines cooling needs
at higher engine rev/min.
=======================================
Driving a 2001 Discovery TD5 in hot climate and reviewing the listed thermostat temperature:

PEM100990 - Cream is 88° With hard Spring (Designed for Diesel and V8 applications)

PEM101020 - Black or Cream is 82° With Hard Spring (Designed for a V8 and used as a stopgap with K4 engines)

PEL500110 - Grey is 82° With Light Spring (K4 engines)

I'm confused:
1. What is K4 Engine?
2. Assuming driving at 2000rpm at desert area (hot weather), 2500rpm on steep hills climb (desert area) and 2850rpm on freeway (~ 100KM/h speed) what is the best choice?
3. While driving bumper to bumper at hot ambient 35C and above with rev at ~ 800rpm, does the PEL500110 diverts more hot water towards the heater-matrix (in cabinet heat radiator) cooking the passengers...?

[roverv8]

1. Freelander engine 4 cylinder

2. If the standard 88 deg thermostat starts to open at 82deg & fully open at 96,
you have an advantage of the 82 deg thermostat starting to open in the high 70's & fully open in the low 80's.
No matter where you are, in hot weather, by the thermostat opening at a cooler temp you have a chance of your engine running cooler.
This doesn't mean you engine will always run at 82 deg, especially towing, it can still reach high temps
it just means the thermostat is fully open, with full flow at that temp.

3.this won't happen when the thermostat is open as your cooling system has flow through the thermostat.
you need to understand how an inline thermostat works, when thermostat is closed, coolant is forced through the bypass valve on the thermostat, (comes from top rad hose)this is where thermostat gets the heat from to open.
The bypass valve is small so when the thermostat is closed, a larger volume of coolant is re-circulated through the engine & heater matrix untill the thermostat opens & it has flow

Hope this makes sense

[assafde]

Thank you for the educated answer.
Some more info I'm not clear:
1. Since I'm "used to" a 91C-96C at offroading and this is normal run today, although I had removed the EGR system from the engine theoretically it should run hotter since the Exhaust gas recirculation NO2 emissions is not there... using the PEL500110 should take me towards ~ 86C-92C i assume, am I basically in the right direction here?
2. Is there any issue with the temps going up and down damaging the head? or I should expect a steady temp about 5C less of what I have today?
3. What about "having lower temp" is not efficiently burning the fuel (It's a 2001 Discovery TD5)?
4. The ECU can "think" the engine is "cold" and it's to inject more fuel to reach it's engineer planned Land Rover to be at 91C to 96C, any real in that theory I read in the web (could not find any proof for this anywhere)?

[ozscott]

very happy with mine (yes I said it,,)
car telling me 40 outside Torque telling me 88deg at 100kph,
idleing for 6-7 minutes (left car on and aircon on for passenger Guiness) and it showed 90, 30secs later back to 88.

add late 30's and ocean humidity and its a good day to be at the Alex Surf Club!!!:cool::beer:

Pedro you might have told me before but what Stat is your truck running?

Cheers

Sent from my SM-G900I using AULRO mobile app

[Pedro_The_Swift]

Thank you for the educated answer.
Some more info I'm not clear:
1. Since I'm "used to" a 91C-96C at offroading and this is normal run today, although I had removed the EGR system from the engine theoretically it should run hotter since the Exhaust gas recirculation NO2 emissions is not there... using the PEL500110 should take me towards ~ 86C-92C i assume, am I basically in the right direction here?
2. Is there any issue with the temps going up and down damaging the head? or I should expect a steady temp about 5C less of what I have today?
3. What about "having lower temp" is not efficiently burning the fuel (It's a 2001 Discovery TD5)?
4. The ECU can "think" the engine is "cold" and it's to inject more fuel to reach it's engineer planned Land Rover to be at 91C to 96C, any real in that theory I read in the web (could not find any proof for this anywhere)?

most of the thermostat chat on here is from V8 owners,

yes too cold an engine temp will make the TD5 misfire,, but thats at startup only,
I have never heard of any TD5 fuel map injecting more fuel to raise engine temps,, The much later TDV6's will do this to burn/clean the diesel particulate filter,, not something TD5 owners have to worry about.

[Pedro_The_Swift]

Pedro you might have told me before but what Stat is your truck running?

Cheers

Sent from my SM-G900I using AULRO mobile app

this will require a bit of searching,,,:angel:

[Pedro_The_Swift]

Bought from Roverlord Sept 2014,, :o
how time flies:(
its was stamped 82, actual part number requires more effort:angel:

[peter51]

To add to the data in this thread I can confirm that running a PEL500110 in a TD5 actualy increases operating temperature by at least 5 degrees.

Normal genuine thermostat and normal driving around Cairns on a humid 32 degree day gives 92 degrees at the back of the head and 91 from the nanocom. Coolant pressure is 9psi.

With PEL500110 temperature tops out at 100 on the same route and same conditions. Coolant pressure sat at 11psi. The system was thoroughly bled after the chageover to the PEL500110 BTW, so there was definitely no trapped air.

So it was definitetly a good side by side comparision. The PEL500110 came in a bearmach box and was not stamped with a temperature. However this thermostat had a support bridge which was significantly thicker that the genuine thermostat and this may have affected flow rate.

BTW I have tested the flow rate from a TD5 water pump and it is not that flash - far less that the rate from a 20mm hose connected to a town water supply!

My 2 cents - if you own a TD5, then do not go to the trouble of changing your thermostat to a PEL500110. You will definitely run hotter by 8 degrees.

Needless to say the genuine part went back in the next morning. If anyone wants this PEL 500110 to test further then PM me and Ill send it too you.

[Chubbs878]

See thread titled "American know how"
I will be posting parts list for thermostat modification where you will see a 20 degree drop in operating temps. With this mod we are now experiencing operating temps between 183f-84c and 189f-87c. Anything over 200f-93c is too hot for these poorly manufactured engines.

[ozscott]

Running a pel500110 in my 4.6 high compression motor. It is returning typically 84-87 on hot days in sunny Qld. Towing a 2 tonn dual axel trailer boat on a hot day a few weeks ago returned 90-91 degrees when labouring up hills in overdrive (5th). I have had the thermostat for 8,000k and am very happy with it. Offroad on steep climbs in low range is is typically around 90-91 degrees. The hottest it has been was 93 in very stop start traffic on a high 30's day.

Cheers

PS. I wonder if some of you who have bought pel500110's might have been given the wrong part...?
OK so I'm not sold on the inline stat. Today it was 32 degrees outside and in very slow stop start traffic sucking hot exhaust gasses in from the car in front it got to 94 degrees and on the highway at 100kph in the same ambient temp it sat on 93_95 depending on Hills... So I blame the inline stat size... I think the thermostat in the 3 way LR one must have a wider bore for more flow?

I might have to go back to the old system... Cheers

[Battler]

Something must be wrong Ozscott; yesterday mine didn't go above 86c in traffic (roadworks Gold Coast) and sat most of the time at 82c. Ambient was 29c

Maybe your housing is too far away from the inlet manifold or the thermostat is faulty?

Big test today, it's going to be 35c where I live so I'll let you know how t goes.

Cheers

[ozscott]

Thanks mate. Appreciate it. Is yours running 50/50 HOAT? Cheers

[Battler]

Just spent about an hour driving around in the suburbs, lots of stop-starting and roundabouts. I also stopped a few times and was idling for about 5mins while I was trying to tune the stupid gas system. Temp mostly stayed between 84 and 86. Went to 87 every time I stopped at lights. When I did get a bit of straight run it dropped to 83.2 and stayed there until I stopped again. Twice it went to 90 very briefly stopped at long lights before dropping straight back to 87c. Very pleased with this mod.

I using 50/50 Nulon OAT.

Cheers

[Battler]

Did you drill a 1/8 hole in the thermostat and mount it so it's at the top?

[ozscott]

Thanks mate. Sure did. Might have some air in it still. Thanks for posting up. Are you running the 82 degree stat still?

[ozscott]

What was outside temp mate?

[Battler]

Yeah, an 82c Tridon and it was 36c outside at the time.

Might be air or last time I saw your installation it looked like it wasn't as close to the inlet as it could be. According to the Americans that makes a big difference.

[Battler]

or maybe the thermostat is the wrong way? From memory, it's spring towards the engine.

Cheers

[ozscott]

Thanks mate. Yes could well be the position. Thermostat is spring side to motor. I thought it was import to have the bleed on the engine side so there was no air pocket before the thermostat. That made it difficult to get the thermostat as close as I would like. The D1 is the best inline cause its screwed into the top of the motor.... Cheers

[ozscott]

Just had a look at your picture. Wouldn't be much in it as you have the bleeder before the thermostat also. Maybe half an inch to an inch? Cheers

[Battler]

Agree, not much in it. Could be air or maybe some else is going on:o

Give a lower temp thermostat a try.

[Jazzman]

This took a lot of reading. I'm running a PEM100990B 82 degree thermostat. I have a brand new std radiator, water pump and hoses. TD5 in great condition.

I read my temps via Nanocom.

I typically run between 82-87 degrees C outside temp about 25 degrees. Temps are fine for around town and highway.

When I'm trying to climb muddy rutted hills on a track somewhere my temps will climb as expected, low speed high revs traction control working, eg. 3rd gear low range 3K-3500 rpm.

Nanocom over temp is set at 95 degrees, this will go off without fail. Max temp will be approx. 107 degrees, which i feel is too high, although it should be only for a short time. This is not an uncommon occurrence for me as I enjoy my off roading, i'm not a hoon but do occasionally drive challenging tracks.

Would changing my thermostat to one of the other numbers help me? Am i worrying about nothing? Would it be a better option to consider another electric fan on the front?

[Jazzman]

Bought from Roverlord Sept 2014,, :o
how time flies:(
its was stamped 82, actual part number requires more effort:angel:

I believe you are running the same as me PEM100990B

[ozscott]

I am probably going to a grey 82 stat... Ie soft spring bypass LR. Cheers
https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/11/585.jpg

[Pedro_The_Swift]

showoff! :p

just googled ebay and theres millions of different countries and pricing :blink:

[ozscott]

Haha. I will get back to you Pedro thanks mate... Want to get air out and get it cool as a priority. Cheers

[ozscott]

I put a grey soft spring 82 stamped thermo in to see how it went. Lower than stock temps but not as good as a hard spring 82. Having had a good look at the Rave diagram I am satisfied that a harder spring is more resistant to coolant coming into the top centre port of the thermostat and back out the side port to the water pump...ie the bypass circuit. Firmer spring means less hot coolant likely to return from the engine Valley to the water pump without first running through the radiator. See attached photo.... If that top spring is stronger it will more easily keep that bypass closed meaning cooler running. The hot coolant would only trickle in through the small holes to land on the thermostat sensing area to control opening and not much more. Cheers https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/11/382.jpg

[ozscott]

OK old 3 way LR thermostat back in. Put a 1/4 inch restriction in the hose from the valley to the bypass plate in the thermostat (ie the radiator bypass circuit). Still plenty of flow to allow sensing in the thermostat (these trucks get most of their sensing from this circuit and very little from the radiator - cool - side of the thermostat) but with the advantage of forcing more coolant through the radiator. Happy with results. Sitting on 86-89 round town and idling is 90-91. Highway is 89-91 depending on gradient. I found the inline got the engine running much cooler in cooler weather, but hotter than this in summer days. Every motor is different. The 4.6 would also tend to run a little hotter due to the extra displacement and burn within the same size block with same size cooling passages compared to the 4.0. Also relevant to note is that the temp sensors are all likely to be different from each other, so comparing electronic readings taken from the ECTS is a general guide only. What is important is that in stock form when I had the same sensor in my 4.0 the normal temps were mid to high 90's and up to 102-105 on very hot days...so I have achieved a 10 degree reduction in running temps.

Cheers

[Pedro_The_Swift]

https://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/11/382.jpg

well theres your problem,,, :p

[Pedro_The_Swift]

If you have a quick stroll through the Tridon catlledog the D2 thermostat is the highest temp.
Nothing else runs that hot.

[ozscott]

If stock is 92 when it first starts to open then at least BMW uses that in a number of models. Volvo specify up to 92 thermostats also in some models. Cheers

[Pedro_The_Swift]

92? you wish! try 96 ;),,
tap dancing on a knifes edge--

[ozscott]

Something must be wrong Ozscott; yesterday mine didn't go above 86c in traffic (roadworks Gold Coast) and sat most of the time at 82c. Ambient was 29c

Maybe your housing is too far away from the inlet manifold or the thermostat is faulty?

Big test today, it's going to be 35c where I live so I'll let you know how t goes.

Cheers
Dead right mate. Water pump. New Airtex with cast bronze impeller going in in next few days. Was sucking in air through telltale. Cheers 117715117716

[ozscott]

So this doesn't look healthy ...and weeping out weep hole

117746

117747

[ozscott]

And this117751

[ozscott]

And now donehttps://www.aulro.com/afvb/images/imported/2016/12/282.jpg

[ozscott]

I have put the inline stat back. This time I turned the stat around inside the housing so there is more room at the spring end for water flow. I also added a further 3mm bleed/sensing hole in addition to the bleed hole in the top of the stat. Will give it a day for the Permatex Aviation Gasket goo to go off then I will give her the coolant, a bleed and a run!

Cheers117752

[Battler]

Should run cooler now!

I'm very happy with my inline stat mod. Recently went to Coffs fully loaded up, towing a camper trailer and the temps fluctuated between 82 to 87c.:D

[ozscott]

OK cool day but filled and idled and 84 degrees very stable. Increase revs to fast idle and 79 c. Will let it cool off overnight and recheck clamps and fluid...then drive but I think it will be good. Cheers

[ozscott]

No thermostat and she runs nicely up to 92 with 53 degrees intake temp and low 80's just running along in the suburbs in 30 degrees ambiebt...I think thermostat is still too far from Valley outlet and I also think I should treat her to a new radiator. Cheers

[Pedro_The_Swift]

Wow, whats your thoughts on rads? Alloy? Gen?
Do PWR do one?

[ozscott]

Not sure mate. I think PWR would be the way to go for longevity and cooling capacity. Don't know if they do one though. I have emailed them.. Cheers

[ozscott]

OK today with all the air out of it it was 84 to 85 up and down hills at 70-80kph and 85 to 88 on the highway depending on hills or not. All at 29c outside temp. Ran it hard up a steep hill and pulled over several times then ran it hard from stationary etc and then pulled over at the top and it idled up to 92c. Then home and at 50 degree air intake temp it idled from 85 when I pulled in to 88 and went no higher. Again 29c outside temp. All with thermostat out. Firstly these temps are good for a high compression 4.6. Secondly I need to move the thermostat closer to the valley. Thirdly I would prefer a 71 degree stat that was fully open at 82 and finally I reckon a new radiator would see even lower temps. Food for thought. Sure beats stock 102-105 idle temps of a stock set up...

Cheers 117872

[Geoff86RRC]

Greetings
PROBLEM
Four years I have struggled with my V8 overheating. I bought an OBDC and plugged it in and used my iPhone to monitor the temperature. I did this because the gauge is completely useless. It used to run at 105 to 110 degrees. After a new radiator it got hotter. On the highway, on hills at night in the cool it was always hot hot hot. I replaced the viscous fan. It had extra fans, everything was checked and changed out to no avail. I also bought an engine watchdog and found that it was running about 3 degrees below that showing from the OBDC (which comes from the actual temp sender)
SOLUTION
Murray, at Jagrover Spares in Brisbane got sick of all of the engines overheating and blowing and liners slipping and head gaskets popping and radiators popping and I even saw one of the thermostats with a huge split in its side due to excessive temperature and pressure. He has totally redesigned the coolant flow and he now uses an in-line thermostat running at 82 degrees, with a slight drillhole modification. He has done away with the stupid BMW heart valve monstrosity, and my D2V8 now sits on 84 to 89 degrees. I cannot thank him enough and urge all D2 and P38 owners to contact him. (07) 3857 5763. He has actually worked it out and my vehicle is fantastically cool just like the old ranges and disco ones of yesterday. This works for p38s too. He has the hoses and inline thermostat that fit and work. Hallelujah.

[Disco Muppet]

I'm about to fit a PEM100990 to my Td5 D2, running larger intercooler, BAS remap, etc.
This is being fitted in conjunction with a new rad and water pump, as well as solving a head gasket leak.
I'll be interested to see running temps, as I think the highest I ever saw previously was 96 and that was sitting in the middle of summer in drive through with the AC on, normally sat between 88 and 92.

[ozscott]

Greetings
PROBLEM
Four years I have struggled with my V8 overheating. I bought an OBDC and plugged it in and used my iPhone to monitor the temperature. I did this because the gauge is completely useless. It used to run at 105 to 110 degrees. After a new radiator it got hotter. On the highway, on hills at night in the cool it was always hot hot hot. I replaced the viscous fan. It had extra fans, everything was checked and changed out to no avail. I also bought an engine watchdog and found that it was running about 3 degrees below that showing from the OBDC (which comes from the actual temp sender)
SOLUTION
Murray, at Jagrover Spares in Brisbane got sick of all of the engines overheating and blowing and liners slipping and head gaskets popping and radiators popping and I even saw one of the thermostats with a huge split in its side due to excessive temperature and pressure. He has totally redesigned the coolant flow and he now uses an in-line thermostat running at 82 degrees, with a slight drillhole modification. He has done away with the stupid BMW heart valve monstrosity, and my D2V8 now sits on 84 to 89 degrees. I cannot thank him enough and urge all D2 and P38 owners to contact him. (07) 3857 5763. He has actually worked it out and my vehicle is fantastically cool just like the old ranges and disco ones of yesterday. This works for p38s too. He has the hoses and inline thermostat that fit and work. Hallelujah.
Geoff I am happy to say I sent a thread entitled American Know How from AULRO started by our very own Pedro the Swift to Murray and hassled Murray until he went with the inline Stat per that thread...it is a good thing. Is yours the white auto D2 V8 that I have seen there?

Cheers

[Geoff86RRC]

This problem is solved. Thanks for your help Scotty. This should be a sticky ie the in line stat. Happy new year, as now I can drive the long beach on Straddie's and stay cool. :) ps mine is the mica black one with tjm winch bar and ECB roof rack. Very very happy as I did not trust it for a trip so hot.
[/U]

[Pedro_The_Swift]

[FONT="Book Antiqua"][COLOR="Gray"][SIZE="3"]Im glad you're happy, mine gets those temps with just a change of thermostat ��

[Geoff86RRC]

Thanks Pedro,
I am constantly amazed at the work and knowledge that you put into this site and thank you very much. I possibly could have changed the thermostat but all in all this solution is much simpler and does not rely on that plastic heart shaped thing. Whether it is just a change of thermostat, or putting an in-line thermostat in and re-routing the hoses, I just want all the V8 and TD5 owners who are having overheating problems to know that there are simple solutions which see these vehicles reach their full potential. Thanks again mate and have a happy Christmas and a happy New Year.
PS this seems like such a serious and little understood topic I was wondering should it be a sticky?

[ozscott]

As Murray might have pointed out from quite a few thermostats he has pulled off and the bottom part that comes from the radiator is typically much much less stained than the part that comes along the bypass hose from the motor...ie the hot motor water that is bypassing the radiator. Cheers

[Geoff86RRC]

As Murray might have pointed out from quite a few thermostats he has pulled off and the bottom part that comes from the radiator is typically much much less stained than the part that comes along the bypass hose from the motor...ie the hot motor water that is bypassing the radiator. Cheers

Yes
I'm a bush/sea engineer only but IMHO those things are designed badly and are causing engines to blow up fro not being cool enough. Those old Buick 3500s would do 500,000 miles properly maintained.
Thanks again

[gavinwibrow]

Muppet, did you go for the standard/OEM radiator or?
I have similar mods and I'm still looking for any incremental cooling aids when towing the other brick (3T+ caravan) on a warm day and a PWR HD fully alum radiator at $1K might have to be next cab off the rank.
Although as Blacknight says it does put the fan a bit closer to hitting the rad if anything come loose - or if I hit a big cow.

[Disco Muppet]

Muppet, did you go for the standard/OEM radiator or?
I have similar mods and I'm still looking for any incremental cooling aids when towing the other brick (3T+ caravan) on a warm day and a PWR HD fully alum radiator at $1K might have to be next cab off the rank.
Although as Blacknight says it does put the fan a bit closer to hitting the rad if anything come loose - or if I hit a big cow.

Yeah just standard. It's supposed to be good for 200Kw so more than sufficient for my means.

[northiam]

The factory thermostat setup on the V8 and Td5 is designed maintain constant coolant flow through the engine block, the radiator is partially or mostly bypassed for temperature control.

Even old engines like the cleveland, windsor and LA V8's all bypassed to maintain block flow.

That flow prevents hot spots within the block and heads when not in full flow.

[ozscott]

Yep all good in theory. But in the LR case it bypasses the radiator for the sake of the heater matrix. The fact is that many people on this and other forums find their D2 V8's run consistently cooler with a dead head inline stat than the 82 degree 3 way LR one. If you drill some holes you get some pressure relief and hopefully not too much cavitation in the water pump. Anyone who has experienced block or head gasket failure from high temps looks for a better solution than just passenger comfort. Cheers